From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #239 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Tuesday, May 11 1999 Volume 02 : Number 239 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 7 May 99 22:54:10 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: RAPTUS: [Fwd: If I Were the Devil...by Paul Harvey] (fwd) On May 07, Krioni wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] > "If I Were the Devil..." by Paul Harvey > >If I were the Prince of Darkness, I would want to engulf the whole world in >darkness. And I would have one-third of the real estate and four-fifths of >the population , but I wouldn't be happy until I had the ripest apple on the >tree. So I'd set about, however necessary, to take over the United States. > >I'd subvert the churches first; I'd begin with a campaign of whispers. >With the wisdom of a serpent I would whisper to you as I whispered to Eve: >"Do as you please." > >To the youth I would whisper, "The Bible is a myth." > >I would convince them that man made God instead of the other way around. > >I would confide that what's bad is good and what's good is "square." > >In the ears of the young married I would whisper that work is debasing, >that cocktail parties are good for you. > >And to the old I would teach to pray after me: "Our Father, who art in >Washington..." > >And then I'd get organized; I'd educate authors in how to make lurid >literature exciting, so that everything else would appear dull and >uninteresting. > >I'd threaten television with dirtier movies and vice versa. > >I'd peddle narcotics to whom I could; I'd sell alcohol to ladies and >gentlemen of distinction; I'd tranquilize the rest with pills. > >If I were the Devil I'd soon have families at war with themselves, >churches at war with themselves, and nations at war with themselves; until >each in its turn was consumed. And with promises of higher ratings I'd have >mesmerizing media fanning the flames. > >If I were the Devil I'd encourage schools to refine young intellects but >neglect to discipline emotions: let those run wild. Before you know it, >you'd have to have drug-sniffing dogs and metal detectors at every school >house door. Within a decade I'd have prisons overflowing. > >With flattery and promises of power I would get the courts to do what I >construe as against God and in favor of pornography. > >I'd designate an atheist to front for me before the highest courts and I'd >get the preachers to say, "She's right." Thus, I could evict God from the >courthouse, then from the school house, and then from the Houses of >Congress. > >And in His own churches I would substitute psychology for religion and >deify science. I would lure priests and pastors into misusing boys, girls, >and church money. > >If I were the Devil I would make the symbol of Easter an egg and the >symbol of Christmas a bottle. > >If I were the Devil I'd take from those who have and give it to those who >want it, until I had killed the incentive of the ambitious. > >What'll you bet that I couldn't get whole States to promote gambling as >the way to get rich? > >I would caution against extremes: in hard work, in patriotism, and in >moral conduct. > >I would convince the youth that marriage is old-fashioned, but swinging is >more fun; that what you see on television is the way to be; and thus I could >undress you in public and I could lure you into bed where there are diseases >for which there is no cure. > >Then I would separate families, putting children in uniform, women in coal >mines and objectors in slave-labor camps. > >In other words, if I were the Devil, I'd just keep doing what he's doing. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 May 99 22:54:59 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: SLICK: An idea whose time has come (fwd) On May 8, RichSlick@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Just in case you are the only one on the internet who doesn't know who Ron Paul is, he's one the new generation of conservative Congressmen=20 that the mass media thinks is an aberration of the electoral process.=20 Rather than tell you why I like and respect the man, I'll let him tell you=20 him self. Rich Martin Editor of Slick Liberty Study Committee Dear Friend of Liberty - Rep. Ron Paul asks,=20 "Will you help me save America from the United Nations?" I have reintroduced H.R. 1146 - American Sovereignty=20 Restoration Act of 1999. Last year, the Establishment was taken=20 by surprise when we got 54 votes in favor of getting us out of the U.N. This year, if we do our job, we can leave the hate-America=20 bureaucrats at the U.N.in shock. Here's the plan on how we get things moving. Legislation has sponsors and co-sponsors. I'm the sponsor of H.R. 1146. =20 Co-sponsors are other U.S. House Members who put their names=20 on the legislation after it is written to say, "Yes, I'm for this too!" Like ground troops in hand-to-hand battle, the more co-sponsors=20 we have signed up with the American Sovereignty Restoration=20 Act of 1999, the better our chances of breaking through enemy=20 Lines. Make no mistake, the enemies of freedom will be armed with all=20 the dirty tricks in the book of Capitol-Hill politics. They will try=20 to kill our legislation before it can come up for a vote. Why? Because H.R. 1146 would shut down the U.N.=20 Headquarters and cut off all American funding for the U.N. Including all of its agencies as well as its funding and participation In U.N. "peacekeeping" operations. H.R. 1146 would also revoke Diplomatic immunity for U.N. bureaucrats. H.R. 1146 makes our message crystal clear: U.S. out of the U.N. The global-government types will go nuts. Here's our strategy. Each Member of Congress who voted for=20 H.R. 1146 last year should be urged to become a co-sponsor this=20 Year. Please contact your Representative first, and then as many=20 others as you can. The more co-sponsors we have, the better=20 chance we have for victory. (If you do not know the name of your Representative, send the number of your district, and state, and we will supply you with the name) We're already ahead of the game with 14 current co-sponsors. =20 But that's not good enough. If you do your job now, we have a=20 chance to get over 50 co-sponsors of this legislation to ditch=20 the U.N. This means your Liberty Study Committee is open for business - with a BANG. Our mission is=85to improve the well-being of=20 humankind by defending and advancing liberty. Can you think of a better way of accomplishing our mission than by defending=20 American Sovereignty? Since its founding 52 years ago, Americans have poured over=20 $30 billion into the U.N. monstrosity. Americans pay 25% of all U.N. bills and a whopping 31%of all "peacekeeping" costs. Now, U.N. bureaucrats want $2 billion in "back dues" and the=20 Right to tax us directly on airline tickets, phone calls and=20 international transactions! They want to put their hand directly=20 into our pockets without having to go through the U.S. Congress=20 to pay for their lavish lifestyles=85And I haven't even mentioned=20 the U.N. "standby" army for which the Clinton administration=20 gave the U.N. seed money last year. =85And all this says nothing about the U.N. conventions and=20 treaties that endanger individual rights and are designed to take=20 control of U.S. lands and property rights, as well as regulate=20 human behavior. Help me tell the globalists: "Pack your bags!" You are a Liberty Study Committee activist. What you do today =20 Counts for Liberty tomorrow. I have good news! Over 10 fellow Members of Congress have=20 officially signed up with the LSC team! That's twice the number=20 we had expected. I'll be writing more about who these courageous and determined fellow crusaders are. This is an important moment. You have a decision to make. Will you tell other like-minded=20 friends about the Liberty Study Committee? Show them this letter. Urge them to sign up as an activist. Make up your mind to take this letter to three more potential=20 activists and become a recruiter for Liberty. Ask your friends to=20 send me their address, telephone, fax and E-mail information so=20 they can promptly receive "Liberty Updates" and "Liberty Alerts." Use the address and E-mail below to contact me. Have them mail or E-mail that information as soon as possible. This information is vital as very often we have only 24-hours notice before an=20 important vote. The enemies of freedom know this time constraint=20 makes it difficult to rally our troops which is the very reason they=20 spring critical votes on us with little notice! We're organizing the resistance! You are working with us, ten=20 other Members of the U.S. House of Representatives and with=20 thousands of other Americans - who have had enough. It's up to=20 you. Contact as many Members of the Congress as possible,=20 encourage them to co-sponsor H.R. 1146. Next, recruit three=20 friends, and their three friends to help swell the ranks of the Army=20 of Liberty. E-mail: p51@wi.net Address: Liberty Study Committee PO Box 085692 Racine, WISC 53408-5682 [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 99 08:32:49 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fwd: U.S. Senate Vote Coming (fwd) On May 10, ASSETNJ@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:05:07 -0400 From: Gun Owners of America Reply-To: Gun Owners of America To: goamail@gunowners.org Subject: U.S. Senate Vote Coming U.S. Senate Set To Vote On Gun Control - -- Ask your Senator to oppose Clinton's anti-gun agenda Gun Owners of America E-Mail/FAX Alert 8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151 Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408 http://www.gunowners.org (Friday, May 7, 1999)-- It's been a busy week. You guys did an outstanding job directing attention upon the Second Amendment compromises occurring in Austin, Texas. Gov. George Bush's office stated they received hundreds upon hundreds of phone calls and other contacts from concerned gun owners. This sends a tremendous message to a man who aspires to the presidency in the year 2000. But now it's time to shift your focus from Texas to Washington, D.C. As you well know, the Colorado tragedy has spawned a feeding frenzy among the political left, and next week, gun control is going to be the topic in the United States Senate. Debate over a juvenile crime bill (S. 254) is scheduled to begin on Tuesday. Your hard work last year has resulted in the virtual sanitizing of this crime bill. But the greatest danger now is that many Senators are planning to offer anti-gun amendments-- many of them containing the President's proposals. Legislative contacts in the Senate have told GOA that some Republicans are wilting. Some feel that they have to vote for something; that they have to support some kind of gun control. So it is important that you start contacting your Senators right away. According to legislative and media sources on Capitol Hill, four issues where Republican Senators could "buckle under" are the following: imposing instant "registration" checks for private sales at gun shows, banning the imports of large-capacity magazines, banning young adults from possessing semi-autos, and holding parents responsible for crimes that a minor commits with their firearm. To make matters worse, former NRA first Vice President Neal Knox reported in the Shotgun News (6/1/99) that the NRA might be willing to consider extending the instant check to private sales at gun shows. Knox writes that at the recent NRA convention in Denver: "[NRA Executive Vice President Wayne] LaPierre clearly offered a compromise with President Clinton's campaign to require 'Instant Checks' on private sales at gun shows. He said: 'We will consider instant checks at gun shows when, and only when, this Administration stops demanding new gun taxes and stops illegally compiling the records of millions of lawful gun buyers.' "President Charlton Heston went even further this morning on ABC 'This Week' by saying he was 'in favor' of gun show background checks if the government does not keep records on buyers." If this is the NRA's official position, it will make it very difficult for Senators to see that background checks are ALWAYS a constitutional infringement, and to see that such checks will ALWAYS give officials an opportunity to register gun buyers-- regardless of how many "protections" are printed in the law. [Note: USA Today also reported Heston's position on the young adult gun ban (one of the amendments mentioned above that Republicans might help pass). The paper reported today (5/7/99) that "NRA President Charlton Heston says he supports a ban on juvenile possession of semiautomatic assault weapons"-- or in other words, a ban on any semi-auto Clinton deems is politically incorrect.] Senate staffers have told GOA that Senators not only need to hear opposition to gun control from the grassroots, but that Senators need to hear what they can vote IN FAVOR of-- what they can support. GOA has responded in the following manner: Support a repeal of the School Zones Gun Ban. This law, prohibiting the possession of a firearm within 1,000 feet of a school, has not stopped kids from shooting up schools. But it does threaten to penalize decent Americans like Joel Myrick of Pearl, Mississippi who used his firearm to subdue a gunman in 1997. Good people should not have to face the prospects of felony charges for defending the lives of others. Consider how absurd such a ban would be if we applied it to cars. More Americans die in cars than by guns every year. And just recently, a nut in California intentionally ran over several children on a play ground-- killing two. Should we now ban cars within 1,000 feet of a schoolyard? Why are these suggestions absurd when applied to cars, but not to guns? HERE'S WHAT TO DO: Please contact your two Senators (202-224-3121; see the GOA website for fax and e-mail info). Ask them to vote against any and all infringements of the Second Amendment-- no matter how "minor" the infringement may appear on its face. Ask them to support a repeal of the Gun Free Zones law which punishes law-abiding citizens for defending themselves-- and which does nothing to keep guns out of the "wrong hands." P.S. There is also a proposal being considered in some Senate offices that would halt the march toward more gun control by requiring a two-thirds supermajority vote in the U.S. Senate before any gun control measure can be considered. It is unclear at this time whether such a proposal has enough votes to pass. But such a requirement would permanently destroy the effectiveness of HCI in the Congress' most powerful chamber. Moreover, this requirement would have ample precedent in the U.S. Senate, since currently spending caps can be exceeded only if a Senate supermajority allows it to happen. This should also pass Constitutional muster under Article I, Section 5. While your Senator might not have heard about this proposal yet, you can make him or her favorably predisposed to it by mentioning your support of the idea. P.P.S. Handgun Control, Inc. is also asking its members to call the Senate. It's important that you show your Senators that there are more of the good guys who support the Constitution. ************** Did someone else forward this to you? To be certain of getting up to date information, please consider subscribing to the GOA E-Mail Alert Network directly. There is no cost or obligation, and the volume of mail is quite low. To subscribe, simply send a message to goamail@gunowners.org and include the state in which you live, in either the subject or the body. To unsubscribe, reply to any alert and ask to be removed. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 99 15:30:22 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Legislative Auto-E-Mail (fwd) On May 10, Paul A. Miller wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] >From another list.... - ----Forwarded Message(s)---- Subject: GSL> Legislative Auto-E-mailer Grass Roots South Carolina has set up an auto E-mailer with prewritten letters to Senators and Representatives opposing more gun legislation in response to the Colorado incident. It's easy to use because all you have to do is highlight your Senators and Represenatives and hit the send button to automatically send them a pre-written letter. Try it and blitz their e-mail boxes on this issue - it will only take you 30 seconds! The Auto-E-mailer can be found at: http://www.scfirearms.org/mailer/fed/mailerx.html [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 99 22:40:46 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fw: EIA Communique - 5/10 (fwd) On May 10, Kevin McGehee wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Kevin McGehee Fairbanks/North Pole, AK mcgehee@mosquitonet.com http://www.mosquitonet.com/~mcgehee/ Don't forget to check out The McGehee Clan website http://www.mosquitonet.com/~mcgehee/family/ - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, May 10, 1999 11:16 AM Subject: EIA Communique - 5/10 The Education Intelligence Agency COMMUNIQU=C9 - May 10, 1999 Now on the Web at http://members.aol.com/educintel/eia + Over the weekend NEA held one of its semi-annual collective bargaining conferences, this time in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The agenda illustrated= the continuing tug-of-war between new unionism and old. The 24 workshops were split fairly evenly between collaboration and confrontation. There were seminars on interest-based bargaining, labor-management partnerships and "win-win bargaining" (in which one of the steps was the helpful "develop options to satisfy interests on pertinent issues"). But other sessions we= re keeping with the industrial union tradition -- in fact, the keynote speak= er was a representative of the Industrial Areas Foundation, which was create= d in 1939 by labor legend Saul Alinsky. The juxtaposition of new unionism and old led to some amusing contrasts. In one room, a staffer from the Indiana State Teachers Associa= tion discussed "different approaches that have been used successfully to inspi= re school boards to negotiate," while in another room, officials of NEA's lo= cal affiliate in Las Cruces, New Mexico, talked about strategies to elect pro-education school board members (a month too late for the Milwaukee union). In still another room, people from the Fairfax Education Associat= ion in Virginia advised participants about the techniques they used to obtain "the clout to elect school board members who work in collaboration with F= EA." Clearly, negotiation and collaboration are a lot easier with school board members hand-picked by the union. No NEA conference would be complete without at least one workshop with the word "Attacks" in the title (in this case, "Attacks on Collectiv= e Bargaining" by Tom Taylor of the Michigan Education Association) and NEA staffer Lee Berg's traveling voucher conspiracy show (by now, most NEA officials can probably identify J. Patrick Rooney in a line-up). But Berg's presentation was not as out of place as it may seem. Collective bargaining may have been the topic of the conference, but vouc= hers were very much the topic of conversation outside the conference room. NEA= has just finished court battles in Arizona and Maine (one loss, one win) and = both may be reviewed by the U.S. Supreme Court. Its affiliates are fighting voucher legislation in Florida, Texas, Pennsylvania and New Mexico. And seemingly out of nowhere came the passage of a voucher bill in Louisiana'= s Senate Education Committee. Teachers' unions are being fed a steady diet = of school voucher bills and they don't like it. Voucher supporters and opponents are spending vast amounts of time and resources on the issue. EIA asks this question: With opposing forces fully engaged in a voucher frontal assault, who will be the first to try = to work an agenda item around the flank? + Last week, EIA reported on the plans of the Washington Education Association to put a cost-of-living raise initiative on the state ballot. Other labor unions, including the Washington Federation of Teachers, immediately opposed the idea. Over the weekend, WEA delegates voted by a = 2 to 1 margin to abandon the initiative. WEA President Lee Ann Prielipp showed= the usual gift of understatement required of a union president when a leaders= hip initiative is about to go down in flames. "I'd say that they have some mi= xed feelings," Prielipp told The Columbian before the delegate vote. + WEA has other problems. The union is on trial in a suit brought by the Evergreen Freedom Foundation, a conservative public policy foundation. EF= F charges that WEA is, in itself, a "political committee" as defined by sta= te law and is subject to the same reporting requirements as other political committees. + Lu Battiglieri, a Michigan representative on the NEA Board of Director= s, was elected the new president of the Michigan Education Association. Battiglieri plans to "step up efforts to expose and challenge the motives= of the critics of public education." God knows the union hasn't been doing enough of that lately. + Union elections in Newark, New Jersey, led to a lawsuit filed by the presidential challenger and her slate of candidates. Antoinette Baskervil= le, running for the presidency of the Newark Teachers Union against incumbent Joseph Del Grosso, filed a defamation suit for statements made in Del Grosso's campaign literature. The literature reportedly claims Baskervill= e and her caucus have misappropriated millions of dollars in union dues. "I= t's beyond distortion," Baskerville told the Newark Star-Ledger. "It's fabrication. I think they're desperate and totally unable to stand on the issues." Ballots will be counted on May 21. + Unusual reports can lead to unusual reviews. Case in point: the review= of Rotten Apples: School Crime from a Different Angle by Michael J. Petrilli= of the Thomas B. Fordham Foundation in the foundation's quarterly compendium Selected Readings on School Reform. "Antonucci reports on sex and drug offenses, violence, thievery, cheating, and false accusations," Petrilli writes. "The examples he cites are sometimes stomach-turning. Reading thi= s report is, in fact, so painful that we do not exactly recommend it. But w= e should all heed its lesson: school people can be criminals, too, and all schools certainly need systems to screen out the 'rotten apples' and to m= ake sure our kids are protected." Rotten Apples and EIA's latest report, Measure for Measure: A Magnified Look at Standardized Test Scores (no stomach-turning, but could hurt your brain), are still available through the mail from EIA. + Quote of the Week #1: "Voucher programs would allow for splintering al= ong ethnic and racial lines. Our primary concern is that voucher programs cou= ld end up resembling the ethnic cleansing now occurring in Kosovo." -- David Berliner, dean of Arizona State University's College of Education, speaki= ng before the New Mexico Legislature. + Quote of the Week #2: "There are few things in education you can't fix with common sense." -- Gayle Fallon, president of the Houston Federation = of Teachers. Amen, Ms. Fallon. If only we could increase both the supply and= the demand. # # # The Education Intelligence Agency conducts public education research, analysis and investigations. Director: Mike Antonucci. Ph: 916-422-4373. = Fax: 916-392-1482. E-Mail: EducIntel@aol.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 99 22:42:42 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Re: We are the scapegoats... (fwd) On May 10, Jim Zoes wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] True. We are definitely the scapegoats on t.p.g However, gun owners are giving it back. Since the gun grabbers are being uncivil, so are gun owners. Personally, I've not been holding back with those a**holes. I'm especially relishing the fact that the child of an HCI activist is a gun runner. I've also taken a shot at Dick Durbin (which I posted here). And, I've gone after my local media. I'm holding just short of advocating that gun grabbers and those who *still* support Clinton (and I've run into a few via private email), be taken outside, and given 20 lashes with a whip made of barbed wire. Sweet reason isn't going to work any more....and I'm no longer reasonable. In my non-so-humble opinion, we need to get in the media's face, in the gun grabbers faces, and defend our position. We need to remind them that *WE* didn't kill anyone. We didn't sell gun to teen aged killers and that won't tolerate being scapegoats. All gun owners must become as unreasonable as hell when dealing with those who advocate "sensible gun controls" -- even if they are friends and relatives. Being reasonable hasn't worked, didn't work, and won't work. It's time for 80 million gun owners to start being pushy and unreasonable.... I like Don Cline's tag line: "Do you have the right to free speech?" "Yes." "Do you own a gun?" "No." "Shut up. - ------------------------ From: ataylor@nmsu.edu Subject: We are the scapegoats... Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:03:52 -0600 To: fap@world.std.com > I've been dipping into talk.politics.guns > a bit lately, and the level of sheer hatred > aimed at anyone who owns a firearm is as high > or higher than immediately after the OKC bombing. > > Many, if not most, of the most vituperative, > nasty, and ugly posters call themselves "liberal". > Such subject lines as: > > "JOIN THE NRA:: FREE HIGH SCHOOL MASSACRE" > and > "LITTLETON IS THE NRA'S GODDAM FAULT" > > to pick but two examples, are common. Many of > the posters are the same people who, in other > newsgroups, routinely denounce "hate speech", > and call for understanding, peace, and caring. > > I would like to personally invite anyone who reads > this e-list that claims to be a liberal (I know > that some are lurking...) to go and sample these > threads, then please explain to me why I should > not regard the word "liberal" to be a synonym > for "lying, hate-filled hypocrite". > > Please explain this to me. I'm clearly just too > stupid to figure it out on my own. > > ataylor@nmsu.edu - ---------------End of Original Message----------------- Jim Zoes Subject: Littleton's Lesson: Don't Count on Police Washington Times, May 11, 1999 Commentary Section p. 17 SWAT Team Misfire? by James Bovard Federal and Colorado officials are seeking to transform the April 20 disaster at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado into a law enforcement triumph. Attorney General Janet Reno praised the local police response as "extraordinary" - "a textbook" example of "how to do it the right way." President Clinton declared Saturday that "we look with admiration at the... the police officers who rushed to the scene to save lives." However, the excruciatingly slow response by SWAT teams and other lawmen to the killings in progress turned a multiple homicide into a historic massacre. The pathetic excuses being offered vivify how law enforcement has no legal liability to people they fail to protect. The Colorado killings offer stark evidence why citizens cannot rely on government for their personal safety. "Close enough for government work" is the motto for the defenders of the law enforcement response. Jefferson County deputy Neil Gardner, the first policeman to shoot and miss at the killers, said on NBC's Dateline: "I think with exchanging fire, it did allow some--some people that are--that were fleeing the scene to get out of the building. I always will have to live with the fact that, maybe if I could have dropped him, maybe it would have saved one or two more lives." However, at the time of this gunfire exchange, the teens had apparently only killed two people. If Gardner had hit one of the teens, it might have unnerved his co-killer and led to a surrender - or an earlier suicide - and thus saved as many as 11 lives. Two other policemen arrived on the scene, fired at one of the killers - and missed. Jefferson County Sheriff John Stone later explained: "We had initial people there right away, but we couldn't get in. We were way outgunned." This wasn't Beider-Meinhoff: this wasn't Abu Nidal's terrorist cliche: this was two relatively inexperienced teens with a few cheap firearms. If policemen on the scene actually felt outgunned, they could have quickly retrieved automatic weapons or other heavy-duty firearms from patrol cars. Many local SWAT teams descended on the high school parking lot and vicinity after the shooting started. But none of the SWAT teams confronted the killers. Police spokesmen said the SWATs were not sent in "for fear that they might set off a new gunfight," as the New York Times reported. At least there was no danger of a "gunfight" when Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were executing unarmed students. Sheriff Stone justified the non-response: "We didn't want to have one SWAT team shooting another SWAT team." It seemingly never occurred to police not to send in all the SWAT teams. Apparently, the more police who respond to a crisis, the more incapable any policeman becomes of doing anything to stop the killings. The police response also seemed paralyzed by concerns for "officer safety." Steve Davis, spokesman for the Jefferson County Sheriff's Department, said, "We had no idea who was a victim and who was a suspect. And a dead police officer would not be able to help anyone." But the "suspects" were brazenly walking around with sawed off shotguns and firing at will and were identified in the first few minutes as wearing trenchcoats. Donn Kraemer of the Lakewood SWAT team explained: "If we went in and tried to take them and got shot, we would be part of the problem. We're supposed to bring order to chaos, not add to the chaos." Some police seem to see their role as historians - entering the building after the crime spree is over and carefully noting where each dead body lay. Is it necessary to have SWAT teams with the most advanced equipment and machine guns in order to distribute body bags after the carnage is over? Law enforcement spokesmen are now bragging that they successfully contained the two teens in the school after the killing rampage started. Sheriff Stone proclaimed last Saturday that "early intervention" by the cops who shot at the killers and missed "saved one heck of a lot of kids' lives, by pinning these guys down [Harris and Klebold spent most of their time in the library, where they killed 10 people], by putting them on the defensive, instead of the offensive [except for the 13 murder victims], and subsequently probably led to their suicide." Yet, one of the youths left a suicide note before the carnage began. SWAT teams may have become an impediment to public safety. There were probably plenty of individual policemen with the courage to enter the building and go after the shooters while the killings continued. But the militarization of law enforcement seems to have also resulted in police becoming bureaucratized - if not Dilbertized. President Clinton, Attorney General Reno, and others are claiming that the Colorado tragedy proves the need for stricter gun control. The Washington Post used the tragedy to call for the confiscation of all handguns. But the more successful gun control is in disarming citizens, the more dependent people become on government officials for protection - protection that is often slow and unreliable. When government ineptitude results in unnecessary killings - well, the survivors can write a letter to their congressman or state legislator. A federal appeals court declared in 1982, "There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state against being murdered by criminals or madmen." Citizens have no effective, enforceable right to police protection - and both police and criminals know this. Is there anyone who has closely followed this tragedy who would trust the lives of their children to the Colorado SWAT teams? The police can be trusted to protect themselves. But what about the rest of us? TAGLINE: Bovard is the author of Freedom in Chains: The Rise of the State & the Demise of the Citizen (St. Martin's Press, 1999). [to see first chapter of Freedom in Chains: http://www.jamesbovard.com ] ************************************************************************** Subscribe to Freematt's Alerts: Pro-Individual Rights Issues Send a blank message to: freematt@coil.com with the words subscribe FA on the subject line. List is private and moderated (7-30 messages per week) Matthew Gaylor,1933 E. Dublin-Granville Rd.,#176, Columbus, OH 43229 Archived at http://www.egroups.com/list/fa/ ************************************************************************** [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 99 11:26:02 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fwd: Fw: NEWS CREW BUSTED!!!! (fwd) On May 11, ASSETNJ@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] In a message dated 5/11/99 9:19:42 AM Eastern Daylight Time, timetrial@worldnet.att.net writes: << >Date: Sunday, May 09, 1999 10:27 PM >> >> >>>I just got back from our weekend gun show here in Las Vegas. What >>>excitement!!! A news crew sent a 17 year old in to buy a gun, a rifle, >>>which he did from a private individual. The guy selling it did ask for >>>and was given ID, but apparently failed to add the years right. He was >>>wired and had hidden cameras filming him. As he started to leave, he >>>was apprehended by the local police AND they ended up busting the whole >>>crew, cameraman, reporter and all!!!!! Tomorrow morning they are having >>>a meeting with the district attorney to see just how many charges can be >>>leveled against them. Dan rattled off a bunch of charges in our >>>conversation. He is the head of the pawn detail, which works with the >>>pawn and gun shops here, and he is very much pro-gun. So is the >>>district attorney. They have promised to press long and hard on >>>this!!!! The show is HQ'd here, Access, but is syndicated across the >>>country in many markets. >>> >>>Now, what are the chances we will see the footage of the reporter be >>>busted for breaking the law?!?!?!?!???? >>> >>>I will keep you posted as more comes out. The cop in charge was the >>>last one I talked with as I was leaving the show. News crews were all >>>over the show the entire weekend. >>> >>>Glen >> >>================================ >> ****************************************************************************** Send submissions to nj-rkba@toto.com. Administrative requests (subscribe, unsubscribe, etc.) should be sent to nj-rkba-request@toto.com. The human maintainer is behanna@fast.net. For emergencies outside of working hours, reach him at behanna@fast.net. Chris BeHanna maintains this list and disclaims all formal and legal responsibility for its content. ****************************************************************************** [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #239 *************************