From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #324 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Tuesday, April 4 2000 Volume 02 : Number 324 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 27 Mar 00 13:26:55 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: [slick-d] 17th Amendment (fwd) On Mar 27, Charles F. Nawrocki wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] From The Desk Of Grandmothers For Honest Government P.O. Box 6934 Tyler, Texas 75711 Working for better government today and all of tomorrow's. Asking nothing for ourselves. PLEASE RE/POST THE 17th AMENDMENT OF THE U.S. CONSTITUTION Was it Valid? Was it Constitutional? Addressed to all State Legislators: The United States Constitution was ratified in 1787. For the following 125 Years through 1912 we had a CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC; whereby, each State Legislature selected their two U.S. Senators. The House of Representatives, on the other hand was selected by direct popular vote. The basic premise was interded to give checks and balance in the Federal Legislature, making laws coming from two distinctly different points of view, maintaining State's Rights with a balance of influence between the States and the Federal Government. This Legislative check and balance were destroyed in 1913, (eighty-six years ago). The appointment of U.S. Senators by State Legislators was replaced by popular vote. This change was made in a period when force s were moving our Nation toward a more dominant central government. In the same year, 1913, this movement also brought Federal Reserve Banking and the FEDERAL INCOME TAX. With Unlimited taxing power and limitless spending, we have a Federal Government that is "out of control." This is the opinion of most Democrat and Republican State Legislatures. YOU can take an important step in bringing the Federal Government back in control while at the same time restoring much of the original structure of our CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC, with equal partnership between Federal and State Governments. James,Madison expressed in the Federalist Papers, "The State Legislature is the 'Voice of the State'and must be the vehicle for implementing States' Rights through selection of the U.S. Senators; ONLY THEN, shall the balance of power between the State and Federal Government be MAINTAINED in the U.S. Legislature." Was this basic structure of our Constitution altered? The last sentence of Article V of the Constitution clearly specifies, "NO STATE, WITHOUT ITS CONSENT, SHALL BE DEPRIVED ITS EQUAL SUFFRAGE IN THE SENATE." This is the key to States' Right's and States'Sovereignty! Each State Legislature has the right to choose their two U.S. Senators regardless of how other States select theirs. You will then hold your two U.S. Senators accountable to your State through State Legislature thereof. Article 1, Section 3, of the U.S. Constitution, states, "The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, CHOSEN BY THE LEGISLATURE THEREOF, for six years, and each Senator shall have one vote." In 1931 an Archive Research Study (U.S. Senate Document # 240) was made by the U.S. Senate in all forty-eight states. This study was to verify proof of the validity of the ratification of all the Constitutional Amendments. In 191 3 when three fourths or thirty-six of the then forty-eight States were needed to ratify an Amendment. The U.S. Senate Study in 1931 indicated 31 States ratifying the 17th Amendment in 1913, instead of the necessary 36 States. The State Archive Search in 1996 came to the same conclusion. The records do not confirm ratification in seventeen states. Following are the results of this Archive Research. - - Five States (Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, Virginia, and Alabama) were not in session in 1913 and never considered the 17th Amendment. - - Georgia and Rhode Island (issue died in Committee) - - South Carolina (postponed the issue) - - Florida (never reached the State Senate) - - Utah and Delaware (rejected the 17th Amendment) - - Maine and New Hampshire's votes and procedure were questionable (voice vote only). Maine's record of voting in either chamber is nonexistent. New Hampshire's record of State Senate vote is nonexistent. - - The States of North Carolina, Connecticut, and Massachusetts show no record of a vote in one or both Legislative Chambers. Louisiana passed in May 1914 (one year after the facts) Regardless, the political pundits did not have the commission for changing our Basic form of Government. THE CONCLUSION-IS -- THE 17TH AMENDMENT WAS NEVER PROPERLY RATIFIED. You may ask, "Why hasn't this question of validity been addressed through the Federal Courts?" The answer is, it has been addressed several times. However, the usual court answer, "It is too late to do anything about this Amendment because it is already built into our System of Government." This issue was set aside, by the 7th Federal Circuit Court over a decade ago. (Law of Prescription) As for the American people they are mostly honest and hard working. They are our nation's taxpayers and they know right from wrong-The problem with this amendment is :ust a simple math problem in addition and it is never too late to correct a problem most especially when it completely changes the intent of our Founding Fathers who gave us the most perfect government the world has ever known. Since this amendment was never properly ratified, it is the duty of each State Legislature to select two of their members to represent their respective State in the United States Senate as set forth in the United States Constitution ratified in 1787. Let us live up to the intention of our Country's Founders and take action on this part of our Constitution; whereby, you, the State Legislators may select your two U.S. Senators. It's up to YOU -not the Federal Courts to bring back what we yearn for -- a Federal Government under better control, whereby, you in the State Legislature may have a say in Federal Taxation and spending. Now is your opportunity to take immediate action on this important issue by returning to our Constitutional Republic. FOLLOWING IS THE BILL OR RESOLUTION TO BE INTRODUCED IN EACH STATE FOR ACTIVATIND STATE LEGISLATIVE SELECTION OF THE TWO UNITED STATES SENATORS THEREOF 1. Continuation or curtailment of the terms of the present U.S. Senators to be left to the discretion of the State Legislatures thereof. 2. The wages of a U.S. Senator appointed by a State Leciislature shall be paid by that State, and that Senator shall be accountable to the State Legislature thereof. 3. The last clause of Article V of the U.S. Constitution specifies; "...THAT NO STATE, WITHOUT ITS CONSENT SHALL BE DEPRIVED OF ITS EQUAL SUFFRAGE IN THE SENATE." (This is the key to the very existence of States' rights in the U.S. Senate) 4. States choosing to implement Article V shall activate Article 1, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution. "The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, CHOSEN BY THE LEGISLATURE THEREOF, for six years, and each Senator shall have one vote." 5. The Federal Courts shall have no commission in this basic structure of our Government. (The Constitutional Republic) 6. The States built and implemented our basic Constitution form of Government including the Federal Courts -- It's the Commission of the States -- not the Federal Courts -- to maintain this basic Governmental structure -- the product of the constitutional convention in 1787. 7. There shall be NO ATTEMPT to use this Resolution as a vehicle to open up a Constitutional Convention. It is not a question of altering this excellent form of Government, but it is.a question of adhering to the basic premises of this important document -- THE CONSTITUTION. Submitted by, Grandmothers for Honest Government Working for better government today and all of our tomorrows asking nothing for ourselves. Myra Davis-Dippel, President P.O. Box 6934 - Tyler, Texas 75711 NOTE: Myra and I have been working on this for several years. This letter was sent to all of the State Legislatures of the 50 States United. It needs to be done again. Myra has had a stroke and can not do any work on this for the time being or may never be able to. In my opinion it would be nice if a group from every state would pick up the work and carry it through your State Legislature and get the 17th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution voided and give States control over their Senators in Washington, D.C. again. If you have time please send Myra a Get Well Card. Rocky [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Mar 00 20:00:56 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: McGehee's News & Comment - March 27, 2000 (fwd) On Mar 27, The McGehee Zone wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] McGEHEE'S NEWS & COMMENT (c) 2000 KEVIN McGEHEE Newnan, Georgia mail@mcgeheezone.com http://www.mcgeheezone.com/ Permission granted to anyone wishing to forward, redistribute, or broadcast this article WITH FULL ATTRIBUTION. ================================================================ HERE THEY COME -- AGAIN They're back, and they're coming for the abortion plank in the GOP platform. They've come for it every four years since 1980. They've failed every time. And they keep voting Republican, giving lie to their dire warnings that the abortion plank drives their ilk away from the party of Lincoln and Reagan. Each time they come, they argue that eliminating the plank won't hurt the party's chances on Election Day, because the pro-lifers "have nowhere else to go." In truth, pro-lifers and others -- who watch the GOP's stance on abortion as a bellwether of what the party will do on other movement issues -- have demonstrated effectively, and repeatedly, that they don't have to go anywhere at all to make their point -- including to the polls. Insanity has often been defined as "doing the same thing over and over, again and again, each time expecting a different result." So what does that make this quixotic splinter group that keeps trying, and failing, to remove the abortion plank? The fact is that in recent years, abortion has not been on anybody's front burner. Since President Clinton and the Democrats, with the help of the four divisions of the U.S. Ministry of Propaganda (ABC, CBS, NBC and CNN), turned aside efforts to ban partial-birth abortions, elected officials have by and large left the issue alone. "Pro-choice" activists have been virtually invisible in the popular "news" media, and if it weren't for "moderate" Republicans bashing their pro-life brethren during the run-up to the national convention you might not even know there was such a thing as an abortion "issue." This is not to say, though, that *nobody* cares about it. Obviously there are still activists out there who support the unregulated availability of abortion at any time for any reason (or none whatsoever), and some of them are obviously bent on making their quadrennial mischief in the Republican Party in order to get their faces on television and their names in the newspapers. And there are also pro-lifers, nearly all in the GOP, whose votes will turn on whether the party stays true to its longstanding (and long politically beneficial) position on abortion. The idea that millions of single-issue "pro-choicers" will suddenly abandon the party of sexual abandon to vote Republican, if only the GOP will drop its pro-life platform plank, is lunacy at its maddest. "Pro-choice" Republicans may argue that the plank costs the GOP more votes than it gains, but that is so obviously untrue that any rational person who uttered it would have to be engaging in farce. Plank opponents claim to fear that abortion, and other movement issues such as gun rights and substantive education reform, could marginalize the Republican Party in the way that the movement issues of the Left marginalized the Democrats. But there are differences that these "moderates," in their homage to moral equivalence, are ignoring. For one thing, as an example, law-abiding gun owners number in the tens of millions, making them a potential voting bloc of monumental proportions, if the typical gun owner should ever become as mobilized as are the few million who actively belong to gun-rights organizations. What potential voting bloc exists supporting gun control? According to the most scientific polls, there is none. Education reform is an issue that the Democrats have been trying to co-opt for years because of both its tremendous power as an issue and the long-term havoc they could suffer if substantive reform were ever implemented. The Left's movement issues include -- besides abortion -- "gay rights," radical environmentalism, and animal "rights." In almost every case, when mainstream Americans have these issues explained to them, overwhelming majorities reject the Left's position. Voters have rejected "gay marriage," for example, in liberal Hawaii, libertarian Alaska, and diverse California, all by huge margins. Obviously the Democrats have a serious movement-issue gap. It's only right that they should have become marginalized because of the looney positions that movement voter blocs have imposed on their platform. The GOP's movement issues, though, are far more mainstream than even those of *non-movement* Democrats! In contrast, hard-core abortion voters on both sides do seem fairly evenly matched, with a sizeable middle segment whose views lie in between, on the one hand, supporting abortion on demand regardless of need and, on the other, opposing all abortions all the time. This makes abortion an excellent defining issue for both parties, and all things being equal neither party should back away from its position until the middle begins to move decisively in one direction or another. Of course, all things are not equal -- when the issue is defined in the terms that resonate best with typical voters, the pro-life position tends to draw more support than does its opposition. "Pro-choice" activists can only hold off public opinion by obfuscating the issue with confusing jargon that conceals the cruel reality behind the soothing rhetoric. And that is undoubtedly what motivates the "pro-choice" Republicans. So long as the GOP stands in opposition to a practice that victimizes the most innocent, there is the risk that its stand will eventually turn America against the practice. And so the "pro-choice" handful tries, and tries, and tries yet again, to marginalize the much larger and -- within the GOP -- much more mainstream pro-life multitude. Perhaps if the GOP's "pro-choice" splinter group ever realized that the so-called "mainstream" media isn't, they might realize that a strategy that resonates with Peter, Dan, Tom and Bernie is pretty well doomed -- not only in the Republican Party but in America as a whole. Meanwhile, they'll just keep coming. And losing. And coming back again... - -30- March 27, 2000 ================================================================ McGehee's News & Comment will not appear on April 3 or 10. I'm taking the next couple of weeks off to consider a new direction for this project. Watch for the next distribution on Monday, April 17, 2000. ================================================================ This article can also be read online at http://www.mcgeheezone.com/news&comment/2000/0327.htm The views expressed herein are entirely those of the author(s), and do not reflect those of any person or group with whom the author(s) may be affiliated, unless explicitly labelled as doing so. - --... ...-- -.. . -.- .-.. ----- - -.-- [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Mar 00 09:53:41 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fratrum: Peace Officer (fwd) On Mar 28, Margi Crook wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Dear Peace Officer: I don't want to kill you. I don't even want to wound you. I admire your courage and the commitment you've made to help others, often at the risk of your own life. I hope you won't come for me, because if you do, one of us will die. It may be you. I've done nothing wrong. I don't intend to. But the government that you serve has passed too many laws. I am sure to accidentally break one, some day. And that same government is systematically destroying the unalienable rights which our Constitution says may not be infringed - very specifically, my right to keep and bear arms. I am not some wacko lunatic, but I can no longer stand idly by, while decent people are systematically enslaved by an out-of-control government. I cannot allow a corrupt judiciary to use its power to destroy my rights and my country. That government and that judiciary has begun to use you to arrest and kill people just like me - people who believe that the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights mean what they say. You don't know me, but you see me every day. I may be a businessman, a truck driver, an executive. I could be a housewife or a salesman. But I am armed, as Americans have been for over 250 years, and I am determined to keep the freedoms that only an armed people may retain. With a rifle, I can hit a man-sized target at 800 yards. At shorter distances, in the blink of an eye, I can hit a head-size target with a handgun. I don't wear a uniform. I don't drive a marked car. I don't wear camouflage. I could be your own secretary, or your barber. I might be the guy who delivers your bottled water, or the parcel delivery lady. You don't know who I am, or what arms I have, and you never will. I am millions. I am America. But I know you. I know your uniform, your car, and your work schedule. I know where you work, and where you live. And that is good for you, because not only am I no threat to you, so long as you do the job for which you are hired, I am also prepared to assist you when you are threatened. There aren't many of me left, you may think, but believe me, there are many, many more than you can imagine. When the chips are down, we are the ones who are truly on your side. On your side, that is, so long as you honor your Oath. We are on your side if you are one of the majority of peace officers who are not corrupt and who have not sold out to the socialists and communists who will do anything, say anything to destroy the America our fathers and grandfathers bequeathed us. No, I am no threat to you, but your bosses in government don't see it that way. They think that I, and my arms, are a threat to them, and they are planning to send you for me, just as they've sent armed, dangerous officers on select little missions for years, taking out targeted individuals. On their orders, you may succeed in murdering me for my beliefs. Or you may not. Whether or not you succeed in murdering me, as federal agents murdered Vicki Weaver in Idaho; or as those same federal agents murdered 81 men, women and children at Waco, Texas; there will be others who will rise up in my memory, as I now rise up in honor of the innocent lives taken by the jack-booted thugs and black-clad imitation ninjas who think it is fun to murder Americans -who have somehow become convinced that it is their job to murder Americans. I am prepared to die, honoring my sacred Oath as an American, to defend and protect the Constitution of the united States of America. Are you prepared to die to violate the Oath you took? You see, our government is out of control. You know it. You've seen it. But you, like many others, have been too concerned with your job, your family, and your pension, to say or do anything about it. Deep down, you know I am right. But you think you must follow orders. Or must you? Are you going to murder me for having the courage to stand up for the country and the principles in which you believe? Are you going to go along with unconscionably illegal, unconstitutional orders, just as the "good" German soldiers followed their orders? Are you going to be a peace officer or a jack-booted thug? There is little difference between a street outlaw who murders and robs; and a uniformed thug who murders and robs under color of law. The result is the same. Property confiscated, lives ruined, families ripped apart, murder committed, and a free nation destroyed. Look at history. Look around the world. As we move toward a lawless society, our country moves closer and closer to anarchy and then some form of fascism. Are you going to enforce unconstitutional laws? Are you going to be the private army of fascist dictators masquerading as democratic representatives? Or are you going to do your part to recapture America? Are you going to keep your eyes and ears open? Will you let me know when the jack-booted thugs in the SWAT teams have targeted me? Will you let your fellow officers know that they are being sold down the river by their corrupt masters? Don't come to kill me. Because I don't want to kill you. If you do come, you may succeed - if you get lucky. But don't count on luck, because it will probably be hard - damned hard. Like millions of other Americans, I am the son or daughter of a nation of riflemen - citizen-soldiers who have a rich heritage of beating the best the enemy can send against us. We are resourceful. We understand weapons and tactics. You are foolish if you intend to be our enemy. If you don't succeed in the long run, and you won't, here's what you can expect: Ambushes of SWAT teams; the wholesale slaughter of all the jack-booted thugs who have murdered innocent Americans on the orders of their socialist masters; targeted assassinations and kidnappings of anti-Constitution judges; assassinations of anti-American, anti-gun politicians. By your willingness to be a good little Nazi, you will have unleashed a civil war. It doesn't have to be that way. You can do something about it. It's easy. Read the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Although you took an Oath to defend them, you don't see much of them in your training, do you? Today, these documents are considered dangerous by the government, just as King George found them dangerous over 200 years ago. Why do you suppose your leaders lead you to oppose the very rights you swore to protect? Why do they want a disarmed public? You know the reason. It has nothing to do with controlling crime. It has everything to do with using you to disarm, fine and control your fellow American Citizens. Don't fall for it. Don't force me to kill you. (Signed, 100 Million Real Americans) [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Mar 00 16:34:55 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fwd: Help Rep. Hostettler Overturn Clinton And Wesson (fwd) On Mar 30, David W Shuee wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] From: Gun Owners of America Reply-To: Gun Owners of America To: goamail@gunowners.org Subject: Help Rep. Hostettler Overturn Clinton And Wesson Rep. Hostettler needs your help to overturn the Clinton & Wesson sell-out -- Prospects for passage are good; but your Rep. must hear from you! Gun Owners of America E-Mail/FAX Alert 8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151 Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408 http://www.gunowners.org (Wednesday, March 29, 2000) -- Rep. John Hostettler (R-IN) is leading the charge against the latest unholy alliance to rear its ugly head. As most activists know, the Clinton administration struck a deal with Smith & Wesson almost two weeks ago -- an agreement that not only affects the company itself, but would also inflict gun control restrictions on private gun buyers and impose massive red tape on ALL gun sales by retailers that carry S & W products. To enforce the Clinton & Wesson deal, an Oversight Commission that has the force of law will make sure the gun control restrictions agreed to by S & W are being followed by all dealers doing business with the company -- restrictions that apply to ALL brands carried by the dealer, not just the S & W guns that they sell. But Rep. Hostettler is working to get pro-gun language put in the budget this year that will put a stop to this insanity. His language will not only defund the Oversight Commission, it will deny funds for any future lawsuit by the Clinton administration that would seek to extort more companies to follow Smith & Wesson's lead. This Battle Is Definitely Winnable Two years ago, Senator Bob Smith (R-NH) succeeded in defunding the FBI's plan to tax gun owners. Smith boldly went to the floor of the Senate -- where fellow colleagues told him his measure could not pass. But he ignored the naysayers, forced a vote on his measure, and accomplished his goal of getting an provision in the budget withholding funds for an FBI gun tax -- a provision that is still there to this day. This budget battle is similar, although it will take a little bit more work on the part of the grassroots. The House is not like the Senate; it's not as easy to get amendments put into legislation. But it can be done! URGENT ACTION: Please take the time to contact your Representative. This is super important! If Clinton gets his way and bankrupts the American firearms industry through lawsuits, how easy will it be for you to get new firearms? How easy will it be for your children and grandchildren to buy new firearms in the future? The future of the Second Amendment is on the line here. Please contact your Rep. right away! You can use the text below to fax, email or call your Representative. Ph) 888-449-3511 (toll-free). - ----------- Pre-written message ------------ Dear Representative: Rep. John Hostettler is trying to get a very important amendment into the Treasury budget this year. In order to get support from various Representatives, he is circulating a letter addressed to appropriations subcommittee Chairman Jim Kolbe. This letter asks Rep. Kolbe to insert language defunding the Oversight Commission that was created in the recent Clinton & Wesson agreement. This Commission has the force of law to make sure the gun control restrictions agreed to by Smith & Wesson are being followed by anyone who does business with the company. I hope you will take the time to sign this very important letter and support his efforts 100 percent! The recent Clinton & Wesson agreement is disgusting, and it is completely out of line with what Americans want. A recent Zogby poll found that 2/3 of the people say it's illegitimate to bring lawsuits against gun manufacturers or to hold them liable for the criminal misuse of guns. And despite what the media seems to think, people don't want more gun control. Zogby also found that only 29 percent of people would be likely to support a candidate that is a "supporter of stronger gun controls." The President's recent deal is nothing but an end-run around the Constitution. Congress has power to enact laws -- not the President through the extortion of American businesses. Again, I hope you will sign the Hostettler letter and do everything you can to stop this back-door attempt at gun control. I would also request that you speak to Rep. Kolbe personally and ask him to put the pro-gun language in the budget. Thank you. Sincerely, __________________ ************** Cheaper Than Dirt donates a percentage of your total order to GOA if you use http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/goa.htm to enter their online store. ************** Did someone else forward this to you? To be certain of getting up to date information, please consider subscribing to the GOA E-Mail Alert Network directly. There is no cost or obligation, and the volume of mail is quite low. To subscribe, simply send a message to goamail@gunowners.org and include the state in which you live, in either the subject or the body. To unsubscribe, reply to any alert and ask to be removed. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 00 22:31:48 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: OT Joke - Enjoy! Josie (fwd) On Apr 02, by way of Josephine Lindsay Bass wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] A language instructor was explaining to her class that French nouns, unlike their English counterparts, are grammatically designated as masculine or feminine. Things like "chalk" or "pencil," she described, would have a gender association. For example: House is feminine, la" maison. In English, of course, words are of neutral gender. Puzzled, one student raised his hand and asked, "What gender is a computer?" The teacher wasn't certain which it was, and so divided the class into two groups and asked them to decide if a computer should be masculine or feminine. One group was composed of the women in the class, and the other of men. Both groups were asked to give four reasons for their recommendation. The men decided that computers should definitely be referred to in the feminine gender (la) because: 1. No one but their creator understands their internal logic. 2. The native language they use to communicate with other computers is incomprehensible to everyone else. 3. Even the smallest mistakes are stored in long-term memory for later retrieval. 4. As soon as you make a commitment to one, you find yourself spending half your paycheck on accessories for it. The group of women, however, concluded that computers should be referred to in the masculine (le) gender because: 1. In order to get their attention, you have to turn them on. 2. They have a lot of data but are still clueless. 3. They are supposed to help you solve your problems, but half the time they ARE the problem. 4. As soon as you commit to one, you realize that, if you had waited a little longer, you could have had a better model [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Apr 00 22:33:54 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fw: Fwd: S&W MUST DIE! (fwd) On Apr 3, Jim Zoes wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] From: Edgar Suter Subject: Fwd: S&W MUST DIE! Date: Mon, 3 Apr 00 18:07:36 -0700 To: firearms-alert@lists.best.com > ---------------- Begin Forwarded Message ---------------- > > Date: 04/03 09:40 > Received: 04/03 17:02 > From: L. Neil Smith, lneil@ezlink.com > To: 000 L. Neil Smith, lneil@ezlink.com > > SMITH & WESSON MUST DIE > > By L. Neil Smith > > See it soon in _The Libertarian Enterprise_ > http://www.webleyweb.com/tle > > Over the past couple of weeks, a third of my e-mail has concerned > a decision of the Smith & Wesson company to sign an "agreement" with > the Clinton Administration -- supposedly in order to avoid massive > state lawsuits -- to act as if the Second Amendment had never been > written. > > What began as a depressing event -- foreshadowing, many feared, > the end of private gun ownership -- has suddenly turned into something > else. Gun Owners of America announced what promises to be an effective > boycott against S&W. One by one, other companies told the Clintonistas > where to shove their "agreement". When everybody said the Austrians > would geek, they didn't, and neither did the Belgians -- although > Ruger and Beretta are lying low -- and distributors and dealers have > started sending S&W products back to Springfield, where they came > from. > > Most recently, S&W's Chicago lawfirm has quit them. > > Even Utah Senator Orrin Hatch -- arguably the most evil individual > in politics today -- could see which way the wind was blowing and has > introduced legislation in the Senate to forbid any further federal > participation in lawsuits against gun companies. And a credible move > is now underway in the congress to render the S&W "agreement" null and > void. > > It's sad to think that S&W, which predates the War between the > States, introduced the self-contained metallic cartridge, and in the > 1980s gave us the wonderful "Ladysmith" program -- encouraging women > to learn to defend themselves by redesigning weapons specifically to > fit the female hand -- has sunk to the low, crawling, yellow-bellied > pusillanimity that signing Clinton's "agreement" required. But the > fact is, S&W never did make managerial decisions particularly well, > whether it involved Second Amendment politics or merchandising of > weapons. > > Just in my lifetime, S&W has come up with bonnet-bees -- or some > focus panel has, or some overly-blonde vice president's wife -- so > stultifyingly imbecilic that it's embarrassing even thinking about > them. Back in the 60s, when they were owned by something called Bangor > Punta (which always sounded to me like one of Tarzan's animal friends) > they called publicly for handgun registration. This latest display of > the white feather is hardly unprecedented. They've always been Second > Amendment weaklings, likely due to their location in the only state > carried by George McGovern, and the fact that -- despite their actual > sales numbers -- they've always seen themselves primarily as a police > outfitter. > > Managerial decisions? If ever there was a "suicidal corporation", > S&W is it. Their .41 Magnum Model 58 Military and Police -- featured > prominently in my first novel, _The Probability Broach -- is a slick, > no-nonsense fighting instrument that, employing two cartridge power > levels, can take a man down or stop a car with only a little added > weight or bulk compared to the traditional (and woefully inadequate) > police .38 Special. One of the finest combat revolvers ever conceived, > S&W discontinued it, rather than producing it in stainless steel -- > and in .44 Magnum and .45 Colt -- as anyone with any brains would have > done. > > Managerial decisions? In the 1990s S&W had somebody working for > them who created what we all ended up calling the "gun of the week" > program, under which S&W came out with more innovative concepts over > the short span of a year than they'd introduced in the 50 preceding > years. Of course the man responsible was run out of the ancient outfit > with extreme prejudice and to this day they're ashamed to talk about > him. > > Managerial decisions? In my capacity as a competitive shooter and > retired gunsmith, S&W's Model 610 was technologically and historically > the best revolver ever produced anywhere by anyone. Naturally, after > only a year or two of production and almost no attempt to promote it > to gun buyers or any other part of the public, they discontinued its > manufacture. > > Managerial decisions? There are those who may disagree, but again, > in my opinion as a competitor and a gunsmith, S&W never could make > decent semiautomatic pistols, although they've wasted several fortunes > trying to get it right -- and failing every time. Their incompetence > may even account, at least in part, for the remarkable longevity of > Colt's 1911A1. Having shot (and repaired) many S&W autos and listened > to the lamentations of their owners, I have never been moved to buy > one. > > S&W revolvers are something else altogether. Magnificent "engines > of destruction" made legendary (most recently) by Clint Eastwood's > "Dirty Harry", they occupy a different plane of existence. I love them > all. My collection includes a .38, a .357 Magnum with an adjustable > front sight, a 10mm auto (that's the M610 I mentioned above, a sixgun > chambered for the 10mm autopistol cartridge -- it also shoots .40 > S&W), a .41 Magnum, a .44 Magnum, and a .45 ACP that works the same as > the 10mm. Once again, as a shooter and gunsmith, I agree they're a > trifle antiquated, designwise, fragile compared with Ruger's output. > But nothing can match their eye-pleasing elegance and hand-pleasing > grace. > > I risk boring the non-gunners (and non-wheelgunners) among my > readers because I want them to understand fully -- in technicolor and > 3D -- how painful it is for me to write the next few paragraphs. The > proposed boycott of S&W and other measures are good as far as they go. > I support them all wholeheartedly. However they don't go nearly far > enough. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > I'm not saying that they don't go nearly far enough to satisfy our > purely emotional desire for justice, retribution, even revenge. I'm > saying that they don't go nearly far enough to guarantee our continued > _survival_. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > Smith & Wesson must be amputated from the American social body > like the gangrenous excrescence it has become and thrown out with the > rest of the medical/political waste. Otherwise the infection will > spread. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > Understand that it's going to take more than a boycott; S&W was > prepared for that or they'd never have signed Clinton's "agreement". > Being owned by an English holding company, it's more than likely that > their "surrender" was a put-up job to begin with, a gift from Tony > Blair, intended to give Clinton what he needs to destroy an entire > industry -- exactly as he's promised his comrades under international > agreements he's made to eliminate every personally owned weapon in the > world. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > I've heard that the S&W CEO -- in a manner foully reminiscent of > the late Republican National Committee chairman Lee Atwater -- has > been confiding to the media that his customers are "a little crazy > just now, but they'll be back". What that tells me is that this time > -- unlike many similar moments over the past 50 years -- we can't be > satisfied to fend off the latest attack and survive with minimal > losses. > > This time it has to cost them something. Have no qualms about it. > A corporation isn't private property -- it's only an extension of the > state. Yes, that's what I said. In applying to the state for special > powers and immunities, a corporation becomes an _extension_ of the > state. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > A boycott is not enough. Our goal must be to make life completely > impossible for S&W -- in exactly the same way anti-nuclear activists > made life impossible for the nuclear power industry in the 1960s and > 1970s. We must interdict S&W's sales to government agencies at every > level, starve the company, and kill it. For those who have the means, > we must find judges who will issue injunctions against city, county, > or state purchases -- especially preferential purchases -- of S&W > products. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > For those who don't, picketing public buildings is an alternative, > as is attending the meetings of your local city council or county > commission. Remind them that they've taken what's supposed to be a > sacred oath to uphold and defend the Constitution. Tell them that, in > choosing to do business with a foreign corporation savaging the Bill > of Rights, they're violating both the letter and the spirit of that > oath. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > Get every one of your gunny friends to help. If you see a S&W auto > or revolver in a cop's holster, don't bother him -- in these post-Waco > days he'll probably kill you if you do, and cook you, and eat you, and > get a commendation for it -- but find out if your city has a contract > with S&W and demand that it be terminated immediately on the grounds > (if all else fails) that the company falls short of Bill of Rights > compliance. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > Lawyers among us need to injoin HUD and other government agencies > prepared to reward S&W for its cowardly behavior. One of the goodies > Clinton promised S&W (and anybody else who signs on) is preferential > treatment in the purchase of weapons by the the Department of Housing > and Urban Development and similar agencies. (I was unaware that HUD is > a major weapons buyer -- that's something, in itself, that should be > looked into.) I could be mistaken, but doesn't that sound illegal to > you? > > Whatever happened to competitive bidding? > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > Choke off S&W's sales for six months while the courts muddle the > whole thing, and S&W will miraculously find the grounds they need to > abrogate the deal. It's either that or be thrown onto the cliche-heap > of hisory. As New York's nasty attorney general can attest -- he's the > disappointed little creep whose cherished plans have backfired and > who's now trying to argue that a boycott is a violation of antitrust > laws -- it was signed under extreme duress that he himself helped > apply. > > (This is the pocket Nazi who warned gun companies to comply with > his demands or prepare to greet their bankruptcy attorneys at their > door. What they need to tell him is that times change and regimes > change with them. He _will_ learn to obey the highest law of the land > or prepare to greet federal marshals at his door with a big, noisy > collection of manacles, leg-irons, and belly-chains, and TV cameras to > record the moment as they shove him into the Black Maria and haul him > away.) > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > In the long run, this war will be won in the court of popular > opinion. We've always known -- and now, thanks to Gary Kleck and John > Lott, we can prove -- that guns and gun ownership save lives. Which > means that anything or anybody who interferes with unencumbered > ownership of and free access to guns endangers lives. In today's > battle of sound bites and slogans, that translates as "S&W kills > kids". > > We need to talk publicly about S&W's "Kid Killer Kontrakt". > > Smith & Wesson must die. > > If you ever hope to live in a civilization where you can walk into > a hardware store, put your cash on the counter, and walk out with the > weapon of your choice -- without ever having produced identification > or signing even a single piece of paper -- then Smith & Wesson must > die. > > Maybe once they're bankrupt, no more than a name, and in the hands > of pro-gun Americans again, we can go back to buying their beautiful > revolvers. > > Smith & Wesson must die. > -- > ======= order at: http://www.webleyweb.com/lneil/lnsbooks.html ======= > Author: The Probability Broach, The Venus Belt, Their Majesties' > Bucketeers, Lando Calrissian and the Mindharp of Sharu, Lando > Calrissian and the Flamewind of Oseon, Lando Calrissian and the > Starcave of Thonboka, The Lando Calrissian Adventures, The Nagasaki > Vector, Tom Paine Maru, The Gallatin Divergence, The WarDove, The > Crystal Empire, Brightsuit MacBear, Taflak Lysandra, Contact and > Commune, Converse and Conflict, Concert and Cosmos, Henry Martyn, > Pallas, Bretta Martyn, The Mitzvah (with Aaron Zelman), Forge of the > Elders, Lever Action, The American Zone > ======= order at: http://www.webleyweb.com/lneil/lnsbooks.html ======= [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #324 *************************