From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #234 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Tuesday, April 27 1999 Volume 02 : Number 234 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 25 Apr 99 20:56:46 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: another poll (fwd) On Apr 25, ataylor@nmsu.edu wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] http://www.richmond.com/index.cfm?from=style [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Apr 99 22:26:26 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: SAY WHAT? (fwd) On Apr 24, 206140826@worldnet.att.net wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] SATURDAY, APRIL 24, 1999 23:52:09 DEATH EDUCATION WAS TAUGHT AT COLUMBINE HIGH The school that became the site of one of the nation's worst massacres this week, was in the headlines in the early 90's for offering death education classes to confused students. One student even planned to kill herself after attending one of the classes, ABC NEWS reported in a 20/20 profile back in 1991. "We talked about what we wanted to look like in our casket," student Tara Becker told ABC in an interview. "Tara Becker believes she was seduced into a suicide attempt by her Death Ed class." Tara was a junior at Columbine High in Littleton, Colorado, reported Tom Jarriel. A transcript of the stunning ABC NEWS broadcast was obtained by the DRUDGE REPORT. Anchor Hugh Downs introduced the segment: "Your child could be in a class that only a few years ago might have been unthinkable- death education. These classes are supposed to prepare young people for coping with death and while most schools make it part of a health class, some actually make it an entire course." Becker told the news magazine: "I had thought about [suicide] as a possible option for a lot of years, but I never would have gone through with it, never, because I wasn't brave enough. The things that we learned in the class taught us how to be brave enough to face death." Jarriel summarized: "Graphically introducing death to impressionable young minds is at the core of the controversy over death education in our public schools. Will students walk away from here with clearer understanding of death or with nightmarish memories that might haunt them for life and perhaps, inadvertently, suggest death as an answer to adolescent problems?" _________________________________________________ Reports are moved when circumstances warrant (c)DRUDGE REPORT 1999 [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 19:03:14 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Ceasefire calls for anti-NRA demonstration (fwd) Keep your air sickness bag handy..... On Apr 26, Mikey wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Washington Ceasefire Action Alert 4/26/99 For Immediate Release: April 23, 1999 Submitted By: Washington Ceasefire Bruce Gryniewski Seattle, Washington Phone: (206) 322-7564 Seattle--Washington Ceasefire has called on its members and other like minded individuals from around the country to converge on Denver to protest against the NRA during their shortened 1 day convention in Denver on Saturday, May 1st. We will silently protest against them and their agenda that puts honest, hardworking innocent Americans at risk every day by promoting the widespread use and misuse of firearms. The NRA has been the single most prominent organization that has fought legislation and enforcement of gun laws that would make our community a safer place. They share a large amount of the responsibility for the Littleton Massacre. The protest will be in front of the Convention center that is at 700 14th St (at 14th and California) in Downtown Denver. It is 4 blocks from the Adams Mark Hotel at which the NRA membership will be staying during their visit to the city. The NRA member meeting begins at 10 AM. The silent protest will last from 9 AM to 11 AM in front of the convention center. The Adams Mark Hotel is located at 1550 Court Place Denver CO 80202. (Emphasis added) [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 19:04:21 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Ninety Day Moratorium on Federal Firearms Legislation (fwd) On Apr 26, Jeff Miller wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] RKBA Defender: Please forgive the unsolicited e-mail. If you are reading this message, it is because I pulled your address from a variety of Internet resources, and I believe you will support what I am trying to do. I am advocating a Ninety Day Moratorium on Federal Firearms Legislation that is being proposed in the aftermath of the Littleton shooting. I am asking people to write to their representatives in Congress advocating this position. You can find more information at: http://www.MillerPages.com/NinetyDayMoratorium.html Please pass this information along to anyone you believe may be interested, and thank you for your time. Jeff Miller http://www.millerpages.com === _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 19:06:23 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Another poll (fwd) On Apr 26, Paul A. Miller wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] There's another online poll at www.usatoday.com/news/comment/debate.htm It asks "Do you favor new gun control initiatives," and I was excited about the results: Yes 8.3% No 91.6% but then I saw that only 12 had voted.... Paul [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 19:07:57 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: RAPTUS: Fwd: Perilous Times items (4/26/99) (fwd) On Apr 26, Sarahanna Richards wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Hello All, This is a bit much if ya ask me. IS there no privacy for anyone?? IN HIS GRIP, SArahanna ***************************************************** > Know Your Passenger: FAA Introduces New Screening Rules > >The Federal Aviation Administration proposed new rules on April 20 for >increasing airline security by requiring that all airlines conduct >computerized profiling of all passengers on domestic flights. The new >program, called Computer Assisted Passenger Screening (CAPS), would >use data from airline computers and secret profiling standards to >select passengers for additional questioning and searches. > >Under the new rules, airlines would select passengers for increased >scrutiny based on internal profiling standards. They would also >randomly select some passengers for the "deterrent value that would >increase airline passenger safety." The FAA funded the program, >paying the carriers over $10 million to develop CAPS. The new rules' >details on who would be targeted by the automated systems are not >revealed for security reasons. However, the Department of Justice has >determined that the rules raise no civil liberties concerns. > >The rules are based on the recommendations of the White House >Commissioner on Aviation Safety and Security, led by Vice President Al >Gore. The Gore Commission issued its report in 1997 and was >criticized by a coalition of groups for its intrusive proposals. The >proposed rules recognize that there have been few actual incidents of >the sort that CAPS seeks to address (the only one reported was in >1979), but links unrelated occurrences such as the World Trade Center >bombing and the accidental crash of TWA Flight 800 as justification >for the stringent new procedures. The FAA estimates that it will cost >between $50 million and $70 million to implement the program, which >will be paid by the airlines and presumably passed onto passengers. > >Comments are due on the proposal by June 18, 1999. They can be >e-mailed to 9-NPRM-CMTS@faa.gov. More information on the proposed >rules, airline security and privacy issues is available at: >http://www.epic.org/privacy/faa/ (EPIC ALERT 4-99) > > > "Orwell Awards" Presented to Biggest U.S. Privacy Invaders > >Privacy International presented its first Orwell Awards on April 7 >to the worst corporate and government privacy invaders in the United >States. Privacy International's Director, Simon Davies, said the >awards were designed to raise awareness of the erosion of privacy >rights in the U.S. "Surveillance over our private lives has reached a >dangerous new level. It's time to turn the spotlight around and shine >it on the invaders." The awards were presented at the Computers, >Freedom and Privacy (CFP99) conference in Washington, DC. > >A total of five awards were announced, but most recipients were not on >hand to receive them. The winner in the "Worst Public Official" >category was Rep. Bill McCollum (R-FL) for his numerous activities in >Congress opposing privacy, including pushing through a law increasing >wiretapping approved last year, several bills promoting the creation >of a national ID card, opposition to efforts to improve financial >privacy, and his recent efforts to amend the SAFE encryption bill to >mandate key escrow. Runners-up were New York Mayor Rudolph Giuliani >(for his suggestion to take DNA samples of all children at birth) and >Ambassador David Aaron and White House Advisor Ira Magaziner (for >their travels around the world promoting encryption restrictions and >opposing privacy laws). > >The Federal Depository Insurance Corporation received the award for >"Most Invasive Proposal" for its "Know Your Customer" proposal (see >EPIC Alert 6.05). The runners-up were the Communications Assistance >for Law Enforcement Act (CALEA) and the FAA's Airline ID Program. The >"Greatest Corporate Invader" award went to Elensys Inc., a Woburn, >Massachusetts company that has secretly collected the pharmacy records >of millions of consumers from 15,000 pharmacies nationwide. The >runners-up were Intel for the Pentium III Processor Serial Number >(designed to identify and track users) and ImageData for its attempts >to create a national database of drivers license photographs. > >The "Lifetime Menace" award went to the Federal Bureau of >Investigation for its activities over the past 80 years, including >CALEA, COINTELPRO, and its efforts on information warfare. Runners-up >were the Direct Marketing Association, the National Security Agency, >and credit bureau TransUnion Corp. Finally, Microsoft Corp. received >the "People's Choice" award for the Global User ID Number, Open >Profiling System, and the proposed P3P standard. The other candidates >were Intel, President Clinton and Special Prosecutor Kenneth Starr. > >Two "Brandeis" Awards were presented to individuals who have made an >outstanding contribution to the protection of privacy, as well as to >victims of privacy invasion who have successfully fought back. Phil >Zimmermann, author of the encryption program Pretty Good Privacy, and >Diana Mey, a West Virginia housewife who successfully took on Sears >telemarketers, were the recipients this year. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 22:40:53 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: McGehee's News & Comment - April 26, 1999 (fwd) On Apr 26, Kevin McGehee wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] McGEHEE'S NEWS & COMMENT (c) 1999 KEVIN McGEHEE North Pole, Alaska mcgehee@mosquitonet.com http://www.mosquitonet.com/~mcgehee/ Permission granted to anyone wishing to forward, redistribute, or broadcast this article WITH FULL ATTRIBUTION. ================================================================ THE MONSTERS ARE NOT THE VICTIMS, OKAY? (Now that a decent interval has passed since the Littleton atrocity...) Some, predictably enough, are blaming guns. Others are blaming Marilyn Manson, or the shooters' parents. But from the looks of things the growing consensus appears to be that the Societal Evil that inspired the two junior lunatics to turn Columbine High School into a slaughterhouse was (drum roll, please)... HIGH SCHOOL CLIQUES. Well, heck, if I had known that being on the outs with all the cool high school cliques could excuse mass murder, God only knows what I could have gotten away with. If only I had been in high school twenty years later than I was, that is. In fact, everyone who was "dissed" by the jocks/cheerleaders/chess team/whatever in high school, please raise your hands. Quite a turnout. How many of you have ever committed a mass murder? Anyone? Okay, let's get serious. The lessons to be drawn from what happened in Littleton are many and varied. For those who regard misfits -- themselves or others -- as victims, the lesson would be that children need to be taught not to "dis" one another. Those of us in the real world -- misfits or not -- see it a little differently. A song by The Eagles comes to mind, name of "Get Over It." I doubt anyone gets through adolescence without having his or her feelings wadded up like a used Kleenex and stomped flat at least a hundred times. One could argue, and I would do so happily, that this is what adolescence is FOR. All during childhood each of us was the center of the universe -- to our parents if we're lucky, to ourselves even if we're unlucky -- and it is this delusion that must be shed before we can rightfully assume the title of "mature adult." Nature is clever, but not very gentle: that period of years during which our bodies become physically mature is also the perfect time during which that childhood delusion gets, well, wadded up like a used Kleenex and stomped flat -- until we finally stop picking it up and smoothing it out like a security blanket, whereupon we graduate to adulthood. This, like the existence of cliques, has been true since the beginning of time, yet only lately have we seen misfit kids take bloody revenge for the routine battering of their childish self-regard. Perhaps this is because our popular culture has in so many ways taken an attitude of disdain for maturity -- for doing the grown-up thing and having a grown-up outlook on life. Everyone is encouraged to find a way to be the victim, everyone is encouraged to look upon *their* wants and *their* feelings as paramount. Although it's still rare, thank God, for people to "take out" those who irritate them, there is a profound undercurrent of dehumanization in America today. The human fetus is a blob of tissue; people of different ethnic backgrounds are not individuals but representatives of their race, as faceless as if they were wearing hoods; even one's life partner and children are subject to being discarded if they merely become inconvenient. Back when true maturity was held in high regard, our society still had its troubles, yes. In every generation there have been those who never grew up enough to get over the shock of discovering that the universe doesn't revolve around them, who spend their lives trying to reset the world on that illusory spindle so that the comfortable delusions of childhood can be preserved. The whiners, the professional victims. Those people, in those generations, were the exception. I don't really believe they have yet become the rule, but the culture certainly seems bent on making it that way. And I do mean *bent*. In their own minds, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were the victims. Let's not join them in their delusion. - -30- April 26, 1999 ================================================================ **Visit the McGEHEE'S NEWS & COMMENT archives** http://www.mosquitonet.com/~mcgehee/news&comment/ The views expressed herein are entirely those of the author(s), and do not reflect those of any person or group with whom the author(s) may be affiliated, unless explicitly labelled as doing so. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 99 22:41:38 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fw: EIA Communique - 4/26 (fwd) On Apr 26, Kevin McGehee wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, April 26, 1999 11:58 AM Subject: EIA Communique - 4/26 The Education Intelligence Agency COMMUNIQU=C9 - April 26, 1999 Now on the Web at http://members.aol.com/educintel/eia + How committed to democratic practices are the teachers' unions? Critic= s, including EIA, are never slow to emphasize those instances when union democracy falls short of union rhetoric about democracy. In North Carolin= a, NEA's state affiliate silenced those critics. The North Carolina Associat= ion of Educators (NCAE) is so committed to democracy, it repealed the laws of mathematics through a majority vote. For the past few months, the biggest internal issue for NCAE has been whether to grant full membership rights to ESPs (education support person= nel - -- custodians, bus drivers, teachers' aides, et al.). Most NEA state affiliates already do this, the notable exceptions being California, Connecticut and Hawaii. NCAE's elected leaders were forceful in their advocacy of the ESP inclusion amendment. NCAE President Joyce Elliott (wh= o, interestingly enough, is running for vice president, while her vice president, Geraldine McNeill, runs unopposed for president) called it "th= e right thing to do." NCAE publications listed the locals and districts tha= t supported the amendment and admitted to "intensive lobbying by NCAE leade= rs." As with all constitutional amendments, the ESP inclusion measure required a two-thirds majority of the NCAE Representative Assembly to pas= s. The day of the vote, banners, fliers and buttons reading "ESP Yes!" were = seen everywhere. NEA national headquarters provided financial assistance to th= e amendment supporters. A long debate was held, and then 1,304 delegates vo= ted. The final result was 869 in favor and 435 against. The measure was pronounced "passed." Opponents of the measure (evidently led by math teachers) challenged the result, pointing out that the measure fell one vote short of a two-th= irds majority, and had in fact received only 66.6411 percent of the vote. The challenge, however, required a majority vote of delegates, which it did n= ot receive (naturally). The definition of "two-thirds" thus succumbed to the will of the majority and ESPs are now full voting members of NCAE -- able= to participate in the upcoming election of NCAE officers. + More fun with democracy is on display in Rhode Island. Last month, EIA reported on a decision by the U.S. First Circuit Court of Appeals upholdi= ng the eviction of 24 top teacher union officials from the state's public employees' pension plan. These officials claimed the time spent on union = work as public employee time. Since pension payments are based on salary, the state found itself asked to dole out huge amounts of money. For example, current AFT Vice President Edward McElroy (a former Rhode Island union president) contributed $34,400 to the pension fund and would have receive= d a benefit of $550,000 -- in addition to his union pension. The circuit court ruled that the union officials were never public employees for pension purposes and ruled their eviction legal. But it isn= 't over yet. NEA Rhode Island had already called in the big guns for this ca= se - -- namely NEA General Counsel Robert Chanin. Last week, NEARI's executive board voted to spend union funds on an appeal. Some local officials balke= d at the vote, since it was held without first placing it on the board's agend= a, without copies of the court's decision, and without copies of counsels' opinions. This week, former NEARI President Ronald L. DiOrio and former N= EARI Executive Director Donald Hill will be tried on conspiracy and pension fr= aud charges. Both men stand accused of misrepresenting DiOrio's employment st= atus in order to gain him a state pension. + I posted the following editorial on the EIA website last Friday under = the headline "Who's Really to Blame for the Columbine High School Massacre?" = For those of you who may have missed it, here it is: For the last few days, Americans have been subjected to gut-wrenching images of bloody carnage. Their natural reaction has been to ask why such barbarism occurred -- particularly on a school campus. And there has been= no shortage of commentators with theories. They're all wrong. First and foremost, neither the school, the teachers, the principal, the school board, nor the district were responsible for what happened. No= r was it the Internet, video games, Gothism, violent movies, teasing, homophobia, racism, the NRA, Adolf Hitler or trenchcoats. It wasn't a lac= k of safety precautions and it wasn't a shortage of school counselors. It coul= d have happened in a supermarket or a church instead of a school. Who is responsible for the massacre? Eric Harris, Dylan Klebold and whoever else helped them. That's all. These adolescents were evil, mentally deranged or both. Some have asked why no one "reached out" to Harris and Klebold. You don't "reach ou= t" to Charles Manson and Jeffrey Dahmer. If you're lucky, they make a mistak= e and you get the handcuffs on them before they kill. This time, we weren't lucky. Many young people use the Internet -- including the victims. They see violent movies and play video games. They feel alienated and depressed ma= ny times in their young lives. It's a very long step from that to building propane pipe bombs in the basement of your suburban home and shooting you= r schoolmates in the face. Let's not make Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold the symbols of a generation. Let's remember the 12 students and 1 teacher who had earned t= he respect and love of their peers, and who will have no more opportunities = to pass that respect and love on to others. + In one of its few public disclosures since the election debacle of Apr= il 6, the Milwaukee Teachers Education Association admitted that "[m]ore mem= bers participated in this election -- and in more direct activities -- than ev= er before." The result? Low turnout and five losses in five races. What's mo= re, the Wisconsin Education Association Council commissioned a poll and discovered that a majority of residents had no positive comments about th= e state's public schools. WEAC President Terry Craney called the informatio= n "sobering." But he has a brilliant solution: a PR campaign to convince th= ese citizens they're wrong! Of course, such a monumental task isn't cost-free= , so Craney proposed an as-yet-unspecified dues increase to find just the righ= t public relations firm to pull it off. Who says outsourcing is all bad? + People for the American Way released a report revealing the vast (yawn= ) conspiracy being perpetrated by the Children's Scholarship Fund. The fund made national headlines last week when it announced the names of 40,000 private scholarship winners out of the 1.25 million applications it recei= ved. This report lacks the normally obligatory "flow chart" of interconnection= s between these evil geniuses (if John Walton charged residuals for the use= of his bio by left-wing groups, he wouldn't need Wal-Mart). That's too bad. = I was very much looking forward to finding out where Charles Rangel, Colin Powell, Erskine Bowles, Tom Daschle, Andrew Young, Michael Ovitz, Will Sm= ith and Oprah Winfrey fit in this plot. Of course, CSF's Board of Advisors do= es contain the one absolutely necessary ingredient for any dark conspiracy: Henry Kissinger. + The Deseret News (Utah) joined the growing list of newspapers that published a story on EIA's report, Measure for Measure: A Magnified Look = at Standardized Test Scores. Still available through the mail, free, from EI= A. + Quote of the Week: "The NEA needs to get out of the way. We can't allo= w the union's sacred cows to block the path of members who want to pursue t= heir own vision of school quality, and school renewal and reform." -- NEA President Bob Chase in the April 20 Christian Science Monitor. # # # The Education Intelligence Agency conducts public education research, analysis and investigations. Director: Mike Antonucci. Ph: 916-422-4373. = Fax: 916-392-1482. E-Mail: EducIntel@aol.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 09:36:00 -0700 From: Kenneth Mitchell Subject: Re: Another poll (fwd) Yet another gun poll, at MSNBC: http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken Mitchell Citrus Heights, CA kmitchel@gvn.net 916-955-9152 (vm) 916-729-0966 (fax) - --------------http://www.gvn.net/~creative/------------------------ "Compared to the Clintons, Reagan is living proof than a Republican with half a brain is better than a Democrat with two." P.J. O'Rourke - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Buy This Stamp! http://www.usps.gov/images/stamps/99/ayn_rand.htm - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Worried about the "Good Times" or "AOL4FREE" viruses? Check out the Urban Legends page at http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/ for the facts! - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:20:14 -0700 From: Kenneth Mitchell Subject: Re: Another poll (fwd) And another... http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/guncontrol990427.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken Mitchell Citrus Heights, CA kmitchel@gvn.net 916-955-9152 (vm) 916-729-0966 (fax) - --------------http://www.gvn.net/~creative/------------------------ "The constitutions of most of our States assert, that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves, in all cases to which they think themselves competent, ... or they may act by representatives, freely and equally chosen; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, and freedom of the press." "The Living Thoughts of Thomas Jefferson", pp.46 - 47, Presented by John Dewey - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Buy This Stamp! http://www.usps.gov/images/stamps/99/ayn_rand.htm - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Worried about the "Good Times" or "AOL4FREE" viruses? Check out the Urban Legends page at http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/ for the facts! - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:39:38 -0700 From: Kenneth Mitchell Subject: Re: Another poll (fwd) At 09:36 AM 4/27/1999 -0700, I wrote: >Yet another gun poll, at MSNBC: > >http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp My apologies; apparently this poll is visible only to Internet Explorer users; Netscape people need not apply. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken Mitchell Citrus Heights, CA kmitchel@gvn.net 916-955-9152 (vm) 916-729-0966 (fax) - --------------http://www.gvn.net/~creative/------------------------ "The constitutions of most of our States assert, that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves, in all cases to which they think themselves competent, ... or they may act by representatives, freely and equally chosen; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, and freedom of the press." "The Living Thoughts of Thomas Jefferson", pp.46 - 47, Presented by John Dewey - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Buy This Stamp! http://www.usps.gov/images/stamps/99/ayn_rand.htm - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Worried about the "Good Times" or "AOL4FREE" viruses? Check out the Urban Legends page at http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/ for the facts! - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 10:48:24 +0100 From: boyd@seanet.com Subject: Re: Another poll (fwd) You may wish to click on the "write us" link at the bottom of that page and send a message something like: - --------------------- Why is the poll at http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp#BODY not visible to users of netscape navigator 4.5? Boyd Kneeland - --------------------- In your own words of course. I chose to send that to the opinions editor link on the "write us" page (wich may be incorrect, I'm not sure). Hope you'll let them know what you think of this. Boyd Kneeland Kenneth Mitchell wrote: > > At 09:36 AM 4/27/1999 -0700, I wrote: > >Yet another gun poll, at MSNBC: > > > >http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp > > My apologies; apparently this poll is visible only to Internet Explorer > users; Netscape people need not apply. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ken Mitchell Citrus Heights, CA kmitchel@gvn.net > 916-955-9152 (vm) 916-729-0966 (fax) > --------------http://www.gvn.net/~creative/------------------------ > "The constitutions of most of our States assert, that all power is > inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves, in > all cases to which they think themselves competent, ... or they > may act by representatives, freely and equally chosen; that it is > their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled > to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, > and freedom of the press." "The Living Thoughts of Thomas Jefferson", > pp.46 - 47, Presented by John Dewey > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Buy This Stamp! http://www.usps.gov/images/stamps/99/ayn_rand.htm > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Worried about the "Good Times" or "AOL4FREE" viruses? Check out the > Urban Legends page at http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/ for the facts! > > - - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 11:16:57 +0100 From: boyd@seanet.com Subject: Re: Another poll (fwd) the URL to use for comments about their non interoperable design is: http://www.msnbc.com/modules/feedback/techsup.asp?http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp#BODY If this URL is wrapped in email paste it into a text tool like notepad and make it one line before pasting it into your browser. Boyd boyd@seanet.com wrote: > > You may wish to click on the "write us" link at the bottom of that page > and send a message something like: > --------------------- > Why is the poll at > http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp#BODY > not visible to users of netscape navigator 4.5? > Boyd Kneeland > --------------------- > In your own words of course. I chose to send that to the opinions editor > link on the "write us" page (wich may be incorrect, I'm not sure). Hope > you'll let them know what you think of this. Boyd Kneeland > > Kenneth Mitchell wrote: > > > > At 09:36 AM 4/27/1999 -0700, I wrote: > > >Yet another gun poll, at MSNBC: > > > > > >http://www.msnbc.com/news/262926.asp > > > > My apologies; apparently this poll is visible only to Internet Explorer > > users; Netscape people need not apply. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Ken Mitchell Citrus Heights, CA kmitchel@gvn.net > > 916-955-9152 (vm) 916-729-0966 (fax) > > --------------http://www.gvn.net/~creative/------------------------ > > "The constitutions of most of our States assert, that all power is > > inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves, in > > all cases to which they think themselves competent, ... or they > > may act by representatives, freely and equally chosen; that it is > > their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled > > to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, > > and freedom of the press." "The Living Thoughts of Thomas Jefferson", > > pp.46 - 47, Presented by John Dewey > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Buy This Stamp! http://www.usps.gov/images/stamps/99/ayn_rand.htm > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Worried about the "Good Times" or "AOL4FREE" viruses? Check out the > > Urban Legends page at http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/ for the facts! > > > > - > > - - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 99 13:06:17 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Guns in schools? (fwd) On Apr 27, hes@unity.ncsu.edu wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Someone sent me this - it is an AP article, but I wonder whether you'll see it in your local paper which as access to AP material? Note that this is copyrighted - so don't "publish" it. - --henry schaffer >Words of praise may be directed to Dwight Creech, Principal, >Calvary Christian School, 400 S. Bennett Street, Southern Pines, >NC 28387 or phone 910-692-8311! This school welcomes guns in class Associated Press (NC) April 27, 1999 SOUTHERN PINES, N.C. (AP) While most schools ban guns on campuses, one private school in North Carolina welcomes them at least during its gun safety courses. Principal Dwight M. Creech, one of two National Rifle Association-certified instructors for the program, said gun safety is an important part of the curriculum for students from kindergarten through 12th grade at Calvary Christian School. Education is needed to counter the fantasy images of guns as portrayed in movies and on television, he said. The shootings in Littleton, Colo., will not affect the program, he said. "One of the most important reasons for us to continue our gun education program is that there is a gun education program going on almost every night in the home of almost every American family," Creech said. "They get hundreds of hours of fantasy and outrage with no opportunity to separate truth from error." "I think it's child abuse, to not afford children educational programs of this type," Creech said. The program teaches students in kindergarten through sixth grade that > if they see a gun, they should not touch it and should find an adult to deal with it. Students identify safe and unsafe ways to deal with guns and take part in role-playing exercises in which one child hypothetically finds a gun. Creech said he knows some critics disapprove of gun safety education in schools. "I would question their knowledge of guns, and I would also question their rationale," he says. "As you think about the other kinds of dangerous things people have to deal with in the course of growing up, such as driving an automobile, what's the difference? "One of the things I think causes the general public to be uneasy about guns is, they often associate guns with the criminal mind. Guns have nothing to do with the criminal mind." The booklets used in the kindergarten through 6th grade programs are published and provided by the NRA, which also provides support for the gun safety program for students in grades 7-12. The NRA has given the school $6,000 for the courses since 1996. However, Creech said the program was under way before the NRA got involved. "I think a lot of people are ignorant concerning the National Rifle Association and how much good work they have done over the years," Creech said. "The National Rifle Association is about as American as any institution that I know of." One week of the school year is devoted to gun safety, with each class spending a few minutes of each day discussing material in workbooks. With parental permission, older students can participate in a more intensive gun safety program that takes them to a shooting range, where they get hands-on experience with firearms. That part of the program emphasizes the proper handling and discharge of a gun. ---- AP-NY-04-27-99 0407EDT Copyright (c) 1999 The Associated Press [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #234 *************************