From: roc-owner@xmission.com To: roc-digest@xmission.com Subject: roc Digest V2 #12 Reply-To: roc@xmission.com Errors-To: roc-owner@xmission.com Precedence: roc Digest Thursday, 27 June 1996 Volume 02 : Number 012 In this issue: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection RE: Court Rules for Internet Access Vin's Latest RE: Libertarians Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection Re: Churches burning Re: militia survey to complete Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection Re: militia survey to complete Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection Re: militia survey to complete Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection (Fwd) What's Wrong With This Picture? Re: militia survey to complete See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the roc or roc-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: wootan@dmi.net Date: Wed, 26 Jun 1996 23:27:02 -0700 Subject: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection Chad ended his response to my earlier question with: >IMNSHO this is not any sort of new world order thing or some conspiracy >thing. It is a WIN-WIN situation where we save a base and our ally gets >better training facilities. It seems to me that the D-Day invasion of Normandy would have been a lot greater disaster had we NOT trained with our allies. As it was, it was a minor disaster for our side (Because of insuficient training) and a major disaster for the other team. This question has nothing to do with exchange student police abusing US citizens it would appear. Sorry Monte, I can't follow your reasoning on this one. We seem to be training our allies, not providing them with neutron bombs. The other side of this coin, the side I cannot abide, marches on. Has anyone noticed how quiet things have been of late with regard to the "National Peace Park" or UN training ground that they intend to develope in northwest Washington State. This is a situation where they propose closing the Glacier Peak wilderness area, and millions of other acres to our own public so that UN troops can train there. If you all want to look for black helicopters, I think you will have a better chance of finding them there than in New Mexico. I use the term "black helicopters" as a buzzword only. Most of us who have been in the military know full well that our own troops use black helicopters for night insertions and other such work. Of course we see them on occasion. Besides, on a nice bright day with a thin overcast, I challenge you to tell me that a dark green Huey is NOT black as it flies overhead. Just because Chad, myself, and several others have come out unopposed to the German base in New Mexico does NOT mean we are on board with a UN controlled police state. Quite the opposite. Jerry Wootan ------------------------------ From: righter@aros.net Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 04:17:23 -0600 Subject: RE: Court Rules for Internet Access >>On Sat, 15 Jun 1996, sabutigo@teleport.com wrote: >> I don't know the specific cases you've discussed with the ACLU, but >>I do think there is a difference between the right to free speech picketing, >>and the "non-right (imnsho)" of free action picketing when it infringes on >>someone else's free action. > >Try two lawful pickets on public streets and sidewalks by six to a dozen >people where the police were notified by the picketers two weeks in advance. >One of the picketers was charged with and found guilty of "stalking" for >being at the two pickets (and noting else, according to the judge). Well that certainly sounds strange, but without access to the details and local laws I can't say for sure. >> However, here in Utah, the ACLU is our last bastion of support and hope >>against an ever-increasing theocracy that would willingly deprive me of ALL >>rights. And while we're usually on opposite sides on gun legislation, the >rest >>of the time I support them fully. >> >Its interesting that when a high school valedictorian decided to mention >(not preach about) God in his closing address here in Oregon, the ACLU was >there to defend all Oregonians against "an ever-increasing theocracy that >would willingly deprive [them] of ALL rights." The same ACLU was strangely >silent when the city dedicated its new comvention center being led by a >native American shaman burning sage and chanting prayers to the Great Spirit >and the opening of another city center with the unveiling of Shinto >religious bells being rung by a Shinto priest. Well I'd definitely agree with you that that's WRONG. Alas, it's also "politically correct", which tends to silence the ACLU. >Unless your ideology happens to coincide with theirs, you may as well talk >to the wasll as ask them for help. Your comment that they are "our last >bastion of support and hope against an ever-increasing theocracy that would >willingly deprive me of ALL rights" sounds curiously like you may share some >of their beliefs and thus see them in such a gloroius light. Next time you >need a gun, call the ACLU. Then you'll know who the real "last bastion" is. I DO share a lot of their beliefs. I think most libertarians do. They're far from perfect, and they ignore what they choose not to see, but when they do take on an issue, they do a good job. Hey, the NRA ain't perfect either, and I disagree with a lot of their policies too, but I still support them. Sarah Sarah Thompson, M.D. The Righter PO Box 271231 Salt Lake City, UT 84127-1231 801-468-4637 - voice mail 801-966-7278 - fax righter@aros.net Dedicated to ALL Civil Liberties ------------------------------ From: "Howlin' Blue" Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 05:52:24 -0600 Subject: Vin's Latest FROM MOUNTAIN MEDIA FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE DATED JULY 3, 1996 THE LIBERTARIAN, By Vin Suprynowicz And now: the Federal Bureau of Employment Eligibility My mother's people come from the low-rent corner of Ohio that lies near West Virginia. To my New England Yankee dad, the oratory that used to fill most of the audible frequencies on grandpa's old Philco - in between Patsy Cline and the Statler Brothers - must have seemed like something from another planet. But he did have a kind word for the Reverend Ike: "At least he's honest." We heard them all, on those radio beams bouncing over the coal-dust mountains. The radio preachers who wanted help building overseas missions. The one who vowed that if you placed your hands on the radio you could be healed. And the Reverend Ike. The Reverend Ike said he knew we felt guilty about all that money we had. He knew we felt we didn't deserve it. But never fear, the lord had come to the Reverend Ike and told him the solution: We should send it to him. Not to build a mission in some fly-plagued third-world mudhole. No, "Jesus said you should send the money to me, the Reverend Ike, so that I can build a house. The Lord said he wants you to help me build a beautiful big house for the Reverend Ike and his family." We need more Reverend Ikes. When today's politicians seek unlimited graft and power, do they say, "Give me more power, so I can blackmail my opponents and feed at the public trough forever"? They do not. They speak of the "shared sacrifices" we all must make, waiving some piddling portion of our rights for the "greater good." In exchange, we'll be protected from whatever fresh dark chaos threatens us: the Kaiser and his Huns, the godless Communists, the dastardly drug runners, the capitalist oppressors with their sweat-shops, even ... deadbeat dads. In an address to the American Nurses Association in Washington D.C. on June 18, 1996, William Jefferson Clinton actually proposed that a huge new federal bureaucracy be established to OK or reject every private hire by every firm in the country. Just as you now fill out a form and wait for government approval before you can buy a handgun or get a driver's license or visit another country, a sitting president actually proposed that a vast new federal tyranny be erected so that hungry workers can wait ... how long? for their prospective bosses to receive an OK from Washington to put them to work. Why? To "protect the children," of course. To catch "deadbeat dads." When the president said this, the nurses applauded enthusiastically. No one stood to shout: "Tyrant! You swore an oath to defend the Constitution. Where in that sacred document do you find the express authority for this?" No one even wondered aloud whether the same bureau would arrange to cut off all income from deadbeat moms who refuse to grant divorced fathers the visitation time ordered by these same courts. Yes, for a parent to neglect the support of his natural children is indeed pathetic. But only a tiny minority of job-seekers owe child support, and only a minority of (start ital)those(end ital) are callous scofflaws. Yet to "catch" this tiny minority, we will now require federal screening of all hires? If a man seeking a job is told he can't start work till he pays up, where do we imagine he's going to get the money? The end result can only be to drive such "deadbeat dads" into the lucrative and ever-expanding underground "gray economy," where no one reports anything to the government, anyway, while the rest of us get to pay a huge new employment tax for the privilege of having the government "check us out." And let's suppose, for the moment, that a checker at the new Federal Bureau of Employment Eligibility were to turn from her computer screen and say to her supervisor: "No, this one doesn't owe any child support. But it's a funny thing; since he moved into a new IRS district I don't see any evidence of tax returns being filed for the past three years. There also seems to be a curious pattern of $4,900 money orders drawn on a series of different banks under his SS number. There's an exit visa to Yugoslavia but no return; this one might be a drug or an arms dealer. And there's a note here that he made some anti-government remarks on a call-in radio program in Denver, talking about stockpiling guns in his basement." Do we really think that supervisor is going to say: "Delete that screen, Marcy. We don't care about any of that. We're not authorized to show anything we find here to the IRS, the bank regulators, the BATF or the DEA. So long as he doesn't owe back child support, that's all we care about. Mr. Clinton said he was interested in seeing the little children fed, not expanding the reach of the massive federal police state. Shame on you for even asking: Just queue all that other stuff to trash and tell the employer he's A-OK." Really? Do you really think that's what that supervisor will say? In that case, I wonder if I could invite you to attend a sales presentation for some prime housing lots I'm offering, about 50 miles southwest of Gila Bend, Arizona. ... Vin Suprynowicz is the assistant editorial page editor of the Las Vegas Review-Journal. Readers may contact him via e-mail at vin@intermind.net. The web site for the Suprynowicz column is at http://www.nguworld.com/vindex/ The column is syndicated in the United States and Canada via Mountain Media Syndications, P.O. Box 4422, Las Vegas Nev. 89127. *** Vin Suprynowicz vin@intermind.net "Next year in Galt's Gulch!" ------------------------------ From: righter@aros.net Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 04:57:56 -0600 Subject: RE: Libertarians On Tue, 18 Jun 1996, Larry Tate wrote: >On Tuesday, June 18, 1996 7:05 AM, berg stephen erik[SMTP:z931086@corn.cso.niu.edu] wrote: >[snip] >>Yes, Jefferson was a radical, and he would be >>hated and feared today for his clarity of thought and republican >>principles, if his ideas were still publically taught and discussed. >> > >"if his ideas were still publically taught and discussed" > >This should be the core of any curriculum... public or private. Well, OF COURSE it SHOULD be. But American governement is no longer a required course, seeing as it reeks of Eurocentrism and DWM syndrome. No, the required course here is "Diversity". (Whimper) Sarah Sarah Thompson, M.D. The Righter PO Box 271231 Salt Lake City, UT 84127-1231 801-468-4637 - voice mail 801-966-7278 - fax righter@aros.net Dedicated to ALL Civil Liberties ------------------------------ From: Brad Dolan Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 07:21:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection On Wed, 26 Jun 1996 wootan@dmi.net wrote: > > Just because Chad, myself, and several others have come out unopposed to the > German base in New Mexico does NOT mean we are on board with a UN controlled > police state. Quite the opposite. > > Jerry Wootan > > > Just an interesting observation - to me, anyway - on the topic. A Jewish friend who is normally pretty left of center told me it gave her the creeps to think about the German Army establishing a base in her country. bd ------------------------------ From: righter@aros.net Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 05:28:32 -0600 Subject: Re: Churches burning On Wed, 19 Jun 1996, "Donna J. Logan" wrote: >On Tue, 18 Jun 1996 sabutigo@teleport.com wrote: >> I noticed on the news that so far this year a total of 58 churches >> have been burned down south -- 29 black and 29 white. Insurance figures show >> that about 500 churches are torched each year and that the numbers we're >> hearing on the news are about average. makes on wonder who is drumming up >> all the hype and why there is no investigation of anti-Christian groups is >> being undertaken. Pagans, atheists, and just general estranged malcontents >> from the Jewish and Christian faiths (Fundamentalists Anonymous, et. al.) >> all have their fringe elements. Why no investigation of them? > >Speaking solely from my experience with people considering themselves >"pagan" and/or "wiccan" (NOT "satanists"), they'd be the last to set fire to >churches of any faith, and are usually victims of desecration and violence >themselves. And I sincerely doubt anyone of the Jewish faith is >systematically torching Christian churches. THANK YOU DONNA!! Sarah Thompson, M.D. The Righter PO Box 271231 Salt Lake City, UT 84127-1231 801-966-7278 - fax & voice mail righter@aros.net Dedicated to ALL Civil Liberties ------------------------------ From: Brad Alpert Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 06:46:04 CST Subject: Re: militia survey to complete > > No offence, but why should we? What is she trying to do with this > information? What does being "in earnest" have to do with anything? Why > does she deserve our help? > > How about some detail here. She's doing academic research, on her own initiative. Those of us who have had dealing with her regard her as being on the up-and-up. No big deal, nothing to get paranoid over. Unless you insist on it. :) Brad ------------------------------ From: Liberty or Death Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 06:20:41 -0700 Subject: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection - -snip- >This question has nothing to do with exchange student police abusing US >citizens it would appear. Sorry Monte, I can't follow your reasoning on this >one. We seem to be training our allies, not providing them with neutron >bombs. >-snip- >Just because Chad, myself, and several others have come out unopposed to the >German base in New Mexico does NOT mean we are on board with a UN controlled >police state. Quite the opposite. > >Jerry Wootan What I see going on could be called a series of hundreds of "coincidences," in many seemingly non-related areas, from the military to national parks to global courts. Some of them are no doubt real coincidences, and not part of the "plan." The German base might very well be merely a coincidence, as may some others. But I truly don't believe you can have hundreds of "coincidences" and have them all be simply that. The set up for knock down is real. - - Monte - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> Don't Tread On Me! <<< - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- * Psalm 33 * - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. - Samuel Adams - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- O- ------------------------------ From: caps@visigenic.com (Cap Schwartz) Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 12:33:16 -0700 Subject: Re: militia survey to complete At 10:20 PM 6/26/96 CST, Brad Alpert wrote: >Hi, folks. > >Charlotte Meador is doing this research and she deserves our help. Please the the 3 >minutes required to fill this out and return it to her. She's in earnest. >Thanks - Brad Brad: I cannot find her e-mail address. Could you please post it? Cap ------------------------------ From: boydk Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 12:41:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection On Thu, 27 Jun 1996, Liberty or Death wrote: > -snip- > >Just because Chad, myself, and several others have come out unopposed to the > >German base in New Mexico does NOT mean we are on board with a UN controlled > >police state. Quite the opposite. > > > >Jerry Wootan > > What I see going on could be called a series of hundreds of "coincidences," > in many seemingly non-related areas, from the military to national parks to > global courts. > > Some of them are no doubt real coincidences, and not part of the "plan." > The German base might very well be merely a coincidence, as may some others. > > But I truly don't believe you can have hundreds of "coincidences" and have > them all be simply that. The set up for knock down is real. > > - Monte Well the thing with coincidences is they're all so danged coincidental. The first thing I learned in Syllogistic logic was that there are far more things that -appear- causal or even just logically linked, then things that actually are (the second thing I learned was that I was not going to be getting an A ; ). Compare everything that might exist in the world with the limited things that you are exposed to in a lifetime. Then compare that with the set of things that you are exposed to -and- can truly understand. Frankly it's a miracle any of this "reality" jazz exists at all and I am -never- surprised at the number of seemingly related little coincidences I stumble across. Who was it who said never to attribute to malice what might be caused by stupidity? They were right, generaly. Boyd ------------------------------ From: "Brad Alpert" Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 15:48:22 +0005 Subject: Re: militia survey to complete Cap, I won't be back in front of my home computer for another 30 hours. !I still can't believe I managed to forward her post and whacked off her email address!) Maybe another here who received it could do the favor? - --Brad > I cannot find her e-mail address. Could you > please post it? > Cap > > > ------------------------------ From: neil@geol.niu.edu (Neil Dickey) Date: Thu, 27 Jun 96 16:36:28 CDT Subject: Re: FEMA -- BOSNIA connection Liberty or Death wrote in response to me: >>Regardless of what one feels about the UN, and the various "one-world" >>scenarios, it does appear to me reasonable that allies should make an >>effort to be sure that their armed forces can work together as smoothly >>as possible in the event of war. >> [ Snip ] > >Dateline 1999. > >Well, it took a while to get here; the fact is that we're just one big global >happy family these days. My house is your house. My army is your army. >My strategic nuclear warheads are your strategic nuclear warheads. Alliances have been made, broken, and re-made for as long as history has been recorded. There is nothing particularly modern about making alliances and co-operating with your allies. Neither is there anything particularly sinister in it. If either we or the Germans decide that such an alliance no longer pleases us, the bases they use on our sacred soil will be closed down. You are perfectly free, of course, to believe anything you like, but to paraphrase what Boyd just wrote: Correlation does not in any way imply causation. Causation has to be proven in other ways. The really neat thing about conspiracy theories, of which NWO theories are a sub-species, is that they can never be conclusively proven nor disproven. By definition there's never enough information to form a judgement. Speculation can fill in the gaps, and it's certainly great fun, but, when all has been said and done, and much is said and done, one still knows nothing for certain. For that reason I find them rather unsatisfying. [ Snip ] The opinions which I have expressed herein are entirely my own, unless other- wise noted. No-one else should be held responsible for what I think. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- | D. N. Dickey | Virtuous motives, trammeled by inertia and | | Research Associate | timidity, are no match for armed and | | Northern Illinois Univ. | resolute wickedness. | | neil@earth.geol.niu.edu | - W. S. Churchill | | **Finger for public key** | | - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: "Brad Alpert" Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 20:04:54 +0500 Subject: (Fwd) What's Wrong With This Picture? Folks, Frank is someone I am *very* proud to call a friend of mine. Please read his words and consider whether or not you want to share in his efforts. If you do, email him at bradyco@bradyco.sky.net. - ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- From: "bradyco@sky.net" To: Patriot.Network Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 17:03:07 +0000 Subject: What's Wrong With This Picture? Reply-to: bradyco@sky.net Priority: normal WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE? Reuters News Media moved the following story on Thursday, June 27, 1996 at 2:24 PM, Eastern Daylight Time. Comments and questions have been inserted in the body of the story for your consideration. Clinton Calls for Anti-Terrorism Alliance LYON, France (Reuter) - Standing in a small French town liberated from the Nazis by U.S. and French forces, U.S. President Bill Clinton Thursday called for a new alliance to fight attacks like the bombing that killed 19 U.S. citizens in Saudi Arabia this week. [COMMENT: President Clinton, thus far, has treated the bombing attack like a "crime," rather than an attack on the armed forces of the United States. He has spoken sternly about the need to track down "those who did this," but has made no mention of the nations who finance, train, and provide explosives to terrorist groups (Iran, Iraq, Syria, Libya). He has dispatched FBI agents "to investigate" and he plans to "discuss this" at the G-7 economic summit. Where is the Central Intelligence Agency? If American Intelligence agencies didn't know this was about to happen, why didn't they? When did a terrorist attack on the armed forces of the United States become a "criminal" matter?] ``Fifty-two years ago the French resistance worked here in common cause with American GIs to win your freedom back. Now we must join together to face down the new threat to our freedom,'' Clinton said ahead of a summit of the Group of Seven leading industrial nations in Lyon. [COMMENT: How's that again? Terrorism is clearly a threat to life, but it is a stretch to compare that to the threat to freedom caused by Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union. By what stretch of the imagination does it require a "new alliance" to combat terrorism? Is this necessary to create acceptance of foreign police forces operating within the United States? Why was terrorism even on the agenda at a G-7 ECONOMIC summit, planned long before the Saudi bombing?] ``We must rally the forces of tolerance and freedom everywhere to work against terrorism,'' he added. Clinton spoke in the village square of Perouges, a medieval walled town about 25 miles outside Lyon that was freed from the Nazis in 1944 by U.S. forces and French resistance fighters after fierce tank battles. Hundreds of residents, many of them schoolchildren, crowded the square under a sunny, blue sky, waving U.S. and French flags during the president's brief speech. ``Terrorism is on our minds today because of the cowardly bombing in Saudi Arabia,'' Clinton said. ``We will not rest in our efforts to discover who was responsible, to track them down and to bring them to justice.'' The G7 summit's traditional economic focus has been overshadowed by Tuesday's truck bombing at a military complex near Dhahran, Saudi Arabia that killed 19 U.S. military personnel and injured about 400 U.S., Saudi and Bangladeshi citizens. Clinton said he expected the G7, which includes Britain, Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the United States, to approve 40 specific measures to fight terrorism at the summit, which begins Thursday night and ends Saturday. [COMMENT: How extraordinarily convenient that this bomb creates such mayhem on the very eve of the President's trip to the G-7 where, as it just happens, 40 SPECIFIC MEASURES to fight terrorism have been prepared and will be approved. How long, one wonders, did it take to prepare these "40 specific measures" and why have they not been discussed in the national news media?] U.S. officials said these fall into four categories: making it easier to seize the assets of criminals, making it harder for criminals to hide from international law enforcement, tightening border controls and cracking down on high-tech crimes like computer fraud. They said a proposal to increase information sharing among national police forces was among the most controversial of the 40 measures. [COMMENT: What, exactly, is being proposed to make it easier to "seize the assets of criminal, to make it "harder for criminals to hide from international law enforcement," etc? For that matter, what is met by the term, "international law enforcement?"] To dramatize his call for collective action against terrorism, Clinton alluded to a linden tree in the Perouges town square that was planted shortly after the French revolution and is known locally as ``the tree of liberty.'' "Today's threats to liberty your tree symbolises (sic) are very different rom those of 200 years ago, different from the threats of World War Two or the Cold War,'' he said. ``But they are real and we must face them.'' Perouges was liberated by the U.S. Army's 45th Oklahoma regiment, many of whose soldiers came from Oklahoma City in the state of the same name. [COMMENT: Ah, what imagery. In the blink of an eye, the Oklahoma City bombing and "international terrorism" are linked in the public mind. Who could possibly object to the uniting of governments to counter this "threat?"] On arriving in Perouges, Clinton was greeted by 84-year old Henri Girousse, a French resistance commander who fought with the U.S. soldiers in a tank battle near the town. After attending the summit, Clinton is expected to cut short his trip to France to fly to Florida to attend memorial services Sunday at two Air Force bases to honor those killed in the Saudi attack. Clinton is expected to have dinner in Paris with French President Jacques Chirac as scheduled Saturday night, and then to leave for Florida. He had originally been scheduled to spend Sunday in Paris. [COMMENT: Last night, every major network television news show commented on the "similarity" in the images of the Saudi bombing and the Oklahoma City bombing. A little reflection, however, might produce a different result. The damage in Saudi Arabia was caused, we are told, by a 5,000 pound hi-explosive bomb. In Oklahoma City, the government claims much greater damage to a much larger building was caused by a single 4,000 pound ANFO (fertilizer) bomb. Munitions experts have publicly stated that the Oklahoma City bombing damage could not possibly have been caused by a single ANFO bomb because of the characteristics of blast damage sustained by the Murrah Federal building. What in heaven's name is going on here?] * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * I urge you to post the episodes of this ongoing series to other newsgroups, networks, computer bulletin boards and mailing lists. It is also important to post hardcopies on the bulletin boards in campus halls, churches, supermarkets, laundromats, etc. -- any place where concerned citizens can read this vital information. Our people's need for Paul Reveres and Ben Franklins is as urgent today as it was 220 years ago. Frank Brady bradyco@sky.net ------------------------------ From: Jacques Tucker Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 21:11:37 -0500 Subject: Re: militia survey to complete > >Subject: Re: militia survey to complete >Guys, if you could take 5 minutes to help this nice lady out, I would >appreciate it. >She's in earnest. Brad >*********************** > Aha! Here's Charlotte's email address: >Forwarding note from: charlotte meador 06/26/96 6:14pm -0500 > >Hi- > >As a militia member who has participated in my focus groups for militia >members for my study at the University of Houston, I hope you will >complete the following survey ( the final step of my study) and return it >to me. I will collect all the data, compile it and post the results to the >misc.activism.militia newsgroup around the middle of August. You can >return the survey to me by email or print it out and return by mail at C. >Meador, P. O. Box 1275, Willis, TX 77378. <<<>> "The question is not whether we will be extremists, but what kind of extremists we will be." - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. "A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks." - Thomas Jefferson ------------------------------ End of roc Digest V2 #12 ************************ To subscribe to roc Digest, send the command: subscribe roc-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@xmission.com". 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