From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #269 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Saturday, August 14 1999 Volume 02 : Number 269 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 01:29:06 +0100 From: boyd@seanet.com Subject: Re: Clinton is trying to take over the Internet (fwd) - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 It's a committee. The guy has said "make a committee" and we're talking about Clinton "taking over the Internet"?!? We are the sovereign people of this country and we're preparing for totalitarian control of this form of communication? It's not likely but if they tried it we'd stop them. More comments below Bill Vance wrote: > > On Aug 9, Jim Zoes wrote: > > [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows ------------ - - - - -------] URLs snipped > Here's my analysis: > > There was no fanfare and zero news coverage that I could detect about this > executive edict. Without WND and Drudge, I certainly would not have known > about it. This is, I believe, another STEALTH executive order "STEALTH executive order" Is like saying wet water or hot sun. Is this the department of redundancy department? ALL executive orders are done quietly because historically they were orders to regulate the beuracracy (and now because they get away with it). The day we expect Dan Rather to -mention- an EO is the day Peter Jennings' toupe grows legs and runs off the set. > Further, 120 days is not enough time to explore this problem and come up > with any cogent solutions to the problem of "unlawful conduct" (whatever > this is) on the Internet, and run it by the OMB. Therefore, I think that > this has already been done, and in 120 days time, we will be facing edicts > and other executive orders effectively curtailing freedom of information on > the 'net. Any future edicts will not necessarily depend on the "findings" of this committee. He doesn't need the AG to say "ooh those scary child porn freaks are killing us with their internet" to issue an EO saying "shut it all down". Now, what people would -do- when faced with such a rediculous EO is another thing entirely. > For example: Expect an executive order forbidding the sales of gun over the > net. Expect an executive order to install monitoring and databases to > identify and track these "criminals" who are committing "misconduct" by > advertising such products using "illegal Internet" conduct. The FBI currently uses "monitoring and databases" to catch criminals, this is how they caught Kevin Mitnick here in Seattle. That -does-not mean- their is a spy in your modem. Think about the economics of this, these sniffers are damned expensive and if there's going to be enough bandwidth to capture suspect traffic, sniff, -and- allow users to operate (you know, alla us potential "criminal" types) they would have to -double- the capacity of the internet. Aint gonna happen, not for overhead like this. > Expect an executive order requiring large proprietary ISP's and the Internet > backbones to install monitors and traps to prevent these "criminals" from > using the net -- or at least identify and track them. Hey folks, ya ever -met- an ISP owner? AOL is trading (or was before last weeks tech stock drop) about 40 times earnings and the local guys are NOT getting rich off this stuff (I know two in Seattle selling at Net Asset Value). The ISP business is not highly profitable as it is. The president can "require" all of us to wear yellow stars but that doesn't mean its gonna happen. There isn't enough money for this. > Expect this tracking to include people who talk about "rights" and the "2nd > Amendment." Expect it to include *us*. > snip > message that traverses the Internet or subscriber private network be scanned > for prohibited concepts, words or other content tokens. This is a > no-brainer. I'm sure they already have the methodology worked out. I have LONG (Hussein) assumed (bomb) this (Milosevic) happens (Korea) now. Guess how we can (Tariq) change (Pakistan) the economics (India) of this in our (viral) favor? The people of this country sadly haven't woken up yet to the critical nature of their right to self defense. But the DO understand the right to freedom of expression and more then one person I know (not all gun folks) paste a collection of spook words at the bottom of their email just to foil attempts to track phrases. Who knows, maybe nobodies listening (great!) but if someone is a few thousand of the millions using the net can dramatically change the economics of trying to track words. And that aint no chopped (virally infected and mascerated) liver! If the president wants to play around with the constitutional right to freedom of expression then -bring- -it- -on-, he will wake the wrath of the people like no foe of freedom before! > Yes, it's a direct violation of the 1st Amendment, but the government will > claim that illegal conversations HAVE NO 1ST AMENDMENT PROTECTION. So, all > Internet communications (web site downloads, email ads, chat room > conversations) will be scanned, on the off chance that they might be > involving the sale of medicine, guns, etc. And who knows what other > information content will be included? Cool, a -much- easier battle for freedom then the continuing "divide and conquer" war of dripping water waged so succesfully against liberty for so long. > Finally, note who is on the "working group." At least two of them are on > record for wanting to ease controls against spying on the public. Remember > the Clipper Chip? Remember the phrase "down in flames"? > Recomendations: > > (1) Time to write your "bosses" and "rulers" (those are Claire Wolfe's terms > for "elected representatives" -- see her book "Don't Shoot the Bastards > (Yet)") and complain vociferously. It probably won't stop the anti freedom > juggernut, but enough noise might get it before the public. Good advice at any time. > (2) Time to start using PGP or other encryption routinely. It won't stop > the NSA from decoding messages, but strong encryption will make it more > difficult. Universal and routinely encrypted messages (using strong > encryption) will raise the ante and possibly defeat the system. Excellent advice, I generate a new key each January and put the public one up on the servers with that years current date as my middle initial. So, to validate that this message was from me, install PGP, then use it to get the public key for "Boyd 99 Kneeland". Its fun, and again it -dramatically- changes the economics of snooping. There are lists- of very intelectual people finding new ways to push this, to gaurantee our privacy and to extend personal liberty through technology. Sure, we face a government that doesn't much like that. But the -smart- guys (like Phil Zimmerman) are on OUR side IMNSDHO. > (3) Several years ago, there was a discussion on this list concerning > setting up our own dial up private bulletin board *off* the Internet. Maybe > this should be reconsidered. Please keep such systems connected to the net until you have -proof- that traffic in them is being used against users. Balkanizing our communications will only serve to -help- anti freedom forces until such a time. > (4) ASSUME THAT EVERY MESSAGE SENT ON THIS LIST IS BEING READ BY AN ATF OR > FBI AGENT WHO HAS SURRIPTIOUSLY SUBSCRIBED VIA THE NORMAL CHANNELS. Phrase > your messages accordingly. Of course! You are speaking in the town square here. Don't think agents of the government are so stupid they can't figure out how to subscribe to a list like you did. Neither should we assume they are all evil cloak wearing blood suckers. For the ones who arent; please remember your oathes and decide for yourself what is important in your life and for the future of your country. For the Horiuchis out there; we're glad you are literate and hope you get the message. > Jim Zoes > > "In God We Trust -- Everyone Else We Keep Under Constant Surveillance." > > [New motto for US currency, as proposed by the Richmond > Times-Dispatch (Virginia), February 21, 1999, in light of the "Know > Your Customer" proposal] Yet another evil proposal appropriately shot down in flames. Lets make sure it doesn't resurrect. committe creation EO snipped. All of my comments are my opinion alone. -Boyd - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.0 Charset: noconv iQA/AwUBN6/iAB+71fwppszUEQI4dQCgx5M+j+KD3WFzKdsE7nbewV922yUAn3vR FU8CmOU51WOExNvMrbDwczV4 =J7MD - -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 99 15:35:10 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) On Aug 11, me too wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] This is not directly related to any topic we are presently discussing, and it is not my habit to forward messages just because some one asked me to. I am making an exception in this case, because the idea really appeals to me, and I hope it will to you all, also. The idea is to send a tea bag to our representatives (NOT "law-makers" as they prefer being called) in the Federal government, as a reminder of the Boston Tea Party. Some people may not like everything that the originating group (Christian Coalition) stands for. Some of you are not even Christians. Even if you don't like the group, but you do the idea, please take part in it. I have already told them that it might make me choke to use the words, "Honourable" and "Trent Lott" in the same sentence, but I will send the tea bag. (LOL! my spell check keeps trying to replace "Lott" with "Loot". It's smarter than I thought.) Eeema - ----------------------------original message--------------------- From: coalition@ccfla.org To: fulmer@atlantic.net Date: Tuesday, August 10, 1999 6:14 PM Subject: TEA BAG TAX REBELLION OF 1999 >Dear Friends: > >I am tired of hearing my President say that I don't want or need the >proposed $792 billion tax cut. It is my money and I want to keep it! >So as acting Director of Christian Coalition of Florida I am declaring >a tea bag tax rebellion. In the spirit of the Boston tea party of December >16, 1773, I am asking every American who wants his to keep his hard earned >money rather than leave it in the hands of greedy government bureaucrats to >flood Washington with tea bags. > >Mail the first tea bag to: > >President Bill Clinton >1600 Pennsylvania Avenue >Washington, DC 20500. > >Include a note that says something like "Mr. President please don't veto my >tax cut. If you do I am asking the Congress to close down the government as >the patriots did Boston harbor in 1773 to protest the tea tax. I want every >cent of my $792 billion tax cut. > >Send a second tea bag to the Speaker of the House, >The Honorable J. Dennis Hastert >2263 Rayburn House Office Building >Washington, DC 20515. > >Include a note that says something like "Rep Hastert please don't give up >on my tax cut. If you have to close down the government as the patriots >closed Boston harbor in 1773 to protest the tea tax, I want every cent of >my $792 billion tax cut without breaking the budget agreement. >I will support you in this effort. > >Send a third tea bag to the Senate Majority Leader , >The Honorable Trent Lott >487 Russell Senate Office Building >Washington, DC 20510 >Include the same message you sent to Speaker Hastert. > >You may also want to send a tea bag and message to your own Congressman and >Senators. You can look up their addresses at http://government.aol.com. > >Then forward this message to everyone on your e-mail list and e-mail me >back at coalition@ccfla.org to let me know that you are taking part in the >tea bag tax rebellion of 1999. > >With your help, we will get our tax cut! > >Yours for good government > >Bob West >Acting Director >Christian Coalition of Florida > > >If you wish to contribute to Christian Coalition please go to >http://www.ccfla.org/pages/contrib.htm > >If you wish to Volunteer please go to >http://www.ccfla.org/pages/Volunteer2.htm If there's duct tape left on the roll, there is still work to be done. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 99 19:23:12 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Re: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) A pointer for those who are going to send their, "Boston Teabag", and , "I want my Tax Cut!", note, and would also like to send a whole, "box o' bags", but consider the phone book to be too, sophomoric: Try sending in some in the name of your favorite Local Liberal Democreatures. You can be sure they'll _love_ any replies thanking them for support of the Tax Cut.....:-) - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:18:58 -0700 From: "Lew Glendenning" Subject: RE: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) This would not be entirely honest. I do not support degrading the culture further. Lew > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-roc@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-roc@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Bill Vance > Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 8:23 PM > To: roc%xmission.com@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) > > > A pointer for those who are going to send their, "Boston Teabag", and , "I > want my Tax Cut!", note, and would also like to send a whole, > "box o' bags", > but consider the phone book to be too, sophomoric: > > Try sending in some in the name of your favorite Local Liberal > Democreatures. > > You can be sure they'll _love_ any replies thanking them for > support of the > Tax Cut.....:-) > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > ---------- > ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+----------- > ---------- > An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no > weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his > hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a > on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | > sword.--Jesus Christ > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+----------- > ---------- > > - > - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 99 11:13:50 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: RE: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) Well, there _was_ a smiley face at the end.....:-) On Aug 12, Lew Glendenning wrote: >This would not be entirely honest. > >I do not support degrading the culture further. > >Lew > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-roc@lists.xmission.com >> [mailto:owner-roc@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Bill Vance >> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 8:23 PM >> To: roc%xmission.com@lists.xmission.com >> Subject: Re: Tax rebellion suggestion (fwd) >> >> >> A pointer for those who are going to send their, "Boston Teabag", and , "I >> want my Tax Cut!", note, and would also like to send a whole, >> "box o' bags", >> but consider the phone book to be too, sophomoric: >> >> Try sending in some in the name of your favorite Local Liberal >> Democreatures. >> >> You can be sure they'll _love_ any replies thanking them for >> support of the >> Tax Cut.....:-) - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Aug 99 11:26:29 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Conference Committee Voting (fwd) (fwd) On Aug 13, Paul M Watson wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 01:27:21 -0500 From: TSRA Alert To: TSRA Email List Subject: Conference Committee Voting - -- Texas State Rifle Association Email --- August 13, 1999 It's time to direct the telephones, e-mail, and fax machines to the members of the Juvenile Justice Bill Conference Committee. The committee has 26 House Members and 5 Senators. There are 18 Republicans and 13 Democrats. There are 16 with pro-gun voting records and 15 with anti-gun voting records. The antis include enemies like Ted Kennedy, Sheila Jackson, Carolyn McCarthy, and John Conyers. The pro-gun voting records are not pure and three of the Republicans have anti-gun voting records. So, we have our work cut out for us. Here is what we need to do: 1. First, contact your senator and representatives. Ask them not to support any of the gun control measures in the Juvenile Justice Bill. 2. Contact the pro-gun committee members and give them the same message. Thank them for their past voting records. 3. Contact the anti-gun committee members for a show of strength. Tell them that their support for gun control under the guise of doing good is actually doing nothing beyond harassing law abiding gun owners. Prosecuting criminals would be far more effective. This is a big order for each of us. The minimum would be to do number 1. If you can make the time, do number 2. Some of us can do all three. The more the better. The reason that we need to do this is to discourage thinking like a very confident Sen. Kennedy expressed below. In what should come as no surprise to gun owners, Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-Mass.) threatened that a failure by House and Senate leadership to come to an agreement would not signal an end to continued attacks on law-abiding firearms owners in stating, "If we don't get it done [in conference], we're going to get it done on other pieces of legislation this year." Go to the TSRA web site to see this statement, the contact information, and more at: http://www.tsra.com/conf_com.htm Please visit the Texas State Rifle Association website: http://www.tsra.com/ If you wish to no longer receive email from TSRA, please send a message to leavelist@tsra.com. - - To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@mainstream.net, and as the body of the message (plain text, no HTML), send the following: [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Aug 99 11:27:44 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: (Fwd) [Fwd: Quote of the day] (fwd) On Aug 13, liberty2@mindspring.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] - ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- Date sent: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 19:21:59 -0600 From: "L. Neil Smith" From: Boris Kupershmidt "Guns are no more responsible for killing people than the spoon is responsible for making Rosie O'Donnell fat." ========================================================== Mary Lou Seymour Liberty Activists http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/1797 Gulchers guide http://www.angelfire.com/biz/gulchers The Bill of rights For President Support L.Neil Smith http://www.lns2000.org [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Aug 99 15:44:35 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fratrum: Re: Family's Y2K Preparations Judged Illegal (fwd) Looks like a potential Condition Red Flap folks. For those unfamiliar with who Norm Olson is, he's a Gunshop owner, Commander of the N. Michigan Militia, a retired Veteran, and S. Baptist Pastor of Freedom CHurch. On Aug 13, Huck wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] It's time to do something folks. I've never been to MI, that's a good enough reason for me at this point in my life. There are also addresses and phone numbers so some of you might want to help that way. This is a bit lengthy, but please read it all. Thanks! Huck > From: Norm Olson > Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 07:43:52 -0400 > > Please. I need everyone's help to distribute this material. > Please send it to every organization that is involved with > land rights, Y2K planning, child abuse prevention, > everywhere. > > The following are the Press Releases sent last night. > > If any recipient has the ability to forward these press releases > to media or interests that might be interested in a headline such > as: > "JUDGE RULES Y2K PREPARATIONS ILLEGAL, PUTTING > FAMILY OF EIGHT IN PERIL" > > then by all means, please get these press releases out. > > If any recipient wants to call the tyrants who are destroying this > family, here are the principles: > > Bill Westcott, Township Supervisor 231-634-7372 > Clover Schlund, Clerk (the leader of the pack, also the > next door neighbor to the Stitts. > Can't stand the Stitts and their > animals as neighbors. Uses > position as Clerk to foment > persecution of them) 231-634-7500 > Gary Wagner, Trustee 231-634-7240 > David Rittinger, Zoning Inspector 231-634-7260 > Cheryl Stevenson, Treasurer 231-634-7200 > Lani White, Trustee (who is also the teacher who stands to > lose her salary because the children > were withdrawn from the school) > 231-634-7440 > > The Press Releases: > > PRESS RELEASE - FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE > Contacts: Norman Olson, 231-548-5878, Mike & Chris Stitt > 231-634-7030, Clover Schlund, Township Clerk 231-634-7500, > Bill Westcott, Supervisor, 231-634-7372, Township Attorney > c/o Peck & Assoc. 906-635-6286 > > Island Officials May Try to Block Militia on Saturday > Emergency Strategy Meeting by Township Held > Echoes from Ruby Ridge and Waco heard > > Bois Blanc Island, MI (August 12) - An emergency meeting of the > Bois Blanc Township board was called today to plan a strategy to > deal with the Northern Michigan Regional Militia. Graham Whipple, > Sheriff of Bois Blanc Island attended. > What started as a show of support to a beleagured family may > be taking on a more ominous and frightening spectre. The militia > is determined to stand with Michael and Christine Stitt and their > six children in opposition to a Township Board and the County that > is waging a war of persecution against them. On Saturday, > August 14, the militia will attempt to assemble on the Stitt's > property. Last week, the commander, Norman Olson and chief of > staff, Ray Southwell went to the island to measure the severity > of the problem and the potential for confrontation. Olson said in > a press release Thursday, "I can tell you that this situation is > becoming frightenly like Waco and Ruby Ridge. We have a > family being driven into the ground by a vindictive and hateful > government body. The family is determined to stand their ground. > They have no choice, no where to go, no one to help. The court > and deceitful lawyers have forced this family into a corner. If > they comply and dispose of all their animals and garden, they > place their children at great risk. If they refuse to comply they > will be arrested and jailed for contempt and possibly lose their > children. They've asked me for help. I can't say no. The > battlelines are forming and escalation may result in another > armed standoff...this time with well trained militia defending > a helpless family. I'm deeply troubled that this little matter > might turn into another Waco or Ruby ridge. It starts like that, > you know, and before we can stop it, it takes on its own energy. > In the aftermath, we analyze where the mistakes were made > and we vow to prevent it from happening again. Well, it is > happening and I'm trying to stop it." > The problem has a simple solution, but the township board > refuses to negotiate with Olson who offered to withdraw the > militia if a 1-year variance or waver is granted to the Stitts > to keep their animals and buildings and garden on their 37-acre > property on Bois Blanc Island near Mackinaw. "Is it too much to > ask that a frightened family be given one year to ride out Y2K? > Is it too much to ask that the children be told they can stay and > that mom and dad are not criminals? Is a township board so > insensitive that it cannot understand that people are frightened > about Y2K and the animals and garden are the means of > preparation to survive?" > On Saturday, the militia will go to Bois Blanc Island. > No one knows what to expect between now and October 7, > the deadline imposed by the District Court of Mackinaw County. > Olson said late Thursday night, "I pray that Waco and Ruby > Ridge are far behind us, but I fear that cold unfeeling and > corrupted government bureaucrats are everywhere. First it was > Idaho, then Texas. Let the record show that I have tried to offer > a fair and rational solution. Failing that, the next American > nightmare may come to Michigan. > > End Press Release > > **************************************** > PRESS RELEASE - FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE > Contacts: Norman Olson, 231-548-5878, Mike & Chris > Stitt 231-634-7030, Clover Schlund, Township Clerk 231-634-7500, > Bill Westcott, Supervisor, 231-634-7372, Township Attorney c/o > Peck & Assoc. 906-635-6286 > > Militia to Invade Bois Blanc Island? > Residents may get more than they bargained for by > ordering family off island. > > Alanson, MI (August 12) - Four years ago, Mike and Chris Stitt > moved to Bois Blanc Island. They were warmly welcomed by > the township government then. But Mike and Chris are self-sufficient > folks with a strong religious background. They wanted to get away > from downstate. They needed to prepare for Y2K. Now the township > wants them to leave. The reason? They dared to plant a garden, > erect a barn and raise chickens, and emus, and goats to survive > what they believe is God's coming judgment on America. They > have 6 children, all living with them. The majority of neighbors > support the Stitt family and find no fault with their garden or animals. > In fact, they buy the eggs and homemade bread Chris provides. > But the board members have labeled the Stitts as "too religious and > odd." To rid themselves of Mike, Chris, and the children, they've > refused to grant a variance. It seems zoning doesn't allow animals > or a large garden on the Stitt's 37 acre piece of wilderness. > Money is also involved. The one-room school house had only the > Stitt children as students. When Mike and Chris chose to educate > them at home, the island lost $45,000 in school revenue. > The Stitt family has resolved to stay, even though the township > refuses to give them the variance necessary to keep the garden and > the animals. But the clock is ticking and the court has ordered them > to dispose of animals, buildings, pens, and even the manure. If not, > they face contempt charges, jail time, and a fine of $500 per day. > Their property will be liened by the township. > Enter the militia. Last week, Norman Olson, Commander of the > Northern Michigan Regional Militia, dressed in camouflage and > driving a camouflaged truck visited the Stitts. Ray Southwell, his > Chief of Staff went with. After discussing the hopelessness of a > resolution, Mike offered to turn the property over to the militia as > a training facility. > The Township attempted to have the Stitts physically removed > by June of next year. Circuit Court Judge Nicholas Lambro said > he could not force someone to leave but agreed in court that the > Stitts apply all reasonable efforts to sell out. Mike and Chris don't > want to leave and still have a great love for the island and majority > of the people who live there. "It's just a handful of powerful people > who are being swayed by money and prejudice," Chris said. "We > sacrificed all we had to get away from that. Zoning wasn't an issue > four years ago even when they knew what we had in mind. They > still received us with open arms. We were celebrities with our > team of oxen. Hundreds of people came to see us and our animals. > But that's all changed and the people who used to buy our eggs > now file suits against us. We've spent all we have to defend > ourselves in court, but to no avail. There are powerful and corrupt > interests on this island and now we face being bulldozed off our > land. My children are frightened and uneasy. Winter is coming. > We have no where else to go." > Olson plans to deploy the militia to the island on Saturday, > August 14, to do site survey work and to show support for the > beleagured family. He has also scheduled time to address the > Township concerning the Stitt family. "A training facility on the > island is possible if the township forces the Stitts off. We hope > the township will make peace with Mike and Chris and provide > them with a variance they need to keep their animals. It's live > and let live as far as I can see. If the Stitts are forced to leave, > they may dispose of the property in any way they may choose. > After a few months of the militia, perhaps the people would welcome > the Stitts back to their island home. As they say, the ball is in the > Township's court. I hope there is compromise and reconciliation > between the parties involved." > During his visit to the island, Olson tried to talk with Clover > Schlund, Township Clerk, but she refused to talk with him. Later > he called Bill Westcott, the Supervisor, but Westcott refused to > discuss the matter and hung up the phone. > End Press Release > > **************************************** > > PRESS RELEASE - FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE > Contacts: Norman Olson, 231-548-5878, Mike & Chris Stitt > 231-634-7030, Clover Schlund, Township Clerk 231-634-7500, > Bill Westcott, Supervisor, 231-634-7372, Township Attorney > c/o Peck & Assoc. 906-635-6286 > > Family's Y2K Preparations Judged Illegal - > Y2K Preparations Turn Into Nightmare- > Family with Children may lose everything > because of they've prepared too well. > > Bois Blanc Island, MI (August 12) - Two years ago Mike and > Chris Stitt got very serious about Y2K. They built a barn and > bought animals. They planted a large garden for their 6 children. > They have chickens, and emus, and goats and sell eggs. Now > they are totally self-reliant and prepared to face a Y2K emergency > on their remote island property in northern Lake Huron. > But in preparing for the worst, they have brought the worst > upon themselves. The township wants them to dispose of their > animals, tear down the barn, burn or bury everything. They have > less than 60 days. Zoning doesn't allow animals or gardening > on the Stitt's 37 acre piece of wilderness property. > Bois Blanc Island sits halfway between the upper and lower > peninsulas of Michigan, about 5 miles from Cheboygan. The 7 > by 13 mile island is inhabited by less than 60 year around > residents. In spite of the fact that the Stitts are gifted craftsmen, > experienced with raising animals, vegetables, and children, > the zoning prohibits agriculture. Oddly, neither the state nor > the county has considered what to do when residents' precautions > about Y2K violate zoning and other ordinances, but some citizens > have already raised the question. Benjamin Thompson, Mackinaw > County FEMA coordinator says that residents must comply with > zoning and ordinances, Y2K preparation notwithstanding. Many > people would disagree. > Norman Olson, Commander of the Northern Michigan Regional > Militia, alerted Governor John Engler of this potential conflict > more than a year ago. In a letter to the Governor, Olson warned > of possible conflicts between existing laws and the critical nature > of Y2K in Michigan. Issues brought to the Governor's attention > included people who want to keep animals for food and keeping > large quantities of fuels on residential property. But nothing has > been done to provide relief for citizens. > Olson is now involved in negotiating a settlement between > Mackinaw County, Bois Blanc Township, and the Stitt family. > "This is sheer madness," Olson said in a press release from > militia headquarters, "here the government is urging people to > prepare for Y2K, but if they do, they will be fined and persecuted > by petty bureaucrats and judges because of insane zoning > restrictions. Whoever enforces zoning in the face of the coming > crisis ought to be tarred and feathered and run out of town. Peoples' > lives are in danger and the persecution of the Stitt family is a > prime example of governmental abuse at its worst. If I must, I > will stand in front of the county bulldozers with a weapon rather > than have that family forced into the snow. And there are a few > hundred who will probably stand with me! It's crazy to enforce > zoning that prevents families from preparing for possible power > and food shortages." The township's attorney Lyle Peck said in a > letter to Olson, "There is nothing that prevents the people on the > island from fishing should Y2K occur." Peck should know that ice > piles more than 15-feet high around the island. Relying on fishing > would mean starvation to a family of eight. "Apparently Peck thinks > this is a joke..a game. This is no joke, I can assure him!" Olson says. > The Stitt family has resolved to stay and will not comply with the > court's order to have their complete farm disposed of by October 7th, > the court's imposed deadline. The clock is ticking and Mackinaw > County has threatened to remove the barn and animals and family > by court order, if necessary. Failing to meet the deadline will put > the property in jeopardy. Fines and liens will be imposed. Mom > and Dad will go to jail for contempt of court. > The judge and the Township have recommended that the Stitts > sell the property and get out. Mike and Chris don't want to leave > and still have a great love for the island and majority of the people > who live there. "It's just a handful of powerful people who are > being swayed by money and prejudice," Chris said. "We sacrificed > all we had to get away from that. Zoning wasn't an issue when we > came to the island. The people received us with open arms. > But that's all changed and the people who used to buy our eggs > and chickens now file suits against us. There are powerful and > corrupt interests on this island. What can we do?" > Olson says that the militia will stand by the Stitts. "We are at > a critical stage in preparing for what may be a great crisis in our > land. To force a family off it's farm now is a criminal act. Zoning > must give way when there is an emergency like Y2K involved. > Give the Stitt family a zoning waver or variance for 1 year. By > next summer, we'll know about Y2K. Enforce the zoning now and > you'll have angry people from around the nation to contend with. > The Stitt family has decided to stand and with God's help, > we'll stand with them. > End Press Release > > Thank You for your help. Please get the word out.... > Please help the Stitt Family... Please prevent > another Waco. > > --------- End forwarded message ---------- [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Aug 99 10:20:45 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: LEGAL drugs and guns (fwd) Well, here it is with docs, citations, and URL's. On Aug 14, ataylor@NMSU.Edu wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] - -----Original Message----- From: David Wiegand [mailto:DWIEGAND@apsinc.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 1999 7:45 PM To: 'adbco@netaxs.com' Subject: Gore, Gun Control, and the Pharmaceutical Industry Andy, As a private security professional, I have the opportunity to view various bits and pieces of information that passes across my desk. I have recently come across a firearms-rights angle that, honestly comes somewhat out of the blue! > As an example, (somewhat unverified) intelligence data that has come my > way indicates that Al Gore is currying the favor of financial institutions > who fund pharmaceutical companies (and major media like Time Magazine) to > finance his bid for the presidency. He is so eager to advance the > financial interests' drug companies' propaganda line that blames "the gun" > to hide the violence CAUSED by mind-altering psychiatric drugs that he has > made some real serious mistakes in the media. His latest is his blunder > in advancing the anti-gunners line to prohibit under 21 year olds to > purchase a handgun (already prohibited by earlier legislation) that you > may have heard about. > > This evening another "dot" in the puzzle is to be aired on the 60 Minutes > II TV program. It's a follow-up to an earlier program, Unsafe Haven. > Have you heard about it? > > Best, > David F. Wiegand > ________________________________________________________________ FIREARM OWNERS - WARNING! BEWARE MIND ALTERING PSYCHIATRIC DRUGS Firearm Owners, As mouth pieces for the psychiatric industry, some US national leaders promote the lie that firearms, video games, and the entertainment industry are at the root of the recent rise in the number of violent incidents in society. The psychiatric industry wrongly points to anything BUT the role their dangerous and damaging mind altering drugs have in promoting that violence. In the late 1800s and early 1900s, "snake oil" peddlers traveled about selling "elixirs" that could "cure" all sorts of aliments. They seemed to work for a while, until the withdrawal of the cocaine or heroin content of these "miracle" drugs kicked in. By that time, the snake oil peddlers had left for parts unknown and were far beyond the long arm of the law and the injured victim. The bio-psychiatrist in a medical smock is the modern candy flavored "snake oil" peddler. The illicit drug dealer operates outside the law peddling drugs that are well known for their harmful effects. Psychiatric drug dealers operate under cover of legality, behind the facade of a medical authority and sham scientific pretense, and with the backing of the very "best" people. Not all medical professionals are drug peddlers. Many medical doctors recognize the harmful effects of mind altering psychiatric drugs and work to get people safely off them. As an example; Dr. Mary Ann Block, medical director of the Block Center in the Dallas/Fort Worth area is the author of No More Ritalin: Treating ADHD Without Drugs, A Mother's Journey, A Physician's Approach. You can access The Block Center in the Internet at: www.blockcenter.com/ It is becoming more and more evident that drug companies like Eli Lilly have twisted and distorted studies and drug trials in order to get Federal approval for their highly profitable psychiatric drugs. One law firm that has documented this in the courts is Baum, Hedlund, Aristei, Guilford & Downey, on the web at www.bhagd.com/ The psychiatric profession itself knows about the dangerous "rebound effects" of psychiatric drugs and fails to adequately inform potential consumers in their pursuit of profit. Some psychiatrists, who have had the courage and ethics to put patient welfare before profit, have called for an end to the unholy alliance between psychiatry and the psychiatric drug companies. Check out this December 4, 1998 letter from Loren Mosher, M.D., a respected, long time member of the American Psychiatric Association. http://home.att.net/~thesaint/lrm.htm Psychiatric drug companies absolutely do not want ANYONE to know that their drugs harm. They have teams of media/marketing types (drug detailers or jobbers), who respond to tragedies like we have seen recently, who down play the relationship between psychiatric drug use and violence, and who turn aside this public knowledge, and BLAME THE GUN! Who finances much of the propaganda aimed at gun "control'? Just look at those who PUSH for such things as mandated mental health insurance parity, mandated psychiatrists and psychologists in our public schools, forced psychiatric drugging, mandatory psychological testing for a carry permit, the list goes on and on. Moreover, just who are these people? Who are these people indeed? They are the same people who lobby for restrictive gun control! Check out this article by David Bresnahan on the WorldNetDaily page, Doping Our Kids, at: http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_bresnahan/19990429_xex_doping_our_k.s html The media is slowly waking up to the fraud, deceit, and outright lawlessness of some psychiatrists. Recently a CBS 60 Minutes II program documented numerous cases of medical fraud and assault at Charter psychiatric facilities. Unsafe Haven is on the web at: http://www.cbs.com/prd1/now/template.display?p_story=145221 The Hartford Courant, Hartford, CT ran a series of articles about how innocent children are often injured or killed in psychiatric institutions by untrained psychiatric workers. Psychiatric institutions are not obligated to report deaths or injuries, as are most legitimate businesses. You can downloaded the articles from: http://www.courant.com/news/special/restraint/day1.stm From first-hand knowledge, the private investigative industry knows that psychiatrists and psychologists lead all other "medical professionals" in cases of insurance fraud. Several of the larger insurance companies have even set up Special Investigative Units (SIUs) to combat the rampant fraud by psychiatrists and psychologists. Many legal professionals know very well that the non-existent "symptoms" in the psychiatric billing bible, the DSM-IV, Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, are so vague and generalized as to be worthless. This manual relies on totally subjective criteria that are voted on by psychiatrists. No objective, scientific or physical duplicable proof exists for any of the billing codes listed. The manual is simply a billing manual, nothing more. Even the legal profession recognizes the fraud of psychiatry. Check out the article by Dana Levitt, of Alschuler, Grossman, Stein & Kahan, Cross-Examine the Plaintiff's Psychiatric Expert, an article on how to refute the "expert" testimony of a psychiatrist at: http://www.agplaw.com/artdnl.htm If you have a psychiatric history you generally may not obtain a carry permit, (CCW). You may not join the armed service or obtain a license to practice many professions. And that is exactly how the psychiatric drug industry wants it. Disarmed, unable to participate in the defense of your country, and unable to obtain in many cases a license and permit to operate in your chosen profession, you are now under the control of the psychiatric industry and their dangerous mind-altering drugs. If you are a firearm owner, DO NOT TAKE MIND-ALTERING PSYCHIATRIC DRUGS! If you are taking psychiatric drugs, GET OFF THEM under a doctor's care. And if you know someone who is taking psychiatric drugs, urge them to get off them. If you do not, you may be the next psychiatric drug violence victim. Wake up gun owners. The drug-peddling psychiatrist is NOT your friend! Best, David F. Wiegand Private Security Industry Professional Gun Owners of America Life Member National Rifle Association Life Member Law Enforcement Alliance of America Life Member PO BOX 20850 OAKLAND CA 94620 DFWiegand@email.msn.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #269 *************************