From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #152 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Thursday, October 8 1998 Volume 01 : Number 152 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 16:33:00 -0600 From: agottfre@telusplanet.net (Angela Gottfred) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Harrison Rogers Daybook Please pardon me if this question has already been answered; I subscribe to the digest version of the list, so I get my mail a bit later than most folks. Todd Glover wrote: >> In doing some research on Jedediah Smith, I was reading through Harrison Rogers daybook. Some of the entries in his ledger are a little puzzling, I hope some of you can expound. For example, on the right column of each entry are the letters "Dr." What does that mean? Some sort of debit mark?<< "Dr." was the usual abbreviation for the word "debit". (For an earlier example of this, see Henry Duckworth's edition of a 1786 North West Company account book, in _The English River Book_. Credits were written below the heading "Contra", much as accountants use that term today.) I would interpret the example you gave as stating that James Reed's account was debited 150 cents, or $1.50, for his purchase of a pound of tobacco. The fact that the amount is noted twice might be because the Rogers was noting the unit price, and then extending it; in other words, if Reed had bought 2 lbs of tobacco, it might have read 2 lbs tobacco, 150 cts [per lb.], $3.00. Your humble & obedient servant, Angela Gottfred agottfre@telusplanet.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 16:18:40 -0700 From: Pat Quilter Subject: MtMan-List: RE: Harrison Rogers Daybook "do" mark The "Do" mark was shorthand for "ditto" which meant the same as now, ie, repeat the above entry. For instance, a common journal entry might be 3 yards red cloth, $3 2 yards do, $2 In your case, the "Dr" (assuming this is actually "do") should refer to the entry above the one you copied. See if this makes sense. I would assume that 150 cts means 150 cents -- it matches the $1.50 entered on the right. As far as sheepskins goes, I would defer to anyone more familiar with the game and livestock of that area. YMOS Pat Quilter - -----Original Message----- From: TetonTod@aol.com [mailto:TetonTod@aol.com] Sent: Saturday, October 03, 1998 6:47 PM To: hist_text@xmission.com Subject: MtMan-List: Harrison Rogers Daybook Howdy All... In doing some research on Jedediah Smith, I was reading through Harrison Rogers daybook. Some of the entries in his ledger are a little puzzling, I hope some of you can expound. For example, on the right column of each entry are the letters "Dr." What does that mean? Some sort of debit mark? A typical entry looks like this: _____________________________ James Reed Dr To 1 lb tobacco 150 cts $1.50 _____________________________ what does the 150 cts mean? Also I find intriguing the entry for "tin strikers?" And there is an entry for sheep skin leggings and two other entries for sheepskins. I wonder if these are shepp as we know them, or the wild Bighorn sheep. Any thoughts? Todd D. Glover ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 21:38:29 -0400 From: jayward@juno.com (Joseph W Ward) Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #151 Hello the list, This might not be directly on point of the list, but does anybody know a source of the heavy kind of canvas that military leggings are made of? It seems to me it's about twice as heavy as new blue jeans. It needs to be stiff so the leggings won't sag. I'd like to buy a few yards and make a few pair. Thanks. -Joe Ward Louisville ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 19:12:49 -0700 From: Pat Quilter Subject: MtMan-List: RE: Harrison Rogers Daybook "Dr" mark If the mark in question is clearly "Dr" as described by Angela, please disregard my theories about it maybe being a "do" mark as noted below. Pat Quilter. - -----Original Message----- From: Pat Quilter [mailto:pat_quilter@qscaudio.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 1998 4:19 PM To: 'hist_text@lists.xmission.com' Subject: RE: Harrison Rogers Daybook "Dr" mark The "Do" mark was shorthand for "ditto" which meant the same as now, ie, repeat the above entry. For instance, a common journal entry might be 3 yards red cloth, $3 2 yards do, $2 In your case, the "Dr" (assuming this is actually "do") should refer to the entry above the one you copied. See if this makes sense. I would assume that 150 cts means 150 cents -- it matches the $1.50 entered on the right. As far as sheepskins goes, I would defer to anyone more familiar with the game and livestock of that area. YMOS Pat Quilter - -----Original Message----- From: TetonTod@aol.com [mailto:TetonTod@aol.com] Sent: Saturday, October 03, 1998 6:47 PM To: hist_text@xmission.com Subject: MtMan-List: Harrison Rogers Daybook Howdy All... In doing some research on Jedediah Smith, I was reading through Harrison Rogers daybook. Some of the entries in his ledger are a little puzzling, I hope some of you can expound. For example, on the right column of each entry are the letters "Dr." What does that mean? Some sort of debit mark? A typical entry looks like this: _____________________________ James Reed Dr To 1 lb tobacco 150 cts $1.50 _____________________________ what does the 150 cts mean? Also I find intriguing the entry for "tin strikers?" And there is an entry for sheep skin leggings and two other entries for sheepskins. I wonder if these are shepp as we know them, or the wild Bighorn sheep. Any thoughts? Todd D. Glover ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 22:16:22 EDT From: Casapy123@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Harrison Rogers Daybook Todd, You right on about the meaning of "dr." It is shorthand for "debit" and indicates the amount charged to the account. The 150 cts. is 150 "cents" so the debit shows as $1.50. The price following the item is most often the price per unit. As far as "Tin" strikers, intriguing is a good word. I assume Rogers refers to a fire striker although the "tin" part makes little sense. Allen chronister and Clay Landry are both far more knowledgable than I regarding inventories. Hopefully one of them will see this and weight in. If we don't hear from them soon, I'll drop them an e-mail and get back to the list. Since this ledger is written as Smith's party traveled the arid, desert regions to the southwest of Salt Lake, the sheep is probably not what we think of as domestic sheep. It probably is the bighorn sheep. Jim Hardee, AMM#1676 P.O. Box 1228 Quincy, CA 95971 (530)283-4566 (H) (530)283-3330 (W) (530)283-5171 FAX Casapy123@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 20:45:59 -0600 (MDT) From: Clay Landry Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Harrison Rogers Daybook At 09:46 PM 10/3/98 EDT, you wrote: >Howdy All... > > In doing some research on Jedediah Smith, I was reading through Harrison >Rogers daybook. Some of the entries in his ledger are a little puzzling, I >hope some of you can expound. For example, on the right column of each entry >are the letters "Dr." What does that mean? Some sort of debit mark? > >A typical entry looks like this: > >_____________________________ >James Reed Dr >To 1 lb tobacco 150 cts $1.50 >_____________________________ > >what does the 150 cts mean? > >Also I find intriguing the entry for "tin strikers?" And there is an entry for >sheep skin leggings and two other entries for sheepskins. I wonder if these >are shepp as we know them, or the wild Bighorn sheep. Any thoughts? > > >Todd D. Glover > > >----------------------------- Todd The ledger and day book were the nuts and bolts of the fur trade- remember that those guys did not use money they used a ledger book which contained debits and credits. When a trapper bought an item-say powder- form the company stores the clerk would write his name in the "daybook" for the date of the transaction. The entry would look like this; January 5 th, 1836 John Gray Dr To 2# Powder @ $1.5 .........$3.00 Then when he brought in some fur he received a credit in the Daybook; January 10 th, 1936 John Gray Cr By 3# Beaver @ $3.00..........$9.00 The Daybook was a listing of all the transactions for each day for all the men, while the ledger was organized with a page for each man which summarized all the transactions for that individual. A daybook can tell the researcher a lot about what was going on on a particular day for example the Fort Hall daybook for on day in January shows just about all the men being debited for Rum and brown sugar and about half of the men debited for playing cards. On that cold winter day on those boys were going to huddle up drink some spirits and play cards. By the way you could pay your gaming debits by telling the clerk to debit your account and credit you owed!!! Adios Clay Clay Landry P.O. Box 1033 Columbus MT 59019 - -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 20:07:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Newbill Subject: Re: MtMan-List: RE: Harrison Rogers Daybook "do" mark On Mon, 5 Oct 1998, Pat Quilter wrote: > I would assume that 150 cts means 150 cents -- it matches the $1.50 entered > on the right. Could "cts" possibly be shorthand for "carrot" of tobacco? Regards Lee Newbill Viola, Idaho email at lnewbill@uidaho.edu Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/7186 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 23:28:23 EDT From: JSeminerio@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Buckskin Coats Dear Mr Carl Thank you for contacting me. I would like to make a hunting coat, appropriate for the eastern region of this country. Any references , pattern sources etc would be most helpful ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Oct 1998 22:22:41 -0500 From: "Ken" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #151 What period are you referring to? YMDS, YellowFeather - ---------- > From: Joseph W Ward > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Cc: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com > Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #151 > Date: Monday, October 05, 1998 8:38 PM > > Hello the list, > > This might not be directly on point of the list, but does anybody > know a source of the heavy kind of canvas that military leggings are made > of? It seems to me it's about twice as heavy as new blue jeans. It needs > to be stiff so the leggings won't sag. I'd like to buy a few yards and > make a few pair. Thanks. > -Joe Ward > Louisville > > ___________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:53:15 EDT From: TetonTod@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Roger's Daybook Thanks to Jim, Pat, and Clay for the info on daybook entries. It makes more sense now. That "tin striker" still puzzles me. Keep wondering if he was refering to a tin striker box? But if so, why wouldn't he have said as much? Hmmmm I agree, the sheep must have been Bighorn. Interesting that they had leegings on hand. Must have purchased them at Rendezvous from the Indians along with other tanned sheep skins. You're right Clay, daybooks make for some facinating research. Well I remember your presentation at the symposium '97. How's the book coming? Thanks all Todd D. Glover ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:28:10 -0400 From: sean@naplesnet.com (Addison O. Miller) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Parts needed Thanks for all the advise guys! I finally got ahold of Thunder Ridge and got the lock for the Traditions and installed it. Fits great!! Now I justneedthe touch hole liner... Thanks again Addison Miller ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1998 20:05:48 -0500 From: "Jody Carlson" Subject: MtMan-List: Christian Royal Rangers group for boys? Hello the List; I was wondering if any of you could give me some information on a group for kids which I believe was called the Royal Rangers. If I remember correctly, it was a group somewhat like the Boy Scouts which combined living history with our kind of woodslore for boys in their teenage years. It was also Christian based which, is a plus, and appeals to me more than the baloney I've been hearing about the BSA the last few years. I have been searching the net, but to no avail. Could somebody out there help me out? My kids are a little young at the moment, but in a few years.... In advance I thank you, Scott sjsdm@conpoint.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 16:07:38 -0700 From: "Terry Landis" Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Roger's Daybook possibly a tinder striker? my 2 cents worth. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of TetonTod@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 9:53 AM To: hist_text@xmission.com Subject: MtMan-List: Roger's Daybook Thanks to Jim, Pat, and Clay for the info on daybook entries. It makes more sense now. That "tin striker" still puzzles me. Keep wondering if he was refering to a tin striker box? But if so, why wouldn't he have said as much? Hmmmm I agree, the sheep must have been Bighorn. Interesting that they had leegings on hand. Must have purchased them at Rendezvous from the Indians along with other tanned sheep skins. You're right Clay, daybooks make for some facinating research. Well I remember your presentation at the symposium '97. How's the book coming? Thanks all Todd D. Glover ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 17:30:31 -0600 From: jbrandl@wyoming.com (Joe Brandl) Subject: MtMan-List: buffalo hides I have just finished tanning the rest of my buffalo from last year. WE have several hides that have rub marks on the hips and shoulders. Good winter robes but not perfect. Most are cows, therefore a lot lighter than the bull hides. Ave sq ft is 40 to 45. I want to move them, so......................for $300 to $400, I will select the poorer ones for $300 and the better ones for $400. Every hide is guarenteed. If you don't like it, just return it within 15 days for your money back. All hides have a lifetime cleaning and reconditioning. Let me know if anyone is interested. Joe Absaroka Western Designs and Tannery Call us about our professional home tanning kit-307-455-2440 Write for custom tanning prices We produce rawhide lampshades and carry a large selection of leather and hair on robes Fine lodgepole furniture, pillows, Indian reproductions, paintings, baskets check out our new web site: http://www.onpages.com/absaroka ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 00:15:52 -0400 From: "Fred A. Miller" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Christian Royal Rangers group for boys? Jody Carlson wrote: > > Hello the List; > > I was wondering if any of you could give me some information on a group for > kids which I believe was called the Royal Rangers. If I remember > correctly, it was a group somewhat like the Boy Scouts which combined > living history with our kind of woodslore for boys in their teenage years. > It was also Christian based which, is a plus, and appeals to me more than > the baloney I've been hearing about the BSA the last few years. > > I have been searching the net, but to no avail. Could somebody out there > help me out? My kids are a little young at the moment, but in a few > years.... Scott, go to their web site at: http://www.clcchurch.org/rrpage.html. GOOD group, by the way!! Best, Fred ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 03:33:30 -0500 From: MacRaith@mail.swbell.net Subject: MtMan-List: pipestone I was recently given a piece of pipestone for a pipe bowl. I've read that the material was often shaped by scraping with knife blades. I can't make a dent in this stuff with a horseshoe rasp much less a knife. What's the trick? Bill "Chases Hawks" Vannoy MacRaith@SWBell.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 22:46:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Newbill Subject: MtMan-List: Cannons amongst John Works Snake Expedition 31-32 Good Day Came across a reference about a cannon bursting during a skirmish between John Work's Snake expedition and a band from the Blackfeet tribe. Date is about Jan 30 1932. Checked Dean's site, but unfortunately, the journal from that time frame doesn't mention this. Does anyone know what kind of cannon he had? Regards Lee Newbill Viola, Idaho email at lnewbill@uidaho.edu Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/7186 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1998 01:32:24 EDT From: RR1LA@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pipestone Bill, Sounds like you got hold of 'ironstone' LOL. you need Catlinite, which is usually pink to orange and sometimes mottled with white. Also known as the indurated variety of Red Silicious Clay, it is USUALLY workable with the most primitive of tools. As with all minerals, sometimes there are aborations in hardness, graining, etc. yhs, GunShot ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1998 03:16:12 -0500 From: Jeff Powers Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pipestone On 1998-09-22 hist_text@lists.xmission.com said to kestrel@ticon.net >X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en]C-SBIS-NC404 (Win95; U) >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Sender: owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com >Precedence: bulk >Status: >I was recently given a piece of pipestone for a pipe bowl. I've >read that the material was often shaped by scraping with knife >blades. I can't make a dent in this stuff with a horseshoe rasp >much less a knife. What's the trick? >Bill "Chases Hawks" Vannoy >MacRaith@SWBell.net the pipestone I've carved was 3-4 days out of the ground and carved like soapstone when I started it like granite a year later when I finished it. I think you got some that has been out of the groung to long,the only things I've found that work it then are silicon carbide and diamond tools. Jeff Powers,Rogue & Ne'er do Well "They make no scruple to break wind publickly" Fr.Louis Hennepin 1698 Net-Tamer V 1.08.1 - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 98 04:23:49 PDT From: "Jerrys" Subject: MtMan-List: Fur Trappers Where can I purchase commercial brain tanned deer and or elk hides at = a reasonable price ? also I am still looking for the definition of the term " pinchon ",the = word was used in relation with fox in an artical by Gary Lantz.iin the = outdoor oklahoma march/april 1997 " His source was Pioneer days in the early southwest by Grant Forman = . Forman took the term from the records of the CHOUTEAUS shipping furs = and hides from eastern Oklahoma in the late 17 ,earley 1800s........thank= s Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 10:16:02 -0600 (CST) From: mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU (Henry B. Crawford) Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Waxing gourds >Henry, >Jon told me to write you on how to finish a gourd to carry water. >Do you need to seal the inside someway. >I was thinking of using beeswax and brewers pitch after I clean them out. >What do you use, or your thoughts on this matter? >Thanks for you help. > >"Pockets" >A.K.A. >Matt Mitchell >Palouse Hills Muzzleloaders >Moscow, Idaho >travel@turbonet.com > > "They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist---" > General John B. Sedgwick's last words, 1864 Matt, "Uncle John" Sedgwick forgot that a good sized general makes a good sized target for rebel snipers. I'm going to pass this on to the list in case anyone else wants to get into gourds. I have a pretty decent crop on the vine now. With our changes in weather lately, being much cooler than normal in the evenings, they should be ready to harvest by November. It's best to wait till after the first frost. I don't pick them till the stems are completely dry. We're expecting an early winter. In answer to your question, gourds should be lined with some kind of wax, not just as a water seal, but to improve taste. I usually use a craft wax that looks like sculptor's wax that I get at Hobby Lobby, but I suppose any wax will do. Most craft stores carry what I use. Bee's wax might be more flexible with less potential for cracking in winter. As for technique, I pour hot wax into the gourd after seeds and as much inner skin, etc. as possible have been removed. Don't worry about hard to reach spots because a couple to three coats of wax will cover what's left behind. Also, there is no need to pre-heat the gourd, because the hot wax will do that on the first pouring, and pre-heating might cause too much of the wax to settle, instead of sticking on the wall. The hot wax will automatically regulate the temperature of the gourd. Pour the wax into the gourd without letting it overflow. I'd leave the upper chamber empty (if using bottle/birdhouse gourds) to avoid overspilling. Better to use gloves because soon the gourd will get quite warm. They also protect you if wax spills on your hands. I also use a photographic tray to avoid spilling on my counter top. Newspaper is fine, but you want to catch spilled wax to use it again. After filling, pour out the wax back into the pot to be used again. Wax can be recycled as long as it's clean. *IMPORTANT-Pour while rotating the gourd so that all sides of the area near the opening are coated.* Wait about a minute or so, then pour more wax into the gourd. Repeat the procedure as many times as you need to. The more pourings, the stronger gourd you end up with. Be careful not to reduce the capacity of the gourd. 3-5 pourings would be optimum. As the gourd is used, the wax on the opening will wear away, especially if you use a cork. I wouldn't worry about that unless it maked your water taste really bad. If that happens and you want to fix it, let the gourd air dry for a few days. (never reheat a waxed gourd unless you want to start the coating procedure all over again.) Dip the mouth into a pot of hot wax momentarily and set aside for a minute. Two dippings should give you a satisfactory coating on the gourd mouth. You may have to re-fit a new cork. And speaking of corks. They do tend to break, especially after repeated opening and closing. Always check your corks and replace fatigued, worn, and cracked ones. If your opening is sized for them, wine bottle corks are great because they are very high quality. I try to make my gourd openings to fit wine bottle corks. In spite of their quality, they will also crack eventually. Corks tend to fray on the wet edges because that deterioriates the material. That is a good sign to start finding a replacement. You can rotate a cork and use the other end, but that is only a short term solution. Better to replace it sooner than later. There's nothing so disconcerting as half a cork floating inside your perfectly made gourd. One more thing, then I'll shut up. Never store an empty gourd with the cork on. Corks need to dry so that mold and bacteria don't break it down. It's organic, which makes it highly suceptible to decay in a moist environment. Allow them to air dry after events. Any questions?? Cheers, HBC ***************************************** Henry B. Crawford Curator of History mxhbc@ttacs.ttu.edu Museum of Texas Tech University 806/742-2442 Box 43191 FAX 742-1136 Lubbock, TX 79409-3191 WEBSITE: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum ****** Living History . . . Because it's there! ******* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 12:44:13 -0600 (CST) From: mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU (Henry B. Crawford) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Buckskin Coats John, Eagle's View and Green River Forge both have frock patterns that can be adapted for leather. In fact, the Eagle's View pattern (#692 in Townsend's catalog 18) for the rifleman's frock has specific instructions for making it from leather or buckskin. Let me know how yours comes out. I'm planning to do the same thing. I need additional leather for the sleeves. Cheers, HBC >Ho the List > >I am currently researching buckskin hunting frocks and would like to make >myself one. I am intersted in making an indian style buckskin coat. > >I have "The Frontier Rifleman" by Richard B. La Crosse, Jr. and the Mountain >Man Sketchbooks by Hanson. I cannot get the patterns showing the coats >attributed the Indians to work. I make very small models > >Has anyone made such a coat or hunting shirt ? What type of research did you >use? Does any one know where I can get any useful patterns etc. > >Thank you all very much for your time >Watch your topknot >John Seminerio ***************************************** Henry B. Crawford Curator of History mxhbc@ttacs.ttu.edu Museum of Texas Tech University 806/742-2442 Box 43191 FAX 742-1136 Lubbock, TX 79409-3191 WEBSITE: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum ****** Living History . . . Because it's there! ******* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 12:26:26 -0700 From: Roger Lahti Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Fur Trappers Jerry, Try Mike Rider at:208-265-4862, 290 Gold Creek Rd., Sandpoint ID.83864. He tans deer and sells commercially. His hides are second to none! I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' Jerrys wrote: > Where can I purchase commercial brain tanned deer and or elk hides at a reasonable price ? > also I am still looking for the definition of the term " pinchon ",the word was used in relation with fox in an artical by Gary Lantz.iin the outdoor oklahoma march/april 1997 " > His source was Pioneer days in the early southwest by Grant Forman . Forman took the term from the records of the CHOUTEAUS shipping furs and hides from eastern Oklahoma in the late 17 ,earley 1800s........thanks Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Oct 1998 10:04:15 EDT From: TetonTod@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pipestone Bill, All the pipestone (Catlinite) I've ever worked was fairly soft and easily worked with a knife. Once I was told to store the stone in water until ready to work. I'm not sure if this was to keep it from cracking or to keep it soft enought to work. However, even after a number of years my pipebowls are still easily carved. Are you sure it's pipestone and not some kind of soapstone? Todd D. Glover ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 09:35:32 -0500 From: Jim Colburn Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pipestone Washtahay- At 03:16 AM 10/7/98 -0500, you wrote: > >I was recently given a piece of pipestone for a pipe bowl. I've > >read that the material was often shaped by scraping with knife > >blades. I can't make a dent in this stuff with a horseshoe rasp > >much less a knife. What's the trick? > >Bill "Chases Hawks" Vannoy > >MacRaith@SWBell.net >the pipestone I've carved was 3-4 days out of the ground and carved like >soapstone when I started it like granite a year later when I finished it. >I think you got some that has been out of the groung to long,the only things >I've found that work it then are silicon carbide and diamond tools. When all else fails, soak it in water for a while-maybe as much as a year. It works, and its traditional (or at least is what I was taught when I did an apprenticeship of sorts in pipemaking). I'd suggest keeping it from freezing, for fear of expansion cracks-but I don't know if this is necessary. LongWalker c. du B ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #152 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.