From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #684 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Thursday, November 30 2000 Volume 01 : Number 684 In this issue: -       MtMan-List: camp names -       Re: MtMan-List: Ojibway style snowshoes -       Re: MtMan-List: camp names -       MtMan-List: Beer -       Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? -       Re: MtMan-List: camp names -       Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather -       MtMan-List: Re: Mttn. Man list Smokes? -       Re: MtMan-List: camp names -       MtMan-List: Re: Beer / Native Drinks -       MtMan-List: Camp names -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: camp names -       Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: camp names -       Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather -       Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather -       RE: MtMan-List: Smokes?? -       Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? -       RE: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather -       Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? -       Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather -       RE: MtMan-List: Camp names ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 10:04:27 -0600 From: "Frank Fusco" Subject: MtMan-List: camp names I would appreciate being educated on what is considered the protocol for an individual to identify himself with a 'camp name'. For a long time I have used one but at other times have been called another. I do know that there is a practice of a name being "given" at a ceremony but I have never witnessed such a ceremony. I also am aware that, if anyone responds, we may see some wildly divergent points of view on this question. Now I will tell the two names and how they came about. For many years, I have identified myself as "Bearclaw". Perhaps not original but I like it for several reasons. I like and respect bears and the way they conduct themselves. I choose that name because I believe it reflects my personality. Bears tend to go about their business quietly and will slip away at the first sign of trouble. However, if one is cornered or their offspring are threatened they will fight and defend with a ferocity that is almost unstoppable. I am often perceived as mild mannered and retiring and will leave the scene if there is a possibility of some kind of violence. However, if my family or my well being is threatened and there is no other recourse I will defend vigorously with whatever means are at my disposal, hands, knife, hawk or gun until the attacker is subdued. No quarter. That is that name story. The other camp name that some have called me is "Short Grass". I do not like it and do not use it. At one time we had a local group of 'skinners who started using that to address me. It came about because some of the group could not understand or pronounce my last name, Fusco. Some thought it was 'fescue' like the pasture grass. From that came "Short Grass". Some local guys still call me that and I take no offense but I never introduce myself with that moniker. OK, pitch in. Do I have a 'proper' camp name or not? What is the accepted custom? Frank G. Fusco Mountain Home, Arkansas - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 11:14:15 -0500 From: "Addison Miller" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Ojibway style snowshoes Check www.sportsmansguide.com They have some advertised in one of their catalogs. Ad Miller Subject: MtMan-List: Ojibway style snowshoes > I'm looking for some Ojibway style snowshoes, with rawhide lacing. > Anyone out there no of a good place with a good price? > > So far the best I've found is at Andriondac Outdoors for $84.95 without > bindings. These are 12x60. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 11:20:43 -0500 From: "Dennis Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: camp names If you gave yourself a "camp name" it would, in my somewhat dubious circle of "friends" , seem some what egotistical & even pompus and would not stand for very damned long....One does not choose his/her camp name.. It is given and if it sticks, you are stuck with it until you do something that creates a need for change, either an honorable action, mannerism, characteristic or something you did that defies the fact that you are supposedly a thinking, rational being. D "It doesn't matter HOW MANY "skydives" you've got behind you.. Until you have stepped out of a door of an airplane in total darkness at twelve hundred and fifty feet wearing ninety-five pounds of equipment and forty-two pounds of parachute. You are STILL a leg...." AIRBORNE - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 10:33:35 -0600 From: "Best, Dianne" Subject: MtMan-List: Beer Larry Huber wrote: "I always figured those "Injuns" came from Viking stock!" Well, again from the oral history, my Grandmother told me there were blue-eyed people among the Iroquois before Columbus came. The cultural history said the Europeans were received "too well" because they looked so much like our own people (just a bit smaller and a lot stinkier! - sorry! - the Europeans didn't bathe often and most native people had some form of "sweat lodge", so the new arrivals were often perceived as "dirty") As an aside, I did hear of a linguistic study of Native languages which was attempting to determine when various groups of people "split" into two groups through rate of evolution of their languages. The interesting thing that struck me from the categorization of the language families was that one Native language in the American southeast was only related to one other language in the world - from the area of NORTHERN SPAIN! (I wish I could find the reference to that linguistic study again!!!) Figure that out! To reiterate, on the subject of fermented beverages, Maple sap/sugar was a very important part of the Iroquoian diet and highly valued, not just as a commodity but also having a spiritual element. Although some would/may have been allowed to ferment, such a use would have been seen as extravagant. Also, I do not know what percentage of alcohol would have been attainable without sterile handling, vapour traps, etc. I have no doubt that the European beverages were WAY more potent and much more plentiful than the local products. I will do some more research and see if I can find the traditional name for fermented Maple sap. Jin-o-ta-ka (Dianne) - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:04:26 EST From: Wind1838@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? I bought two clay pipes this summer. One (ceramic) was made by the potter, Sprinkle - from Texas. Lanney introduced me to his work a couple of years ago and I have become a collector. One consideration is the length of the stem. You can buy them where the bowl simply fits into the stem, which helps packing. Laura Jean - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:10:47 EST From: LivingInThePast@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: camp names Frank, It sounds like you just haven't righteously screwed-up yet! Are you hiding a story that will get you an appropriate name? Anybody seen or heard of anything we could use against him? Come'on guys, spit it out.... Barney (aptly camp-named Barney Fife, in ceremony, after a shooting incident (read accident), and yep, now I'm only allowed to carry one bullet, in my pocket! LOLOL - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:07:50 EST From: SWzypher@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather In a message dated 11/30/0 08:32:22 AM, GHickman@aol.com writes: <> Regarding fabric softner and substitute brain-tanning: In a visit with one of the finest tanners known in this region I was told this: The hides, after brain tanning, but before stretching can be soaked in water with fabric softener for a better product. This from Shoshone Walace Zundel. His wife, Hazel, immediately remarked, "don't leave them in there too long, though, or they will ruin". Walace's comment, "this is true, but if you do it right, it sure makes them smell good!". There are no details here but just the comments of a couple of people who knew their business but have since gone under. R. James - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:26:21 -0500 (EST) From: SpiritoftheWood@webtv.net Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Mttn. Man list Smokes? Dianne, don't smoke your hand roll tobacco in your clay, as it burns hotter then Hades!!! Get some Straight Virginia (very period but still a bit hot!) or better yet a natural "Cigar Leave" Blend for a cooler smoke! Not to nag but.. quite those dang Cigarettes,not very period correct and a bit contrary to traditional Native beliefs,please don't take offence as this comes from and ex-cigarette(15 years) smoker and fellow person of Native decent, who now enjoys the occasional Pipe or Cigar! I remain , Michael A. Smith "In Wildness Is the Preservation of the World" Thoreau http://community.webtv.net/SpiritoftheWood/THEBUCKSKINNERSCABIN - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:40:23 EST From: SWzypher@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: camp names In a message dated 11/30/0 09:05:40 AM, frankf@centurytel.net writes: << OK, pitch in. Do I have a 'proper' camp name or not? What is the accepted custom? Frank G. Fusco Mountain Home, Arkansas>> Frank: In the early formative period of AMM I issued memberships from=20 two-digit numbers up to the high 700s. I found applicants presented=20 themselves with an overwhelming preponderance of "Bear" names. I appealed t= o=20 the membership at the 1976 Rendezvous to look in a different direction when=20 assigning themselvs names as we had many duplicates of all parts of bear=20 anatomy - Bear Paw, Bear Paw, Bear Nose, Bears' Ears, Bear Butt, plus the=20 variations of "Griz" Bear. This appeal was not to point out any flaw of=20 reasoning but to make all aware of duplication. Many Hispanics are named=20 Juan or Jesus. Many Italians are Tony. So I guess lots of Bears does not=20 break any precidence. Indian boys usually started out with one name but tha= t=20 name was changed when they later "came of age" (16 + or - ). The second was= =20 more of an earned name. For myself, the original Capitaine used to call me=20 "Utah" - probably because I was the only one from this state he phoned on a=20 regular basis. I never really accepted or used this one because there were= =20 many others from Utah and I still felt an allegance to Wyoming where I grew=20 up. (We already had a "Wyoming", though, but he lived in Colorado). He=20 later called me Pathfinder because six of us were lost in the village of=20 Park City at night until we finally found "the spot". That wasn't much of a= =20 claim to fame as it was issued "tongue-in-cheek", and so I never advertised=20 that one either. Finally I picked up a handle assigned me by an old, wise=20 and thoroughly delightful Gosiute lady - Grandma Bear : the name Dah Pud=20 Ootsie Bodee. I use it because I came by it honestly from an Indian and it=20 is accepted by other Indians - Gosiute and Shoshone. It is not at all mach= o=20 and could in fact be a "sissy" name. But these folk have different values=20 than we and within the last 150 years have used names like Black Penis and=20 Smelly Vagina. A note on this: Chief Edgar Red Cloud once told me that=20 Indians (he was speaking for the Sioux) have no swear words in their languag= e=20 like we have in the European-stemmed languages. If the occasion for insult=20 arose, rather than: ##@#~~=A3 =A2=A2 =A7 =A2=95=B6=A7=95 =A7##!!, they wou= ld say "You have a=20 big nose!" or some such to point out their opponent's embarassing flaws. So - Your Mountain Man name. The possibilities are as numerous as there are= =20 individuals who sport such names. . . . Free country. Its up to you. Yo= u=20 asked the time . . . .the above is directions for building your own watch. =20= I=20 wish you peach and comfort in your decision. Respectfully Richard James - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:44:53 -0500 (EST) From: SpiritoftheWood@webtv.net Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Beer / Native Drinks I belive your wrong about Reindeer being only from Europe.In my Funk and Wagnalls New Standard Encyclopedia under Reindeer : (Rangifr tarandus) a species of deer, native of the northern parts of Europe, Asia, and America... This however in no way proves my other statement which was just something I heard and may very well be a "Frontier Legend". Y.M.O.S M.A Smith Esq. "In Wildness Is the Preservation of the World" Thoreau http://community.webtv.net/SpiritoftheWood/THEBUCKSKINNERSCABIN - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 10:59:49 -0800 From: "Larry Huber" Subject: MtMan-List: Camp names This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C05ABC.A8A040C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Frank, Camp names can be given formally in a ceremony or naturally by = common usage. You're not supposed to have to like your common-usage = name. =20 In the circle of "skinners" our family traveled in, we evolved a = "naming ceremony" for young people of a certain age. Among males it was = generally the celebration of the thirteenth birthday. Among females = (who mature earlier) it was done when thought appropriate by the Women's = Society. On the two occasions of female naming I participated in, it = involved a passing and progression. One young woman taking over the = family after the death of her father and the other woman leaving to = attend college. In both genders it often involved much emotion. =20 The young males endured a "gauntlet". They had to proceed slowly = down two parallel lines of adults who would step out one at a time and = speak on the observations of the growth of the "boy- becoming-man" and = suggest a name. The adult would step back into line, often delivering = the boy a whack on the bottom as he passed to the next adult. At the = end of the line was the boy's father who considered the names proposed = and declared the final name the young man would be known as. Gifts were = usually presented to the "new man" entering the family after this. Among the women, the adults formed a circle and the new woman walked = around the circle stopping in front of each adult who had a suggestion = and a story. The mother or "Aunt" of the "Girl-becoming-Woman" would = bestow the name at the end. The results of the two female ceremonies = was "Wind in the Trees Woman" and "Looks East Woman". Both very = emotional namings. I received my names by general usage, the one replacing the earlier = name. Often times the name marks a major screw-up unfortunately = witnessed by your "brothers". My current name was the result of a = premature discharge of my Sharps rifle after a long sneak up on a small = herd of buffalo bulls on the South Dakota prairie. I would rather my = camp name recorded a work of prowess but, unfortunately, I am due to = remain: "Shoots-the-Prairie" Larry Huber =20 - ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C05ABC.A8A040C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Frank,
    Camp names can be = given formally=20 in a ceremony or naturally by common usage.  You're not supposed to = have to=20 like your common-usage name. 
    In the circle = of "skinners"=20 our family traveled in, we evolved a "naming ceremony" for young people = of a=20 certain age.  Among males it was generally the celebration of the=20 thirteenth birthday.  Among females (who mature earlier) it was = done when=20 thought appropriate by the Women's Society. On the two occasions of = female=20 naming I participated in, it involved a passing and progression.  = One=20 young woman taking over the family after the death of her father and the = other=20 woman leaving to attend college.  In both genders it often involved = much=20 emotion. 
    The young males = endured a=20 "gauntlet".  They had to proceed slowly down two parallel lines of = adults=20 who would step out one at a time and speak on the observations of the = growth of=20 the "boy- becoming-man" and suggest a name.  The adult would step = back into=20 line, often delivering the boy a whack on the bottom as he passed to the = next=20 adult.  At the end of the line was the boy's father who considered = the=20 names proposed and declared the final name the young man would be known=20 as.  Gifts were usually presented to the "new man" entering the = family=20 after this.
    Among the women, the = adults=20 formed a circle and the new woman walked around the circle stopping in = front of=20 each adult who had a suggestion and a story.  The mother or "Aunt" = of the=20 "Girl-becoming-Woman" would bestow the name at the end.  The = results of the=20 two female ceremonies was "Wind in the Trees Woman" and "Looks East=20 Woman".  Both very emotional namings.
    I received my names = by general=20 usage, the one replacing the earlier name. Often times the name marks a = major=20 screw-up unfortunately witnessed by your "brothers".  My current = name was=20 the result of a premature discharge of my Sharps rifle after a long = sneak up on=20 a small herd of buffalo bulls on the South Dakota prairie.  I would = rather=20 my camp name recorded a work of prowess but, unfortunately, I am due to=20 remain:
 
    "Shoots-the-Prairie" = Larry=20 Huber
  
- ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C05ABC.A8A040C0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:13:01 -0700 From: "Daniel L. Smith" Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: camp names From: "Dennis Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: camp names If you gave yourself a "camp name" it would, in my somewhat dubious circle of "friends" , seem some what egotistical & even=A0pompus and would not stand for very damned long.... D. - ------------------------ Isn't that the truth, how many times has one's name changed through the years and not by choice, right Dennis. Later, Daniel "Concho" L.Smith Site Survey & Research for: ____________________________________________ HISTORICAL RESEARCH & DEVELOPMENT http://pages.about.com/dlsmith/ _______HRD__ ____________________________________________ Research page: http://pages.about.com/conner1/ _______HRD__ ____________________________________________ Sign up for a free About Email account at http://About.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 15:20:41 -0500 From: "Dennis Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? Laura I got a couple of clays from a fella in Canada that does them with pipe clay, in the traditional manner . Best doggone pipes I ever had. I will hunt up his website and post it, if I can find it.. Nice fella to deal with.. D "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" DOUBLE EDGE FORGE http://www.bright.net/~deforge1 I Now Offer Gift Certificates - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 15:28:12 -0500 From: "Dennis Miles" Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: camp names - ------------------------ "how many times has one's name changed through the years and not by choice, right Dennis." Concho, Yup...<>G D (Deux Espouses, A name that is seldom used by anyone other than close friends, but has endured for many a year) - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 15:44:57 -0500 From: "Ken Jones" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_01A3_01C05AE4.7DE6E0A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tom- When I tan deer and coyote hides I buy regular tanning chemicals from a = taxidermy supply catalog. They do a very good job. I am getting ready = to tan a few coyote hides in the next couple of weeks. I do have the = instructions for tanning with naptha soap and neatsfoot oil but it is = alot of work. My step-dad (who is a taxidermist) convinced me of the = modern ways. If you still want the steps for the naptha soap I can dig = them up and scan them to you. Ken - ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Thomas Ballstaedt=20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 1:27 AM Subject: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather Iam asking this for a friend of mine. does anybody out there know of = anything other than brains that can be used as a substitute for brain = tanning hides? I have heard of lard, or naptha soap. if I've heard = right, how are they used? thanks Tom - ------=_NextPart_000_01A3_01C05AE4.7DE6E0A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tom-
When I tan deer and coyote hides I buy regular = tanning=20 chemicals from a taxidermy supply catalog.  They do a very good = job. =20 I am getting ready to tan a few coyote hides in the next couple of = weeks. =20 I do have the instructions for tanning with naptha soap and neatsfoot = oil but it=20 is alot of work.  My step-dad (who is a taxidermist) convinced me = of the=20 modern ways.  If you still want the steps for the naptha soap I can = dig=20 them up and scan them to you.
 
Ken
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Thomas=20 Ballstaedt
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 1:27 AM
Subject: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning=20 leather

Iam asking this for a friend of = mine.  does=20 anybody out there know of anything other than brains that can be used as = a=20 substitute for brain tanning hides? I have heard of lard, or naptha = soap.  if I've heard right, how are they used?
thanks Tom
- ------=_NextPart_000_01A3_01C05AE4.7DE6E0A0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 16:18:48 EST From: LODGEPOLE@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather In a message dated 11/29/00, tphsb@earthlink.net writes: << Iam asking this for a friend of mine. does anybody out there know of anything other than brains that can be used as a substitute for brain tanning hides? I have heard of lard, or naptha soap. if I've heard right, how are they used? thanks Tom >> You need not use a substitute. just use brains. If the hides you have came just as hides and not from a deer, meaning you have not got the dee'r's brains....just head to the butcher and pick up some brains. A cow's brains will tan the hide just as well from what I have read. Longshot "Longshot's Rendezvous Homepage" (Newly Redesigned) http://members.aol.com/lodgepole/longshot.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:15:09 -0700 From: louis.l.sickler@lmco.com Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Smokes?? Ho the camp, I don't know if this is the one Dennis is referring to, but here is a good site Olde World Clay's http://www.bytor.com/pipes/pipes.htm Lou Sickler Colorado > -----Original Message----- > From: Dennis Miles [SMTP:deforge1@bright.net] > Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 1:21 PM > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? > > Laura > I got a couple of clays from a fella in Canada that does them with pipe > clay, in the traditional manner . Best doggone pipes I ever had. I will hunt > up his website and post it, if I can find it.. Nice fella to deal with.. > D > > "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" > DOUBLE EDGE FORGE > http://www.bright.net/~deforge1 > I Now Offer Gift Certificates > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 16:31:49 -0500 From: "Dennis Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? Louis, That's the one.... Finest, coolest smoking clays made.. NO comparison to those "clays" that are sold at most doins... The price is awful reasonable if you stick to the simple models. And it is real nice to just put it in the coals at night and in the morning you have a fresh, clean pipe to enjoy. A sheer joy, inded. D > Olde World Clay's > > http://www.bytor.com/pipes/pipes.htm - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:39:41 -0700 From: louis.l.sickler@lmco.com Subject: RE: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather Ho the list, This has been my thoughts on this whole thread. Once again, trying to get around or find a substitute ends up being harder than the original method. More often than not, I don't get home from the hunting trip with the brains from the animals killed. Even grocery stores will order you in some brains, albeit with sometimes funny expressions, but once they get to know you it almost becomes a point of humor. Yes, beef brains do a great job. It seems I always need more than the animal would have provided anyway. They are so cheap, I use them once and discard them. More environmentally friendly than some of the "commercial" methods that contain chromium, etc. Would everyone dispose of the waste with proper care? So, all you folks wanting to tan, use brains and go for it. Also, anyone in the Colorado front range who would like a hands on demo, contact me off list. I can always use some help getting stuff tanned. Lou Sickler > -----Original Message----- > From: LODGEPOLE@aol.com [SMTP:LODGEPOLE@aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 2:19 PM > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather > > In a message dated 11/29/00, tphsb@earthlink.net writes: > > << Iam asking this for a friend of mine. does anybody out there know of > anything other than brains that can be used as a substitute for brain tanning > hides? I have heard of lard, or naptha soap. if I've heard right, how are > they used? > thanks Tom >> > > You need not use a substitute. just use brains. If the hides you have came > just as hides and not from a deer, meaning you have not got the dee'r's > brains....just head to the butcher and pick up some brains. A cow's brains > will tan the hide just as well from what I have read. > > > Longshot > > "Longshot's Rendezvous Homepage" > (Newly Redesigned) > http://members.aol.com/lodgepole/longshot.html > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 14:22:04 -0800 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Smokes?? - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Best, Dianne" To: "'MountainMan Digest'" Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 5:34 AM Subject: MtMan-List: Smokes?? > Another question from the recent arrival.... > > I have heard that smoking "tobacco wrapped in white paper" is not allowed at > Rendezvous. As one who makes way too many tobacco offerings every day with > roll-your-owns, I assume that I will be relegated to a clay pipe during > gatherings? Dianne, I see you have gotten some good advice and answers to your question. May I offer some more perspective? Keep in mind that "Rendezvous" is not an inclusive term. There are many different "rendezvous" with just as many different rules of conduct. I suppose in the most strictly "juried" events, using white paper cigarettes whether hand rolled or ready made would not be permitted. I can't imagine someone not being aware of that going in if they are at all careful to read the "list of requirements". In such situations, the several suggested alternatives would likely be acceptable such as cigars and pipes. In the spirit of the events, most open Western Rendezvous' don't prohibit ready made cigarettes but most folks that want to really get into the "game" will roll their own or smoke a pipe or cigars or cigarillos (those little black nasty things that are dang near impossible to inhale ). At less formal club shoot/rendezvous, not even that is particularly required much less practiced. I for one don't care what you smoke. What bothers me more than anything else is what is done with the cigarette butt after it's smoked. I really wish cigarette smokers would not just throw their butts down on the ground. I really would prefer they not even throw them into a none burning fire pit. It's analogous to throwing pop can pull tabs down or the empty can itself. What is otherwise a beautiful scene of recreated history is some how spoiled by all those filters, etc. laying around. When I was a heavy smoker I probably didn't think about it all that much either. The habit was so consuming. I still use tobacco (chew) and occasionally smoke a clay pipe (though I am trying not to do that any more) but where my spit goes and where my pipe smoke goes is of concern to others and it is incumbent on me to take that into consideration regardless of what vice I choose to indulge in. Hope that helps in its own way. Try learning how to roll your own "doogy" (there's something endearing and romantic,even sensual, in a lady rolling a cig by hand in the great out of doors ) and if not then try a pipe and if not then at least be sure to field strip your butt's when your through. Other than that, I don't think most folks care how you get your fix. Good luck and good health. I remain....... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:03:05 -0600 From: "jdearing" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: alternatives for brain tanning leather > > Iam asking this for a friend of mine. does anybody out there know of > > anything other than brains that can be used as a substitute for brain > > tanning hides? I have heard of lard, or naptha soap. if I've heard > > right, how are they used? > I recieved this information from another list. The poster is known for his knowledge and truthfulness. That said, I have not tried this method of tannning. The Mayo Tanning Recipe 1 lb of mayo (I think it's a 32oz jar) regular, not fat free 1 bar of Ivory soap (is purer tha other types) cut into slivers 1 gal water You have to mix all ingredients until the soap shavings or slivers are dissolved. I soak the rawhide overnight and work the next day. Like all of my postings to this group, I never post anything unless I have an experiential knowledge of it. The mayo technique works very well. I also live where there are few if any butcher shops but a lot of people dropping off deer skins for me to work. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 19:34:08 -0600 From: Todd Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Camp names This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C05B04.8239D980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I remember asking this question a while ago Frank, and was told the same thing. Names are given, not chosen. A friend of mine will probably be called Wrong Way for a while, least until he gets a new name. Something about going to Lincon from Kansas City, by way a Des Moines. =). And he wasn't exactly pleased with it much either. Probably why we still call him that. So far, I've managed to avoid embarassing myself too much, and haven't earned a name yet. Todd -----Original Message----- From: owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Larry Huber Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 1:00 PM To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Subject: MtMan-List: Camp names Frank, Camp names can be given formally in a ceremony or naturally by common usage. You're not supposed to have to like your common-usage name. In the circle of "skinners" our family traveled in, we evolved a "naming ceremony" for young people of a certain age. Among males it was generally the celebration of the thirteenth birthday. Among females (who mature earlier) it was done when thought appropriate by the Women's Society. On the two occasions of female naming I participated in, it involved a passing and progression. One young woman taking over the family after the death of her father and the other woman leaving to attend college. In both genders it often involved much emotion. The young males endured a "gauntlet". They had to proceed slowly down two parallel lines of adults who would step out one at a time and speak on the observations of the growth of the "boy- becoming-man" and suggest a name. The adult would step back into line, often delivering the boy a whack on the bottom as he passed to the next adult. At the end of the line was the boy's father who considered the names proposed and declared the final name the young man would be known as. Gifts were usually presented to the "new man" entering the family after this. Among the women, the adults formed a circle and the new woman walked around the circle stopping in front of each adult who had a suggestion and a story. The mother or "Aunt" of the "Girl-becoming-Woman" would bestow the name at the end. The results of the two female ceremonies was "Wind in the Trees Woman" and "Looks East Woman". Both very emotional namings. I received my names by general usage, the one replacing the earlier name. Often times the name marks a major screw-up unfortunately witnessed by your "brothers". My current name was the result of a premature discharge of my Sharps rifle after a long sneak up on a small herd of buffalo bulls on the South Dakota prairie. I would rather my camp name recorded a work of prowess but, unfortunately, I am due to remain: "Shoots-the-Prairie" Larry Huber - ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C05B04.8239D980 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I=20 remember asking this question a while ago Frank, and was told the = same=20 thing.   Names are given, not chosen.   A friend of = mine=20 will probably be called Wrong Way for a while, least until he gets a new = name.    Something about going to Lincon from Kansas = City, by way=20 a Des Moines.  =3D).    And he wasn't exactly = pleased=20 with it much either.  Probably why we still call him=20 that.
So=20 far, I've managed to avoid embarassing myself too much, and haven't = earned a=20 name yet.
 
Todd
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 [mailto:owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Larry=20 Huber
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 1:00 = PM
To:=20 hist_text@lists.xmission.com
Subject: MtMan-List: Camp=20 names

Frank,
    Camp names can be = given=20 formally in a ceremony or naturally by common usage.  You're not = supposed=20 to have to like your common-usage name. 
    In the circle = of=20 "skinners" our family traveled in, we evolved a "naming ceremony" for = young=20 people of a certain age.  Among males it was generally the = celebration of=20 the thirteenth birthday.  Among females (who mature earlier) it = was done=20 when thought appropriate by the Women's Society. On the two occasions = of=20 female naming I participated in, it involved a passing and = progression. =20 One young woman taking over the family after the death of her father = and the=20 other woman leaving to attend college.  In both genders it often = involved=20 much emotion. 
    The young males = endured a=20 "gauntlet".  They had to proceed slowly down two parallel lines = of adults=20 who would step out one at a time and speak on the observations of the = growth=20 of the "boy- becoming-man" and suggest a name.  The adult would = step back=20 into line, often delivering the boy a whack on the bottom as he passed = to the=20 next adult.  At the end of the line was the boy's father who = considered=20 the names proposed and declared the final name the young man would be = known=20 as.  Gifts were usually presented to the "new man" entering the = family=20 after this.
    Among the women, = the adults=20 formed a circle and the new woman walked around the circle stopping in = front=20 of each adult who had a suggestion and a story.  The mother or = "Aunt" of=20 the "Girl-becoming-Woman" would bestow the name at the end.  The = results=20 of the two female ceremonies was "Wind in the Trees Woman" and "Looks = East=20 Woman".  Both very emotional namings.
    I received my = names by general=20 usage, the one replacing the earlier name. Often times the name marks = a major=20 screw-up unfortunately witnessed by your "brothers".  My current = name was=20 the result of a premature discharge of my Sharps rifle after a long = sneak up=20 on a small herd of buffalo bulls on the South Dakota prairie.  I = would=20 rather my camp name recorded a work of prowess but, unfortunately, I = am due to=20 remain:
 
    = "Shoots-the-Prairie" Larry=20 Huber
  
= - ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C05B04.8239D980-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #684 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.