From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 31 Jan 2001 12:48:15 -0700 (MST) > > As I said, I haven't read _Disoriented_ but if ends like that, that may > be what Ivan is talking about. > > Thom I meant that i was set up for an ending with some stuff unresolved, and while God doesn't fix everything up in one final climactic send-of (like in The Stand), everything is quickly and suddenly wrapped up as though the author had run out of space. --Ivan Wolfe - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] LTU&E Writing Contest Date: 31 Jan 2001 13:18:36 -0700 Life the Universe, and Everything, an annual symposium on Science Fiction and Fantasy held at Brigham Young University, is pleased to announce its writing contest for 2001. Along with the name of the contest (DragonComet), a few of the rules have been changed. Take a look to see what changes we have made. The contest is divided into three categories: 1. School age writers (7th - 12th grade at contest deadline) 2. Adults 18+ writing for young adult audiences 3. Adults 18+ writing for adult audiences The contest deadline is 12 February 2001. There is no entrance fee. Only one entry is allowed per person per category. No simultaneous or previously published entries will be accepted. Entries must be in the Science Fiction and/or Fantasy genre. All stories should be mailed unfolded in a manila envelope to: LTUE WRITING CONTEST ATTN: JENNA EATOUGH E120 BNSN BRIGHAM YOUNG UNIVERSITY PROVO, UT 84602 No email entries will be accepted. Entries remain the property of the author. Entries will not be returned unless a SASE is included. Do not send the only copy of your entries. We are not responsible for lost entries. All stories should have a cover sheet including name, title of work, mailing address, email address (optional), school you are attending (optional), the entry category, author's signature of permission, parent's signature if under eighteen, and where you learned about the contest. A sample cover sheet is on the web page. The author's name and any identifying information should appear only on the cover sheet in order to retain the objectivity of the judges. The title and page number should appear on all pages of the story. Length should be no greater than 17,000 words in length. Entries must be on 8 1/2 by 11 white paper, and they must be typed, double spaced, one inch margins, and 12pt. All entries must be in English. Illegible entries will not be considered. The top three stories in each category will receive awards. Further prizes will be announced at a later date on the web page. Judging will be done blindly to avoid any bias of the judges. Authors of winning stories will be notified after the final judging. Winners will be posted on the web page. Prizes will only be awarded at the discretion of the judges. Thank you for your interest. Please pass word of the contest on to anyone you feel may be interested. Email dragoncomet@hotmail.com with any questions. symposium web page: http://www.jps.net/helgem/ltue/ contest web page: http://www.eatough.net/dragoncomet/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Tarbet" Subject: RE: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 31 Jan 2001 13:24:23 -0700 > How about a novel that portrays Mormonism as spiritual survival > of the fittest, which is what it is when you look past all the > Christian paradoxes? > > Chris Bigelow We're graded on some sort of heavenly curve? Wouldn't a novel based on that premise confirm all the worst "earn your way to heaven" stereotypes about Mormon theology? What are the "Christian paradoxes"? The idea that we're saved through grace after all we can do? -- Scott Tarbet - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Darlene Young Subject: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 31 Jan 2001 12:19:56 -0800 (PST) Could someone give me some information on Brady Udall's connection with Mormon literature? Is he LDS? From somewhere (on this List, I believe, or else in the AML-edited Dialogue issue) I picked up a recommendation for his short story collection, "Letting Loose the Hounds." The stories are quite interesting, very colorful. Some of them take place in Utah and one has an LDS character. Does Udall have any other connections with Mormon lit. than this? Thanks. ===== Darlene Young __________________________________________________ Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: Re: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 31 Jan 2001 15:40:50 -0500 I saw a Tonight Show appearance by the young woman (Erika Christensen) who plays Caroline Wakefield in Traffic. She struck me as awfully Mormon. Anybody know? Tony Markham - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 31 Jan 2001 15:17:53 -0700 _I Am Jane_, the play-with-music ("Negro Spirituals") I wrote about Black pioneer, Jane Manning James, will play for two days only at BYU, sponsored by the Black Student Union. The showtimes and places: Friday Feb. 9, and Sat. Feb. 10 in room 3220 (with other rooms) of BYU's Wilkinson Center. We are really excited about this production. We have a new director, Lisa Edwards, who is a consummate expert and has brought in some marvelous new cast members. I am trying to get volume 2 of the trilogy done, so I haven't been involved in the production, but everything I hear from the cast members is EXTREMELY enthusiastic. They feel this will be several notches above the level we've performed it previously. Please come. Tickets are cheap--$2.00 for BYU students; $3.00 for community, available at the Wilkinson Center Information Desk. If you want to be sure you get a seat (we sold out when we played at Marilyn and Bill Brown's Villa Theater), you may want to pre-pay for your tickets. You can call (801) 378-4313 and pay via credit card--though they will charge you a processing fee. There were a number of folks who saw it when we did the abbreviated version at the Visitors' Center who asked when we were going to do it again, so they could invite their friends. I have no idea who those people are, but if you know someone who you think might be especially interested, please pass the word along! [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Dialogue Date: 31 Jan 2001 18:22:49 -0700 > I'm sorry, but I have lived in eight states since I was married and have > traveled as an actor or director or teacher or convention goer to another > fifteen or so. Every one of those states had distinctive speech patterns > or dialects. Ah, but you see, I couldn't agree more. That's what I was trying to show in the piece you responded to. We each have our own way of saying things. That's what makes us all wonderful individuals, yet part of the same grand country! Lu Ann Staheli - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: RE: [AML] Dealing with Mormon History Date: 31 Jan 2001 20:33:03 -0700 Scott Tarbet wrote: >As far as the government of Mexico is concerned I was never a missionary >there. According to my visa I was a basketball instructor for the Mutual >Improvement Association. (Anybody who has met me knows what a laugh *that* >is ;-d) Because of centuries of abuse, foreign missionaries are >specifically forbidden by the Mexican Constitution. But the Missionary >Department arranged my visa without any unwieldly concern for the truth or >the law. This is really interesting to me. I know that in Germany we not only obeyed every bit of the law, but that were specifically accepted by it. When I got my Geistlichenasweis (ministerial certificate) I was specifically authorized by the federal government to perform all standard ordinances of religion, including marriages. Germany is odd in that while they support the existence of many churches, only a very few are recognized by the government. As a missionary in West Berlin (at the time there were still two Germanies and two Berlins) I heard a lot about the efforts to move into East Germany, where proselyting missionaries are explicitly illegal. I also heard that they simply wouldn't violate those laws under any circumstance. Then again, the German police are known for being sticklers for the law and having no sense of humor whatsoever for violations of it. Different places have different assumptions, I guess. Intriquing. Scott Parkin - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rose Green" Subject: Re: [AML] Author's Say in Book Layout Date: 31 Jan 2001 22:57:59 -0600 >Some regional presses might let an author have limited say in the >layout/design of a picture book, but not the national publishing houses. >An >author usually doesn't even get to help choose the illustrator. > >I'm surprised that a book published by Knopf would be so poorly designed. >Perhaps it is *supposed* to look amateurish. What is the title? The Playmaker, by J.B. Cheaney. When you first pick it up, it doesn't look so bad, but it's hard to actually read. The library binding probably doesn't help. I'm sure someone really liked the design and did it on purpose, like you said. Still, in a non-illustrated book, I'd rather read the content than spend time thinking about the typeset. Rose _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] First Attempts to Be a Writer Date: 31 Jan 2001 23:45:44 -0800 How delightful this topic should come up now. A couple of years ago (that long?) I wrote an essay called "Lucid Dreaming" (title essay for a collection) which is a combination of memoir, literary theory, practical criticism, record of my development as a critic, and collection of my diverse styles.=20 I would note, if this were a thread on my development as a writer, how much that development owes to Benson Parkinson and AML-List. Because of Ben's invitations to write things and because the threads here have been most fructifying I have material for several books of essays. I consider myself a fiction writer, but have found a talent for quirky personal essays. Much thanks to him. Anyway, here's an excerpt from "Lucid Dreaming." I wish I still had the story I describe: My waking life floats on words like Moses in his basket, words and stories, words calling forth stories, stories giving life to words. "I Discover Moses and the Bulrushers," might be chapter 1 for my sense of story, as it was for this boy named Huckleberry Finn=97as surely related to Huckleberry Hound Dog as Abraham Lincoln to Isaac, demanded by the Lord as a sacrifice. What a wonderful, mysterious word, bulrushers, but I didn't read the book, plumb the mystery, just then. I wrote a story, a story I have only a memory of. Third grade, I think. My mother asks me to take an article to Mrs. Harris for the ward newsletter. Walk up to the top of the hill, which is the bottom of the wildmouse, a long uphill s-curve. Cut off and head up through the gulley. Steep climb at the end, then a short uphill walk. I take the story I have written to read to Mrs. Harris, about a man who is drugged and kidnapped and wakes in the Coliseum in Rome to find himself being rushed by a bull. I struggled mightily with how to describe it. "Found himself being bulrushed," I considered, but didn't know if bulrushed was a proper word, or if it was used that way. I didn't know I was struggling with whether it was a passive transitive verb, but I knew from the -er suffix that bulrush was a verb, something bulrushers did. But maybe bulrushers rushed bulls. Even my story couldn't settle the matter, so I kept writing stories. Harlow S. Clark "In literature, as in our dreams, death does not exist" --Isaac Bashevis Singer, Author's Note to _Passions_ "Shortly after that [his grandmother's death] Gary [5-years-old] started having nightmares. They were always the same dream: He was being beheaded. --Mikal Gilmore, _Shot in the Heart_, p. 105 ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 01 Feb 2001 01:22:15 -0700 "Richard R. Hopkins" wrote: > I thought it was fairly obvious that sending his spirit back was an option > determined by "the powers that be" in the spirit world, not something that > occured automatically. The villain, too, was "reoriented" but his spirit was > not given the option of returning. The return was facilitated by the fact > that the hero spent very little actual time in the spirit world. Did that > come across? That particular bit of information did not get across to me. But I didn't need it. His father got permission from "higher authorities" to send his son back. That was good enough for me. What I didn't like was how it was so conveniently handed to him--after too many other convenient resolutions of a conflict. > The reconstitution of the hero's body at the end seemed inevitable to me > based on the physics premise. That's probably why you guys figured it out > from the start. Frankly, I was surprised how few people anticipated that. So > what did you feel was wrong in going with the obvious? Is this writing > skill, or personal taste? Personally, one of my pet peeves is the penchant > of some writers to posit the occurence of events that could not have > happened just to make their story seem different. I always like a twist that surprises me, but it's not a requirement. Any surprise does need to be justified by what went before--no "impossible" events by the laws of the novel's universe. But the skilled author needs to do what he can to avoid telegraphing the ending as much as possible, without cheating the reader of the right clues to set it up. If that's impossible to avoid, then the ending needs to be significant in some other way than a surprise, or have an added unexpected twist, so it doesn't feel anticlimactic. > This criticism is very curious to me. What's wrong with everything turning > out okay, resolving all the consequences? Personally, I feel an author is > sloppy if he or she doesn't tie up the loose ends in a fictional story. This is probably more a symptom of not liking the book before getting to the ending. If the book ain't working for someone, no ending is likely to satisfy. On the other hand, an acknowledged, thought-provoking loose end or two isn't a bad idea, as long as enough of the significant loose ends are tied up in a satisfying way. But then acknowledging a loose end and its significance _is_ a sort of tying up. At least it shows the author didn't just forget about it. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "mjames_laurel" Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 01 Feb 2001 02:25:28 -0700 . What's wrong with everything turning > >out okay, resolving all the consequences? Personally, I feel an author is > >sloppy if he or she doesn't tie up the loose ends in a fictional story. I haven't read the book--but here's my take on this question, Richard: we don't necessarily want everything to always turn out "okay." What we want is for things to turn out better than okay--okay, but in a way we didn't expect, in a way we didn't forsee, in a way that is completely natural and honest, and was there all along but we didn't notice. What we do want is an ending that works, not because the writer resorts to Deus ex machina, as Thom said, or worse, resorts to Bobby Ewing in the shower. We don't want "happily ever after." What we want is hopeful. A good recent example is "Cast Away". Just when things are darkest and most un-resolvable, when you've given up hope the writer is going to be able to get himself out of the deep deep hole he's dug, the seeds that were unobtrusively planted along the way suddenly sprout. The ending is suddenly hopeful, and that hope is just enough that we are satisfied. It's only then we see where the writer has been leading us all along. There is closure. All the loose ends are tied up, even loose ends we hadn't noticed till now. We were glad when he survived the crash. We were glad when he is rescued. We are glad he is reunited with his love. That's what we thought we wanted out of this movie, isn't it? Except, suddenly there is one more thing, one thing we didn't expect, one thing that goes beyond, the thing that makes you go, Wow. And that's the thing that stays with us. The last, best thing we did not expect. Laurel - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 10:33:57 -0700 Brady was a BYU student, who went from here to Iowa, and was personally contacted by Norton Publishers to submit a collection of short fiction. John Bennion had Brady as a student, and would probably love to tell about it. Hope he does. Brady lives in Idaho, and the last I heard was teaching part time at Idaho State in Moscow, Idaho. I don't know how "Mormon" he is now, but he was raised Mormon and treats Mormonism with respect in his fiction. [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 01 Feb 2001 10:39:15 -0700 mjames_laurel wrote: > [talking about Cast Away] Except, suddenly there is one more thing, one thing we didn't > expect, one thing that goes beyond, the thing that makes you go, Wow. > Even then, that "thing" has been properly foreshadowed. When we see the first reference to it, we don't quite understand what's happening. The "Aha" moment comes during Hanks' monologue at the end. Wonderful writing. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: plus two Subject: [AML] Influence of Mormon Literary Tradition (was: Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_) Date: 01 Feb 2001 09:44:32 -0800 (PST) --- Ivan Angus Wolfe wrote: > > Thom - I'm with you on that - I am the same way - > after having read teh best > (and worst) SF has to offer - Disoriented left me > angry and embittered. > This (and the post from Thom that Ivan is responding to as well as D. Michael's reminder in the Mormon Regionalism thread that Mormon SF authors didn't begin bringing explicit Mormon elements into their work until they were already established in the field) brings up an issue I've been thinking about lately. We have among us (and by us I suppose I mean 'educated' and/or 'well-read' Mormons) many who have read the best SF or literary fiction or romance has to offer. How does that translate into what gets written and published by Mormon authors? In other words, do we learn how to write from the masters of the idiom(s) and then graft something Mormon-like-in- substance onto it, or does our writing grow slowly out of our homegrown traditions? I'm sure the answer varies according to genre and author, but I'd like to hear what those of you who are firmly grounded in a particular genre or field have to say about this. I guess what I'm really asking is do we need to familiarize ourselves with both the Mormon literary tradition and the canonical tradition of the genre we're writing in? If I want to write Mormon spy thrillers do I need to read Orson Whitney and Eliza Snow and Maureen Whipple and Clinton Larsen? Or is it enough to read Le Carre and company? Do we only need to familiarize ourselves with the Mormon literary canon if we want to write 'literary' fiction? The reason I bring this up is that I'm of two minds on the issue right now. On the one hand my literary critic personae wants me to read from the Mormon canon so that I can react, dispute, steal from, consciously ignore my predecessors; on the other hand my wannabe maverick creative writer personae (the one that wrote plenty of bad song lyrics in high school) says chuck it all and just write. Just writing is appealing, but we all have our influences, can't help but have them, so there's no such thing as 'just writing.' I don't expect answers, but if anybody wanted to share how they approach the question of reading and influence on writing, I'm a willing, eager audience. ~~William Morris [MOD: My thanks, by the way, to William Morris, who has several times in the last few weeks--as he did this time--sent a post that raised such interesting questions that I felt compelled to start a new thread. Those of us who have been around a while on AML-List may recognize the importance of new voices on the List to ask new questions, or to ask old questions in new ways, and get the conversation going again.] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 02 Feb 2001 03:24:16 +0900 As body of LDS historical literature grows, Y professors issue caution By Kathryn Dougall kathryn@newsroom.byu.edu NewsNet Staff Writer In recent years, LDS literature has gained considerable popularity, especially in the historical fiction genre. Series' like Gerald Lund's "The Work and the Glory" have attracted LDS readers who want to learn and be entertained at the same time. "I think Mormons are such a practical people," said Dean Hughes, BYU professor of English and author. "If they can read something that's entertaining that also teaches history and at the same time is affirmative without being simple minded, that's what people seem to be looking for," he said. Hughes is the author of the popular LDS series "Children of the Promise," a series set during World War II. He said LDS literature has come a long way in recent years. Only 25 years ago almost no literature existed for the LDS audience, Hughes said. When literature did begin to develop it seemed to be "faith promoting" stories, he said. Historical fiction, however, seems to challenge readers more and help them learn about history, Hughes said. Although the reception of historical fiction has been overwhelming, there are also concerns associated with the genre. Hughes said that while historical fiction can be educational, it is not as important as sacrament meeting or scriptures. "People start placing novels on too high of a rung," he said. Historical fiction should not replace scripture study, said Camille Fronk, assistant professor of ancient scripture. "There is a great power in reflecting what is given to us in scripture or church history," she said. Although the impact of historical fiction has generally been good, authors must take care to make their works historically accurate, said Richard Holzapfel, associate professor of church history and doctrine. There can be problems in attempting to make Hollywood versions of history, Holzapfel said. Audiences often create images caused by our culture, he said. But they must filter through these images to understand what is historically accurate, he said. "We live in an age where pop culture must be taken seriously. We can't be academic snobs," he said. "We need to encourage authors to be historically accurate." Holzapfel posed questions to evaluate the impact of historical fiction. "Have authors been responsible? And have they generated interest in scriptures, doctrine and history?" he said. Holzapfel said the increase of historical fiction has seemed to perpetuate a greater interest in church history sites and other historical subjects. Fronk said great contributions have been made in LDS art, literature and poetry. They help show that individuals in church history were real people in a real world, she said. But LDS authors have a great responsibility, she said. "There is a tremendous responsibility to be true to the facts given us," she said. This story was posted on Tuesday, January 30, 2001 _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Jerry Johnston on Editing (Deseret News) Date: 02 Feb 2001 04:05:49 +0900 Trimming words of wisdom is tough By Jerry Johnston Deseret News staff writer At the last LDS general conference, Elder Neal A. Maxwell talked=20 about our "personalized prisons" and said, "Moments are the molecules that= =20 make up eternity." You didn't read those comments in the Deseret News, however. You didn't read them because we trimmed them out. We had to take a=20 2,000-word talk and boil it down to 200 words for our daily edition. I know. I was the guy who did the boiling. Afterward I told my wife, "It's like taking Thanksgiving dinner and=20 trying to turn it into a box lunch. It's frustrating." My wife, a teacher, seldom misses the chance to spot a lesson. "Well," she said after a moment, "now you know how Mormon must have=20 felt." She was right. My admiration for Mormon went up a notch. For the LDS faithful, Mormon, of course, was the man who "boiled down"= =20 a room full of scriptures into what we know as the Book of Mormon. It's his= =20 book not because he wrote the book, but because he edited it. And as with=20 all editing tasks, it must have been a thankless job. As my friend Kiplin=20 Griffin says, nobody holds up "Mormon the abridger" as their favorite Book= =20 of Mormon hero. Over in the Old World, Luke was doing much the same with the Book of= =20 Acts. He was picking and choosing details, selecting stories to include,=20 stories to leave out. It couldn't have been easy for him either. Just as we= =20 say a prayer before carving up a meal, I'm sure the editors of scripture=20 said a prayer before carving up holy writ. Deciding whose words to use must= =20 have felt like juggling lightning bolts. I'm also sure there were some self-important complainers =97 people= who=20 felt their words and deeds merited more. I can imagine some blowhard saying,= =20 "Peter and Paul, Paul and Peter. What about me? I was there." That, of course, is the reason I've never chosen to be an editor. I=20 refuse to deal with persnickety souls like me =97 writers who think their=20 stories form a sonata. I remember writing a column once and getting a note from my editor,=20 Carrie Moore. She liked the column, she said, but the last paragraph seemed= =20 to come out of nowhere and hang from the bottom of the piece. I remember scowling at her note and thinking, "She makes it sound like= =20 I'm playing pin-the-tail-on-the-donkey, like my summary paragraph dangles=20 from the piece like some kid's untied shoelace." The fact her observation was 100 percent dead-on-target really had=20 nothing to do with it. And so today, I offer a tip of the hat to editors ancient and modern.= =20 I haven't walked a mile in their shoes, but by abridging several conference= =20 talks I've taken enough steps in them to know how agonizing it must be to=20 edit scripture. Undoubtedly early editors had facts to double-check and=20 dates to verify. Undoubtedly some people quibbled with versions of events and=20 second-guessed the editor's "news judgment." And, undoubtedly, there were a few gems =97 phrases like "Moments are= =20 the molecules that make up eternity" =97 that ended up on the cutting room= =20 floor. Mormon said he was not able to include a "hundredth part" of the=20 things he was writing about. A "hundredth part" of Elder Maxwell's conference talk would be 20=20 words. As for editors today, let me offer thanks for any embarrassment=20 they've saved me =97 in this column and others. I understand that at times= =20 they've had to trim my column so it would fit on the page. Let me also say, if readers are ever curious to know what "golden=20 nuggets of thought" those editors trashed, they should feel free to call me= =20 and I'll read those immortal sentences to them over the phone. E-mail: jerjohn@desnews.com _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Handling Agents Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:20:33 -0700 Great idea! Thank you, Chris! Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 9:39 AM When I get a chance, I will type up and post a full list of all agents/editors I've come across who are showing openness to Mormon themes (21 so far). One of the reasons is to put them on Irreantum's mailing list--maybe some will get into the habit of scanning our magazine for interesting authors. I do hope my ms. catches on with someone, but if not I still consider this query experience to be helpful in breaking Mormon writing into the mainstream, as least for us to discuss some query strategies and start grooming more agents/editors to look at Mormon stuff. I hope anyone else working along similar lines will share your experiences with us, as well as names/addresses of anyone showing openness to mainstream Mormon writing. Chris Bigelow - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Higbeejm@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 14:14:58 EST >>>Could someone give me some information on Brady Udall's connection with Mormon literature?>>>>>> Have just received this biographical info from my sources (Brady's brother, via a mutual friend)... Brady Udall * Currently a Visiting Assistant Professor of English at Franklin and Marshall College, Lancaster, Pennsylvania * Recently completed his first novel. Will possibly be released around June. * Grew up in St. John's Arizona, son of an FBI agent and a high school English teacher. * Age: 32 * Married with 2 children. * Graduated from BYU about 1994. I believe with a BA in English. * Attended IOWA MFA creative writing program * Although he is LDS (served a mission in Brazil), he doesn't view himself as a "Mormon writer," but as a "writer who happens to be a Mormon, * Have been told by another native of St. John's that reading his short stories was like reading the biographies of people she grew up with. Janelle Higbee - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Dixon" Subject: Re: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 01 Feb 2001 14:18:52 -0500 Tony Markham wrote: >I saw a Tonight Show appearance by the young woman >(Erika Christensen) who plays Caroline Wakefield in >Traffic. She struck me as awfully Mormon. Anybody >know? She's not, according to this article: http://www.teenhollywood.com/d.asp?r=4753 [...] Christensen attributes this uncanny poise to her involvement in the Church of Scientology. "It has made me so confident. I just have a different point of view that I got from Scientology. I figure that whatever I don't know, I can learn. And I don't really care that my opinions on something might be wrong. Based on what I do know, I can make an opinion. Later, I can change. That gives me the stability to be who I am." "Also, this is completely personal and I can't speak for other Scientologists," she continues cautiously. "But I think the idea that you will be re-incarnated takes the pressure off. I believe that you can lead a worthwhile life and make a difference, but you will live again." [...] Eric D. Dixon "We get away with nothing. We cannot escape the repercussions of our actions, however subtle they may be. We cannot get away from ourselves. We cannot get away from the world we live in. Our decisions, our choices which underlie our actions & give rise to them, create the world we inhabit." -- Robert Fripp - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:39:09 -0700 Yes! Read Brady. He was one of the featured speakers at the Capitol Reef conference as summer, and I had the chance to get to know him. A very nice "Mormon kid." But like most REALLY successful Mormon writers, his writing is just a shade off of Mormon (as you can see if you read the book) and he doesn't really strike me as MORMON now. The closest story to MORMON was BEAUTIFUL PLACES about the boy in church who helped the two vagrants. Carol Houck Smith, my ideal editor from W. W. Norton (she also published Ron Carlson who was another of my "mentors") absolutely loves Brady. He has a touch of Indian blood, and even looks like a Cherokee. I like him a lot. In the same discussion, may I refer to Margaret's comment that if someone who really believes like a real Mormon ever gets the attention (in mainstream, not youth or children's literature) that Brady is getting (maybe it will be Chris Bigelow?) we should eat our hats with joy. It would be amazing. Here are the bio lines from the book: "Brady Udall, born and raised in the Indian country of northeastern Arizona, is a graduate of the Iowa Writers Workshop and a Jams Michener Fellow. He was the winner of the PLAYBOY fiction contest in 1994. His stories have been published in GQ, STORY, THE PARIS REVIEW and THE MIDWESTERNER, among other places. He now lives in Idaho with his wife, Kate, and young son, Finn. [Marilyn Brown] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:41:44 -0700 Congratulations for keeping your show in the public arena, Margaret! I'm so proud of you. It is such a superb show! We would certainly do it again at the villa! By the way, we are doing Eric Samuelson's THREE WOMEN soon. Keep an eye out for times, etc. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] First Attempts to Be a Writer Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:43:57 -0700 Interesting, Harlow. But a question for all. Is our LIST father Ben still on somewhere? He truly is a much appreciated SOURCE! Marilyn Brown [MOD: I believe he is still on the subscription list, but does not keep up with it much because he's trying to get his own writing done. He is also still AML-List owner and administrator--handling the technical details.] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Jerry Johnston on Editing (Deseret News) Date: 01 Feb 2001 13:37:54 -0700 And guess how translators feel when they get to do simultaneous translation of Elder Maxwell's talks? The two GA's with "difficult" reputations for translators are Elder Maxwell and the late LeGrande Richards--who simply spoke too fast to translate. I've tried translating Elder Maxwell for my Institute students, and often have to stop and explain the English meaning of a word so my students will get a glimpse of the metaphor he's using. [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jason Steed" Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:41:32 -0800 Brady's a pretty good friend of mine. He and his wife, Kate, own a parcel of land in northern Idaho, and I got to know him while I was doing my MFA at the U of Idaho a couple years ago. He is presently teaching at Franklin & Marshall in Pennsylvania. Last he told me, though, he was looking into jobs in the West--one at U of Oregon, I believe. His novel is supposed to be coming out soon. On the question of his "Mormonism," my estimation of him--if it is appropriate to discuss someone else's faith behind their back--is that he is active in the Church, though, like many of those on this list I suspect, he does have the occasional concern or complaint about things. I do know he was active in Idaho, at any rate. He and Kate have two sons--Finn and Hector--and Brady is a big fan of writers like Rick Bass and Lewis Nordan. I think his stories are great, and I'm looking forward to reading his novel, which should be out early this year, he said. In addition to his stories, he has also written the occasional nonfiction piece--including an article for Esquire which dealt with polygamy in Utah. Jason Steed _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 01 Feb 2001 13:44:35 -0700 Thanks for the congratulations, Marilyn, but I have little to do with keeping this show in the public arena. The cast members--who are so dedicated to telling this story--are the ones keeping it alive. It is a very personal mission for each of them. Nobody has ever gotten paid (and two of us have incurred some hefty debts to do the show), but pre-show prayers have always talked about the MISSION of the play. To take it a level deeper, one of the players sent a cast-wide e-mail which said, "This started out as Margaret's show. But it's not hers now. It belongs to all of us, and it's ours to tell." So I'm not even being unduly humble here. I primed the pump, but they're the ones working it now, and I am SO PROUD of them! I will be in the audience, not even onstage--and this will be my first time to actually see it! [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 12:29:14 -0700 > Here are the bio lines from the book: "Brady Udall, born and raised in the > Indian country of northeastern Arizona, is a graduate of the Iowa Writers > Workshop and a Jams Michener Fellow. He was the winner of the PLAYBOY > fiction contest in 1994. His stories have been published in GQ, STORY, THE > PARIS REVIEW and THE MIDWESTERNER, among other places. He now lives in Idaho > with his wife, Kate, and young son, Finn. For what it's worth, wife, Kate, is my cousin. I don't know much about Brady, but Kate is about as Mormon as you can get. Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: Re: [AML] Handling Agents Date: 01 Feb 2001 15:19:52 -0700 Margaret Young wrote: <<>> My stance as a writer and as a person is "I believe in Mormonism but don't = like it," which has all kinds of conflict both for my writing and my own = real life, and which is a stance that could bring in more national readers = than "I believe in Mormonism and you should too." I think Mormon writers = need to find a way to explore Mormon spirituality and belief in ways that = don't make people feel proselyted. It's possible to both throw bones to = those who want to continue disbelieving and provide insights and thought = triggers to those who aren't completely skeptical. I don't hold my = missionary memoir up as a great manuscript yet (it's reportage, not art, = hopefully with a unique enough marketing angle to get bought), but here's = an example of one way I approach belief: "Some people say things like = science fiction and psychedelic drugs are counterfeits for true religion, = but I think they helped me develop the otherworldly mindset I needed to = get interested in religion." Responding to that line, someone could say, = "Okay, Mormonism is just another mental crutch for trying to transcend = this planet's reality," but others might think, "Hmm, what an interesting = way to compare those things. I wonder if this guy finds more satisfaction = in the Mormonism than in the sci-fi and drugs, which I've tried too and = didn't find spiritually fulfulling." (A possible problem with that line is = that it was written by my 34-year-old self to crystalize what I now see = looking back at my 19-year-old self, but I probably wouldn't have able to = articulate it that way then, although the seeds of the concept are in my = REAL journals.) Frankly, I'm more worried about the manuscript's narrative = arc and structure, because it's in diary/letter format and may still = contain too much day-to-day material, plus I don't think the style is = anything magical, though hopefully a compelling picture of the Mormon = psyche emerges and the episodes and characters are interesting.=20 Chris Bigelow -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to = the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT = 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 01 Feb 2001 17:10:16 -0700 > As body of LDS historical literature grows, Y professors issue > caution > By Kathryn Dougall [snip] > Although the impact of historical fiction has generally been good, > authors must take care to make their works historically accurate, > said Richard Holzapfel, associate professor of church history and > doctrine. [snip] > Holzapfel posed questions to evaluate the impact of historical > fiction. > > "Have authors been responsible? And have they generated interest in > scriptures, doctrine and history?" he said. This is not what fiction is for. I've had this quote taped up in my office for awhile. It's from _Teachings of Spencer W. Kimball_. There is available a wide selection of books which will give development to the aesthetic and the cultural. Music, drama, poetry, fiction, and other cultural fields are available to everyone. The contributions come to us from great minds and great hearts and great sufferers and great thinkers. In addition to all the serious study there should be time for just plain reading for pleasure. Here one needs assistance to select that which is pleasurable in a worthwhile way. *There are countless works of fiction which help us to understand ourselves and others better,* and to get real pleasure in the learning. This is a perfect example of someone with a keen understanding of the difference between history and fiction. Let the historians get the facts straight and not depend on novelists or dramatists or poets to be a second witness for them. Historical literature is an attempt to understand the PEOPLE of history -- whether actual historical figures or archetypes of a specific era -- which does not require the artist (insert your definition here) to glue themselves to the facts. In order to try to understand ourselves and others better, the writer must use her imagination in creating characters and their inner lives. She may ask questions like: "Would someone in ancient Greece react to poverty the same way I would? If not, why so?" "How does a nineteenth century woman accommodate herself to a polygamous situation?" So the historians will say, "Then invent your own nineteenth century woman and leave the real people alone." My question then is, Why should I? If we have an actual representative from history with a few things we already know about her, the real learning comes with trying to invent a character within the known facts ... and then speculating. People just need to learn ... or be taught ... that fiction -- even historical fiction -- is an examination of people, not history. J. Scott Bronson--The Scotted Line "World peace begins in my home" "Anybody who sees live theatre should come out a little rearranged." Glenn Close - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: RE: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 01 Feb 2001 18:15:08 -0600 At 13:24 31-01-01 -0700, Scott Tarbert wrote: > > How about a novel that portrays Mormonism as spiritual survival > > of the fittest, which is what it is when you look past all the > > Christian paradoxes? > > > > Chris Bigelow > >We're graded on some sort of heavenly curve? Of course! BYU students are graded on a curve, and it's His University! (This thought is not original with me.) -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN Hallmark Adapts LDS Artist James Christensen's "Voyage of the Basset" for TV: Greenwich Workshop Art News Date: 01 Feb 2001 19:38:51 -0600 Basset" for TV: Greenwich Workshop Art News 29Jan01 A2 [From Mormon-News] Hallmark Adapting LDS Artist James Christensen's "Voyage of the Basset" for TV GREENWICH, CONNECTICUT -- LDS Artist James C. Christensen's "Voyage of the Basset" has been made into a TV movie by Hallmark Entertainment and will air on the Odyssey Channel in early March. The film adaptation, renamed "Voyage of the Unicorn," features actors Beau Bridges, Heather McEwen, Colin Heath, Kristian Ayre. Christensen also recently introduced a new painting, "All the World's a Stage" in commemoration of the 40th anniversary of the Utah Shakespearean Festival. Originally published in 1996, "Voyage of the Basset" was called a "magical journey proves that 'one's imagination is where science starts.'" The critically-praised book tells the story of professor Algernon Aisling and his daughters, who set out in search of mythical creatures aboard the H.M.S. Basset, pledging allegiance to the ship's motto, "By Believing, One Sees." The Hallmark Entertainment adaptation will air on the Odyssey Channel in two parts, on March 2nd at 9pm and March 3rd at 8pm. Most recently, Christensen produced a new piece of art for the Utah Shakespearean Festival, the third time he has produced artwork for the Festival. "All the World's a Stage" shows Shakespeare more than fifty characters from all 38 of his plays. Christensen even added a self-portrait in the piece, dressed in the guise of Julius Caesar. Christensen earlier produced "Shakespeare's Island' for the Festival's 25th anniversary in 1986, and "The Greenshow" for the following year. Both pieces appeared on the Festival's souvenir program cover, as will his new work. Sources: Video of James Christensen introducing "All the World's a Stage" Greenwich Workshop Art News 29Jan01 A2 http://www.greenwichworkshop.com/news/news_archive.asp James C. Christensen Artwork Celebrates 40th Anniversary of Utah Shakespearean Festival Utah Shakespearean Festival Press Release 22Dec00 A2 http://www.bard.org/SectionPress/pressChristensen.html >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 01 Feb 2001 19:19:17 -0700 This is a fabulous explanation of how to write a good ending! (And I'm making no excuses for that exclamation point.) I hope everyone on the list takes note. Thanks for this Laurel. Richard Hopkins PS. I'm looking forward to this approach for the ending of Lydie! Hee hee! ----- Original Message ----- > . What's wrong with everything turning > > >out okay, resolving all the consequences? Personally, I feel an author is > > >sloppy if he or she doesn't tie up the loose ends in a fictional story. > > I haven't read the book--but here's my take on this question, Richard: we > don't necessarily want everything to always turn out "okay." What we want is > for things to turn out better than okay--okay, but in a way we didn't > expect, in a way we didn't forsee, in a way that is completely natural and > honest, and was there all along but we didn't notice. [large snip] > > Laurel - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Re: Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 01 Feb 2001 21:24:13 -0700 Richard wrote: What's wrong with everything turning out okay, resolving all the consequences? Absolutely nothing, provided that those are the natural consequences of the plot lines. Not having read the book, I can't say for sure, I'd guess that some readers feel the neat and tidy ending here is forced, made that way by for the sake of a happy ending, not because it was the inevitable result of the character's actions and other elements. As a reader myself, such endings are not satisfying. I'd rather have a few loose ends or even an unhappy ending any day over one that rings false. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Darlene Young Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 01 Feb 2001 20:27:54 -0800 (PST) Thanks to everyone who provided information about Brady Udall. I haven't even finished the book yet but I definitely recommend the experience of reading his stories to anyone who hasn't done so. I see a little similarity to Levi Peterson's characters in his characters--kind of quirky and rural. ===== Darlene Young __________________________________________________ Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Subject: [AML] Off to Africa... Date: 01 Feb 2001 22:21:58 -0700 Hi Listers, I'm signing off the list for a month and will miss reading you all. I'm heading to Nairobi, Kenya for three weeks of volunteering with "Reach the Children," an organization begun by some LDS folks in Salem, UT, some years ago. They run three schools in the outskirts (read "slums") of Nairobi. I'll be helping develop a music curriculum and songs to go with their values-based education system. Also building an irrigation system for fruit trees on the grounds, and building a new boarding school in an outlying area.) I know in the past there has been discussion on a cultural level about whether some types of indigenous (sp?) music might eventually be incorporated into the services of a world-wide church. I'm excited to hear how the hymns sound in the branches there, but also curious, given the pictures accompanying the article on Kenya in the new February _Ensign_ magazine, about whether there IS any music in these services. Must be some--they're Mormons after all--but likely a capella at this stage? See you in print in March! Steve -- skperry@mac.com P. S. You can see a little about RTC at http://www.reachthechildren.org, or on my website, newly revamped: http://stevenkappperry.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 02 Feb 2001 00:30:51 -0700 > As body of LDS historical literature grows, Y professors issue caution > By Kathryn Dougall > Although the impact of historical fiction has generally been good, authors > must take care to make their works historically accurate, said Richard > Holzapfel, associate professor of church history and doctrine. > Audiences often create images caused by our culture, he said. But they must > filter through these images to understand what is historically accurate, he > said. > > "We live in an age where pop culture must be taken seriously. We can't be > academic snobs," he said. "We need to encourage authors to be historically > accurate." Isn't this the wrong approach, telling authors what they have to write? Wouldn't it be better to educate the audience that fiction, after all, is fiction, and they shouldn't be getting their history lessons from fiction? > Holzapfel posed questions to evaluate the impact of historical fiction. > > "Have authors been responsible? And have they generated interest in > scriptures, doctrine and history?" he said. This to me is the positive result of historical fiction for educational purposes. Not that they present all the facts to the audience, but that they generate an interest so members of the audience go learn the facts for themselves. I think half the fun of historical fiction is to go find out what "really" happened. Find out where the author was accurate, and where he used some literary license. I did it with Shogun, with Jesus Christ Superstar. Our family did it together after seeing Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat. Someday I'll get around to doing it with Braveheart. I don't need to do it with Oliver Stone movies, though. Except for the character and place names, those are totally fiction. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Influence of Mormon Literary Tradition Date: 02 Feb 2001 00:31:09 -0700 William Morris wrote: > In other words, do > we learn how to write from the masters of the idiom(s) > and then graft something Mormon-like-in- substance > onto it, or does our writing grow slowly out of our > homegrown traditions? I don't try to do anything. I as a Mormon and as a science fiction reader write what I want to write. If it comes out mainstream, then it's a mainstream book. If it comes out uniquely Mormon, then it's a LDS book. If I'm lucky, it may come out both, and become a mainstream book about the Mormon culture. That's when I'll ask Chris Bigelow for his list of agents. But I wouldn't try to write a mainstream book that grafts Mormon stuff into it. Sounds like a disaster to me. > I guess what I'm really asking is do we need to > familiarize ourselves with both the Mormon literary > tradition and the canonical tradition of the genre > we're writing in? If I want to write Mormon spy > thrillers do I need to read Orson Whitney and Eliza > Snow and Maureen Whipple and Clinton Larsen? Or is it > enough to read Le Carre and company? Do we only need > to familiarize ourselves with the Mormon literary > canon if we want to write 'literary' fiction? It depends on how good you want to write. A writer can't read too much. The more he reads, the more he has to draw from in crafting his own writings. If you want to write something that people will say, "It's like that Heimerdinger stuff," then I guess all you'd need to read is Chris Heimerdinger. If you want people to start recommending other stuff because it's like the things you write--in other words, they think of you as the standard model for a type of writing--you'll probably have to broaden your reading experiences so you have the depth to write original things. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: RE: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 02 Feb 2001 10:15:48 -0700 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aml-list@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-aml-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of D. Michael > Martindale > Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 12:31 AM > To: aml-list@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) > > > > As body of LDS historical literature grows, Y professors > issue caution > > By Kathryn Dougall > > > Although the impact of historical fiction has generally > been good, authors > > must take care to make their works historically accurate, > said Richard > > Holzapfel, associate professor of church history and doctrine. > >... > > "We live in an age where pop culture must be taken > seriously. We can't be > > academic snobs," he said. "We need to encourage authors to > be historically > > accurate." > > Isn't this the wrong approach, telling authors what they have > to write? Yes, especially since he is an historian. The rules of historian and fiction writer are entirely different. > This to me is the positive result of historical fiction for > educational > purposes. Not that they present all the facts to the > audience, but that > they generate an interest so members of the audience go learn > the facts > for themselves. I think half the fun of historical fiction is > to go find > out what "really" happened. Find out where the author was > accurate, and > where he used some literary license. I did it with Shogun, with Jesus > Christ Superstar. Our family did it together after seeing > Joseph and the > Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat. Someday I'll get around to > doing it with > Braveheart. I don't need to do it with Oliver Stone movies, though. > Except for the character and place names, those are totally fiction. Stone treats historyt exactly the same way that Shakespeare did. As a means to an aratistic end that may have nothing to do with really "happened." Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Valerie Holladay Subject: RE: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 02 Feb 2001 09:30:21 -0800 (PST) In response to the warning about LDS historical literature" "D. Michael Martindale" wrote: > Isn't this the wrong approach, telling authors what > they have to write? > Wouldn't it be better to educate the audience that > fiction, after all, > is fiction, and they shouldn't be getting their > history lessons from fiction? I remember a panel of editors at an AML conference a few years ago (I should, I put it together and then tried to tape it so we could include it in the proceedings, but the tape was absolutely indecipherable and the wonderful comments were never included in the proceedings - but it was my fault, not that of the participants, although a comment in the proceedings seemed to indicate that the panelists "couldn't be bothered." I never asked them to write up their comments. It wasn't part of the deal when they agreed to come and speak.) Anyway . . . A member of the audience asked why no one published poetry and why publishers didn't educate their audiences to like it more. I think it's easier to educate one author about audience and the ramifications of trying to publish a book about poetry, than to educate thousands of readers, and nonreaders, about the importance of poetry. Likewise, in my mind, the thought of "educating the market" what they should read and think when they read it has some similarities to teaching junior high school. Your audience isn't exactly willing, they have other things to do, and for some, their level of understanding just isn't there. It's a lot easier to educate the writer, who has a greater personal interest in learning what's real and a recognition of the need to know why it matters, as well as a desire to learn how it can be done well. Some people, unfortunately, but understandably, have other things on their mind. Valerie Holladay - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Valerie Holladay Subject: Re: [AML] Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_ (Review) Date: 02 Feb 2001 09:35:27 -0800 (PST) In response to Richard, who wrote: > What's wrong with everything turning out okay, > resolving all the consequences? Annette Lyon wrote: > Absolutely nothing, provided that those are the > natural consequences of the plot lines... > I'd rather have a few loose ends or even an unhappy > ending any day over one that rings false. Sure, and this is a problem we all see in popular LDS fiction. At the same time, referring back to our discussions on *God's Army*, it was interesting to see everyone's reactions to the ending. It worked fine for me and others, and others found it "contrived." Same with the blessings given in the movie and other examples. They worked for some and not for others. I'd have to conclude that those particular issues didn't both the majority of the viewers, given the the success of the movie and now the sales of the video. Valerie Holladay - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Valerie Holladay Subject: Re: [AML] Duplicate Book Title Names Date: 02 Feb 2001 09:54:39 -0800 (PST) Darvell at DHunt@cornerpub.com wrote that the title of his (current?) novel is *The Fingerprints of God,* a title also used for a new book from Horizon. > > Changing the title of my novel is just not an > > option. The story is based on the title, which is > > patterned after a poem of the same name that I > > wrote back in college in 1987. I could never > > convince myself to change the title. Anyone who has published a book, unless it's self-published, or subsidized in some way from the author, will tell you that the title - like the cover art, illustrations, and jacket or back cover copy - are all crucial marketing tools, and these in large part are decided upon by the marketing team. In a good publishing house, these people really know what they're doing, and they based their decisions on their experience with the market, not on what the author wants. If you feel that strongly about your title, either plan on self-publishing or wait until the contract is offered and issued before mentioning it, then ask them to put it in the contract. Just be aware that it may make all the difference in whether the book is published. Valerie Holladay __________________________________________________ Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rose Green" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 02 Feb 2001 13:04:52 -0600 I think we have to be careful about falling off the end of the spectrum in either direction. > > Although the impact of historical fiction has generally been good, > > authors must take care to make their works historically accurate, > > said Richard Holzapfel, associate professor of church history and > > doctrine. >Let the historians get the facts >straight and not depend on novelists or dramatists or poets to be a >second witness for them. Historical literature is an attempt to >understand the PEOPLE of history -- whether actual historical figures or >archetypes of a specific era -- which does not require the artist (insert >your definition here) to glue themselves to the facts. Depends on what the facts are that you are changing. A little fiddling here and there may make a better story, but I just don't think there's any excuse for shoddy research. I recently read a few books by a "Christian" author about WWII that were entertaining until I came upon some major errors (characters attempting to fly from Berlin to Prague over the Alps, repeated errors in German language, other geographical mistakes that could have been remedied by studying a map). It was very distracting and made me doubt the believability and premise of a lot of other things the author was writing about. >In order to try >to understand ourselves and others better, the writer must use her >imagination in creating characters and their inner lives... >If we have an actual representative from history with a few things we >already know about her, the real learning comes with trying to invent a >character within the known facts ... and then speculating. Which I think IS the point of writing historical fiction versus nonfiction. I can think of another historical series (this time LDS) that sticks so close to the "facts" as recorded in "history" (whatever that means) that it's boring. (To me, anyway. I can think of scores of people who would violently disagree.) If I want to read a fictionalized account of Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and the early pioneers, I want to get a better idea of their character. I want some life, some imagination, breathed into what they MIGHT have been like. (Like in Card's Stone Tables, or Sarah, both of which I think did a nice job with that.) If, on the other hand, the book saves all the creativity for the imaginary characters and is totally dry and lifeless on the historical ones (or situations), then I'd just as soon read accounts of my own pioneer ancestors, who were just as interesting and also real. So, I agree...on one end, anyway. Rose Green _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Correction) Date: 02 Feb 2001 15:04:38 -0700 OOPS. I got bad information on the ticket prices for _I Am Jane_. Correction: Tickets are $3.00 with BYU student I.D., $4.00 for members of the outside community, and $12.00 for a family of up to six people. Dates are as listed :Feb. 9 and 10 at 7:00 p.m. in 3220 ELWC. [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Alan Mitchell" Subject: Re: [AML] Handling Agents Date: 02 Feb 2001 20:57:16 -0700 >Margaret Young wrote: <<difficult for an agent to SELL a Mormon book wherein the author actually >seems to believe in Mormonism. It happens, but it's rare.>>> Chris Bigalow wrote: >My stance as a writer and as a person is "I believe in Mormonism but don't like it," which has all kinds of conflict both for my writing and my own real life, and which is a stance that could bring in more national readers than "I believe in Mormonism and you should too." I think Mormon writers need to find a way to explore Mormon spirituality and belief in ways that don't make people feel proselyted. I don't know if why we can't do that and write about Mormons. I've had several non-Mormons read Angel of the Danube and none felt proselyted (although Ruth Starkman didn't like the talk perceived by her to be conforming to the Mormon Church at the end--believe me, if I had realized it might be read this way I would have avoided it.) Hey, just have fun with the conflict. I think Chris left out an option, "Mormons aren't cool but they can be very real if they could quit being self righteous." Personally, I would have a hard time if it were my lot to live with the attitude of believing but not liking Mormonism. Maybe I'm just not smart enough to be dissatisfied. Jan Shipps seems to have done well with the inverse-Bigalow attitude, "I like Mormonism, but don't believe it." However, a conflicted character is a good one to write about. A clash of cultures. But does it have to be so much drugery? So much Kafka? Like Kafka, we feel like cultural bugs in a world of flyswatters. Like Kafka's Trial, we may all be arrested and charged with no crime, but let's get a little Peter and Paul going and rejoice in it. This Mormon thing is bigger than all of us. Anyway, that's my take. Alan Mitchell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Little Change Among Mormon Titles on Bestseller Lists: Kent Larsen 1Feb01 A4 Date: 02 Feb 2001 18:58:41 -0600 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ----__JNP_000_0c80.7631.5699 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Larsen 1Feb01 A4 [From Mormon-News] Little Change Among Mormon Titles on Bestseller Lists NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- There was little change among the Mormon titles on US best seller lists this past week. In all, six titles are on the lists, with Anne Perry's Whitechapel Conspiracy dropping back off the lists, probably temporarily, replaced by Card's Ender's Game, which rejoined the list, also probably temporarily. The little change marks the slow nature of book sales this time of year. As noted in prior weeks, Steven Covey's Seven Habits has risen, while newer titles have dropped, as steady sales of a well-known title outshine more sensitive sales of newer titles. The current titles on bestseller lists are: Nothing Like it in the World, by Stephen Ambrose A history of the building of the transcontinental railroad in the US. Ambrose, a highly regarded historian, details the involvement of Mormons in building crucial portions of the road, including the driving of the "golden spike" in the heart of Mormon territory. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 26 24 Barnes & Noble (Jan 31) Top 100 13 13 BooksAMillion (Feb 1) Non-Fiction Hardcover 8 6 Booksense (Jan 29) Non-Fiction Hardcover 8 8 New York Times (Feb 4) Non-Fiction Hardcover [Independents - 7; Chains - 8] - 15 Publishers Weekly (Jan 29) Non-Fiction Hardcover 135 120 USA Today (Jan 31) 14 14 Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Non-Fiction Hardcover 10 - Wordsworth Books (Jan 30) Non-Fiction Hardcover The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, by Stephen R. Covey This ten-year-old personal management classic is still selling strongly. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 19 16 Amazon.com (Jan 31) Non-Fiction Paperback 70 58 Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100 64 63 Barnes & Noble Top (Jan 31) Top 100 76 84 USA Today (Jan 31) 5 6 Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Business Ender's Shadow, by Orson Scott Card A "parallel" novel to Card's Hugo and Nebula award-winning Ender's Game. Told from the point of view of the 'also ran' to Ender, Bean. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 17 14 Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Paperback 108 87 USA Today (Jan 31) Shadow of the Hegemon, by Orson Scott Card The second novel in Card's new series about Bean, Ender's shadow. In this novel, Bean is the tactical genius who wins the Earth for Ender's brother, Peter, the Hegemon. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 3 4 Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Hardcover 85 24 Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100 10 10 BooksAMillion (Feb 1) Non-Fiction Hardcover 8 10 Booksense (Jan 29) Fiction Hardcover 11 9 New York Times (Feb 4) Fiction Hardcover [Independents - 12; Chains - 10] - 10 Publishers Weekly (Jan 29) Fiction Hardcover 84 63 USA Today (Jan 31) 9 11 Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Fiction Hardcover Ender's Game, by Orson Scott Card The original Hugo and Nebula award-winning novel. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 23 - Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Paperback Half Moon Street, by Anne Perry Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 20th novel about the detective. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 129 98 USA Today (Jan 31) The Whitechapel Conspiracy, by Anne Perry Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 20th novel about the detective. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List - 36 Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest ----__JNP_000_0c80.7631.5699 Content-Type: text/html 
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Little Change Among Mormon Titles on Bestseller Lists

NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- There was little change among the Mormon titles 
on US best seller lists this past week. In all, six titles are on the 
lists, with Anne Perry's Whitechapel Conspiracy dropping back off the 
lists, probably temporarily, replaced by Card's Ender's Game, which 
rejoined the list, also probably temporarily.

The little change marks the slow nature of book sales this time of 
year. As noted in prior weeks, Steven Covey's Seven Habits has risen, 
while newer titles have dropped, as steady sales of a well-known 
title outshine more sensitive sales of newer titles.



The current titles on bestseller lists are:


Nothing Like it in the World, by Stephen Ambrose

A history of the building of the transcontinental railroad in the US. 
Ambrose, a highly regarded historian, details the involvement of 
Mormons in building crucial portions of the road, including the 
driving of the "golden spike" in the heart of Mormon territory.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
 26    24   Barnes & Noble (Jan 31) Top 100
 13    13   BooksAMillion (Feb 1) Non-Fiction Hardcover
  8     6   Booksense  (Jan 29) Non-Fiction Hardcover
  8     8   New York Times (Feb 4) Non-Fiction Hardcover
              [Independents - 7; Chains - 8]
 -     15   Publishers Weekly (Jan 29) Non-Fiction Hardcover
135   120   USA Today (Jan 31)
 14    14   Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Non-Fiction Hardcover
 10    -    Wordsworth Books (Jan 30) Non-Fiction Hardcover

See:


Nothing Like It In The World

 More about Stephen E. Ambrose's "Nothing Like It in the World: The Men Who Built the Transcontinental Railroad" at Amazon.com



The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, by Stephen R. Covey

This ten-year-old personal management classic is still selling strongly.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
 19    16   Amazon.com (Jan 31) Non-Fiction Paperback
 70    58   Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100
 64    63   Barnes & Noble Top (Jan 31) Top 100
 76    84   USA Today (Jan 31)
  5     6   Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Business

See:


Seven Habits of Highly Effective People

More about Stephen R. Covey's "Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" at Amazon.com



Ender's Shadow, by Orson Scott Card

A "parallel" novel to Card's Hugo and Nebula award-winning Ender's 
Game. Told from the point of view of the 'also ran' to Ender, Bean.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
 17   14    Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Paperback
108   87    USA Today (Jan 31)

See:


Ender's Shadow

More about Orson Scott Card's "Ender's Shadow" at Amazon.com



Shadow of the Hegemon, by Orson Scott Card

The second novel in Card's new series about Bean, Ender's shadow. In 
this novel, Bean is the tactical genius who wins the Earth for 
Ender's brother, Peter, the Hegemon.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
  3     4   Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Hardcover
 85    24   Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100
 10    10   BooksAMillion (Feb 1) Non-Fiction Hardcover
  8    10   Booksense  (Jan 29) Fiction Hardcover
 11     9   New York Times (Feb 4) Fiction Hardcover
              [Independents - 12; Chains - 10]
 -     10   Publishers Weekly (Jan 29) Fiction Hardcover
 84    63   USA Today (Jan 31)
  9    11   Wall Street Journal (Jan 26) Fiction Hardcover

See:


Shadow of the Hegemon

More about Orson Scott Card's "Shadow of the Hegemon" at Amazon.com



Ender's Game, by Orson Scott Card

The original Hugo and Nebula award-winning novel.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
 23     -   Amazon.com (Jan 31) Fiction Paperback

See:


Ender's Game

More about Orson Scott Card's "Ender's Game" at Amazon.com



Half Moon Street, by Anne Perry

Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 
20th novel about the detective.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
129    98   USA Today (Jan 31)

See:


Half Moon Street

More about Anne Perry's "Half Moon Street" at Amazon.com



The Whitechapel Conspiracy, by Anne Perry

Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 
20th novel about the detective.

Currently on the following bestseller lists:
This  Last  List
 -     36   Amazon.com (Feb 1) Top 100

See:


The Whitechapel Conspiracy

More about Anne Perry's "The Whitechapel Conspiracy" at Amazon.com






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----__JNP_000_0c80.7631.5699-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 03 Feb 2001 08:26:33 -0600 Editors have no muse. Instead, our mythological prototype could be considered to be Atropos--the one of the three Fates whose job (if I recall correctly) was to cut the threads, ending life. (And if I were editing this post, it would be my job to check and make sure that it's really Atropos I'm talking about here...) With which cheery thought I shall proceed to record some more thoughts about editing and the writer-editor relationship. As always, feel free to tune out as desired. As a writer, I've never learned to enjoy being edited. To be perfectly honest, I really keep wishing for my manuscripts to come back with words like "perfect," "stunning," "excellent," "insightful"--but without any red marks whatsoever. (Actually, I prefer to use a black pencil for editing rather than a red one--it stands out more clearly for me, since I'm colorblind, and I like having the option of erasing.) I still remember how frustrated I felt (though I did my best not to show it--I don't know how successful I was) when a member of my thesis committee at BYU--a personal friend and mentor--asked for changes at my thesis defense. So I went ahead and made them. And as I made them, I discovered that the weak spots he had pointed out really did exist--and that his comments had given me the chance to strengthen those areas by adding needed connective tissue. I liked the results. But I didn't like the process. And I particularly didn't like having to go back over something I thought I was already done with. Perhaps there are some authors so mature (or perhaps the word is "masochistic") that they genuinely enjoy receiving back a hacked, slashed-up manuscript from an editor. I'm not sure I've ever encountered any such authors--and I'm positive I've never been one. The only people I've encountered who seem able to take editing comments with perfect equanamity are those who have no personal investment in seeing themselves as authors: stand-up trainers, for instance, or content experts who have to dash off a rough draft of what they know or do, and then are delighted if you can turn it into something comprehensible--but that's a rare characteristic, even among those who don't call themselves writers. The best that the rest of us can generally manage is to pretend that we're all professional, objective, smilingly willing to accept cuts and revisions even though we actually want to RIP THEIR ARMS OFF FOR DARING TO MESS WITH WHAT WE'VE WRITTEN. But we do our best to keep up the pretense, because we've learned by experience that editing often makes our own work better. And even when it doesn't, they're the ones who have to be satisfied in order for us to be published and/or paid. I think that a graceful willingness to work with editing and revisions is one of the true distinguishing marks of a professional attitude in a writer. (Not, mind you, that this is something even all the professionals have.) I think many writers, beginners especially, aren't entirely clear on what it is that's working in their writing. They're nervous about going in and changing things, because they're afraid they might "break it." Or they buy into the notion of the inspired author (inspired either by the artistic muse or by the Spirit) and are afraid they'll mar the inspiration by smoothing the edges. I can't be entirely critical of this attitude, because I've seen stories made worse by too much revision and polishing--but that's usually because the author himself or herself can't be persuaded to leave the work alone, not because of editorial interference. Or (going back to reasons why authors may be reluctant to revise), watching the story come alive under their hands, as stories will when they really take off, they feel that to change it is to mar a living thing, like amputating a limb off a child. It's true that editing and revision demands a different set of talents than the initial writing. One of these is the ability to see and evaluate alternatives--which may mean taking something that has set itself as stone in your mind, and then reliquifying it, so to speak. Not an easy thing for many people to do. But I think this ability is critical to becoming a really *good* writer, or even a competent writer. A good editor can assist in developing and exercising this ability. It's different if you encounter an editor who blindly butchers your work. I can't deny that they're out there--and, as I tried to point out in my previous post, it may be that such an editor is a bad editor for you in particular, and not necessarily for others. This is one reason why it's so important, as Christine Atkinson said, to develop a relationship of trust with your editor. You have to be sure he/she knows what you're trying to do and sympathizes with it before you can have much trust in what he/she is trying to get you to do to your manuscript. It's also important not to simply accept what an editor says uncritically, but to analyze it. Often, as an editor, I will suggest changes that, as it turns out, don't work very well. The author has to learn to become a partner in the process of revision, neither discounting the editor's comments nor simply adopting them without thinking about whether they actually work. There are, I think, two absolutes in the editing process. The author as creator of the work has authority to say whether a given change achieves what he or she wanted to achieve. And the editor, as a reader, has authority to say whether the work as written works for him or her. The entire process works better if both the author and the editor respect each other in those roles, and then work together in the large middle ground of trying to get the piece to work for the audience in a way that will make everyone happy--author and audience both. Both as an editor and as an author, I try to choose which battles I'm willing to fight--and with whom. If I have a writer whose overall command of English is pretty savvy, I'm much more likely to defer to that author in a matter of stylistic judgment than if I'm working with an author whose writing has many obvious problems. Similarly, as a writer, I try to accept any changes that I don't feel too strongly about--unless the editor suggests so many bad changes that he or she loses my trust, in which case I may get mulish about everything. (Not that I necessarily should, but being human...) I'd also like to offer a general observation about something I'll call style/usage sense. As I mentioned in my previous post, once one is out of the realm of house style and the simpler grammar/usage questions, editing isn't a matter of rules so much as sensibilities--which vary, of course, from person to person. A sense for style and what is known as "correct" grammar or usage is not something I think is learned so much as cultivated. As an editor, I see these types of problems and fix them, without thinking too much about defining precisely what the problem is--unless I need to in order to communicate with someone about them (for example, the author). I wonder to what degree that type of usage sense is innate, developed perhaps by extensive reading but building on a certain type of visual/auditory memory. There's a good deal of evidence to suggest that good spellers, for example, are born not made, with a certain type of visual memory that "sees" words and can tell if they're right or wrong--while others who may read just as widely as the good speller don't have that automatic spelling sense. (This sense can be blunted, by the way, by seeing too much poor spelling--I've noted deterioration in my own spelling of particular words after grading too many freshman papers.) I wonder if the same isn't true of much of what I'm calling style/usage sense. In any event, I'm quite sure it's not a matter of mastering a list of "rules of good writing." This is one reason why I have absolutely no faith in electronic grammar/style editors: they attempt to reduce to rules something that's essentially a matter of appropriateness and context. Well, I've maundered on again, as I warned you I would. I have to close, though, by saying that I really like writing and editing both. Writing brings a number of joys, but editing does too--the joy of helping something come out fresh, clean, lovely, with a potential that perhaps only an editor could have perceived in its original form revealed and displayed for everyone to see. I've never been a midwife, but I can't help but feel that it's a little bit like that. Not the parent, but one who plays a key role in assisting something to be born. That's what it's like at its best. And though there may be some swearing at each other along the way, in the tension and pain of the moment, still I think the best writing-editing partnerships end with an acknowledgment that the final product is a much better and healthier thing than either could have produced alone. May you have the joy of working with those types of editors, and those types of authors. Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Handling Agents Date: 03 Feb 2001 00:28:30 -0700 Christopher Bigelow wrote: > My stance as a writer and as a person is "I believe in Mormonism but don't like it," which has all kinds of conflict both for my writing and my own real life, and which is a stance that could bring in more national readers than "I believe in Mormonism and you should too." I think Mormon writers need to find a way to explore Mormon spirituality and belief in ways that don't make people feel proselyted. It's possible to both throw bones to those who want to continue disbelieving and provide insights and thought triggers to those who aren't completely skeptical. Instead of having to take some level of negativity toward the church, whether it includes dibelief or not, how about if we don't proselyte simply by--not proselyting. Another way of describing that is: be honest. No matter how much you believe in and love Mormonism, you have to be dishonest to claim it and everyone in it is perfect. Just be honest. Just tell your Mormon story. You don't have to throw bones at disbelievers. Just tell it like it is, the positive with the negative, and ignore the possible reaction of Sister Grundy down the block who thinks scriptures and church publications are the only proper things to read. If you're honest, only those with their own bone to pick will complain. And since they already have a bone, you don't have to throw them one. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: plus two Subject: Re: [AML] Influence of Mormon Literary Tradition Date: 02 Feb 2001 22:27:24 -0800 (PST) Our moderator wrote: Those of > us who have been around a while on AML-List may > recognize the importance of > new voices on the List to ask new questions, or to > ask old questions in new > ways, and get the conversation going again. Thanks. I've been lurking for almost four years now, so I figure it's my time to contribute. And now I have the time----a 2 1/2 hour commute on public transportation [that's total not one way. I'm not that crazy.] that gives me time on my feet to stand and think. It's hard to read when your packed into a BART train. I just hope what I bring up does seem new in some way because I know that there can be a certain fatigue that comes with some of the issues surrounding Mormon literature, especially on the part of those list members who may have been participating for a while. So I don't mind if people don't want to or don't have the time to discuss what I bring up. Now to give an example of the grafting/own tradition thing that I've been thinking about: I thought that I would grow out of Kafka, but I haven't. I no longer listen to gothic/industrial music that often or write angst-ridden poems, but Kafka continues to haunt. Especially the aphorisms, the parables and paradoxes. I have been of the opinion for awhile that the Mormon tradition could be a fertile one to mine for inspiration in writing this type of literature. [That's why I was delighted to find in the Irreantum fiction guidelines a specific solicitation for parables.] The question is what am I accountable for when it comes to my knowledge of literary history and Mormon tradition? Yes, I know that at some level you have to 'just write' and that inspiration plays a large role in the creative act, but the wellspring of that act is reading. Now, of course, when it comes to parables, you start with the four gospels. But here's the thing---I don't think its possible to directly imitate the parables that Christ relates in the gospels. The reason that they work is not just that he uses the materials of everyday life to illustrate gospel principles, it's also that the gospel principles he relates come from him; they're prophetic; they have a profundity behind them that comes from the mind of the master. Any attempts I've encountered that seek to imitate his type of parable always fail (aren't there some in Esp. for Mormons?). And I think that the reason they fail is that the elements of the analogy are too didactically thought out; they point too directly to the point being made. Kafka almost errs in the other direction. His parabolic language demands interpretation; it pushes the analogy, the imagery to the point that no interpretation can be claimed definitive. [Although in my opinion the 'indeterminacy' of Kafka's work is somewhat exaggerated by some critics.] But while you can't quite get what he's getting at, the very act of thinking about it is (at least for me) rewarding---it leads to thinking about how truth and knowledge and wisdom and ritual works. An example from _The Great Wall of China: Stories and Reflections_: "No. 17 Leopards break into the temple and drink the sacrificial chalices dry; this occurs repearedly, again and again: finally it can be reckoned beforehand and becomes a part of the ceremony." So if Kafka is one extreme (albeit a productive one) and the 'obvious' parable is another one, where does it leave the Mormon parable writer? I don't know for sure. But I do know that a lot of the wilder imagery of the Doctrine and Covenants starts me thinking in some of the same ways that Kafka's aphorisms do. I also think, and now I'm getting back to the Mormon literary tradition, Orson F. Whitney's pronouncement in his epic poem _Love and the Light: An Idyl of the Westland_ is instructive, if at the same time somewhat overwrought: "Were the poet unprophetic,/Or the prophet unpoetic,/Each were wanting in equipment/For the mission laid upon him." In my words, there's something about the interplay between the ideas, the doctrines of the gospel and the poetic image that can push our understanding forward. This is all somewhat premature since I haven't actually made any serious stabs at this mode of writing. But it's what's been percolating in my mind. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Jerry Johnston on Editing (Deseret News) Date: 03 Feb 2001 10:28:12 -0700 This is SUCH a good essay! It is part and parcel of the literary process! Boiling things down into the syrup that gives pleasure! Oh, how often could I take the loose novels that come into our bins at Cedar Fort and boil them down into something worthy! Selecting, boiling and shaping are the keys! I am particularly conscious of exactly what Jerry talks about because it is the activity of my address for AML which just may be laughed off the fact of the Westminster cafeteria. It is the BOILING. It is the SELECTION (of scenes, of bits of dialogue--asking ourselves, what is important) and it is the SHAPING(which item comes first, etc.) that profoundly effects the quality of what we are writing! (And then of course we have to write an adequate sentence.) I am glad you wrote this, Jerry. And that Andrew Hall was wise enough to give it to those of us who don't take the Deseret News. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 03 Feb 2001 10:23:43 -0700 On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 13:04:52 -0600 "Rose Green" writes: > So, I agree...on one end, anyway. Actually, we agree on both ends. You said: > Depends on what the facts are that you are changing. A little > fiddling here and there may make a better story, but I just > don't think there's any excuse for shoddy research. Exactly. Same thing goes for science fiction. Generally, the reader of SF expects that there will be things about the science of the story that will be "wrong." In other words, speculative, or undoable at-this-time, or even completely impossible though reasonable within this particular milieu. The same should be expected in historical FICTION. When a writer isn't getting it "right," he better know that he's getting it "wrong" and have a darn good reason for it too. I don't expect to get a history lesson from historical novels any more than I expect to get a science lesson from SF novels. At the same time, however, if the history or science of a novel intrigues me enough, I just may go out and find out what really is true and what ain't. Vallerie Holladay said: > It's a lot easier to educate the writer, who has a > greater personal interest in learning what's real > and a recognition of the need to know why it > matters, as well as a desire to learn how it can > be done well. Some people, unfortunately, but > understandably, have other things on their mind. And so we run into the question of who you WANT your audience to be. I believe if you write to the folks who have other things on their minds and "can't be bothered" then you wind up with pedestrian prose that is flat and has a serious lack of intellectual or emotional or spiritual variety and is unbelievable to those who -- while they have other things to think about with their minds -- also think about the novel they're reading when they're reading it. And I must confess that one of my goals as a writer is to give my audience something to think about even when they're NOT reading my book. I want my audience to be infected with thoughts about my play/poem/song/story/painting/dance/etc. when they are trying to have other things on their mind. Yes, I want to be a virus. J. Scott Bronson--The Scotted Line "World peace begins in my home" "Anybody who sees live theatre should come out a little rearranged." Glenn Close > > Rose Green > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 03 Feb 2001 10:34:56 -0700 Sharlee wrote the Kate Udall is about as Mormon as you can get! Hooray! I'm glad to hear it! And she's your cousin! How great! Brady is a wonderful fellow. Clean cut and very much a gentleman. All I know is that Brady's writing isn't really what I would call "MORMON" and good for him, I guess, because if it was "MORMON" it wouldn't have attracted Carol Houck Smith in a thousand years. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Handling Agents Date: 03 Feb 2001 10:40:20 -0700 I love the way James Allen and Davis Bitton introduce one of their books on Mormonism, frankly admitting that they are believing Mormons and that their work will be coming through that filter. Nonetheless, they are very bold in discussing controversy and even revealing skeletons in closets. On the other hand, Stegner opens his book with an admission that he does NOT believe Mormonism, but finds it fascinating and the pioneers remarkable. He also maintains objectivity and presents a compelling picture of the Mormon migration--personality flaws in various leaders freely mentioned, but not filtered through an anti-Mormon agenda. [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "mcnandon" Subject: [AML] Alan MITCHELL, _Angel of the Danube_ Date: 03 Jan 2001 06:18:09 -0700 My husband and I just finished reading Angel of the Danube_ and found it a delightful read. We visited Austria just two years ago and enjoyed the incorporation of the Austrian folklore. I must be honest, however and admit that I didn't like the ending. I felt that the folklore analogy seemed contrived and a bit of an encumbrance at that point. It also seemed unrealistic to have her step off the plane wearing a traditional Himmelsruhe Dirndle and a colored apron. Am I off on this, or have you had other such comments? Nan McCulloch - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Tarbet" Subject: RE: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _What Really Happened_ (Performance) Date: 04 Feb 2001 14:30:05 -0700 I commented to another list member at the performance I attended that I'd really like to read it. It's very richly layered. -- Scott Tarbet > Linda asked: > > >Can I read it? > > I'd be happy to make this available on the List, if no one > objects. Or I could just email it to Linda, if you don't mind a > hundred page file showing up. What do y'all think? > > Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 04 Feb 2001 17:40:16 -0700 D. Michael wrote: Wouldn't it be better to educate the audience that fiction, after all, is fiction, and they shouldn't be getting their history lessons from fiction? Sure, in an ideal world. But that isn't going to happen. Not only are people not reading history books hardly at all anymore, but you'd be surprised at how many people believe everything they see/read/hear in a historical fiction piece, and never do any follow-up. I think artists have some responsibility to get it at least remotely right, considering at least part of their audience will believe every word as fact. (I've heard of people trying to look up the Steeds' geneological records, for crying out loud.) Even though I am not one of those blind readers, I've even found myself repeating something I "know" about history, then having to stop and think where I learned it from, whether it was an accurate source or whether it was from a piece of art. Historic art tends to color your view of history, whether or not you are aware of it at the time. Of course, we've been through variations of othis discussion before, and I don't want to be redundant. I tend to not sympathize totally with either side of the issue(fiction is fiction vs. be true at all costs to history). There must be a balance. Of course, "balance" is very difficult to define. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dallas Robbins" Subject: [AML] New Email List LDS Alternative Date: 04 Feb 2001 18:46:11 -0600 Do you read Sunstone, Dialogue, Exponent II, Student Review, Irreantum, Journal of Mormon History, and other LDS/Mormon alternative periodicals, with no one to discuss your reading with? I invite you to join a new email list LDS Alternative. The list is for those who would like to discuss the world of LDS alternative periodicals and books, whether you are a reader, editor, or contributor. This list will encompass discussion primarily about content in such periodicals and books; but will also include discussion on upcoming symposiums and conferences, research requests, the culture of the LDS intellectual community, and it's impact on the LDS church and membership. All differing and diverse ideas and thoughts are welcome, but we ask you write and speak with respect and charity. Off-topic threads are discouraged, and will be asked to be taken somewhere else. We ask all posts to be related to the stated purpose above. Mean spirited attacks, such as church or intellectual bashing, are discouraged, and will not be tolerated. All are encouraged to participate. To join follow this link: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LDS_Alternative/ Sincerely, Dallas Robbins Moderator, LDS Alternative cloudhill@hotmail.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 04 Feb 2001 21:49:16 -0700 Thom Duncan wrote: > Stone treats historyt exactly the same way that Shakespeare did. As a means > to an aratistic end that may have nothing to do with really "happened." That would be fine, except he keeps claiming it's historically accurate. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 04 Feb 2001 21:57:24 -0700 Valerie Holladay wrote: > I think it's easier to educate one author about > audience and the ramifications of trying to publish a > book about poetry, than to educate thousands of > readers, and nonreaders, about the importance of > poetry. > It's a lot easier to > educate the writer, who has a greater personal > interest in learning what's real and a recognition of > the need to know why it matters, as well as a desire > to learn how it can be done well. Apples and oranges. "Educating" people that they should like poetry (i.e., forcing your tastes on them) is a far cry from reminding them of the simple fact that historical fiction is fiction--lots of the stuff in it is made up. On the other hand, "educating" authors that they have to make everything in their historical fiction completely accurate is disguised censorship, not education. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 04 Feb 2001 22:05:33 -0700 Rose Green wrote: > A little fiddling here > and there may make a better story, but I just don't think there's any excuse > for shoddy research. I don't think anyone's promoting shoddy research. We're talking about a special case of the maxim, learn the rules before breaking them. A person who gets history wrong because he doesn't know what really happened is merely incompetent. The author who does his research, and knowingly changes facts because he thinks it will make the story better, is a completely different thing from the author who is just ignorant of the facts. > I can think of another historical series (this time LDS) that sticks so > close to the "facts" as recorded in "history" (whatever that means) that > it's boring. Why the squeamishness? No one else here is shy about naming titles. What series might that be? > If I want to read a fictionalized account of Joseph > Smith, Brigham Young, and the early pioneers, I want to get a better idea of > their character. I want some life, some imagination, breathed into what > they MIGHT have been like. (Like in Card's Stone Tables, or Sarah, both of > which I think did a nice job with that.) Or his book _Saints_, bringing Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and the early pioneers to life. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: [AML] Flashbacks (was: Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_) Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:52:17 -0500 Thom, I am interested in your comment about flashbacks. I've read a few writing books and don't remember coming across this thought. I have been invaded by thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't want to write. I write all the thoughts down because-well, what else can I do? I don't want to write this story but it's what comes knocking on my door at the most absurd times. And it's all in flashbacks. I'm getting the idea that this older woman, in looking back on her life, is learning how to cope with the present she finds herself in. Any further explanation you could add to your comment would be greatly appreciated. Tracie -----Original Message----- One of those is the sparse use of exclamation points. Another is the overuse (or the use at all) of flashbacks. Every book on writing I've ever read seems to agree that a writer who has to resort to flashbacks isn't telling his story from the right starting point. And explanation points (like the too often use of adverbs) is a glaring mark of amateurishness. The existence of these two elements alone tells me that, one, the author is too new and inexperienced for my time. His story may be marvelous despite all that; he may be a genuis who, like Charles Dickens, doesn't understand grammar or punctuation but whose story-telling skills are worth the clunky prose. He may have found a way, in the face of the hundreds of failed examples preceding him, to use extensive flashbacks to his advantage. If so, I'll wait for other reviewers and perhaps history to confirm that fact and then I'll read the novel. At this point, I'm not willing to invest the money in a book that shows such signs of being so amateurish. Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] Mormon Regionalism Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:52:19 -0500 This wouldn't happen to be Francoise Boi would it? If you don't mind saying. Tracie -----Original Message----- Laurel Brady wrote: My experience with my editor at HarperCollins has been exactly the opposite. I was nervous about submitting my first book, as it has rather direct references to faith and God and family and not too subtle Mormon values. My editor jumped on those things, and encouraged me to not only keep them in, but expand them. The end result is not blatant, and not Mormon, but definitely Christian (without being "Christian".) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:52:16 -0500 I think I'm probably one of the mainstream LDS viewers that you may suspect of being offended by this movie. Not having seen it, I don't know if I would be offended. My reasons for not seeing it-other than not being much of a movie watcher--wouldn't be the probability of being offended or not. They would be more on the lines of my stomach/heart/head just can't take really intense portrayals of anything. I'm assuming that when we use the word 'offended' in this context we're talking about 'offending the spirit." I wish we, Mormons, would use different terminology to differentiate between different things. Some members I know equate everything that touches their heartstrings with warm, fuzzy feelings as a spiritual experience, rather the emotional experience it is. There are many films that turn my stomach or 'offend' my emotions without offending my spirit. Depictions of the crucifixion are high on my list of least favorite things to watch. Tracie Laulusa -----Original Message----- Traffic is the sort of film that would offend mainstream LDS viewers. I suspect they would see it as a worldly exploitation of drugs. I would argue against it being exploitative. The movie is shocking, but showed restraint in a number of instances where other directors/writers would not have held back. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Darvell Hunt" Subject: [AML] Small Yahoo! Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:03:30 -0600 Is it appropriate to holler a "small yahoo" in this group? ;) [MOD: Absolutely!] I got my first newspaper article published in the "Lehi Free Press" edition of the "New Utah," a small paper published in Utah County. It doesn't pay much and it's no earth-shattering Pulitzer, but I do hope to gain writing experience by publishing an article or two per week. I'm going to be covering Saratoga Springs for the paper, which is where I'm moving in about a month or two. You can see my article posted on the NewUtah web site at: http://www.newutah.com/10821.htm It's not a novel, but it's a start! Darvell _____________________________________________ Free email with personality! Over 200 domains! http://www.MyOwnEmail.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks (was: Michael RITCHEY, _Disoriented_) Date: 05 Feb 2001 11:40:52 -0700 Tracie Laulusa wrote: > Thom, > > I am interested in your comment about flashbacks. I've read a few writing > books and don't remember coming across this thought. Maybe it's a more of an interdiction in screenplays than novels. Virtually everybook I've ever read in writing screenplays warns against their *over*use. > I have been invaded by > thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't want to write. I write all > the thoughts down because-well, what else can I do? I don't want to write > this story but it's what comes knocking on my door at the most absurd times. > And it's all in flashbacks. I'm getting the idea that this older woman, in > looking back on her life, is learning how to cope with the present she finds > herself in. Any further explanation you could add to your comment would be > greatly appreciated. It's not the use of flashbacks that is discouraged, but the inappriate use of same. What constitutes inappropriate use? That could very well be a value judgement. Basically, if it works, it's okay, whatever "works" means. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tyler Moulton" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 05 Feb 2001 11:47:00 -0700 Tracie Laulusa wrote: >>I have been invaded by thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't = want to write. I write all the thoughts down because-well, what else can = I do? I don't want to write this story but it's what comes knocking on my = door at the most absurd times. And it's all in flashbacks. I'm getting = the idea that this older woman, in looking back on her life, is learning = how to cope with the present she finds herself in. Tracie, reading this, I'm curious if you've seen the film Starchild. Much = of the film explores the confused thoughts of an aging Mrs. Hargreaves = (the girl for whom Lewis Carroll wrote his stories) looking back on her = life. Flashbacks are interspersed with what seems be the beginnings of = dementia (incorporating the mad Hatter and other characters from Carroll's = stories) as she tries to find sense and meaning and resolution in her = life. I thought it was beautifully done. Flashback can certainly be put to good use. The problem is that too often = it's a patch for sloppy story telling. I say, write your book. Tyler Moulton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] SODERBERGH, _Traffic_ (Movie) Date: 05 Feb 2001 11:36:08 -0700 Tracy says: I'm assuming that when we use the > word 'offended' in this context we're talking about 'offending the spirit." > I wish we, Mormons, would use different terminology to differentiate between > different things. I would prefer the phrase, "offending MY spirit." What I like about that expression is that it is saying that, for whatever reason, a certain movie/book, etc. offends you. And who can argue against that? OTOH, to say that "it offends the Spirit" implies a value judgment of one's ability to understand THE spirit, the Holy Ghost. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brent J. Rowley" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:12:41 -0700 > D. Michael wrote: > Wouldn't it be better to educate the audience that fiction, after all, > is fiction, and they shouldn't be getting their history lessons from > fiction? > Annette Lyon wrote: > Sure, in an ideal world. But that isn't going to happen. Not only are people > not reading history books hardly at all anymore, but you'd be surprised at > how many people believe everything they see/read/hear in a historical > fiction piece, and never do any follow-up. Ain't THAT the truth. People are SO extraordinarily gullable these days, it's just amazing. When I was working with Covenant a couple of years ago, they commented to me that one of the most annoying things they have to deal with is readers calling or writing and asking, (sincerely and honestly), "Where exactly is that cave up by Cody, Wyoming, that leads to the Nephites times?" (Tennis Shoes - Heimerdinger) Give me a break! -BJ Rowley * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Have you gone "Inviz" lately? Check out "Missing Children," Volume Three in the "Light Traveler Adventure Series." Exciting and Action-Packed Out-Of-Body Adventure -- by BJ Rowley http://www.bjrowley.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:09:35 -0700 >I don't expect to get a history lesson from historical novels any more >than I expect to get a science lesson from SF novels. At the same time, >however, if the history or science of a novel intrigues me enough, I just >may go out and find out what really is true and what ain't. This is so true. I've been reading a novel set in the 1890s, and one of the characters is the King of Bohemia. I became curious enough about Bohemia to look it up. I found that the last guy in reality to be crowned King of Bohemia took the throne in 1791. I know little or nothing about that part of the world, except to be glad that I wasn't born there, so the exercise was an interesting one for me. Historical novels, if well done, almost always send me for a search for facts about the reality they are based on. Right now I know quite a bit about the Napoleonic Wars, the Mayfair section of London, the Georgian kings of England, and the rigors of life in the Royal Navy. I wouldn't have a clue about any of these things had I not become interested through historical fiction. barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "mjames_laurel" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Regionalism Date: 05 Feb 2001 13:00:54 -0700 No, Alix Reid. ----- Original Message ----- > This wouldn't happen to be Francoise Boi would it? If you don't mind > saying. > > Tracie > > -----Original Message----- > Laurel Brady wrote: > > My experience with my editor at HarperCollins has been exactly the opposite. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 05 Feb 2001 14:54:44 -0700 Jonathan wrote: The best that the rest of us can generally manage is to pretend that we're all professional, objective, smilingly willing to accept cuts and revisions even though we actually want to RIP THEIR ARMS OFF FOR DARING TO MESS WITH WHAT WE'VE WRITTEN. I'm starting to realize how lucky I was to get the editor I did when I first started out. I wasn't particularly confident as a writer, and I waited on pins and needles to hear from her for any revisions. She was always kind when giving feedback--pointing out the good as well as the not so good, and showing me what I could do to give her what she wanted. She was very much the midwife, as Jonathan describes it. I worked with her several times, and as time went on I came to see her as a real ally who could really make me look good. I trusted her implicitly, and since she returned that trust, I think I produced better work than I would have if the person in the editor's chair had been more of an adversary to me. The more I've writen, though, the more confident I am (I suppose the ego grows with experience), so that sometimes criticism is harder to take. I admit in later years I would quite gladly have ripped off someone's arms. : ) Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 05 Feb 2001 12:01:16 -0700 D. Michael Martindale wrote: > Thom Duncan wrote: > > >> Stone treats historyt exactly the same way that Shakespeare did. As a means >> to an aratistic end that may have nothing to do with really "happened." > > > That would be fine, except he keeps claiming it's historically accurate. Not true. In doing the talk show circuit around JFK time, he made it quite clear he was doing what the Bard was doing. Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike South Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 05 Feb 2001 15:39:30 -0700 Our esteemed moderator (Jonathan Langford) wrote: > ...I've seen stories made worse by too much revision and > polishing--but that's usually because the author himself or herself can't > be persuaded to leave the work alone, not because of editorial > interference. This reminds me of something one of my design instructors told me in school. It takes two designers to create a design: one to design it and the other one to tell him when he's finished. --Mike South - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jacob Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 05 Feb 2001 16:09:04 -0700 On Mon, 5 Feb 2001 12:52:17 -0500, Tracie Laulusa wrote: >I am interested in your comment about flashbacks. I've read a few = writing >books and don't remember coming across this thought. I have been = invaded by >thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't want to write. I write = all >the thoughts down because-well, what else can I do? I don't want to = write >this story but it's what comes knocking on my door at the most absurd = times. >And it's all in flashbacks. I'm getting the idea that this older woman,= in >looking back on her life, is learning how to cope with the present she = finds >herself in. Any further explanation you could add to your comment would= be >greatly appreciated. Might I suggest you look seriously at something along the lines of Eileen Gibbons Kump's _Bread and Milk_. It seems similar to what you are doing = and was, for me, a very powerful collection of short stories. The narrative thread that ties them together is, to me, much more powerful than any = series of flash-backs could be. Jacob Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Dixon" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 05 Feb 2001 18:11:06 -0500 Tyler wrote: >Tracie, reading this, I'm curious if you've seen the film >Starchild. Much of the film explores the confused thoughts >of an aging Mrs. Hargreaves (the girl for whom Lewis >Carroll wrote his stories) looking back on her life. Actually, that's _Dreamchild_: http://us.imdb.com/Title?0089052 I first saw this in Fall 1990 at BYU's International Cinema in a double feature with Jan Svankmajer's _Alice_, a fascinating (and periodically morbid) Czech retelling of the Carroll book using a blend of live action and stop-motion animation -- one of my all-time favorites: http://www.awn.com/heaven_and_hell/SVANK/svank2.htm Eric D. Dixon "We get away with nothing. We cannot escape the repercussions of our actions, however subtle they may be. We cannot get away from ourselves. We cannot get away from the world we live in. Our decisions, our choices which underlie our actions & give rise to them, create the world we inhabit." -- Robert Fripp - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 05 Feb 2001 18:03:38 -0600 I think I have to disagree with many of the opinions that are being expressed, essentially--as I see it--blaming readers for their poor judgment if they prefer fiction that is historically accurate, to the extent that the historical facts are known, as opposed to fiction which (either knowingly or unkowingly) takes liberties with those facts. Often, I'm one of those readers. And I don't consider myself either lazy or unsophisticated. Clearly, though, I go to historical fiction for something different than what Thom, or Michael, or some others write it for--though there are also a number of fine historical fiction authors who consider it "part of the game" to take care not to violate any known historical facts, just as some hard science fiction writers consider it "part of the game" not to write anything that violates known physical law, although they may postulate additional laws not currently known. Fine enough; different fiction can have different purposes. But that does put me outside Thom and Michael's audience--as much due to their lack of interest in writing what I want to read, as due to my lack of desire to read what they want to write. Not something for which I (or they) should be blamed, as I see it; all of us make choices about how we will spend our reading and writing time. (By the way, I'm using "Thom and Michael" as a sort of generic label for the position they've staked out here, rather than a comment on any particular work of theirs I've happened to look at...) And so I think that rather than criticize me for my poor taste, it would reward authors who might want to attract my buying dollars (or pennies, depending on how rich or poor I'm feeling at the moment) to find out *why* I feel the way I do. So here are some of my reasons, as best I can sort them out: As I think Tracie pointed out, it's hard to keep track of the source of various "facts" we think we've learned. There's no inherent difference in how we process information from different types of sources--say, from a story as opposed to a history book. I don't like the feeling of not knowing which items I can accept as historically valid and which I can't. More important, as I think I've expressed before, is my sense that in writing particularly about historical characters, authors draw on something already existing: a pool or body of knowledge, attitudes, and so forth. They're not constructing their fictional universe from scratch; rather, they're piggybacking on already existing historical figures and what's known about them. It seems to me that there's a certain responsibility not to misuse that material--a responsibility both to the historical figures involved and to the larger community. The cultural and historical baggage that accompanies historical characters can't be left behind when they're brought into a literary work: it's there along with them. But stories are also actors within a culture, and can have their own effect on the community's body of knowledge and attitudes about historical figures. Indeed, I think that is often their intention. I can't believe that Scott Card had no desire to affect how his readers felt about Joseph Smith when he wrote _Saints_/_A Woman of Destiny_. And even if he didn't plan for it to have that effect, it seems to me that it did--and that the more successful the work as an artistic work, the greater that impact will be. Basically, it seems to me that to fiddle with historical ingredients, then tell us as readers that it's our fault if we let our perceptions of those ingredients be changed by the writers' working with them, is to attempt to exert the storyteller's cultural power while at the same time denying the existence of that power. I should probably add, while I'm at it, that it seems to me that there's a difference between adding something--a character, an event--that was not historically there (as far as we know), and altering the characteristics of a known person or event. The second bothers me a lot more than the first. I also think that in historical fiction, it's appropriate to critique an artistic work not only on points of fact, but also on points of likelihood--for example, whether actions created for a character seem reasonable, based on what we historically know about that person. This seems to me a matter not only of historical accuracy, but of artistic craft as well. If you're going to draw on a certain set of artistic materials, you want to make sure they're well suited to the use to which you're putting them. Of course, such judgments can vary, both in terms of historical meaning and in terms of artistic appropriateness. This doesn't mean, however, that these are inappropriate grounds for critiquing a piece of historical fiction. Rather, it suggests to me that a good critical exchange regarding a piece of historical fiction should help make more explicit the historical *and* artistic assumptions of the reader and writer both. In other words, if I dislike someone else's artistic depiction of Joseph Smith, a good discussion of that fact is likely to include areas such as my own conception of the historical Joseph Smith and the relationship between that conception and the one advanced (in my view) by the work of art. Some may feel that these are not "artistic" questions per se--but in my opinion, the artist invites discussion on precisely these points when using historical figures. Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 05 Feb 2001 20:04:08 -0500 I haven't seen Snow Falling On Cedars but I've read it. In your opinion is that an appropriate use of flashback or is it something you feel could have been done better a different way? Did the movie use the flashbacks like the book did? ( I was just trying to think of an example that most people would be familiar with.) Tracie -----Original Message----- Maybe it's a more of an interdiction in screenplays than novels. Virtually everybook I've ever read in writing screenplays warns against their *over*use. > I have been invaded by > thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't want to write. I write all > the thoughts down because-well, what else can I do? I don't want to write > this story but it's what comes knocking on my door at the most absurd times. > And it's all in flashbacks. I'm getting the idea that this older woman, in > looking back on her life, is learning how to cope with the present she finds > herself in. Any further explanation you could add to your comment would be > greatly appreciated. It's not the use of flashbacks that is discouraged, but the inappriate use of same. What constitutes inappropriate use? That could very well be a value judgement. Basically, if it works, it's okay, whatever "works" means. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ethan Skarstedt Subject: [AML] Who Is Cornerstone? Date: 04 Feb 2001 22:35:53 -0800 [MOD: Since I know the owner/editor of Cornerstone Press is on the List, I'm putting this out for you to answer.] To the Moderator, or everyone on the list in case he doesn't know- Who is Cornerstone Publishing? Are they an imprint of some other firm? How large is their distribution? And finally, how does one get ahold of them? I've looked them up on the web and found a nifty looking front page with all broken links. Thanks for the info. -Ethan Skarstedt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 06 Feb 2001 00:35:30 -0700 Tracie Laulusa wrote: > I am interested in your comment about flashbacks. I've read a few writing > books and don't remember coming across this thought. I have been invaded by > thoughts of a book that, quite frankly, I don't want to write.... > I'm getting the idea that this older woman, in > looking back on her life, is learning how to cope with the present she finds > herself in. You asked Thom, but since I'm down on flashbacks too, I'll throw my two cents in (reminding everyone how much a cent is worth these days). What you are describing isn't quite the same as a book that is telling the story in real time and relies on flashbacks as a quick and easy way to fill in backstory. In your book, the woman in the present would be a frame story to the real story. Frame stories, although not as common as they once were, are still a viable structure in the hands of a competent author. I think the most ingenious handling of a frame story I've come across is William Goldman's _Princess Bride_, where the real story is a fictitious book that a grandfather reads to his sick grandson (the frame story), with comments by the reader and hearer along the way. With your book, the flashbacks wouldn't really be flashbacks, but the main story encompassed by a frame story of the woman remembering. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Valerie Holladay Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 05 Feb 2001 23:35:37 -0800 (PST) --- Jonathan Langford wrote: > Editors have no muse. Speak for yourself, Jonathan, or speak for technical editors. As an editor of fiction, I try to tap into the same muse that inspires the author in the first place, as presumptuous as that sounds. And I'm going to take some time to try to put a name to the editor's muse, because we do have one. Jonathan said so many things so well that it's tempting to add my two cents to everything. But just in terms of writers and editors, here are my thoughts: > As a writer, I've never learned to enjoy being > edited. To be perfectly honest, I really keep > wishing for my manuscripts to come back with words > like "perfect," "stunning," "excellent," > "insightful"--but without any red marks whatsoever. Sure, me too. That's why I read everything to my mom first, because she loves everything I do. Then I go to people whose writing voice and experience I trust. Just remember, that just as writers enjoy hearing "wow, this is great," editors like to hear "wow, what a great idea, thanks for suggesting it" or "yes, thanks - that's the word I was looking for" (as opposed to "hey, stop messing with my stuff or I'll break your arms off"). For example, I know my dentist knows I don't LOVE what he does, but I am grateful and I've learned not to push the drill or shots away (I did when I was younger and broken some expensive equipment - oops :-( But I'll restrain myself from the temptation to compare editors and dentists for the moment. When I write, it helps me to have both the kind of feedback that says "this doesn't work," and "wow, this is great." So when I edit, I try to point out what I think "works" exceptionally well, as well as what I think doesn't (yes, of course,it's subjective but you gotta start someplace). When writers write, we reach deep inside ourselves to tap into that creative place inside to create a story, characters, place and time, and so forth. In graduate school there was a lot of talk in rhetoric of writing as a "social" process, that we can't write in a vacuum because we're all so interconnected in this world, with each other, with our past, with influences we aren't even aware of . . . but, when we write - unless you're writing as a team, together, talking it through as you write - it's a solitary process. It's one person, the writer, drawing upon everything inside - words, experiences, perceptions. But sometimes writing a story is like when I tell a joke, which I don't do well. I get caught up in the joke and by the time I get to the punchline and all I get are bewildered looks, I realize I've forgotten one tiny, crucial detail. In the same way, writer may mentally and emotionally fill in all the gaps in characters and relationships, the scenes, the words, and feel emotions or see pictures that are there for them, but that they haven't created for the reader. One thing the editor tries to do for the writer is to catch those little "oops." A good editor, like a good teacher, may play the role of the midwife, helping the writer who is the primary creator. Although the editor helps in the final stages, sometimes it's a lot more than that. Over the last week, one author and I have managed to produce about sixty pages of email as we've together tried to find the shape of a particular book and the most effective way to present the information in terms of overall organization. The writing at this point is somewhat secondary and since this writer knows that language is not his/her strong point and feels confident in my ability to help, my editorial approach is different here than it would be with some other authors. To move away from the midwife metaphor, the editor might be seen as the member of the construction crew, but generally not the leader. Still, it's a team effort and everyone puts in their input; to the leader falls the responsibilty to integrate all the feedback and come up with the best solution (just as writers have to wade through at times contradictory feedback from teachers, members of writing groups, etc.) (And, as with editors and publishers, the building is then subjected to building codes etc.) When the building crew has done their work, the editors may serve double duty as the clean-up crew and enlist copy editors or proofreaders to help sand down the rough edges, sweep up the sawdust, clean and dust, even paint the walls (perhaps the equivalent of "rewriting," to change the appearance of the language but not the substance of the work. This is where the analogy breaks down, though. Most people can sweep and sand and clean; it isn't really a "craft" that takes an apprenticeship. On the other hand, editing really does take a lot more skill and experience than many people acknowledge. I am continually amazed and irritated at the number of people who think that all it takes to be an editor is to be able to read, find a few typos, and have some opinions they aren't afraid to voice. A writer who is unfortunate enough to get such an editor may very well find his/her writing "butchered." I'll be honest and say up front that when I started out editing, I was a pretty dangerous editor, playing fast and loose with everyone else's language, and even ideas, and my heartfelt apologies to those unfortunate writers who were my training ground. I have settled down a bit but it's still a trick to adapt to the various styles and needs and individual voices an editor may encounter in a single week - one writer may need and accept heavy rewriting, another may want and need very little, others write very fine and tight, so tight their phrases need to be unraveled and loosened a little to allow the reader the space to understand and feel, and others' writing may be so leisurely that some tightening may be needed to generate a quicker pace. >I still remember how frustrated I felt . . . when > a member of my thesis committee at BYU . . .asked > for changes at my thesis defense. I remember being absolutely revolted and even angry by a suggestion Gene England at BYU made about an essay I wrote for one of his classes. I absolutely did not want to take that direction in my writing. And yet . . . several hours later, driving home to Salt Lake, something started to work in my brain and at home, 15-20 pages later, I had done exactly what he had recommended. I was astounded (and neededless to say, quite pleased with myself for having the intelligence to follow his suggestion :-) Three years later, when I defended my thesis, which included this essay, another writer I admire a great deal and who served me very well as my thesis advisor (the quietly brilliant and talented writer John Bennion), suggested that if I had time I might want to completely rewrite this essay at some point(ouch!). Although the thought was completely alien to me at the time, I realized it had been almost 2-3 years and my writing style had changed (I used a lot of adjectives back then). > Perhaps there are some authors so mature (or perhaps > the word is "masochistic") that they genuinely enjoy > receiving back a hacked, slashed-up manuscript from > editor. I'm not sure I've ever encountered > any such authors . . . I don't know about the "genuinely enjoy" part, but I could introduce you to some authors who, after having a few weeks (or longer) to digest the "criticism" and sift through it and weigh it out, have managed to use the feedback to strengthen their writing. While initially disappointed not to hear "stunning" or "magnificant," some writers have felt grateful that (1) an editor even bothered to take the time to comment instead of responding "doesn't fit our needs" or "it doesn't work but I don't know why" and (2) the feedback prompted the writers to make improvements that they felt strengthened their writing. > The only people I've encountered who seem able to > take editing comments with perfect equanamity are > those who have no personal investment in seeing > themselves as authors... Ouch, Jonathan. That's a real insult to some very fine writers I know who are eager to improve their craft and grateful for feedback. It doesn't mean they don't feel a very real stab of disappointment not to hear "incredible" or "brilliant." But they've learned not to be attached to their words just because the words are their creation; the words are merely a vehical - if they "don't work" (at least for one educated reader), then the writer is already busy thinking of other better, stronger possibilities. Not that they "react" to every criticism, but they think it through, see it with another pair of eyes, question its effectiveness, consider other avenues of relaying what they hope to communicate, and, as the saying goes, rewrite, rewrite, rewrite. My favorite example of this is our illustrious AML president, Marilyn Brown, whom I would never describe as having "no personal investment" in her work - but she's so dedicated and professional in her writing, that she is invariably open to careful suggestions and feedback about her writing. So many times with her and with other authors, I've asked for something more from them and what they returned was a more lustrous, richer-hued gem, because I asked a question and they listened. When Jonathan described the different kinds of editing, I remember thinking that there was another level or two that I've experienced, as both an editor and a writer. An editor does more than check grammar and spelling or check the consistent spelling of names, or even the accuracy of certain details. Editing is also about asking questions, and pushing good writers to be terrific and terrific writers to be even better than they ever imagined they could be. Once again, I know that sounds like a presumptuous thing for an editor to think he or she can be, but then, isn't that why writers write books about writing and why teachers teach and why we have writers' groups? And that's as much and probably more than I can take on at the moment (with my thanks to Jonathan for his comments on this - and if you want to know who to blame for this overly long post, look no further :-). With hopes that an editor's perspective, and in this case, a fiction editor's, might be useful to some. Valerie Holladay __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] "The Big KSL Holiday Broadcast" (Musical) Date: 06 Feb 2001 08:26:21 -0700 I appreciated this review of the Big KSL Holiday Broadcast. I also saw = the show, and was similarly impressed with the professionalism and polish = of the company. I thought it was an excellent production, and I also had = cause to reflect on the ephemeral qualities of popular culture. It was a = delightful evening in the theatre. =20 I saw the show with my father, who is an opera singer and was a voice = teacher for many years. He has probably seen 200 musical revues in his = time, supporting the professional work of his students. He felt that this = production by Provo Theatre company was in the top 10 of all the revues = he's ever seen. It's an excellent small theatre company, and like R.W., I = look forward to watching their continued evolution as a theatre producing = company. Unfortunately, it is unlikely that we will have that opportunity. The = company will probably disband within the next few months. They are in the = process of a last-minute fundraising campaign to try to save the company. = If it fails, and it looks now as though it will fail, PTC will be no more. I have to be very careful how I say this, but I need to say something = about critics and the responsibility of critics. The reality is that the = Big KSL Holiday Broadcast was a last ditch effort by PTC to try to keep = their doors open. They needed a hit. And the production was absolutely = killed by the reviews that appeared in the local papers. =20 I attended a party with my parents and some old friends of theirs. = Probably twenty couples were at this gathering, all of them people in = their sixties, people of some means, and people who have supported the = arts their entire lives. It was a gathering, in other words, of the = perfect core audience of the Big KSL Holiday Broadcast. And my father = talked with great enthusiasm about the excellent show he had seen the = night before at PTC. (As it happens, we saw the show closing night). Not = one person in that gathering had seen the show. It looked interesting, = they said. They wanted to see it. But then they read the reviews and = decided not to bother. Here on the AML list, we have a group of people who love literature, and = who enjoy reading. If one among us reads a new LDS novel and thinks it = has some strengths and weaknesses, she'll write a review and say so. And = we'll all read the review, and most of us will probably decide to read the = novel ourselves. There's room, in this venue, for detailed, thoughtful = criticism. But theatre is a different animal. If a newspaper play review says ten = good things about the play, and two bad things, that's a pan, and = audiences probably won't go see it. If a newspaper review says 'it's a = very strong show. You should probably give it a try,' that's a tepid, = lukewarm review, and audiences will probably stay away. People will go = see a movie even if it has rotten reviews, because people like movies, and = have learned that they can enjoy themselves even at a dreadful movie. But = people don't really trust theatre that much. An even-handed, strengths-and= -weaknesses review of a play will kill box office. A review that gives a = show 3 stars, or a B+, well, that's a harshly negative review. =20 Now, I'm a theatre guy, and of course I think the only purpose of a = theatrical review is to sell tickets. I'm very one-sided in my opinions = on this subject. But we talk a lot about the need to create a Mormon = Theatre, about the need to support and nurture a Shakespeare of our own. = That process requires, of course, that good playwrights emerge, and it = also presupposes an audience for the work of a Shakespeare. I'm now = convinced, however, that the single biggest need we have, as we work = towards the day that a MS will arise, is for a critical community that can = and will support that theatrical community. And that critical community = will have two componants. First, a generation of critics is needed that = can put good work into a proper perspective. But second, and just as = important, a generation of reviewers is needed, to create the audience in = the first place. We have the first. We do not have, and desperately = need, the second. In the meantime, PTC is on its last legs. I think it's heartbreaking. Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 06 Feb 2001 09:27:10 -0700 I LOVE it, Scott, that you have made the brave admission that you want to be a virus. Of course! That's the goal! Why didn't I think of that? It's much more fun to be one than to have one! (I'm serious!) Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Influence of Mormon Literary Tradition Date: 06 Feb 2001 09:34:06 -0700 >William wrote: In my words, there's something about the interplay between the ideas, the doctrines of the gospel and the poetic image that can push our understanding forward. William, this is exactly the kind of thing we can do! And the miles are ahead of us! Wonderful discussion! Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: [AML] Critical Terms (was: SODERBERGH, _Traffic_) Date: 06 Feb 2001 09:42:11 -0700 Tracie, I have got a tremendous idea. You know, you are hitting on something truly pertinent! We all know how the eskimos have thirty words for different kinds of snow. I think you and some of the others of us should work on a list of good terms to define some of these emotions that happen in literature or film. (I'm serious) Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 10:52 AM > I think I'm probably one of the mainstream LDS viewers that you may suspect > of being offended by this movie. Not having seen it, I don't know if I > would be offended. My reasons for not seeing it-other than not being much > of a movie watcher--wouldn't be the probability of being offended or not. > They would be more on the lines of my stomach/heart/head just can't take > really intense portrayals of anything. I'm assuming that when we use the > word 'offended' in this context we're talking about 'offending the spirit." > I wish we, Mormons, would use different terminology to differentiate between > different things. Some members I know equate everything that touches their > heartstrings with warm, fuzzy feelings as a spiritual experience, rather the > emotional experience it is. There are many films that turn my stomach or > 'offend' my emotions without offending my spirit. Depictions of the > crucifixion are high on my list of least favorite things to watch. > > Tracie Laulusa > - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Maxwell" Subject: Re: [AML] Brady Udall Query Date: 06 Feb 2001 09:00:00 -0800 Last year the radio show "This American Life", on PRI (Public Radio International), broadcast "Resurrection", one of Brady Udall's short stories. I'm not sure whether the story was read aloud by the author, or by an actor. The show's main website is: www.thislife.org You can listen to this particular episode on Real Player at: www.thislife.org/ra/154.ram Here's the episode's synopsis from the thislife.org website: "In Dog We Trust March 10, 2000 Episode 154 Stories of dogs and cats and other animals that live in our homes. Exactly how much are they caught up in everyday family dynamics? We answer this question and others. Prologue. Heather and her girlfriend lived with a cat named Sid. The girlfriend showed all sorts of affection to Sid that she never showed to Heather. And at some point -- against her better judgment -- Heather started to become jealous ... of (6 minutes) Act One. The Youth in Asia. When a pet dies, to what degree can it be replaced by another? To what degree can pets replace people in our lives? David Sedaris tells this story of cats and dogs and other animals. (16 minutes) Act Two. If Cats ran Hollywood. What do cats want to see on television? Steve Malarky, creator of the world's best selling home video for cats, tells all. His website: . And -- in the interest of equal time -- a cashier who works at a chain store that sells pet products rants about the absurdity of the items she's ringing up every day: St John's Wort for dogs, CDs for pets, spinach-flavored bones. (10 minutes) Act Three. Resurrection. Another story about what it is that animals can take the place of, in our lives and in our homes, from writer Brady Udall. This work of fiction originally appeared in the Autumn 1999 issue of Story Magazine. (23 minutes)" Regards, Frank Maxwell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 06 Feb 2001 12:11:15 -0600 Ouch! In the course of some very good comments about editing, Valerie made me aware that there were some things in my original post that were not as clear as I could wish them to have been. (Yet another thing a good editor can help one avoid...) I wrote: >> The only people I've encountered who seem able to >> take editing comments with perfect equanamity are >> those who have no personal investment in seeing >> themselves as authors... To which Valerie responded: >Ouch, Jonathan. That's a real insult to some very fine >writers I know who are eager to improve their craft >and grateful for feedback. I actually agree with this--that there are many such authors out there. When I said "with perfect equanamity," I meant people who take editing comments with no strong negative (or positive) emotional response at all--no initial disappointment that something has to be changed, no strong sense of critical attention to (but not necessarily rejection of!) whatever changes the editor may propose. Essentially, what I meant is that if you have an investment in seeing yourself as a writer, it's impossible not to care about what an editor does with your work. That's all. Like Valerie, I've often had the experience of writers grateful to me for making the work become more what they had originally intended--though my *professional* experience lies more in nonfiction than fiction editing. But I also try to remember, from my own experience, that even if you're a professional, that gratitude--and the willingness to look beyond the initial disappointment to see the real potential value of an editor's (or critic's) comments--does not necessarily come easily. And I wanted to share that observation, in part so that authors who may have felt that type of disappointment and wondered how other writers can seem so pleased when an editor returns a marked-up manuscript will know that in many cases, we're faking it--at least until the initial disappointment is over and we've had a chance to think through the suggested changes, to have the experience of letting the work-as-I-wrote-it sit side-by-side in our mind's eye with the work-as-it-might-otherwise-be, so we can more fairly judge which set of options will better embody the story (fiction or nonfiction) that we want to tell. I love collaborative writing. I've had the good fortune to do a fair amount of it (in the realm of nonfiction), and when it works well, it's one of the greatest things in the world, in my opinion. A good writing-editing relationship is very similar to that. Unfortunately, there are few editors out there anymore (from what I have heard) who have the luxury of providing that kind of feedback to writers. I think you're fortunate, Valerie, to be able to spend 60 pages' worth of e-mail in a back-and-forth exchange with an author. I have a good friend whose breakthrough novel (as he had hoped it would be, and as I think it perhaps has been) received, if I recall his estimate correctly, about a day's worth of attention from his editor--total--at the draft stage. Hardly time to read through the thing once, I'd say, with any degree of attention at all. Perhaps if he had been a worse writer, the editor would have spent more time on him. But this friend of mine was very serious about his need to get good reader feedback from others, because he felt he wasn't getting it from his editor. Perhaps the best analogy for the emotional side of editing and revision that I can come up with, from the author's point of view, is exercise. Personally, I hate exercise. I doubt I will ever like it, even though I know it's important to me. But I know there are many people who say they love it. I suspect, however, that even for those people, it's still uncomfortable while you're actually doing it. The slight pain, the discomfort--I don't think those can be eliminated from the process. (If they can, let me know how and when that happens.) But once one is in good shape, and exercising regularly and properly, there comes, I understand, a kind of rush--the endorphin rush, I guess it is--with a certain mental as well as physical satisfaction from pushing oneself to one's limits. This seems to me very much like my response to the need for revision, in response to (good) editing comments. It's a pain. It's somewhat painful, as well. But once I start actually doing it, to watch the work improve gives me a great feeling. There's a quote from Dorothy Sayers--in which a detective novelist, surprise surprise, is talking with someone else about writing--that expresses it pretty well: "Isn't the writing of good prose an emotional excitement?" "Yes, of course it is. At least, when you get the thing dead right and know it's dead right, there's no excitement like it. It's marvellous. It makes you feel like God on the Seventh Day--for a bit, anyhow." (_Gaudy Night_, Chapter IX; p. 173 in my paperback edition) After one has felt that type of excitement, it can be disappointing to have to go back and revise the writing one initially felt so excited about. But as you see the work improving as the result of the changes you're making, that same excitement can resurface during the revision phase. Indeed, I think I've felt it more often during revision than during the initial composition. And I'll stop there, with the promise that this is positively the last time I'll post on this topic. For a while. Unless I'm otherwise tempted... Jonathan Langford (not, at the moment, wearing my moderator's hat) jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Small Yahoo! Date: 06 Feb 2001 09:40:01 -0700 Congratulations, Darvell! Wonderful! Will you be writing much for the NewUTAH bunch? Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Melissa Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 06 Feb 2001 12:10:34 -0700 On Mon, 5 Feb 2001 20:04:08 -0500, Tracie Laulusa wrote: >I haven't seen Snow Falling On Cedars but I've read it. In your opinion= is >that an appropriate use of flashback or is it something you feel could = have >been done better a different way? Did the movie use the flashbacks like= the >book did? ( I was just trying to think of an example that most people >would be familiar with.) I don't know that I'd even call what that book did "flashbacks." It was more like two or three different stories being told simultaneously, = jumping between the storylines as needed. But it's been over a year since I read it, so I'm not sure. I think it was more effective than telling the = whole story chronologically, because the history that led up to the murder = trial was revealed gradually, like unravelling a mystery. I think that using flashbacks is in general just sloppy. (There are = always exceptions, of course.) For example, say you have a story about a person who, before the story's action begins, suffered a horrible catastrophe. Whatever it is, it affects all her behavior, all her perceptions. But instead of letting us see these effects in real time, you use a flashback and show us the catastrophe. Now the reader knows exactly what happened = and can anticipate to some extent how it will make the character behave. But= if that were so important, why not just start the story there? The purpose = of starting the story *after* is to create a sense of mystery: Why does she hate dogs? Why does she cringe when she passes a hospital? In effect, = the flashback gives away the mystery you've tried to create before it's = actually solved. But this is, again, my fallible opinion, which may change before the day = is out. :) Melissa Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Alan Mitchell" Subject: [AML] Re: Alan MITCHELL, _Angel of the Danube_ Date: 06 Feb 2001 12:42:44 -0700 >Nan McCulloch wrote >My husband and I just finished reading Angel of the Danube_ and found it a >delightful read. We visited Austria just two years ago and enjoyed the >incorporation of the Austrian folklore. I must be honest, however and admit >that I didn't like the ending. I felt that the folklore analogy seemed >contrived and a bit of an encumbrance at that point. It also seemed >unrealistic to have her step off the plane wearing a traditional Himmelsruhe >Dirndle and a colored apron. Am I off on this, or have you had other such >comments? > >Nan McCulloch To answer comment two: the dirndl is just a dirndl, and they happen to have aprons. Yes people wear them, and not usually on an airplane. See a Brunhilde-esque picture at http://www.viewimages.com/AltaVistaView.asp?imageid=7055&promotionid=1&partn erid=2&type=results but beware, this particular photo may ruin your image of the feminine side of the book and of our whole species. That is, unless you are living in Wisconsin or Minnesota, in which case you may fall in love with the dirndl. The specific colors of the Himmelsruhe dirndl was made up because there is no such place as Himmelsruhe (Heavenly peace). To answer comment one, about the contrived folklore ending: Yes Nan, yours is the first such comment I have received. I recall Ruth Starkman thought the final image was the only thing that saved the ending, and others have thought the last chapter was the best. What do the rest of you AMLers think? Alan Mitchell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 06 Feb 2001 18:41:28 -0500 Thanks Thom, Tyler, Erin and D Michael. I'll get busy and look at some of those examples. (I'm glad Starchild turned into Dreamchild. I saw Starchild-very bad recording-and was a little revolted.) Tracie - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: [AML] Re: Who Is Cornerstone? Date: 06 Feb 2001 12:56:04 -0700 Taking the Moderator's invitation below, I've responded to Ethan. Anyone else with comments is welcome to add. I'm just going for the facts. > > To the Moderator, or everyone on the list in case he doesn't know- > > Who is Cornerstone Publishing? Cornerstone Publishing (legal name: Cornerstone Publishing & Distribution, Inc.) is an Arizona corporation, doing business in Utah (but with offices in Chandler, AZ as well as Bountiful, UT). > Are they an imprint of some other firm? No, but they have another imprint--Horizon Publishers. In August 2000, Cornerstone acquired Horizon Publishers in Bountiful, UT from Duane S. Crowther (who's now on an LDS Mission in Mexico). > How large is their distribution? In the LDS market, it is as big as any other LDS publisher. That is, they distribute directly to all the LDS bookstores in the world, including Deseret and Seagull. In addition, they are the only LDS publisher that has membership in the CBA (Christian Booksellers Association), and they distribute to a large (and increasing) segment of the national trade market. In order to accomplish this more efficiently, they acquired a commercial printing company (Paradox Printers, formerly in Layton) in January 2001. Most printing functions are now accomplished very nicely in-house. Cornerstone is the only LDS publisher that has its own printing and binding capabilities. > And finally, how does one get ahold of > them? Email us at horizonp@burgoyne.com, or me personally at either rrhopkins@email.com or rrhopkins@horizonpublishers.com, or call (801) 295-9451. (We'll be changing the websites and email addresses later this year to reflect the Cornerstone name as well as our Horizon Publishers impri nt.) > I've looked them up on the web and found a nifty looking front > page with all broken links. The Cornerstone website is not operational at this time, and the Horizon Publishers website is having some difficulty thanks to some rather poor support from Burgoyne, our current ISP. Later this spring, we'll be hiring a major web designer (the one who originally designed the "nifty" website) to bring everything properly on line. > Thanks for the info. > > -Ethan Skarstedt Your welcome, Richard Hopkins - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 06 Feb 2001 22:21:42 -0500 I remember the last time this thread came up-not very long ago. It was just after that that someone on the list commented about not knowing such and such about WWII until they were reading one of the series-probably Children of the Promise. (Sorry if I murdered that.) I remember wondering if that was a true part of the historical fiction or a fiction part of the historical fiction. At the time I had just enough time to skim through posts and try to keep up so I didn't ask. Personally, when I read historical fiction I want it to be fairly accurate. Yes, I know that no one knows exactly what he said she said and so forth. Yet I still want the base to be as real as possible. I know every writer will bring their bias. And history is very biased. And there are a lot of discrepancies. And knowing all that I still want it to be as truthful as possible. Tracie Laulusa - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rose Green" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 06 Feb 2001 21:54:49 -0600 One use of flashbacks that I can think of that seems to work is in Anne Perry's Monk series. Her main character is a police officer who lost his memory in an accident shortly before the first book begins. As the series goes on, he remembers bits and pieces of who he was before the accident (usually not very positive things about himself, actually). Although flashbacks do figure in a lot in the first book's main plot, they are usually used afterwards to either develop his character more or to add to a subplot of some kind. I personally would tend to avoid flashbacks on the whole, but it seems to work in this case, as in others. Rose Green _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Who Is Cornerstone? Date: 06 Feb 2001 23:20:29 -0600 At 01:56 PM 2/6/01, you wrote: >Your welcome, > >Richard Hopkins Richard is also my editor at Cornerstone. :-) Shouldn't that be "You're Welcome," hm? Don't worry, though, Ethan, Richard is actually quite good. I've been very happy working with them. My first novel, _Prodigal Journey,_ also won Cornerstone's Fiction Book of the Year for 2000, which I thought was cool. Thanks! (I forgot to ask, Richard, did that award include Horizon's books as well, or just Cornerstone, since Horizon was acquired so late in the year?) At any rate, I do recommend them to any of you writers looking for a publishing house. As far as I'm able to tell, they can deliver on their promises. And they're even making Horizon's book covers look better. Grin. Linda ===== Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 07 Feb 2001 00:46:44 -0700 Jonathan Langford wrote: > I think I have to disagree with many of the opinions that are being > expressed, essentially--as I see it--blaming readers for their poor > judgment if they prefer fiction that is historically accurate Whoa, slow down, cowboy! I never said that. I blame readers who are so ignorant of life that they think every little thing represented in a work of historical fiction is true: looking up the Steeds' genealogy, or asking for the location of the cave that shoots you back in time to the Nephites. Not only do I have nothing negative to say about people who _prefer_ their historical fiction as accurate as possible, I count myself among that crowd. There's a difference between principle and preference. I defend the _principle_ that the author of historical fiction has the right to adjust historical facts for the benefit of the story, without having to accomodate the reader too ignorant to understand that this happens regularly. But I still prefer my historical fiction to be as accurate as possible. Somewhere between those two poles is reality: I recognize that historical fiction will always have its rubbery history, so I make a game out of it, going to the historical record to see what really happened. But the closer to known historical facts the author's story is, the more impressed and pleased I am. With those facts he alters, I analyze the possible reasons for his decision. If he seemed to have a good aesthetic reason for doing so, I respect the decision. If altering the facts seemed to bring about no compensating advantage, I criticize the decision. > And so I think that rather than criticize me for my poor taste I hope that what I've said above makes it clear that I don't criticize anyone for _preferring_ historical accuracy. I was criticizing the BYU history professors who said authors _must_ be as historically accurate as possible to accomodate the readers too stupid/lazy/gullible/whatever to realize that fiction includes fiction. "Prefer" is an artistic judgment, and everyone is entitled to their own. "Must" is a moral judgment being foisted on another person, something that's inexcusable in most situations, but especially in regard to things which are really artistic preferences. > It seems to me that there's a certain responsibility not > to misuse that material--a responsibility both to the historical figures > involved and to the larger community. But what constitutes "misuse"? Facts can be changed to misrepresent who the historical figure really was as an effort to promote an agenda. Or facts can be changed to present the honest essence of a historical figure, but in a way that works dramatically so the audience is held throughout the story. One of these is misuse, the other is not. But I would add that even the misuse is a valid decision for an author to make. I'm just not likely to like what he produces. The author has the right to borrow from any source for a story, and develop it in any way he thinks will produce a quality book. Just as Cameron Macintosh thanked Victor Hugo for being out of copyright so he could produce the most successful musical in history without being required to adhere to the original version of _Les Miserables_, historical figures are "out of copyright." Their lives are in the public domain, to be used by an author in any way he pleases. > I also think that in historical fiction, it's appropriate to critique an > artistic work not only on points of fact, but also on points of > likelihood--for example, whether actions created for a character seem > reasonable, based on what we historically know about that person. This > seems to me a matter not only of historical accuracy, but of artistic craft > as well. Of course the author's handling of historical facts are fair game for the critic. But the BYU professors weren't acting as critics, commenting after the fact. They were acting as censors, attempting to squelch certain artistic choices in advance. > but in my opinion, the artist invites discussion on precisely these > points when using historical figures. Discussion, yes. Attempts at censorship, no. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 07 Feb 2001 01:04:13 -0700 Valerie Holladay wrote: > Ouch, Jonathan. That's a real insult to some very fine > writers I know who are eager to improve their craft > and grateful for feedback. It doesn't mean they don't > feel a very real stab of disappointment not to hear > "incredible" or "brilliant." But they've learned not > to be attached to their words just because the words > are their creation; the words are merely a vehical - > if they "don't work" (at least for one educated > reader), then the writer is already busy thinking of > other better, stronger possibilities. I've been amazed to find myself progressing to this happy state of existence. It wasn't too long ago that I was in the "tell me I'm brilliant" category of feedback-seeking. Through multiple baptisms of fire, I learned to improve my writing, but I also learned that I really was a talented writer. The "tell me I'm brilliant" crowd, I believe, are at a stage where they are unsure of their talent--they don't know if they're a writer or not. They need to be called brilliant to confirm their talent. Criticism opens the definite possibility that they can't write after all. What helped me into the stage where I could receive criticism without taking it personally (not much, anyway)? I received enough sincere, knowledgeable, positive feedback to become confident that the talent and ability were there. I _am_ a writer. Criticism no longer caused self-doubt over the wisdom of even trying to be a writer. When a writer becomes confident in his ability, he begins to crave the criticism, because he wants his writing to be the best it can be. He knows even the greatest writers don't produce perfection in the first draft, so he's eager to find out what needs to get better, and is irritated at people who waste his time sparing his feelings instead of being honest. In other words, as Valerie said, the editor needs to honestly praise as much as honestly criticize, so the author can gain the confidence that he really is an author, and can accept the criticism for what it is: the efforts of a friend to help him be the best he can be. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Theater Is Dead (was: "The Big KSL Holiday Broadcast") Date: 07 Feb 2001 01:53:15 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" wrote: > But theatre is a different animal. If a newspaper play review says ten good things about the play, and two bad things, that's a pan, and audiences probably won't go see it. If a newspaper review says 'it's a very strong show. You should probably give it a try,' that's a tepid, lukewarm review, and audiences will probably stay away. People will go see a movie even if it has rotten reviews, because people like movies, and have learned that they can enjoy themselves even at a dreadful movie. But people don't really trust theatre that much. An even-handed, strengths-and-weaknesses review of a play will kill box office. A review that gives a show 3 stars, or a B+, well, that's a harshly negative review. I titled this message "Theater Is Dead," not because that's the assertion I'm making, but to catch your attention. I'm actually asking it as a question: is theater dead? As Eric said, people love movies. Until last century, there was no such thing as movies--or radio--or television--or records/tapes/CDs. All the entertainment that people had before then was live and in person. Of course theater could thrive then. No competition. But theater for today's audience is movies and television. As Egon says in _Ghosbusters_, "Print is dead." Is theater dead? Does it serve no economically viable purpose these days? But in spite of Egon's and everyone else's predictions that print is dead, print is not dead. Same with other pronouncements of death on movies and radio when television was invented. And so far, predictions that e-books will supercede the printed word do not appear to be panning out. Does theater fit into this equation somewhere? Is there some new paradigm for theater that will make it economically viable? I question that. Print, radio, television, and film are all mass-market media. Theater is a one-to-one proposition, as far as orders of magnitude go. One set of performers to one audience on one night. You can't mass produce theater to amortize your up-front costs to a miniscule amount per unit. You have to recreate the "master recording" with every performance. I think I'm right when I say that nearly every orchestra in existence these days is subsidized--they can't exist on their own revenue, for all the same reasons. Is theater doomed to be a minor cultural phenomenon that must be subsidized by philanthropists or the government? What is the success paradigm for theater in the 21st century? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms (was: SODERBERGH, _Traffic_) Date: 07 Feb 2001 02:33:58 -0700 Marilyn Brown wrote: > We all know how the eskimos have thirty words for different > kinds of snow. I think you and some of the others of us should work on a > list of good terms to define some of these emotions that happen in > literature or film. Oofchatter: this book sucks because it criticizes something I feel sensitive about. Disorious: this book sucks because it uses too many flashbacks and exclamation marks. Tendertusch: this book was good, but I'm too whimpy to endure it's true-to-life depictions. Flyswallow: yawn; it's been done before. Soothekopf: I like this book because it validates me. Bashkopf: I hate this book because it validates people who scare me. Ouchmatter: I like this book because it challenges my biases. Ouchextreme: I hate this book because it challenges my biases. Langfordism: this book sucks because it plays fast and loose with historical facts. Duncanism: this book is great because it plays fast and loose with historical facts. Oliverstonism: facts, what are facts? Getalife: where can I find the cave that sends you back in time? Bigelornery: I like this book because it criticizes the church--but still says it's true. Parkinstraneous: this book sucks, it's not science fiction. Bronsonalpha: the planet that destroys the earth in _When Worlds Collide_. Samuelsensory: theater critics suck. Brownian: involuntary motion of microscopic creatures from the bombardment of molecules, of course. (What did you think it was going to mean?) Bennion: an inflamed swelling on the big toe. Harlowicient: I think I'd like this, if I could understand what he's saying. Dmichaerious: this is the best book ever written. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 06 Feb 2001 16:08:57 -0700 ON STAGE BYU Kicking Butt at ACTF Eric Samuelsen I just returned from a week at the Region VIII meeting of the American = College Theatre Festival. I suspect that most List-ers haven't heard of = ACTF, and so I thought I'd tell you about it, especially because my = experience at this year's meeting caused me to think a lot about Mormonism = and the future of American theatre and about the extent to which we might = possibly influence that future. =20 Background first: The American College Theatre Festival is an opportunity = for college student actors, designers and playwrights to get together, see = each other's work and compete head to head. It works like this. Every time = a member school does a show, an outside adjudicator, generally a faculty = member from another university in the region, travels to the school and = sees the show, and then spends an hour or so responding to it. This is, = to me, the most valuable part of ACTF. Students get some outside feedback = on their work, and we faculty types get to see the work our colleagues at = other schools are doing. The adjudicator can nominate the work of student = designers for various design awards. And the adjudicator can also = nominate up to three actors for the Irene Ryan acting competition, about = which more later. The entire show can also be nominated for ACTF. Shows are designated = 'associate' or 'participating' entries. If a show is participating, then = two additional adjudicators are flown in from the Regional Governing = Board. Those adjudicators respond to the show, and then report back to = the Board, and out of all the participating shows in the Region, six shows = are selected to go to Regionals. Adjudicators from the National Board = attend all the Regionals, and a total of six shows are invited to = Nationals, which are held in March or April in the Kennedy Center in = Washington. So getting a show to Regionals is a big deal, and getting a = show to Nationals is a very big deal. And all those actors and designers = and playwrights who compete at Regionals can also go to Nationals, where = they compete for scholarship money. =20 Typically, BYU does eight shows on our season, only one of which we = designate participating. Remember, if a participating show does go to = Regionals, that means it has to be remounted and performed, which means, = in practical terms, only Fall shows can be participating entries. It's = just too hard to remount a show nine or ten months after its initial run. = =20 ACTF is particularly supportive of playwriting. At Regionals, there's a = ten-minute play festival, in which eight ten-minute plays are chosen and = receive a staging, all of it cast, rehearsed and performed during the week = of Regionals. There's also a New Play Development workshop, in which = longer one act plays are workshopped with a director, cast and dramaturg. = That's what I did at this year's Festival--I directed a one act play. But the biggest part of ACTF, far and away the most prestigious part of it = is the Irene Ryan Acting competition. (Irene Ryan--the actress who played = Granny on the Beverly Hillbillies--endowed the competition). Actors who = are nominated for Ryans--up to three per show, whether it's participating = or associate--are asked to prepare a five minute piece, which should = consist of a short monologue and a scene, which they perform with a scene = partner. The two pieces combined must be under five minutes in length, = and actors that go overtime are eliminated. The pieces they prepare are = generally not from the play from which they were nominated. They take = these pieces to Regionals and perform. Three judges give them a score. = =20 Everyone competes in the preliminary round. 32 are chosen to compete in a = semi-final round. 16 of those go on to a final round. Then, after those = 16 perform (usually in the largest theatre that can be found, which is = completely packed), 2 go on to Nationals. At Nationals, in the Kennedy = Center, 16 actors again perform (2 from each Region), and 2 actors win. = They get money, an agent, several auditions--it's a very big deal indeed. BYU's designers usually do pretty well in the design competitions. Our = playwrights usually do very poorly in the playwriting competitions. And = our actors absolutely kick everyone's butts at Ryans. This year, 350 actors came from over 80 schools in our Region, which = consists of California, Nevada and Utah. BYU brought 11 actors, which is = fewer than usual for us. (Other schools brought more--I think Stanford = had 20. We killed 'em). After the preliminary round, 6 of our 11 made it = to semi-finals. So we had 6 of the final 32. And then all 6 of our = actors also made to finals. So we had 6 out of 16. =20 That's pretty typical for us. None of our 6 made it to Nationals this = year, and that's not so typical--we've won the whole ball of wax three = times since 1992. That's sort of like a college football team winning the = Heisman trophy three times in 8 years. This year, we had some bad luck. = The strongest actor in our group, Shelley Graham, didn't make semis. Her = scene was a comic scene, quite active, and she lost her shoe. That threw = her off just enough that her monologue didn't go as well as it had been in = rehearsal--she was worried about going overtime after retrieving her shoe, = and she rushed it. Shelley was our best shot at Nationals, I think. Amy = Adams, another terrific actress, ran into a tough preliminary judge. We = could easily have had 8 of 16 finalists. And that would not have been an = atypical performance for us. =20 In any event, our kids did great. I was tremendously proud of them, not = only for competing well--that's not so important--but mostly because they = conducted themselves so wonderfully well during the entire week. But as I = watched them, I found myself wondering just why and specifically how our = kids are different. Why is it that BYU kids do so well in this competition= ? Just how are they different from the other kids at ACTF? Time for an inspirational story. I directed a play at ACTF, and that meant a mega-audition on Tuesday, = where I saw 250 kids do a one minute monologue, followed by a call-back. = We rehearsed on Wednesday and Thursday and performed on Friday. In the = audition, Shelley Graham was far and away the best actress in the room. I = called her back, and she came into the callback audition, and absolutely = nailed the character. My playwright turned to me and said, 'that's it. = That role is cast.' And I told him 'I can't use her.' Because the = character said the F-word, and Shelley won't. We'd even talked about it = earlier in the day, and she'd said to me, 'I won't say it. I'd love to do = this show. But I won't say that word on-stage.' So the playwright stared at me, and he picked up his script and re-read = it. Then he turned to me and said 'I have to have her in my show. She's = the best actress I've seen in my life. I have to have her. I'll cut the = language.' And so Shelley did the part, and was, predictably, superb. (I = think it took some of the sting out of not being in finals). And the = language being cut did not, in any way, damage the show. In fact, it = strengthened it. The character Shelley played was a woman who probably = wouldn't use harsh language anyway. And the playwright said to me = afterwards "I need to be more careful how I use profanity in my writing. = Sometimes it just isn't in character." Now, some of our BYU actors believe, as I do, that it's not immoral to use = strong language on-stage. Others believe that it is immoral for them, and = have made the choice to not use strong language. Shelley is in that = latter camp. But here's the thing: for none of our actors was this an = easy choice. Every one of our actors has agonized over this decision, and = continues to agonize over it. We tell our actors 'if you're good enough, = they'll cut the language for you.' Shelley's story proves that that is = true. But there's the biggest difference between BYU students and the = other kids at ACTF. Our kids agonize over the moral implications of the = shows they perform in. I don't mean to suggest that the other actors = don't consider such issues, but I do think they weigh them differently. I think that carefully weighing the moral implications of one's actions = and words is part of maturity. And this language issue, which ordinarily = I don't think of as particularly important, became very important to me = this past week; it came to carry broader implications. BYU kids feel = older. I talked to a colleague at another university who was amazed at = how, once again, BYU dominated Ryans. She said 'your kids seem so much = older than the other kids here. And that surprises me, because they come = from such sheltered backgrounds.' =20 Well, our kids did feel older. In the play I directed, one of the other = characters was played by a girl from Cal Fullerton, Tiffanie. Tiffanie, = it turned out, was about four months younger than Shelley Graham, and they = got to be pretty good friends. But Shelley is married, which utterly = baffled Tiffanie. ('You're married? Really? Why?'). And marriage = matures people. And I'd listen to Shelley and Tiffanie talk, and it was = like the conversation between a twenty five year old and an eighteen year = old. Most of our kids have served missions, and missions mature people in = amazing ways. I doubt any other kid at ACTF has dealt with rejection to = anywhere near the degree that any missionary experiences it weekly.=20 Besides, when I look at our students, I don't see kids from sheltered = environments. One of our actresses, Eve, is from a home where her father = and brother are alcoholics, and her mother has been divorced three times. = And Eve is an RM. Another of our kids is divorced. Mormon does not equal = sheltered. Anyway, our kids seemed more mature overall. They were wonderfully = supportive of each other's work. They dealt with disappointment with = tremendous grace and poise. They went to workshops and took good notes. = They supported good work done by kids from the other schools. They bore = their testimonies when it was appropriate and yet weren't pushy about = things either. Man, they were fabulous. Paradoxically, however, the language issue, which helps us as actors, = hurts us in ACTF playwriting competitions. I saw 12 student written original scripts. They ranged from pretty = interesting to goshawful, as one might expect. But they all of them used = the F-word pretty frequently, and they all dealt with sexual subject = matter. None of the plays I saw would play in Provo, of course, but I = think it's a very open question whether they'd play in Fresno either. Our = students have to consider audience pretty carefully. At other schools, = though, this isn't so much a consideration. They're doing plays for the = black box theatre at their school, for an audience of fellow students, who = think it's pretty cool to hear the F-word repeatedly. And for all the = supposed sophistication of such work, it doesn't come across as sophisticat= ed. It comes across as juvenile. =20 But our kids can't be irresponsible. Our kids have to consider audience = sensibilities. Their fellow students won't think a play with the F word = is cute, and won't find a play about coming out of the closet amusing. = And so our kids do work that's challenging and interesting, I think, but = also . . . well, work that would play in Fresno. =20 I think this is why we don't do well in the playwriting competition. Our = students don't write the 'voyage of sexual self-discovery' play that the = judges seem to favor so completely. One of the student plays we submitted,= for example, was about patients in an old folks home, dealing with = Alzheimers. It was superb. But the judges didn't pick it, which sort of = baffles me. Except that the plays they did pick were all cut from the = same cloth. I think our work may seem tame next to some of the work with = which it's competing. But I think that's an illusion. =20 Right now, American theatre is at a moment of crisis, I believe. I think = the reason is that we're no longer connecting to a mainstream audience. = Theatre, to most of our audience, means one of two things: either the big = Les Mis/Phantom/Joseph type musical, a big event, which you pay a hundred = dollars to see and which you expect to be amazing, like seeing the Rolling = Stones. Or something weird/gay/f-word offensive. But when I look at the = golden age of Broadway, I see shows like South Pacific, which said to the = audience "when your son gets back from the war, he may have met an Asian = bride. How are you going to deal with that?" Or Death of a Salesman, or = All My Sons, or The Glass Menagerie. Shows, in other words, that = connected in an immediate and important way with a mainstream audience. That's actually where our kids are already. And in years to come, we're = going to see some amazing work from them. Those are the lessons I = learned, anyway, from my week watching BYU kick butt at ACTF. Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] HOWE, _Burdens of Earth_ (Performance) Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:06:13 +0900 Again I lament my non-Utahness, with another interesting Mormon play hitting the boards in Provo this week. It is Susan Howe's _Burdens of Earth_, about Joseph Smith and his friends in Liberty Jail. It is one of my favorite plays that I have read in Sunstone, and I would love to see it, so I hope a lot of you Utah folks will go see it and tell the rest of us about it. I am including a blurb on the play which appeared in the Deseret News. The blurb is wrong, however, in saying it is a "new drama". It premiered on May 28, 1987 at the BYU Pardoe Theatre, and was published in the November 1987 Sunstone Magazine. BURDENS OF EARTH, a new drama by Susan Howe, is described as "a compelling look into the lives and trials of Joseph Smith, Hyrum Smith, Caleb Baldwin, Lyman Wight and Alexandere McRae during their struggles in Liberty Jail." It will be staged at 7:30 p.m., Tuesdays-Saturdays, Feb. 7-24 in the Margetts Theatre of Brigham Young University's Harris Fine Arts Center. Howe, a member of BYU's English faculty, was inspired by the account of Joseph Smith's experience at Liberty Jail during the winter of 1839. Her play reveals, in flashbacks, critical incidents in early LDS history that led to the prophet's agonizing crucible. George Nelson is directing a cast that includes Joseph S. Hale as Joseph Smith, Jacob Anderson as Hyrum Smith and Phineas Hobart, Jacob Draper as Caleb Baldwin and Hanson Jacobs, Doug Stewart as Alexander McRae and Oliver Cowdery, and Andrew Allman as Lyman Wight and Major Sam Burris. "Burdens of Earth" replaces Tim Slover's "Hancock County," which was originally announced in BYU's season brochure. Slover's play will be produced by BYU in an upcoming season. Tickets are $10 per person ($2 discount for BYU students, faculty or staff). For reservations, call the box office at 378-4322. (end blurb) Here is a bibliography and some information on Howe. She is primarily a poet, and her poems have appeared countless times in Sunstone and Dialogue. She is in the English department at BYU, and got a degree in creative writing at the University of Denver. She has also written a few essays, short stories, and plays. She is a former editor of Exponent II, and I think she was poetry editor at Sunstone at some point. There is another, more famous poet named Susan Howe who teaches at SUNY, I think. Poetry: 1989 AML Poetry award. _Stone Spirits_, BYU Press, 1997. Prose fiction: "Getting to Disneyland", Sunstone, Aug. 1990. Plays: _Burdens of Earth_, BYU 1987, Sunstone, Nov. 1987. _Voices of the Sisters_, BYU Women's conference, 1991. _A Dream for Katie_, BYU Women's conference, 1992. She also has written a few essays for Sunstone. One that AML-listers may remember in the mid-90s, called "On the Violent Literati", or something like that, which was critical of the work of Evenson, LaBute, and Veloz. Andrew Hall _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Darvell Hunt" Subject: [AML] Re: Small Yahoo! Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:23:50 -0600 If things work out like I hope, I will be writing an article or two per week. I'm going to be the official correspondent for Saratoga Springs. This week I'm working on covering the new Saratoga Springs town hall and the town's new vehicle that was just acquired for the volunteer fire department. I hope to keep busy with this new part-time writing job. ;) Unfortunately, you probably won't see my articles unless you live in the Lehi, Saratoga Springs, Eagle Mountain, or Cove Fort areas. (Unless, of course, you read the online version of the NewUtah.) My first article was about 750 words, or 28 inches or so, so I think I've made a good start. ;) Darvell Marilyn Brown (wwbrown@burgoyne.com) wrote: >Congratulations, Darvell! Wonderful! Will you be writing much for the >NewUTAH bunch? Marilyn Brown _____________________________________________ Free email with personality! Over 200 domains! http://www.MyOwnEmail.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:32:59 -0500 At 02:33 AM 2/7/2001 -0700, you wrote: > >Bigelornery: I like this book because it criticizes the church--but >still says it's true. > >Parkinstraneous: this book sucks, it's not science fiction. > >Bronsonalpha: the planet that destroys the earth in _When Worlds >Collide_. > >Samuelsensory: theater critics suck. > >Brownian: involuntary motion of microscopic creatures from the >bombardment of molecules, of course. (What did you think it was going to >mean?) > >Bennion: an inflamed swelling on the big toe. > >Harlowicient: I think I'd like this, if I could understand what he's >saying. > >Dmichaerious: this is the best book ever written. > >-- >D. Michael Martindale >dmichael@wwno.com I love it!!!(Note the spray of exclamation points). Now I'm bitter because I didn't say something pithy in the thrust of the thread..... I, I, I'm so left out. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms (was: SODERBERGH, _Traffic_) Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:13:39 -0700 Well, THAT was fast! And I'm saving it with my dictionariouses! Wow! Trust Michael! Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rachel Ann Nunes" Subject: [AML] NUNES, _This Time Forever_ Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:21:41 -0800 Hello all, It's high time I announce the release of my new book, _This Time Forever._ Seems off to a good start. (It's #1 at the Deseret Book top ten right now http://deseretbook.com/bestsellers/fiction.html ) Yay! I have a sample chapter (not sure if it's the final edited version or not) on my website and a summary if you're interested in reading about the novel. Have a good one, Rachel _______________________ Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) Best-selling author of the Ariana series Web page: http://www.ranunes.com E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms (was: SODERBERGH, _Traffic_) Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:21:25 -0700 D Michael got the definition wrong for Samuelsensory. It's not "Theatre = critics suck." It's "Theatre critics suck unless they like me." Otherwise, what a fun post. I laughed, I cried . . . Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Editing Changes Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:31:09 -0700 .Valerie Wrote: As an editor of fiction, I try to tap into the same muse that inspires the author in the first place, as presumptuous as that sounds. And I'm going to take some time to try to put a name to the editor's muse, because we do have one. I know Valerie wrote a long post, but may I please endorse Valerie, who definitely does have a muse. She's a fantastic editor. And I am SO grateful to her. My first great editor was Lavina Anderson before she got too busy. And I have been lucky to also have Darla Isaacson. Loved them all. And now I'm trying to be an editor. I get great joy from it because I can see the effect my creative "muse" has on needy manuscripts. It is a lark! (It also takes away from my writing, but I'm LEARNING, too.) I was edited by one of the best editors in the business, Sara Blackburn, from New York, who charged $10 a page, and yes, she was FANTASTIC! And I have discovered each editor has a particular style, and Valerie, with her dedicated approach (and Mormon background) is every bit as good as that New York editor--for me. Muses? A good editor definitely has one. But Jonathan, I've so much enjoyed your posts about editors, that I want you to know I've copied every single thing you've written. And thanks for doing it. (Now I'm sure you could edit this post if you were inclined!) Thanks for all you do for us on the list! What a contribution you are making! Sincerely, Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Historical Fiction (BYU Universe) Date: 07 Feb 2001 09:56:34 -0700 >Somewhere between those two poles is reality: I recognize that >historical fiction will always have its rubbery history, so I make a >game out of it, going to the historical record to see what really >happened. But the closer to known historical facts the author's story >is, the more impressed and pleased I am. I like the way Patrick O'Brian handles this issue in his Aubrey/Maturin books about naval officers during the Napoleonic Wars. In the preface to a book, he writes something along the lines of "In reality, the Victory did not reach this part of the world until two months later. But I have altered the date in the interests of my story." In this way, the reader has both the historically accurate facts and a rousing tale. barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 07 Feb 2001 11:44:34 -0700 (MST) > Marilyn Brown wrote: > > > We all know how the eskimos have thirty words for different > > kinds of snow. Actually - we don't know all that - that theory has been disproven. Eskimos have no more words for snow then we do (snow, powder, hardpack, slush, etc.) It's the same with the idea the Hopi Indians have nor word or concept of time. That is another false idea presented by a lingusit who had only limited knowledge of Hopi. More reputable linguists have since becaome fluent and have declared that the Hopis do have a concept of and several words to express time. --Ivan Wolfe [MOD: Ivan, or anyone else: Do you have some references on this? I'd appreciate a good set of locations to look this up.] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms (was: SODERBERGH, _Traffic_) Date: 07 Feb 2001 12:13:28 -0800 (PST) How about: Needleific: This book is out of print, only available through a chance encounter at DI, and could be better written and/or edited, but it is still interesting and even somewhat entertaining. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 07 Feb 2001 14:37:44 -0700 "I think the most ingenious handling of a frame story I've come across is William Goldman's _Princess Bride_, where the real story is a fictitious book that a grandfather reads to his sick grandson (the frame story), with comments by the reader and hearer along the way." I know this is being picky, but since it's a book I love . . . that's the frame story in the movie. The frame story in the book is an adult man supposedly abridging the fictitious book that his _father_ (not grandfather) read to him many times when the "abridger" was a child. The comments along the way are solely those of the grown-up child, although he often comments on what his reactions were as a child. Interestingly, though, the main story has a few hefty flashbacks (chapter length) when some of the characters are introduced, like Inigo and Fezzik. When the Man in Black reaches the top of the Cliffs of Insanity, for example, the action stops and we get a detailed flashback of Inigo's past: his father's sword making, getting the job for the six-fingered man's sword, the scene where Inigo gets his scars, his twenty years (or so--don't recall) of sword practice, etc. etc. before we actually return to the main story and see the sword fight. Normally this wouldn't work, and I wouldn't attempt such a thing in my own writing. But then, this book is very unusual in many respects, and somehow Goldman pulls it off. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 07 Feb 2001 10:18:54 -0700 D. Michael asked: >What is the success paradigm for theatre in the 21st century? Terrific question in a terrific post. First, let me say that theatre is = not dead. Provo Theatre Company has not yet found its audience, and could = possibly die soon. Negative newspaper reviews will have killed it, = because it was at a point in its existence where it was particularly = vulnerable. Lots of small theatre companies fail every year. Many others = succeed, and in fact, theatre as an art form is actually quite healthy = nationally. There are several successful models for theatres in this country. The = first model is the Broadway model. A Broadway producer does shows that he = thinks will be commercially viable. Ticket prices are high enough that = the show may become profitable, if the run happens to be long enough. If = you bring in a large cast/expensive set and costume show like Les Mis, = then you have to hope for a very long run, with packed houses buying = expensive tickets, and also tours and CD sales and tee shirts and all the = ancillary income a mega-hit brings in. A city like Salt Lake will get to = see all the big Broadway hits, because the national tours play in road = houses--theaters specifically dedicated to bringing in shows from the = outside. =20 Another model is the community theatre model, where the expectation is = that the actors won't be paid for their work. That's what the Hale Center = has done, and they've been very successful. They know their audience, and = they know what sorts of shows they can stage, and they also can keep costs = down. And they're very successful. =20 A place like PTC was trying for something other than the community theatre = model. They were trying to do more challenging plays, plays that their = target audience would find interesting, but also not offensive. They paid = their actors, which meant they mostly got better actors than a community = theatre would be able to attract. Ticket prices were higher than Hale = Center, but lower than a touring production would charge--I believe that = PTC tickets were in the 10-12 dollar range. They did superb shows, but = hadn't yet developed an audience sufficient to keep them afloat. My preferred model, however, is the Regional Theatre model. First of all, = in a Regional Theatre, a core company of actors is hired on a season by = season basis, which creates a sense of ensemble and communication in the = cast. Second of all, a Regional can do shows in repertory, which gives = them the flexibility to survive a couple of less-successful shows, and = milk a hit. It also keeps the actors fresh--long running shows can get = very very tired. Finally, a Regional Theatre can develop strong ties to a = community, can respond to a communities needs and values, while still = doing shows with a level of professionalism that a community theatre can't = match.=20 The problem is, a Regional theatre needs to be subsidized. Indiana = Repertory Theatre, for example, uses a 33-33-33 model. They expect to = recoup a third of their expenses from ticket sales, a third from their = endowment and a third from their annual fundraising activities. That's = the only way for them to keep ticket prices reasonable (12-18 dollars). = =20 The best theatre being done in the world today is done in London, much of = it by the RSC (Royal Shakespeare Company) and NT (National Theatre). Both = those remarkable companies receive a subsidy from the government, without = which neither could survive. And both have very reasonable ticket prices, = which means that they can create an audience of people with limited means. = =20 Right now, Utah has Pioneer Theatre Company in Salt Lake and the Utah = Shakespearean Festival in Cedar City. Pioneer, I detest. I think that = it's a theatre company for people who wish they didn't live in Utah. They = waste a lot of money jobbing in actors from New York, and they do distant, = uninvolving theatre. Some people like them--I don't. USF is wonderful. = Fred Adams does have a sense of the community, and even though the quality = of shows they do is pretty uneven, there's a wonderful atmosphere down = there. SLAC--Salt Lake Acting Company--is a small professional company. = They regularly do the best theatre in the state, but have a reputation for = being anti-Mormon, largely because of their annual show Saturday's Voyeur, = which I think is often pretty funny, but which does make fun of Mormons. = Beyond that, there are lots of other small theatres, each with their own = specialities.=20 What Utah needs is a good repertory company on the Regional model. = Theologically, I believe that the reason God permits rich people is so = they can give money to artists--they have no other legitimate function = that I can see. With all due respect to Tuacahn, I think Doug made one = huge mistake. Given 40 million dollars to play with, he spent 38 million = of it building a really nice theatre complex. (It is gorgeous). He = should have spent 2 million building a theatre, and 38 million on an = endowment to cover production costs. That's the best model for a good = theatre company nowadays. Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paynecabin@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 07 Feb 2001 17:07:43 EST Just a few years ago I had two sons at Weber State University, both involved in an interesting parody called "Pirated Penzance," one as a designer, the other as the lead actor. That piece went all the way to the Kennedy Center as part of the ACTF, along with a piece called, I think, "Prisoner" from BYU, and a piece from the University of Utah, meaning that three of the six shows from I-don't-know-how-many across the USA were from Utah. And I think one of the BYU actors that year took the Irene Ryan. I can't remember whether I've told this story here before, but it seems relevant to Eric's observations about the BYU actors. A couple of summers ago, I sat under a late spring sky in the huge theatre at Tuacahn. It was one of the final rehearsals for the last-gasp re-make of the extravaganza UTAH! (Exclamation point is part of the title.) Tim Slover was the playwright, having kept nothing but the title and the obligatory flood. I was the lyricist, having kept nothing but the tunes, which had cost the orig inal producers a lot of money. I sat that night next to Kathy Biesinger, the director. She'd gone to the metropolitan centers (yes, some large cities in addition to New York--no offense to the large apple, to which she also of course went) to cast the show, wanting professional seasoned actors from "non-sheltered" environments. What she shared with me under that desert sky was her regret at having done so. Her cast, well-trained and impassioned, just didn't get the story they were asked to tell. They thought they got it, but they didn't. They had most of them apparently chosen to avoid the kind of commitment to people and ideas that brings about maturity. (By "people and ideas" you may read "family and gospel.") Those cast for looks and charisma most widely missed the mark. The lady who'd been confined to broad comedy roles for most of her career, and was now given something serious, came closer. The single Latter-day Saint among the principle players, Ben Hopkin, nailed it. Last Fall, I was asked to speak to the new ensemble of BYU's Young Ambassadors at a get-the-Spirit retreat in the mountains. What they wanted was "How do I do a life of stage performance and keep my standards?" or something. It might have been as appropriately titled, "How do I succeed in spite of being good?" I skirted the issue entirely by suggesting, you may think crassly, that in fact their spirituality and adherence to principle were their competitive edge. In an audition room full of folks who dance really well, sing really well, and look really nice, the role will go the player who show the most presence, understanding, empathy, and vitality. If these are not fruits of the Spirit, and results of the struggles of the faithful, then I'm going back to Sunday School. Marvin Payne - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 07 Feb 2001 16:12:31 -0700 On Wed, 07 Feb 2001 01:53:15 -0700 "D. Michael Martindale" writes: > Is theater doomed to be a minor cultural phenomenon that > must be subsidized by philanthropists or the government? > What is the success paradigm for theater in the 21st > century? Well, I'm certainly no expert on this stuff, but it seems to me that each arts oriented medium has had to evolve in order to survive whenever a new arts oriented medium was born. Playgoers go to plays to get something that they can't get from TV, radio, or film. Many people just don't realize that there is something different about going to a live show that can be very exciting and rewarding. I think, in order to survive Theatre is going to have to become more theatrical, and Theatre companies are going to have to find a niche, or a voice, or a flavor if you will. I think Eric S. gives too much power to the critics when he says: I'm now convinced, however, that the single biggest need we have, as we work towards the day that a [Mormon Shakespeare] will arise, is for a critical community that can and will support that theatrical community. Speaking of theatre in Utah Valley, since it's what I'm most familiar with, the Hale Center Theater thrives without even providing consistently high quality theatre. Likewise with SCERA. Little London Dinner Theater is beginning to make waves. The Villa continues to plug along. ARTE does okay up at the Castle every Summer and the Provo Theater Company isn't quite as bad off as Eric indicated yesterday. Hale and SCERA, Little London and the Villa all offer pretty much the same fare; they give the audience what they want, which is light comedies and musicals. Hale and SCERA (which have been around the longest) are only blocks from each other and succeed because they offer the right kind of shows for their two very disparate stages. SCERA is big and outdoors. Hale is small and inside. Rather than compete, they compliment each other. They'll be around for a long time if they stay smart. The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub where these other two theaters are and probably gets the same audience as long as they aren't doing the same shows. Unless it can find something else to set it apart from the others, the competition may be too much. Hale and SCERA have developed a trust with their audience that may preclude others from being able to thrive. Little London is north of Hale and SCERA and offers a pretty nice meal to boost its appeal. As long as the shows are adequate, the almost fancy meal setting may be enough to keep it going. ARTE does Shakespeare and other classically oriented shows in a rather rustically romantic setting with a quality that is usually a step above the rest. If they can organize themselves and be wise with their money they will probably be around for awhile simply because the only other Shakespeare festival is at that Tony Award winning theatre way down south. Some folks just can't go that far for Shakespeare ... and who can top Utah Lake and a mountain range for a backdrop? Provo Theatre Company has been around for just a handful of seasons and is struggling precisely because it doesn't yet have a full voice yet. It hasn't found its niche -- it's flavor. When it first started it had a flavor that most of the people around here didn't like. And many of us who did like that flavor just couldn't afford to go. If they don't find a niche real soon, they may very well go by the wayside, which, as Eric said yesterday, would be heartbreaking. Colleges can get away with the eclectic schedules they produce because , well, they're supposed to do that kind of stuff to give their students as balanced an education as possible, and they are subsidized. Whether private, or state, somebody is subsidizing it. So, I left them off the list, and a fair amount of their audiences are required to see the shows, so they do get some revenue there. Audiences are sort of fluid, so don't get the idea that this valley will only sustain light comedies and musicals. There are all kinds of audiences here and some people belong to more than one audience. I, for instance, like light comedies, and musicals, and drama, and Shakespeare, and other classics and contemporary stuff and absurdist and ... whatever. As long as it is well done. Done well, I mean. I have seen, or been in, or directed shows at all of the theatres listed above, and I will continue to do so, I hope. But most people are not like me. They like comfort. If they try out a place once and it suits them, they'll go back. They develop loyalties for a myriad of reasons, and those loyalties can shift and change. But it happens v-e-r-y slowly. The Hales started out doing simple little Mormon comedies written by Ruth Hale herself. They did this for years. And they got a loyal audience. Then they started doing plays from outside the Mormon community that mirrored the sensibilities of Ruth's scripts. And that's pretty much where they have been for about a decade. Maybe they will branch out a little more. If they do, my guess is most of their audience will follow. Their audience trusts them. Theatre is not dead. As long as it offers what the movies can't, it will survive. And theatre companies will to as long as they don't abuse the trust that their audiences give them ... if they can find an audience. J. Scott Bronson--The Scotted Line "World peace begins in my home" "Anybody who sees live theatre should come out a little rearranged." Glenn Close - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jacob Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 07 Feb 2001 16:24:00 -0700 On Wed, 07 Feb 2001 01:53:15 -0700, D. Michael Martindale wrote: >But in spite of Egon's and everyone else's predictions that print is >dead, print is not dead. Same with other pronouncements of death on >movies and radio when television was invented. And so far, predictions >that e-books will supercede the printed word do not appear to be panning >out. Does theater fit into this equation somewhere? Is there some new >paradigm for theater that will make it economically viable? > >I question that. Print, radio, television, and film are all mass-market >media. Theater is a one-to-one proposition, as far as orders of >magnitude go. One set of performers to one audience on one night. You >can't mass produce theater to amortize your up-front costs to a >miniscule amount per unit. You have to recreate the "master recording" >with every performance. I think I'm right when I say that nearly every >orchestra in existence these days is subsidized--they can't exist on >their own revenue, for all the same reasons. Is theater doomed to be a >minor cultural phenomenon that must be subsidized by philanthropists or >the government? What is the success paradigm for theater in the 21st >century? I think this is a very important question. Theater cannot develop the economies of scale enjoyed by any other entertainment media. There just aren't enough sunk costs once a play is ready for distribution. As a result, theater will *always* be more expensive and less convenient for audiences than competing entertainment options. As a result, there is = much less room for innovation, change and improvement. Should I risk $7 on = the latest movie, or $15 on a community theater? If I hate the movie, I'm = only out $7. If I hate the play, well, I'm a lot worse off. So, like Eric = says, *any* hint of problems in the production will prevent me from going to = the theater. Unfortunately, to succeed I think that theater needs to draw more from = its strengths. I think Eric Samuelsen's plays have been instructive to me lately in the power of their production. "Love Affair with Electrons" = was not only a delight, but it also did a fantastic job of leveraging the strengths that theater has over *any* reproducible media. Eric does = things with the stage that couldn't be done via video. The reason this is unfortunate is because these are the most risky things to play with--and doing so can have the potential side effect of destroying the market entirely if done poorly. Less room for innovation, change and = improvement combined with a critical need for more innovation, change and improvement= is just a bad combination to try to fight. Jacob Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: RE: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 07 Feb 2001 17:49:09 -0700 >I haven't seen Snow Falling On Cedars but I've read it. In your opinion is >that an appropriate use of flashback or is it something you feel could have >been done better a different way? Did the movie use the flashbacks like >the >book did? I didn't read the book, but saw the movie and hated it. Beautifully shot but completely, mind-shatteringly boring. The flashbacks were meant to inform the frame story but how it came across was the actors sitting around "pondering" and no real action. If you were to outline the movie you might think there would be action, but the ponderous flashbacks and the long shots of what's-his-face sitting around looking longingly make the film a very long evening indeed. Perhaps if they would have just told the flashback story or just told the frame story then, through the process of rewrites, they might have come up with a compelling film. Instead they used "cut to flashback" to try to make up for lack of action in the script. I wanted to like this movie but I couldn't stand it. Marianne Hales Harding (who watches bad movies all the way through in an attempt to understand "Why? Why????") _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] Cornerstone Award Date: 07 Feb 2001 15:35:55 -0700 ----- Original Message ----- > At 01:56 PM 2/6/01, you wrote: > My first novel, _Prodigal Journey,_ also won Cornerstone's Fiction Book of > the Year for 2000, which I thought was cool. Thanks! (I forgot to ask, > Richard, did that award include Horizon's books as well, or just > Cornerstone, since Horizon was acquired so late in the year?) Cornerstone's Fiction Book of the Year for 2000 included sales of all the Horizon books from August (which actually was the greater bulk of the sales for the year). Congratulations to Linda, who's book was selected for this award purely on sales, which means this award is actually given by the people who buy and read the books. Not only was it the highest in sales of fiction books for the year, it was a close second among all the books sold in the year. (Horizon has a book that just sells and sells all the time -- _Endowed From On High_. It also won an award for the year.) Richard Hopkins - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:05:17 -0700 >Actually - we don't know all that - that theory has been disproven. >Eskimos have no more words for snow then we do (snow, powder, hardpack, slush, >etc.) > >It's the same with the idea the Hopi Indians have nor word or concept of time. >That is another false idea presented by a lingusit who had only limited >knowledge of Hopi. More reputable linguists have since becaome >fluent and have >declared that the Hopis do have a concept of and several words to >express time. [MOD: Thanks for the reference. Interesting.] A reference, you ask? Coincidentally, Cecil Adams wrote a column on this very subject just last week. It's at http://www.straightdope.com/columns/010202.html . Eric D. Snider -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 07 Feb 2001 23:58:32 -0800 On Wed, 07 Feb 2001 02:33:58 -0700 "D. Michael Martindale" writes, in his delightful glossary: > Harlowicient: I think I'd like this, if I could understand what he's > saying. Wish I could figure out what the guy was saying myself. Reminds me a lot of that scene where Mercutio and Benvolio have been teasing Juliet's Nurse, and she asks Romeo, "I pray you, sir, what saucy merchant was this that was so full of his ropery?" Romeo answers, "A gentleman, nurse, that loves to hear himself talk, and will speak more in a minute than he will stand to in a month" (II:iv:152-157) Harlow S. Clark The most heterogeneous of ideas are yoked by violence together; nature and art are ransacked for illustrations, comparisons and allusions; [his] learning instructs and [his] subtilty surprises; but the reader commonly thinks his improvement dearly bought, and though he sometimes admires is seldom pleased. =97Samuel Johnson, "Cowley" ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:32:45 -0700 Eric Samuelsen: >Provo Theatre Company has not yet found its audience, and could >possibly die soon. Negative newspaper reviews will have killed it, >because it was at a point in its existence where it was particularly >vulnerable. Me: I wasn't going to bother refuting this, because Tim Threlfall (PTC artistic director) told me he would. But since it got said again, and Tim hasn't had a chance to respond to it, I will refute it now. When I mentioned Eric Samuelsen's first post declaring PTC's near-death status, Tim said, "No. We'll finish out the season, and there will be a next season." Even if PTC were selling out every performance, it's such a small venue with such high overhead that it would never be terribly profitable. He said the theater has recently received a large donation from someone who wishes to remain anonymous, which will help -- but my impression was that even without that, the theater would stick around. In other words, the rumors of PTC's death have been greatly exaggerated. Eric Samuelsen: Negative newspaper reviews will have killed it, because it was at a point in its existence where it was particularly vulnerable. Me: This strikes a little closer to home, since I'm the main one Eric was referring to. He said, I believe, that even a B or B+ grade (I gave PTC's "Big KSL Holiday Broadcast" a B) is devastating to a theater production because of people's unwillingness to take even a small risk when it comes to live theater. I know Eric is opposed to letter grades of any kind for theater productions (maybe for movies, too, I don't know) because it reduces the whole experience down to one letter. I don't know if using no grading scale at all would help matters or not. The issue, though, is what a critic's role is. We've discussed this before ("we" as in this list, and also "we" as in Eric and I). I whole-heartedly agree that a theater critic should be someone who loves and supports theater and supports it, and I do. I love theater, and I love Utah theater. Around The Daily Herald, I have a reputation for focusing too much on theater in our Friday entertainment section, and I plead guilty to that on occasion. This Friday's centerpiece story is about the fact that on the same night, two regional premieres are happening in Utah County -- "Over the River and Through the Woods" at Hale Center, and "The Texas Chainsaw Manicurist" at Provo Theatre Company. This article is unnecessary; we could have just run the press releases for each show, like we would any show. But I saw the coincidence, I was excited that shows new to Utah audiences were being done instead of "The Foreigner" for the 10,000th time, and I wanted to give an official kudos to the theaters for doing it. So it will be on the front of the section, with color photos and a big headline. I love local theater. I applaud the successes and mourn the failures. As a critic, though, I also have to report the failures. While a critic should support the arts, that does not mean he should look the other way when something is wrong. Who is that going to help? If critics (and audiences, via their checkbooks) don't make it known when a show has made a misstep, then how will anything ever improve? I was fair with PTC's show: I said what was wrong and what was right, and didn't give any more weight or newspaper space to the wrong than it deserved. Since the show was mostly very good, the review was mostly very positive. To suggest that "mostly very positive" is not enough is preposterous. Like I said, I love theater. But sometimes tough love is what's required. On the other hand, if negative reviews are to blame when a theater goes under, does that mean we critics get all the glory when we give glowing reviews and a theater is successful? Do we get a piece of the money? I gave PTC's "Oleanna" a very glowing review (an A), yet it still is, I believe, the least successful show they've ever done in terms of attendance. Maybe the only kind of impact critics can have is a negative one, i.e., negative reviews ruin a show, but positive reviews have no effect either way.... Eric D. Snider -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:49:57 -0700 A fabulous piece, Eric, which teaches me the lesson that living the Gospel really does make you a better person, really does bless you, and really does help you achieve excellence, if you're willing to pay the price to earn it. In other words, we don't have to take no guff from nobody, just because we have religious standards. Maybe that recipe won't help you win as many playwrite awards, thanks to the current bias in mainstream theater, but as you say, it will help you connect with real audiences better. And that's the important thing in theater, is it not? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:56:08 -0700 Rose Green wrote: > > One use of flashbacks that I can think of that seems to work is in Anne > Perry's Monk series. Her main character is a police officer who lost his > memory in an accident shortly before the first book begins. As the series > goes on, he remembers bits and pieces of who he was before the accident > (usually not very positive things about himself, actually). Even though this device is used fairly often, I've always considered it a fascinating kind of story to tell. As long as the character and/or mystery draws you in, you can't help but be hooked. I first came to this realization when watching Disney's _Escape to Witch Mountain_ (the original) for the first time. It's the story of two kids who have lost their memory of where they came from, and have unexplained psychic powers. Now _Escape_ is no great filmmaking. But still I was drawn in wondering what the heck was going on. What the heck _was_ going on turned out to be pretty cheesy, a reminder that you also need to be sure to make your payoff satisfying. But the mystery still drew me in. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 08 Feb 2001 01:04:40 -0700 Richard Johnson wrote: > Now I'm bitter because I didn't say something pithy in > the thrust of the thread..... I, I, I'm so > left out. Johnsonorous: feeling bitter for being left out of a list of satirical wordplays on people's names. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Dixon" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 08 Feb 2001 10:19:15 -0500 Jonathan wrote: >[MOD: Ivan, or anyone else: Do you have some references on this? I'd >appreciate a good set of locations to look this up.] As for how many words Eskimos have for snow, it's a little more complicated than either Ivan or Marilyn indicated. Various figures have been "definitively" tossed around for years as to how many words Eskimos have for snow: nine, thirty, a hundred, etc. The point of this is usually to indicate that language reflects experience and value -- in this case, that when a substance like snow is such an integral part of your life, you'll develop a language that captures it much more subtly than other languages. That may be true to an extent, but eskimos don't have a set number of words for snow. From "The Straight Dope": http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_297.html [...] The problem with trying to pin down exactly how many Eskimo words there for snow and/or ice--or for anything, for that matter-- is that Eskimo is what is called a "polysynthetic" language, which means you sort of make up words as you go along, by connecting various particles to your basic root word. For example, we may add the suffix -tluk, bad, to kaniktshaq, snow, and come up with kaniktshartluk, bad snow. By means of this system we may manufacture words that would fracture the jaw of an elk. To illustrate I offer the word takusariartorumagaluarnerpa, a chewy mouthful signifying: "Do you think he really intends to go look after it?" It takes nerve to flog your way through a word of this magnitude. [...] So, Eskimos can have as many words for snow as might occur to them, by constructing new words on the fly. But the Eskimo lingual *roots* for snow are limited. There's a more recent follow-up to that "Straight Dope" column here: http://www.straightdope.com/columns/010202.html As for the Hopi concept of time, you probably want _Hopi Time: A Linguistic Analysis of the Temporal Concepts in the Hopi Language_, by Ekkehart Malotki. Every online bookstore I checked has it listed as a special order, but you can probably find it at a college library. Eric D. Dixon "Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters . . . but they mean to be masters." -- Daniel Webster - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] YOUNG & GRAY, _One More River to Cross_ (Review) Date: 08 Feb 2001 03:47:43 -0700 ONE MORE RIVER TO CROSS by Margaret Blair Young and Darius Aidan Gray Book one of the trilogy "Standing on the Promises" Bookcraft, 2000 Hardcover, 331 pages, $19.95 "The Color Purple" for Mormons It doesn't matter whether the writing in this book is superb, above average, acceptable, tolerable, or even difficult. This is a book that had to be written. As the rest of the country tries to make up for the utter lack of information about black influences in American history, it's gratifying to know that a pair of LDS members are working to accomplish the same laudable goal in church history. Accomplish it they do. The book follows the lives of two black families as they find the Gospel, convert, and join with the Saints in Nauvoo, as well as the different choices they make when Joseph Smith is martyred and the church follows Brigham Young out west. The reader is amazed to discover how intimately associated with Joseph Smith these two families were. The amazement comes because, until now, no one has seemed to ever talk about it. Why haven't we known that Elijah Able was the undertaker in Nauvoo at Joseph's request and was part of many personal and tender moments as various members of the Smith family died, from Joseph Sr. to all too many of Emma's children? Why didn't we have a clue all those years we received church history lessons in Sunday school, priesthood meeting, seminary, institute, and BYU religion classes that Joseph and Emma had a live-in black woman named Jane Manning, who was proud to be known as the houseservant of the Prophet? Where are these black faces in the numerous films we've seen of the Nauvoo era, when the people behind those faces associated often with the most important characters in the films? Why did no one tell us about them? I grew up assuming there were no blacks to speak of, because I never heard about them, and, I suppose, because I figured no blacks would want to be around with that policy on the priesthood. But they _were_ around. They were around and converted and loved the church and the prophet who founded it. They recognized the charity of Christ in the society of Saints at Nauvoo, and felt more welcome there than anywhere else, in spite of the inevitable racist attitudes of some members of that society. Which attitudes make one cringe when reading of them. Long before Jane and her family, or solitary Elijah, come across the society of Saints, we have grown to love and care about them deeply. We have followed them through their travails, as Elijah's mother flees slavery with her children through the underground railroad; as Jane is raped and impregnated by her white preacher; as Elijah buries his mother in a heartbreaking scene; as houseservant Jane endures the "help" she receives from her Protestant mistress to be a good Christian, help sullied with condescension and bigotry. We rejoice with them as they find the Gospel and convert; as Elijah goes on a mission as a seventy, proud to be a holder of God's priesthood and to be called by a prophet of God to preach the Gospel; as Jane leads her family on a harrowing trek across hundreds of miles to reach Nauvoo. And when the first hints of the policy on blacks and the priesthood appear, we watch with dismay, knowing the pain and heartache that will be coming in the years ahead. A quarter century after the end of the difficult doctrine, we ache as we witness its early beginnings. We don't want these people to have to endure it. The issue never comes to a head in this book, and is mentioned directly only once in the notes at the end of a chapter, in a way that promises greater coverage in books to come. But the hints are already there, as prominent leaders of the church--leaders we are used to seeing in a positive light--inform Elijah that he is only to preach to other blacks; as both Elijah and Jane come to notice that the exciting new ordinances being performed in the Nauvoo temple are somehow not being offered to them. All through the book, we receive the mind-jarring experience of seeing early Mormons through black eyes. Sometimes it's a positive view, sometimes it's not. It's an experience no less transforming than Walker's _The Color Purple_ or Morrison's _Beloved_, albeit in a quieter way. _One More River to Cross_ is a vanguard publication in a trend one hopes catches on and becomes permanent: restoring our black brothers and sisters to their rightful place in our church history. >From now on, whenever a book or film depicts the death of a Smith family member in Nauvoo, Elijah Able had better be there handling the funeral arrangements. Whenever private moments in the Nauvoo Mansion with the Smiths are shown, Jane had better be there as the housekeeper. On the streets of Nauvoo, happy-go-lucky Isaac James, eventual husband of Jane, had better be there, surrounded by admirers as he entertains them with his legendary dancing skills. When stories of sacrifice are told as the Saints gathered to Nauvoo, the story of the Manning family needs to be among them. When we tell pioneer stories to each other, the blacks who were part of the first group to enter Salt Lake valley had better be entering it. This is one of the most important LDS books to come out in years. It wouldn't matter how good the writing is--it's still a must-read. But how good _is_ the writing? The book is told in a bardic style--black bardic, if there is such a thing. It's as if one of Alex Haley's ancestors from _Roots_ were telling the tale. It's a valid literary choice, but I wasn't sure what I thought of it at first. The book tended to commit literary sins--inexcusable sins if a standard storytelling approach had been used. But they were justified in _One More River to Cross_ because of the choice Young and Gray did make. You could almost feel yourself sitting around the one room shanty, fire flickering orange ghosts on everyone's faces, as the white- haired grandfather of a black family spun yarns of his early life experiences. It was as if Celie herself sprang from the pages of _The Color Purple_ and decided to tell you a story of black Mormons. To me, the most bothersome element of this style was how so many details were lacking in parts of the story where I would have liked to experience the details. A standard storytelling approach would have been obligated to include them: a verbal storyteller not so. But I missed the details. However, as I read, as I became engrossed by the experiences of these new brothers and sisters I had never known, as I began to care about them, I stopped worrying about whether I liked the style or not. It didn't matter. The stories transcended the storytelling. By the time I reached the melancholy end of the book, I wanted more. I was glad to know that I would be receiving more, and sad that I couldn't receive it now. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 09:56:57 -0700 Jacob Proffitt wrote: > As a > result, theater will *always* be more expensive and less convenient for > audiences than competing entertainment options. As a result, there is much > less room for innovation, change and improvement. Should I risk $7 on the > latest movie, or $15 on a community theater? If I hate the movie, I'm only > out $7. If I hate the play, well, I'm a lot worse off. So, like Eric says, > *any* hint of problems in the production will prevent me from going to the > theater. > That is the wrong marketing paradigm for theatre, and could be the reason that the Provo is having problems. Several theatre production books I've read say that, in any population, only 3 and 1/2 percent will ever attend theatrical events. Once that 3 and 1/2 percent is obtained, the theatre should consider those people their core audience and conduct rigorous direct mail programs to keep them satisfied. Every ad in a newspaper is 96 1/2 percent ineffective. Trying to build an audience from people who, like Jacob, consider attending plays on a play-per-play basis is doomed to failure with such a small percentage of people who attend theatre. The key is to get your core constiuency, sell them season tickets, and build your audience on that. Someone comes to your theatre once. Hopefully, they like what you produce. Get their name and address and email on a card. The next time you do a play, send them an email or a mailing. You've already sold them once, it'll be easier to sell them again. Direct marketing, to people who have already expressed an interest in what you do is way better than blind marketing, like from ads or mass mailings. You may have to do that to discover who your core audience is, but once you've got them, keep them. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sean Lucero Subject: [AML] Re: Who Is Cornerstone? Date: 08 Feb 2001 09:07:45 -0800 (PST) Richard Hopkins wrote: >>Cornerstone's Fiction Book of the Year for 2000 included sales of all the Horizon books from August (which actually was the greater bulk of the sales for the year). Congratulations to Linda, who's book was selected for this award purely on sales, which means this award is actually given by the people who buy and read the books. Not only was it the highest in sales of fiction books for the year, it was a close second among all the books sold in the year. I'm working on a manuscript and am curious how Cornerstone/Horizon's sales compare to some of the other LDS publishers (Deseret, Covenant, Aspen, etc). Can anyone help me out? Sean Lucero _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance Reminder) Date: 08 Feb 2001 09:16:06 -0700 _I Am Jane_ (the whole thing, not the readers' theater abridgement we performed at the AML writers' conference) opens Friday, Feb. 9 at 7:00 p.m. in 3220 Wilkinson Center for two performances only--the second one being Saturday, Feb. 10. Cost is $3.00 for BYU students/staff and $4.00 for community members. Please come! - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 10:10:39 -0700 [MOD: I'm posting this in the hopes that it will be taken as an invitation to discuss the important question of what type of qualifications a reviewer should have, not whether particular reviewers are qualified. Please respond in that vein.] Eric D. Snider wrote: > Eric Samuelsen: > > Negative newspaper reviews will have killed it, because it was at a > point in its existence where it was particularly vulnerable. Negative reveiws are more likely to kill a single venue production. But over the long haul, a continuously producing theatre can whether even the worst reviews if they concentrate on their core audience, those who've already come and like what the theatre produces. > The issue, though, is what a critic's role is. We've discussed this > before ("we" as in this list, and also "we" as in Eric and I). I > whole-heartedly agree that a theater critic should be someone who loves > and supports theater and supports it, and I do. I love theater, and I > love Utah theater. Around The Daily Herald, I have a reputation for > focusing too much on theater in our Friday entertainment section, and I > plead guilty to that on occasion. But do you know anything about it? Have you ever written a play, produced one? Do you know anything about theatre history, styles? I ask this because I remember a rather scathing review of a Shakespeare play by one of your predecessors who took issue with what she considered the "modernization" of the Bard because the characters called each other, "coz." She didn't know that this is in the script as Shakespeare wrote it. Let me be so bold as to suggest that a reviewer who hasn't studied the theatre, even participated in it to some degree, doesn't have enough background to adequately review shows. > I love local theater. I applaud the successes and mourn the failures. As > a critic, though, I also have to report the failures. While a critic > should support the arts, that does not mean he should look the other way > when something is wrong. Who is that going to help? > Like I said, I love theater. But sometimes tough love is > what's required. Let's make it clear that you are not proposing truth from on high, but merely your opinion. Chris Hicks, not knowing jack about science fiction, traditionally grades sf movies a whole step down from what they really deserve, had he approached the review with the history of science fiction literature that many fans have. If Hicks gives two stars to a sci-fi movie, rest assured it is really a three star flick. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 10:09:31 -0700 Jacob Proffitt wrote: >Theater cannot develop the >economies of scale enjoyed by any other entertainment media. >There just >aren't enough sunk costs once a play is ready for distribution. As >a = result, theater will *always* be more expensive and less >convenient for >audiences than competing entertainment options. As a result, >there is = much >less room for innovation, change and improvement. =20 Up to a point, this is entirely true. Because theatre is live, it also = carries continuing costs that competing entertainment options don't have = worry about. You only have to pay the actors on Frazier once. Whereas = you have to pay Marvin Payne every week. =20 On the other hand, what you get for your money is Marvin Payne, that = compelling live presence. Some people just plain like theatre, which is = why it's not as much an invalid as some people think. >I think Eric Samuelsen's plays have been instructive to me >lately in the power of their production. "Love Affair with >Electrons" = was >not only a delight, but it also did a fantastic job of leveraging the >strengths that theater has over *any* reproducible media. Eric >does = things >with the stage that couldn't be done via video. The reason this >is >unfortunate is because these are the most risky things to play >with--and >doing so can have the potential side effect of destroying the >market >entirely if done poorly. Less room for innovation, change and >improvemen= t >combined with a critical need for more innovation, change and >improvement= is >just a bad combination to try to fight. Ouch. Despite the kind things Jacob says about me and my work, which I = very much appreciate, he places my work on the horns of a dilemma. = Constant experimentation is the only way to continue to survive. But when = the experiment goes wrong, as inevitably some experiments will, you kill = your audience. =20 As Scott said, however, I'm subsidized. I can experiment away, because = I'm not going to lose my job anyway (up to a point, of course; at BYU I = can't experiment with nudity, for example. Not that I'd want to. It's = been done). I've had my flops, but we turn over our entire core audience = every four years. I'm in a position where I CAN experiment. =20 That's why the model I prefer is the Regional Theatre Company model. You = build a structure that gives you room for innovation, while lessening the = possibility of one failure killing your whole operation. But that does = require the philanthropy of the rich. Tough to count on when you're the = author of Gadianton. Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike South Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 08 Feb 2001 10:41:40 -0700 Another book with an interesting use of flashbacks is "The Mezzanine" by Nicholson Baker. In this book the flashbacks don't fill in the story -- they are the story. The book is primarily about the thoughts the main character has as he crosses the lobby floor of his office building and gets on to the escalator. One thought leads to a memory leads to another memory and so on in a sort of highly-detailed stream-of-consciousness way. No real plot or character development, but filled with lots of "hey, I've noticed that, too" moments. Lots of wonderful descriptive language. People seem to find the book either highly entertaining or incredibly dull. I liked it. --Mike South - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara@techvoice.com (Barbara R. Hume) Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 08 Feb 2001 10:46:14 -0700 > The problem with trying to pin down exactly how many > Eskimo words there for snow and/or ice--or for > anything, for that matter-- is that Eskimo is what > is called a "polysynthetic" language, which means > you sort of make up words as you go along, by > connecting various particles to your basic root > word. For example, we may add the suffix -tluk, bad, > to kaniktshaq, snow, and come up with kaniktshartluk, > bad snow. Isn't that fascinating? German puts words together like that, but I don't think they do it on the fly! Makes me wonder about the Adamic language--does it function like a Germanic language? a Romance language? an Asian language? or is it much cleaner and simpler? I'll bet it doesn't include the kinds of words regularly employed on the nastier TV shows--one reason I don't watch TV these days. (Thank goodness for VCRs.) barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 08 Feb 2001 14:38:46 -0500 >Isn't that fascinating? German puts words together like that, but I don't >think they do it on the fly! Makes me wonder about the Adamic >language--does it function like a Germanic language? a Romance language? >an Asian language? or is it much cleaner and simpler? I'll bet it doesn't >include the kinds of words regularly employed on the nastier TV shows--one >reason I don't watch TV these days. (Thank goodness for VCRs.) > >barbara hume > Finnish does that too. It not only has fifteen cases, but words are glued together the same way. One missionary pointed out, in a newspaper, the longest word he ever found, and I, for one was never able to top it. hykkatomyysopimusmahdoliset (with two dots over the first a and o) which means "possibilities of a non aggression pact. Cases could actually be added to mean, "our" or "in" or "into", etc, but this word just shows the aggutionous or "polysynthetic"(hadn't heard that word before) feature without any case endings. Estonian is similar, and I have heard that Hungarian, Turkish, and Korean have similar structures. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff Needle Subject: Re: [AML] NUNES, _This Time Forever_ Date: 07 Feb 2001 21:34:36 -0800 Congratulations! It's nice to be #1, eh? At 10:21 AM 2/7/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Hello all, > >It's high time I announce the release of my new book, _This Time Forever._ >Seems >off to a good start. (It's #1 at the Deseret Book top ten right now >http://deseretbook.com/bestsellers/fiction.html ) Yay! > >I have a sample chapter (not sure if it's the final edited version or not) >on my website and a summary if you're interested in reading about the novel. > >Have a good one, >Rachel >_______________________ >Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) >Best-selling author of the Ariana series >Web page: http://www.ranunes.com >E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com > > > > > > > > > > >- >AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature >http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm --------------- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 21:40:01 Me: > >>I have a reputation for >>focusing too much on theater in our Friday entertainment section, and I >>plead guilty to that on occasion. > Thom Duncan: >But do you know anything about it? Have you ever written a play, >produced one? Do you know anything about theatre history, styles? I >ask this because I remember a rather scathing review of a Shakespeare >play by one of your predecessors who took issue with what she considered >the "modernization" of the Bard because the characters called each >other, "coz." She didn't know that this is in the script as Shakespeare >wrote it. > >Let me be so bold as to suggest that a reviewer who hasn't studied the >theatre, even participated in it to some degree, doesn't have enough >background to adequately review shows. > Me: Someone who has participated too much in theater, though, and then becomes a critic runs the risk of people using that as an explanation for why he didn't like a show: "Oh, well, he's a frustrated actor who's just jealous this show was so good." On the other hand, if it's someone with no practical theater experience, you get the "What does he know, anyway?" approach. It's a fun Catch-22. I agree with the basic ideas here, though I don't know if I'd be quite so dogmatic about it. Knowledge of theater can come in more ways than just taking classes, reading books, or even from being in shows. (Plenty of actors are in lots of shows but still demonstrate they know very little about THEATRE.) Experience is probably the best teacher; it would be hard to see and review dozens of plays without learning about theater in the process. One pities the poor theaters that have to put up with the dope's reviews while he's still in the learning process, though. I think track record counts for a lot, too. If a critic doesn't know what he's talking about, it's going to show in his reviews. The average theater-goer may not catch it, but to them, the simple "Do I agree with him or not?" question is more important anyway. To people who know theater, the critic's knowledge or lack thereof will become apparent. A critic only has to criticize a play's "modern" use of the word "coz" one time to establish he doesn't know much about Shakespeare. Writing ability counts as well. Is the critic a good writer? Does he provoke thought? Knowing how to put together a sentence doesn't make up for lack of knowledge, of course. But at the same time, I can name at least one film critic whose opinions I respect ... up till the time I read his poorly written reviews, at which point I lose some of that respect. Though the MOD has told us this isn't relevant, I will mention (since I was directly asked) that I've performed in a couple dozen shows over the years and took several theater classes in high school and college. I read a lot, too, and if a play comes around for me to review that seems beyond what I already know something about, I'll do some research beforehand to make sure I don't come off like an idiot. It doesn't always work, of course, but I do try. Thom Duncan: > >Let's make it clear that you are not proposing truth from on high, but >merely your opinion. Another good point in critics' defense: What we're saying is, after all, only opinion. Informed opinion, hopefully, and well-thought-out and carefully written, but opinion nonetheless. I think most readers understand this, and know they should take it -- like all opinions -- with a grain of salt. Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brandi Rainey" Subject: [AML] Elijah Abel Photo Query Date: 08 Feb 2001 15:00:37 -0700 I just finished an article on the life and significance of Elijah Abel for = Pioneer magazine (inspired by Margaret Young & Darius Gray's new novel = "Standing on the Promises"). Unfortunately, we're having problems locating = pictures of Elijah to run alongside the article. Do any of you know where = we might find something the designers can use? Thanks in advance, Brandi Rainey - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 15:27:37 -0700 On Thu, Feb 08, 2001 at 10:10:39AM -0700, Thom Duncan wrote: > But do you know anything about it? Have you ever written a play, > produced one? Do you know anything about theatre history, styles? I > ask this because I remember a rather scathing review of a Shakespeare > play by one of your predecessors who took issue with what she considered > the "modernization" of the Bard because the characters called each > other, "coz." She didn't know that this is in the script as Shakespeare > wrote it. > > Let me be so bold as to suggest that a reviewer who hasn't studied the > theatre, even participated in it to some degree, doesn't have enough > background to adequately review shows. I think we need to make a distinction between a reviewer and a critic. These individuals serve entirely different audiences and have different qualifications. A reviewer provides opinions about art so the general populace can choose whether or not to spend their money to experience that art. For example, when my wife and I have the rare opportunity to see a movie, we don't want to see something lame. We want to have a quality experience for our investment of $15. We check with the online reviews posted by the Tribune and the Deseret News to help us choose an event that we will enjoy. Reviewers need to provide people with the tools to choose between different works. Not to downplay the role of a reviewer, but reviewers need only good writing skills to communicate their opinions succinctly to the populace. On the other hand, the critic serves the academic community. A critic must have knowledge of the works that have come before, how the current work compares and contrasts with the current modes in the genre, and makes a value judgment based on how the work stands up to the rigors of an academic examination. Critics often come from various, mutually-exclusive schools of thought. A Marxist critic will look at a work quite differently than a Queer-theory critic. Now anyone can try his hand at criticism, but only with the qualifications that Thom requires will a critic garner respect in the art community. Most newspapers and radio stations employ reviewers not critics. Although the reviewer might have enough education to provide some valid criticism, usually information about the significance of falling objects in the movie "Frequency" doesn't help everyday viewers decide if they want to see it now, wait for the dollar theater, wait for the rental release, or see it on cable. But if you want to make a social commentary on the changes in public acceptance of spiritual phenomenon from 1982 to 1999 through a comparison of "Poltergeist" and "The Sixth Sense," then you probably should ask a critic and not a reviewer. -- Terry L Jeffress [speaking for myself and not the web site] AML Webmaster and AML-List Review Archivist - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 15:43:25 -0700 Eric Snider wrote: >When I mentioned Eric Samuelsen's first post declaring PTC's=20 >near-death status, Tim (Threllfall) said, "No. We'll finish out the = >season, and=20 >there will be a next season." Even if PTC were selling out every=20 >performance, it's such a small venue with such high overhead >that it=20 >would never be terribly profitable. He said the theater has >recently=20 >received a large donation from someone who wishes to remain=20 >anonymous, which will help -- but my impression was that even >without=20 >that, the theater would stick around. >In other words, the rumors of PTC's death have been greatly >exaggerated. This is very good news indeed. Although Tim Threlfall and I are colleagues= and good friends, we haven't actually seen much of each other since = December, and in December, the future of PTC looked very grim indeed. I'm = glad to have this, more optimistic, update. Eric Snider >This strikes a little closer to home, since I'm the main one Eric >was=20 >referring to. He said, I believe, that even a B or B+ grade (I gave=20 >PTC's "Big KSL Holiday Broadcast" a B) is devastating to a >theater = production because of people's unwillingness to take >even a small risk = when it comes to live theater. Actually, I was not specifically referring to Eric Snider's review in the = Daily Herald, but to the combination of his review and the Deseret News = review. The DN review was much more negative than the DH review, and it's = a bigger and presumably somewhat more prestigious paper. But it probably = also has a smaller Provo circulation. =20 >I know Eric is opposed to letter grades of any kind for theater=20 >productions (maybe for movies, too, I don't know) because it >reduces the = whole experience down to one letter. I don't know if >using no grading = scale at all would help matters or not. Most people do not read every article in a newspaper, and most people = don't read reviews. What sticks in the mind are two factors--the = headline, which the critic usually has nothing to do with, and the grade, = one star two star, or, in the case of Eric Snider, a letter grade. The = grade is the single most important factor that the critic has control over = in the reader's decision to see a show or not. That means, in turn, that = eliminating the grade is absolutely crucial. =20 First of all, the headline will probably reflect the thrust of the story. = If you think a show is pretty good, B quality, then you will likely say = five good things about it, and two less good things about it. The headline = will probably reflect the more positive comments, which makes it more = likely that people will go see the show, which presumably is one goal in = writing a more or less positive review. A B grade suggests, to me at = least, that you mean the show well, hope it succeeds, and hope people will = go see it. But to most readers and most audience members, a B is a = failing grade. A B means people will stay away. A B means the show isn't = worth spending money on. So if you think it's a pretty good show, flawed = but mostly enjoyable, and you give it a B, that grade will overshadow any = positive comments you put in the body of the review. After you've given a = show a B, it doesn't matter what else you say about it. You've just = killed it dead. =20 Second, eliminating the grade makes it far more likely that people will = actually read the review--surely the goal of any writer. And third, = eliminating the grade improves the writing of the review itself, allowing = more space for reflectiveness, instead of feeling like the review has to = justify the grade. =20 The single most important decision any young critic could possibly make is = the decision to buck national trends and not grade the work he/she is = reviewing. For Eric Snider, it's not too late. Get rid of the grades. = Do it now. =20 >The issue, though, is what a critic's role is. We've discussed this=20 >before ("we" as in this list, and also "we" as in Eric and I). I=20 >whole-heartedly agree that a theater critic should be someone >who loves = and supports theater and supports it, and I do. I love >theater, and I = love Utah theater. Around The Daily Herald, I have >a reputation for = focusing too much on theater in our Friday >entertainment section,=20 >and I plead guilty to that on occasion. When it comes to Eric Snider's work as a critic, I don't know anyone that = questions any of this. I, for one, want him to succeed. I think he's = bright and insightful and I think he writes well. And he clearly loves = theatre. His enthusiasm for theatre is not at issue. >This Friday's centerpiece story is about the fact that on the same=20 >night, two regional premieres are happening in Utah County -- >"Over=20 >the River and Through the Woods" at Hale Center, and "The >Texas=20 >Chainsaw Manicurist" at Provo Theatre Company. This article is=20 >unnecessary; we could have just run the press releases for each >show,=20 >like we would any show. But I saw the coincidence, I was >excited that=20 >shows new to Utah audiences were being done instead of "The=20 >Foreigner" for the 10,000th time, and I wanted to give an official=20 >kudos to the theaters for doing it. So it will be on the front of the=20 >section, with color photos and a big headline. I think this is super. But do understand that if you review these shows, = and give one of them a B+ and the other one an A-, you will hurt their = ticket sales by 50% and 30% respectively. "But those are good grades!" = you say. Not so.=20 I know this is true. You do not know how many conversations I have had = with potential audience members for various shows, in which they've told = me 'I wanted to see that. But the critic gave it a B+ and I figured it = probably couldn't be very good.' The Big KSL Holiday Broadcast is the = perfect example. Forty people I talked to at one party, twenty couples, = all of them the perfect target audience for the show, and not one had seen = it, because the reviews were 'so negative.' =20 >As a critic, though, I also have to report the failures. While a=20 >critic should support the arts, that does not mean he should look >the=20 >other way when something is wrong. Who is that going to help? >If=20 >critics (and audiences, via their checkbooks) don't make it >known=20 >when a show has made a misstep, then how will anything ever >improve? Quite apart from the notion that a critic's subjective opinion that a = choice made by an artist automatically qualifies as a 'misstep' is somehow = valid, let me say that I agree with you here. I think that a critic does = have an obligation to be truthful and accurate. Also humble, though, = let's be clear about that. Remember, most of those 'missteps' were = choices made, after long reflection, hours of rehearsal, and a conscientiou= s exploration of other alternatives. =20 >I was fair with PTC's show: I said what was wrong and what was >right,=20 >and didn't give any more weight or newspaper space to the >wrong than=20 >it deserved. Since the show was mostly very good, the review >was=20 >mostly very positive.=20 All true. And completely irrelevant. That mostly positive review killed = the show. I know it did. I talked to the people who didn't go because of = it. >To suggest that "mostly very positive" is not=20 >enough is preposterous.=20 No, it's factual. =20 >On the other hand, if negative reviews are to blame when a >theater=20 >goes under, does that mean we critics get all the glory when we >give=20 >glowing reviews and a theater is successful?=20 Surely this happens. I've seen shows that probably wouldn't have done = well, but that did very well because of a review. Some years ago, I = directed a play called Erasmus Montanus, by Ludwig Holberg. 18th century = Danish comedy, with a Latin title, no less. I figured we'd be lucky to = get 40% capacity audiences. We'd done some fun things with it, and I = thought it was a funny show, but I didn't think we'd get any audience at = all. Then Eric Snider came, gave it a rave review, and the next day the = ticket office phone wouldn't stop ringing. Why not give credit? >I gave PTC's "Oleanna" a very glowing review (an A), yet it=20 >still is, I believe, the least successful show they've ever done in=20 >terms of attendance. Maybe the only kind of impact critics can >have is a = negative one, i.e., negative reviews ruin a show, but >positive=20 >reviews have no effect either way.... Again, I don't think this at all. But I do think that for theatre = audiences, a review needs to be 50% more positive than the critic feels = like giving it, or the review will have a disproportionately negative = impact on box office. And a 3 star or B grade is death on toast. = Especially for shows that people don't know well--I don't think the review = matters at all for a production of Joseph/Dreamcoat. =20 Look, I like Eric Snider. I like him a lot. And I think theatre critics = serve an invaluable function. And I think he's a pretty good one. And, = best news of all, PTC did get a big donation and will keep their doors = open. That's wonderful news for us all. Eric Samuelsen=20 - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jacob Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 08 Feb 2001 17:03:46 -0700 On Thu, 08 Feb 2001 10:09:31 -0700, Eric R. Samuelsen wrote: >That's why the model I prefer is the Regional Theatre Company model. = You build a structure that gives you room for innovation, while lessening= the possibility of one failure killing your whole operation. But that = does require the philanthropy of the rich. Tough to count on when you're= the author of Gadianton. I actually kind of like the Regional Theatre Company model as you = describe it. Although, I don't like the pressure of the 33-33-33 model. I'd much prefer a 33-66 model because I *hate* fund-raising (just about every = aspect of it). Seems to me that it'd be easier to double the up front endowment than incur ongoing funding effort and costs. But that's probably just = me. Jacob Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 08 Feb 2001 19:10:39 -0600 Larsen 7Feb01 A2 [From Mormon-News] "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- LDS Church President Gordon B. Hinckley's bestselling book "Standing for Something" will be released in paperback by Random House's Three Rivers Press next month. The book hit national bestseller lists in the US last March when a hardcover edition of the book was released, and stayed on the lists through May. Written with the aim of reaching a broader, non-LDS audience, the book was called a "manifesto of traditional values" by the book industry's trade magazine, Publishers Weekly. But in spite of the book's stated aim to reach a non-LDS audience, some evidence indicates that the book's strongest sales have been among LDS Church members. Amazon.com continues to indicate that it sells strongest in traditionally Mormon areas like Mesa, Arizona; many areas of Utah, and other Western states. Since the paperback edition has a significantly lower price, it is likely that this edition will also hit the bestseller lists in the coming months. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: Re: [AML] Elijah Abel Photo Query Date: 08 Feb 2001 18:01:09 -0700 >>> BrandiR@enrich.com 02/08/01 03:00PM >>> >I just finished an article on the life and significance of Elijah Abel = for Pioneer magazine (inspired by Margaret Young & Darius Gray's new novel = "Standing on the Promises"). Unfortunately, we're having problems locating = pictures of Elijah to run alongside the article. Do any of you know where = we might find something the designers can use? I don't think there are any. There is an often-cited quote from Zebedee = Coultrin claiming that Abel was only 1/8 black and didn't look black. This = quote has been used to attempt to make a case that Abel was ordained in = error. If a picture existed, it would have gone a long way to either = confirm or refute this argument. MBA - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara@techvoice.com (Barbara R. Hume) Subject: [AML] Providing Escape: A Writer's Job? Date: 08 Feb 2001 16:50:19 -0700 We've talked about the notion that fiction "should" reflect the darkest, slimiest parts of reality, a notion I disagree with. Here's the URL to an article that talks about providing the reader with escape from reality by means of using an omnisicent POV. I found the article interesting because it goes along with Dave Wolverton's concepts about giving readers readers some distance in terms of either setting, plot, or character. I offer this not to say see, I'm right, but to say this is an interesting take on POV. http://www.thewritersezine.com/t-zero/archives/2001-texts/2001-02-eisfor.shtml barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN Cope, Swindle and Black Join Forces for Life of Christ Project: Excel Entertainment Press Release Date: 08 Feb 2001 19:21:27 -0600 Project: Excel Entertainment Press Release 8Feb01 A2 [From Mormon-News] Cope, Swindle and Black Join Forces for Life of Christ Project Artistic Collaboration Will Set New Standard in Religious Art SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- At a press conference this afternoon in snowy Salt Lake City, three of today's leading artistic personalities announced the title of their latest collaboration, a project which will set a new standard for excellence in the genre of religious art. Kenneth Cope, Liz Lemon Swindle and Susan Easton Black will spend the next several years researching and creating a multimedia presentation centered on the life of Jesus Christ. Entitled Son of Man: God with Us, the project will detail scenes from the life of the most influential man to ever walk on the face of the earth. Combining original music and poetry from Cope, paintings from Swindle and essays from Black, Son of Man will look thoughtfully and in detail at the human life of Christ. The title was chosen carefully-Son of Man: God with Us will explore the sometimes overlooked humanity of the man whom over 80% of Americans believe to be the divine Son of God. Swindle has already completed several of the first paintings for the project, with input from Cope and Black, and both Cope and Black have made great progress on their portions of the multimedia presentation. At this afternoon's press conference Swindle unveiled her most recent painting, a striking portrait of the adult Christ called Jesus. Swindle's nineteen-month old grand-daughter named the portrait when the child wandered into Swindle's studio and started talking directly to the painting. The only word in the child's conversation that Swindle could make out was "Jesus." Over the next two years the collaborators will continue their in-depth research into the life and times of Christ. In April they will embark on a research trip to Jerusalem, a trip they postponed from last November due to the recent outbreak of violence in the region. They will also hold periodic photo shoots and other events. The entire project will be released to the public in the form of an art book, complete with commentary, poetry and a CD of Cope's original music. The anticipated release date is Fall 2003. While there have been many artistic projects to look at the life of Christ, this collaboration between Cope, Swindle and Black will be entirely unique and in a class of its own. Working together these three leaders in each of their artistic fields generate an excitement and have insights unparalleled in the genre of religious art. Excel Entertainment Group, Inc. of Salt Lake City, UT and Greenwich Workshop of Shelton, CT are backing the project. Excel Entertainment Group is a regional powerhouse in the production and distribution of faith-centered music and film. Greenwich Workshop, a subsidiary of Hallmark Corporation, is a national leader in art and print publishing. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN "Burdens of Earth" at BYU's Margetts Theatre Feb. 9-24: BYU Press Release Date: 08 Feb 2001 19:40:18 -0600 Press Release 3Feb01 A2 [From Mormon-News] "Burdens of Earth" at BYU's Margetts Theatre Feb. 9-24 PROVO, UTAH -- "Burdens of Earth," Susan Howe's dramatic examination of the mind and heart of the Prophet Joseph Smith at Liberty Jail, will open Friday (Feb. 9) at 7:30 p.m. in Brigham Young University's Margetts Arena Theatre. Directed by George Nelson, the play will run Tuesdays through Saturdays through Feb. 24, with a 2 p.m. matinee Feb. 17. Half-price preview performances will be Wednesday and Thursday (Feb. 7 and 8). Tickets at $10 for the general public and $8 for students and faculty are available at the Fine Arts Ticket Office, (801) 378-4322. Howe, a member of the BYU English faculty, was inspired by the account of Joseph Smith's terrible experience in Liberty Jail during the winter of 1839. "What came to influence me as I studied it," said Howe, "was his utterance, 'O God, where art thou? And where is the pavilion that covereth thy hiding place?'" [Doctrine and Covenants 121:1] "It wasn't a rhetorical question-he was really in agony," she said. "I asked myself, 'What could cause him to come to such a crisis of faith?'" The play reveals, in flashbacks, critical incidents in early LDS Church history that led to this crucible. "Missouri as the revealed gathering place for Zion was not going to come to pass at that time, and so many leaders who had been with Joseph since the foundation of the Church-in particular Oliver Cowdery-had fallen away," said Howe. "In addition, Joseph had observed the terrible suffering and enormous losses of the Saints." Joseph is ultimately sustained through this crisis by the help and faith of people surrounding him. The play, Howe believes, is more than an historical retelling. "Most people of faith have a moment in their lives where they feel abandoned by God," she noted. "The thematic quality of the play will never be irrelevant." The Mormon drama was first produced in 1987 at the Cambridge Ward of the LDS Church in Boston, where Howe was working at the time. Robert Nelson of the BYU theatre and media arts faculty heard about the production, obtained the script and secured the rights for the first BYU production that same year. He both directed and starred in that production. "Bob really helped me revise it, cut it and refine the form," said Howe. The first BYU production also helped solidify the flashbacks that are so central to the play. Joseph S. Hale is Joseph Smith, with Jacob Anderson as Hyrum Smith/Phineas Hobart, Jacob Draper as Caleb Baldwin/Hanson Jacobs, Doug Stewart as Alexander McRae/Oliver Cowdery and Andrew Allman as Lyman Wight/Major Sam Burris. Scenic design is by Ann Kirkham-Black, costume design by Jennifer Jenkins and lighting design by Julie Gillette, with makeup and hair by Richard Clifford. "Burdens of Earth" replaces Tim Slover's "Hancock County" originally listed in the 2001 BYU theatre season brochure. It will be produced by BYU in an upcoming season. -###- >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Elijah Abel Photo Query Date: 08 Feb 2001 20:06:03 -0700 Sorry to report this, but I doubt you'll find any photos. The sketch used by Van Wagener and Walker in _A Book of Mormons_ seems to be authentic and of the appropriate time. I talked to Br. Van Wagener. He told me the sketch was found in Illinois, labelled "Elijah Abel." It appeared quite old, and so they are assuming that it's not a Hoffmanesque reproduction. As far as I know, that's IT for Elijah. Now if it were Jane James you wanted, there are several photos. And the best photo of all is of Samuel and Amanda Chambers. William Hartley spoke to the Genesis Group last Sunday (beautifully!) and brought an 11x16 print of the photo. Absolutely gorgeous! There is a photo of Green Flake (not a terribly good one) in _A Book of Mormons_, and there are some descriptions of Hark Lay and Oscar Crosby. How about this for a description (and how many of you think Deseret will let this one into Volume 2?): Hark Lay was bred as a stud slave. His original master, John Crosby, received high payment for the use of Hark's special..uhm...genes. He was large, muscular, and intelligent. Picture an Arnold Frieburg painting of Moroni and make it Black. That's Hark. Brandi Rainey wrote: > I just finished an article on the life and significance of Elijah Abel for Pioneer magazine (inspired by Margaret Young & Darius Gray's new novel "Standing on the Promises"). Unfortunately, we're having problems locating pictures of Elijah to run alongside the article. Do any of you know where we might find something the designers can use? > > Thanks in advance, > Brandi Rainey > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Regionalism Date: 08 Feb 2001 18:51:58 -0700 As an FYI, her last name is spelled Bui and she is with Random House Children's Books as of last July. Tracie Laulusa wrote: > This wouldn't happen to be Francoise Boi would it? If you don't mind > saying. > > Tracie > > -----Original Message----- > Laurel Brady wrote: > > My experience with my editor at HarperCollins has been exactly the opposite. > I was nervous about submitting my first book, as it has rather direct > references to faith and God and family and not too subtle Mormon values. My > editor jumped on those things, and encouraged me to not only keep them in, > but expand them. The end result is not blatant, and not Mormon, but > definitely Christian (without being "Christian".) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Benson Parkinson" Subject: Re: [AML] Elijah Abel Photo Query Date: 09 Feb 2001 08:02:13 -0700 >>> BrandiR@enrich.com 02/08/01 03:00PM >>> I just finished an article on the life and significance of Elijah Abel for = Pioneer magazine (inspired by Margaret Young & Darius Gray's new novel = "Standing on the Promises"). Unfortunately, we're having problems locating = pictures of Elijah to run alongside the article. Do any of you know where = we might find something the designers can use? Thanks in advance, Brandi Rainey >>>>> I guess you know the standard places to look:=20 * Church Archives * (also the Church Historical Department Library and the Family History = Library, which mostly just have screened prints) * Daughters of Utah Pioneers museum (you have to talk to their photo = curator--many are not indexed or displayed) * (also Sons of Utah Pioneers, though they have more histories than photos = I believe) * Utah State Historical Society (some of their collection is online as the = Utah Media Encyclopedia) * BYU and UofU and WSU and USU special collections * Nelson Wadsworth, who has negatives of the Church's daguerreotype = collection and who does the photos for the DUP Two other suggestions, both of which (along with these others), probably = already occurred to you: *Check the credits of photos in published works. I'll bet Utah Historical = Quarterly has done something on him. *Ask Margaret Young. There's a lot of interest now among family historians in old photos. It's = a real snap to take a 300 dpi scan and drop it into anything from a = commercial-quality book or magazine to a personal history or newsletter = done in WordPerfect or Word, or to scale it down for the web or a = genealogy program.=20 I'm chairman of a project to gather scans of all surviving photos and = engravings of Pratt family members (Parley, Orson, Nelson, William, and = Anson and their wives and children).=20 I'm doing the same, mostly on my own, for my other lines (Parkinson, = Young, Benson, Hobbs, Partridge, Clawson, Gollaher, Shough, Fathree, = Reneau, Hunt, Tietjen, Taylor, Bates, Child).=20 I've found good photos in all the places I list above. (Well, I guess I = never asked Margaret Young :^) . Actually I did once ask her husband Bruce = if we were related, and we don't appear to be.) Ben Parkinson - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 09 Feb 2001 08:01:08 -0700 Donny has a sense of humor. Shortly after the first incarnation of the Donny & Marie show was cancelled he made a try at Broadway with "Little Johnny Jones." It was a dismal failure. The critics killed him. Now he has a new album of songs from Broadway shows. The closing song is from "Little Johnny Jones." Give My Regards to Broadway. I think that is so sublime. scott - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra L. Brown" Subject: [AML] Christmas Traditions (was: Two Requests for Information) Date: 09 Feb 2001 10:45:11 -0500 Kellene, when my daughter was celebrating her first Christmas in Switzerland/France as a missionary, I also tried to find Christmas traditions around the world so that I could send her something for Christmas that would help her celebrate in the right style. I think I only found two websites and they were no help at all. What you could do is appeal on every LDS e-mail list asking for help from returned missionaries on how the country they served in celebrated Christmas. I know we have plenty of returned missionaries on this list. And Jim Picht lived in Russia for 5 or 6 years so I'm sure he knows about Christmas in Russia. Oh, and Texas too! My daughter comes home in March from her mission (WHEEEEEEeeeeeeee and I get to go get her!) and I'm sure she could help. I'll also see if I can dig up those two websites I found 18 months ago. I'll volunteer to write an article for you. I think I may have plenty of information on the alphabet or the other. I remember learning about it in Seminary, I think in 1973 and having to write a poem or something using it and having to translate something from the lesson material. Anyone else remember that? Debbie Brown debbro@voyager.net ----- Original Message ----- > I'm not sure if this request is appropriate, but thought I'd try: I am > currently working on a compilation (for personal use primarily, although it > may turn into something else depending on what I end up with) of > Christmas/New Year traditions from countries and cultures around the world. [snip] > > While I'm at it, I am also currently putting together another issue of > Pioneer Magazine (a publication produced by the Sons of Utah Pioneers). Our > next issue is on education, and we are at the very beginning stages of > hammering out the next issue. In reading the list the last few days, I > thought an article on the Deseret Alphabet would be great. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Elijah Abel Photo Query Date: 09 Feb 2001 09:12:01 -0700 I don't have a copy of _Standing on the Promises_ (V. 1) with me, but either Chapter 2 or Chapter 3 deals with the issue of Elijah's race. We have census records of the time. While living in Ohio, Elijah was identified by the census taker (who would only LOOK at the person to identify race) as "Black." Two other census takers in Utah identified him as "Mulatto." Clearly, he would not "pass" for white. And it'd be wise to take everything Zebedee Coltrin said regarding Elijah with a very big grain of salt. It was Brother Coltrin who claimed--forty years after the event--that he had washed and anointed Elijah Abel in the Kirtland temple and had the worst feeling he'd ever had, and would never again do such an ordinance for a black man unless a prophet asked him to. Elijah was actually presented with this information and responded with correct data, as supported by the records: That Zebedee Coltrin had NOT washed and anointed him, but had ordained him to the office of a Seventy. For more information on this, see Armand Mauss/Lester Bush's _Neither Black Nor White_, specifically Newell Bringhurst's chapter called "The Changing Status of Elijah Abel." Morgan Adair wrote: > There is an often-cited quote from Zebedee Coultrin claiming that Abel was only 1/8 black and didn't look black. This quote has been used to attempt to make a case that Abel was ordained in error. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Paxton on HOWE, _Burdens of Earth_ Date: 10 Feb 2001 02:07:20 +0900 Robert Paxton's 1997 review of _Burdens of Earth_ can be found in the AML-List review archive, http://www.xmission.com/~aml/reviews/b/B199746.html. The review is one of Paxton's "Stages" collumns on theater which he wrote for the List in 1997. It is a review only of the text, he hadn't actually seen the play. I'd like to add that I would give the text a stronger review than Robert did. By the way, does anyone know what Robert is doing these days? Is he still writing plays? Andrew Hall Pittsburgh, PA _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paynecabin@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 09 Feb 2001 12:42:03 EST << Since the paperback edition [the forthcoming version of President HInckley's "Standing For Something"] has a significantly lower price, it is likely that this edition will also hit the bestseller lists in the coming months.>> I'm going to suggest that the publishers will be disappointed. My guess is that they'll discover that most of the hard-backed copies of this book were bought as something to give rather than as something to read. A hardcover book is a better gift than a paperback. Let's see. This would be a good test case. I'll be delighted if I'm wrong. Marvin Payne - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Providing Escape: A Writer's Job? Date: 09 Feb 2001 10:58:02 -0800 (PST) --- "Barbara R. Hume" wrote: > We've talked about the notion that fiction "should" > reflect the darkest, > slimiest parts of reality, a notion I disagree with. > Here's the URL to an > article that talks about providing the reader with > escape from reality by > means of using an omnisicent POV. I found the > article interesting because > it goes along with Dave Wolverton's concepts about > giving readers readers > some distance in terms of either setting, plot, or > character. > > I offer this not to say see, I'm right, but to say > this is an interesting > take on POV. > This idea of distancing the reader corresponds to D. Michael's reference in the 'flashbacks' thread to frame stories. As he noted, one of the most common ways for authors to create a distance from readers was to create a narrative frame for the actual story. In 19th century European literature, novellas (which were a lot more popular then) almost always employed the device. The narrative frame varied. Oftentimes a traveler or foreigner would appear in a village/city, would encounter some odd thing, and then meet someone who would tell him (it was usually a him) a story that would tell the story of that 'odd thing.' While the 3-act novella with frame story (that's the other thing, in German literature at least, the novella was seen as the closest textual equivalent to drama) was seen as rather old-fashioned by modernist writers, I really like it. I prefer having some sort of textual buffer between me and the characters. And of course what I like about the frame story is the often interesting relationship between it and the 'main action.' That said, I don't think that in most cases the writer is obligated to provide a specific text-based escape for the reader. Doesn't the fact that the story itself is words on a page create enough of a distance? I'm not saying that I want to read more novels where the entire narrative takes place in one character's head and is written in stream-of-conscience. And I'm also not saying that an author should have to commit herself to one narrative mode. I once wrote a short story that was limited to one character's point of view but was framed by a beginning and closing paragraph that was an outside (not identified) narrator's description of the landscape and that character's position (place) in the landscape. My creative writing instructor told me that you don't all of a sudden turn off the character's pov and switch to another pov because it's confusing to the reader. A couple of years later I read Kafka's short story 'Judgement' where that very thing happens in the last two or three sentences of the story---for a somewhat similar reason to why mine had done the same thing. It's harder for me to judge if my switch works as well as Kafka's, but in both cases there is a reason for the distancing effect. And so after waffling all over the place, I'd say that in my opinion distancing effects are fine, even needed in some cases, but I prefer a limited omniscience (where we get to see into one or two character's heads) to a multiple omniscience that goes all over the place willy-nilly peering into every characters' heads and describing their emotions. ~~William Morris, who vows to get a Kafka reference into every post he makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Dixon" Subject: Re: [AML] Christmas Traditions (was: Two Requests for Date: 09 Feb 2001 14:31:41 -0500 Kellene wrote: >I'm not sure if this request is appropriate, but thought I'd try: I am >currently working on a compilation (for personal use primarily, although >it may turn into something else depending on what I end up with) of >Christmas/New Year traditions from countries and cultures around the >world. Here's an interesting site with links to web sites detailing Christmas traditions from various countries: http://www.stemnet.nf.ca/CITE/christmas_traditions.htm Here's one of the best sites that it links to: http://www.christmas.com/worldview/ Eric D. Dixon "We get away with nothing. We cannot escape the repercussions of our actions, however subtle they may be. We cannot get away from ourselves. We cannot get away from the world we live in. Our decisions, our choices which underlie our actions & give rise to them, create the world we inhabit." -- Robert Fripp - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] HOWE, _Burdens of Earth_ (SL Tribune) Date: 10 Feb 2001 05:31:07 +0900 Howe's Poetic 'Burdens of Earth' Returns to BYU Friday, February 9, 2001 BY CLAUDIA HARRIS SPECIAL TO THE TRIBUNE PROVO -- Susan Howe's "Burdens of Earth" has returned to Brigham Young University. First staged at BYU in 1987, this fine play is long overdue for revival. Howe reimagines one of the most difficult periods in LDS Church history and develops a striking portrait of Joseph Smith. Coupled with what may be the finest stage characterization of the Mormon church founder is the superb performance in the role by Joseph S. Hale. The "burdens" in Howe's play are Smith's as he languishes in Liberty Jail in winter 1839 while his followers are being driven from Missouri: "I rot here like a frozen potato, of no use to them or to anyone." Howe portrays Smith's dark night of the soul, showing through flashbacks the pivotal incidents that led him to agonize, "O God, where art thou? And where is the pavilion that covereth thy hiding place?" (Doctrine and Covenants 121:1.) Susan Howe is better known as a poet than a playwright, and in this lyrical play the poet shines through. While depicting the five prisoners' dire predicament with accuracy and compassion, Howe's language transcends the claustrophobic cell. Howe dares to let a brooding Smith ask: "Well, Joseph, it's finally time to look at yourself. Who are you? A prophet of the Lord? No, that isn't Joseph Smith. That's a cloak under which I've been allowed to hide. But who am I? What have I done?" The play answers those questions as Smith replays scenes in his mind and gradually rises above his anguish and accepts the love offered him by his followers. The small Margetts Theatre becomes the cold, forbidding jail shared by five Mormon leaders, being held on a variety of charges in connection with the "Mormon War." When the audience enters and occupies old chairs and church pews, the prisoners are huddled under tattered blankets -- reading, writing, sleeping. Throughout that long night of despair, there is no escape, despite their efforts to tunnel through the thick stone wall. Nonetheless, there is camaraderie and humor in that dungeon. Hale plays Joseph Smith with rare insight and a remarkable emotional range, and with a remarkable resemblance. All five BYU student actors are excellent. Hale plays only one character, but the other four play both prisoners and, in the flashbacks, other characters, Mormons as well as Missourians. Howe humanizes them all. Jacob Anderson is Hyrum Smith and Phineas Hobart; Doug Stewart is prisoner Alexander McRae and the excommunicated Oliver Cowdery; Andrew Allman is Lyman Wright and Major Sam Burris; and Jacob Draper is Caleb Baldwin and Mormon farmer Hanson Jacobs. Director George D. Nelson elicited fine performances, although the timing is still off in places. Scenic designer Anne Kirkham-Black created a workable set, complete with a lookout perch where Smith can remove himself and ruminate. But the multilevel set and complex script create lighting problems not wholly solved as yet. Costume designer Jennifer Brass Jenkins manages to make the threadbare prisoners look authentic. As Joseph Smith's character unfolds in "Burdens of Earth," so does an understanding of lives lived in extreme circumstances. Howe provides a unique encounter with the crucible of faith. Anyone, Mormon or non-Mormon, would gain from the experience.n At Margetts Theatre "Burdens of Earth" is playing in Provo at Brigham Young University's Margetts Theatre in the Harris Fine Arts Center, Tuesday through Saturday at 7:30 p.m., through Feb. 24, and Feb. 17 at 2 p.m. Tickets are $10 ($8 students). Call 378-4322. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sean Lucero Subject: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 09 Feb 2001 15:02:25 -0800 (PST) I hope this is kosher, but I'm still curious about sales figures. Can any of you who have published with LDS companies offer any numbers to give me a sense of what is realistic? (Margaret--Deseret Book; Linda--Cornerstone; Rachel--Covenant; Marilyn--CFI) I know your books are very different, but it would at least give me some idea of the range. Sean Lucero _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 09 Feb 2001 12:20:04 -0700 I am corrected, Ivan. But didn't we get SOME LIST for emotions! Now, I expect everyone to refer to it like your thesaurosisus. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > Actually - we don't know all that - that theory has been disproven. > Eskimos have no more words for snow then we do (snow, powder, hardpack, slush, > etc.) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ethan Skarstedt Subject: Re: [AML] Who Is Cornerstone? Date: 08 Feb 2001 23:13:02 -0800 Thanks for the information on Cornerstone. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 09 Feb 2001 23:18:48 -0700 "The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub where these other two theaters are and probably gets the same audience as long as they aren't doing the same shows. Unless it can find something else to set it apart from the others, the competition may be too much." Marilyn speaking about the Villa--you are absolutely right. We're a bit on the fringe and definitely investigating new possibilities (more original work to avoid royalties, etc., Mormon works, more youth theatre). We had season tickets to PTC and loved it. Our only saving force is our youth program. Bill writes: There have been over ten thousand youngsters who have benefited through our programs since their inception. 30% of our revenues must come from donations. The lukewarm reviews don't help us either, (and TV and sports). Bill would like to see several different reviewers who have different points of view. But you are right, we keep plugging along. Bill says it would be a shame to lose PTC and our theatre also. Again, we do have to do something different. We are looking forward to running Eric's three one acts, THREE WOMEN, which will run for six performances Feb. 22-March 5 in our Little Brown Theatre, 239 S. Main. Please come! Previously, Bill was grateful to work with Eric in his ACCOMMODATIONS at BYU. We had 9 plays submitted to this year's play contest, and some of them look interesting and produceable. Noreen Astin, theatre PhD from BYU is our chair. A great critic! Winners will be announced shortly. The 2001 competition must be entered (postmarked) by June 30, 2001. With mortgages and the gas and electric sky-rocketing (both bills over $1,000 a month) you better believe we are casting about to do something to save ourselves! Glad for this post. Now, playwrights, is the time to WRITE! Marilyn and Bill Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Critical Terms Date: 09 Feb 2001 23:44:03 -0700 I printed this one off to save it! Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2001 10:21 AM D Michael got the definition wrong for Samuelsensory. It's not "Theatre critics suck." It's "Theatre critics suck unless they like me." Otherwise, what a fun post. I laughed, I cried . . . Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Providing Escape: A Writer's Job? Date: 10 Feb 2001 02:02:00 -0700 William Morris wrote: > This idea of distancing the reader corresponds to D. > Michael's reference in the 'flashbacks' thread to > frame stories. Now how did my name get associated with distancing the reader? I'm against that. I don't read novels to be distanced from the character or for escape. I read them to jump headlong _into_ experiences I can't have in real life. I have no need to escape from real problems into a feel-good fantasy land. I need escape from humdrum daily life into big-time problems, danger, and action. I want to vicariously experience having horrendous choices to make, digging up extraordinary courage to face things most people will never face. Don't distance me; let me crawl into the character's shoes and go for it. > My creative writing instructor told me that you don't all > of a sudden turn off the character's pov and switch to > another pov because it's confusing to the reader. A > couple of years later I read Kafka's short story > 'Judgement' where that very thing happens in the last > two or three sentences of the story---for a somewhat > similar reason to why mine had done the same thing. That's what you get for listening to an academic tell you how to write. If it's a choice between some teacher and Kafka, guess whose judgment I'll pick. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] MN Cope, Swindle and Black Join Forces for Life of Christ Date: 09 Feb 2001 00:45:21 -0700 > [From Mormon-News] > > Cope, Swindle and Black Join Forces for Life of Christ Project > Artistic Collaboration Will Set New Standard in Religious Art For an instant, I thought "Cope, Swindle, and Black" was a sleazy law firm. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 10 Feb 2001 11:27:35 -0700 On Tue, 06 Feb 2001 16:08:57 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" writes: > In the audition, Shelley Graham was far and away the > best actress in the room. I called her back, and she came into the > callback audition, and absolutely nailed the character. My > playwright turned to me and said, 'that's it. That role is cast.' > And I told him 'I can't use her.' Because the character said the > F-word, and Shelley won't. We'd even talked about it earlier in the > day, and she'd said to me, 'I won't say it. I'd love to do this > show. But I won't say that word on-stage.' > > So the playwright stared at me, and he picked up his script and > re-read it. Then he turned to me and said 'I have to have her in my > show. She's the best actress I've seen in my life. I have to have > her. I'll cut the language.' And so Shelley did the part, and was, > predictably, superb. I would like to offer another testimony to the talent of that fine actress. I directed Shelley in Tim Slover's "March Tale" last Summer and was completely charmed by her ability, bravery and devotion to her craft. And she's just a dang sweet girl in the bargain. She had difficult things to do in that show -- in terms of character; walking the fine line between near-farcical comedy and near-melodramatic tragedy -- plus some rather intricate technical shenanigans that stretched her patience to unbelievable limits -- and all with a smile and a laugh and an attitude of pure professionalism. There are a handful of actors around that have considerable talent, and professionalism with no ego, but plenty of assertiveness who(m?) I would work with in any capacity with no hesitations at all. Shelley is in that group. I hope she stays in Utah for awhile ... I'm dying to work with her again. J. Scott Bronson--The Scotted Line "World peace begins in my home" "Anybody who sees live theatre should come out a little rearranged." Glenn Close - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 10 Feb 2001 14:23:35 -0700 --------------836CE9EFF94070E3232CCA3A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ah, but you see, the play and the production starring Donny itself WASN'T a failure; it was the New York critics who killed it. Most people are unaware that prior to the play's move to Broadway, the production sold out several weeks worth of shows in Washington D.C. and, I believe it was, Baltimore. The same cast took the play to New York where the critics did what critics do; they criticized. Promoters backed out, taking dollars with them, and the show closed. Anyone who has had the chance to see Donny perform live in Joseph knows that the quality of Donny's performance of Broadway music can never be questioned. He has an incredible voice, and I, for one, can't wait to hear the new album. I hope any skeptics among you will at least give him a chance to prove what he can do. Lu Ann Staheli "J. Scott Bronson" wrote: > Donny has a sense of humor. > > Shortly after the first incarnation of the Donny & Marie show was > cancelled he made a try at Broadway with "Little Johnny Jones." It was a > dismal failure. The critics killed him. Now he has a new album of songs > from Broadway shows. The closing song is from "Little Johnny Jones." > Give My Regards to Broadway. > > I think that is so sublime. > > scott > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm --------------836CE9EFF94070E3232CCA3A Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ah, but you see, the play and the production starring Donny itself WASN'T a failure; it was the New York critics who killed it. Most people are unaware that prior to the play's move to Broadway, the production sold out several weeks worth of shows in Washington D.C. and, I believe it was, Baltimore. The same cast took the play to New York where the critics did what critics do; they criticized. Promoters backed out, taking dollars with them, and the show closed. Anyone who has had the chance to see Donny perform live in Joseph knows that the quality of Donny's performance of Broadway music can never be questioned. He has an incredible voice, and I, for one, can't wait to hear the new album. I hope any skeptics among you will at least give him a chance to prove what he can do.
Lu Ann Staheli

"J. Scott Bronson" wrote:

Donny has a sense of humor.

Shortly after the first incarnation of the Donny & Marie show was
cancelled he made a try at Broadway with "Little Johnny Jones."  It was a
dismal failure.  The critics killed him.  Now he has a new album of songs
from Broadway shows.  The closing song is from "Little Johnny Jones."
Give My Regards to Broadway.

I think that is so sublime.

scott

-
AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature
http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm

--------------836CE9EFF94070E3232CCA3A-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Paxton on HOWE, _Burdens of Earth_ Date: 08 Feb 2001 00:09:42 +0900 [MOD: Here is the column/review Andrew mentioned previously, which originally appeared in May 1997, reposted with Rober Paxton's permission.] LATTER-DAY STAGES: HOWE, _Burdens of Earth_ by Robert Paxton Last week I reviewed _Digger_, a play about a young, exuberant Joseph Smith. Susan Howe's _Burdens of Earth_ (published in the November 1987 _Sunstone_) depicts a very different Joseph, a discouraged, beaten man, weighed down by feelings of guilt for the suffering of all the Saints who have followed him. Howe tackles Joseph at perhaps his lowest point, when he was confined in Liberty Jail. And where some Latter-day Saints might feel the Joseph of _Digger_ is too flawed, not saintly enough, they might similarly disapprove of Howe's Joseph for seeming to lack faith and endurance. It's not the portrait many of us want to see of our prophets. _Burdens of Earth_ is set in Liberty Jail in March 1839. Joseph, his brother Hyrum, Caleb Baldwin, Alexander McRae, and Lyman Wight are fellow prisoners suffering the cold and the tedium. All the actors but the one playing Joseph double as other characters in memory flash-back scenes taking place in Joseph's mind: the anti-Mormon Missourians Phineas Hobart and Major Sam Burris; the excommunicated Oliver Cowdery; and the faithful but sorely tested Hanson Jacobs. The action of the play is largely psychological, as Joseph tries to figure out what sin he is guilty of to cause the loss of Zion, the suffering of the Saints, and his imprisonment. Though there are brief episodes of physical activity, such as when the prisoners dig a hole in the wall for their escape or momentarily scuffle in their fatigue and frustration, most of the time the physical movement of the play is defined by the restless inactivity imposed by the cramped quarters. But Joseph's mind ranges far and wide, across time as well as space. He is tortured by three characters: Hanson Jacobs, Oliver Cowdery, and himself. Hanson fought his own conversion, and when he finally gave up family and past to join the Mormons in Ohio, Joseph immediately sent him to Missouri, where he was beaten, his wife was repeatedly violated by the mob, and his child suffered injury and illness. Hanson cursed Joseph, and Joseph now bears the weight and blames himself for these sufferings, multiplied by the number of Saints who had similarly suffered. Oliver is the primary object of Joseph's torment. He had opposed Zion, spoken against the prophet, and was subsequently excommunicated. According to the play, Hyrum and others wrote a threatening letter to Oliver, and Major Burris and Hobart try to recruit Oliver to bring a lawsuit against Joseph, insisting the Prophet arranged the letter, even though his signature was not attached. Oliver refuses to go along without first talking to one of the signatories, and he chooses Hanson Jacobs, knowing him to be an honest man. Of course the Missourians get to Hanson first, and thus the mobbing. Joseph spends much of the play trying to figure out how he is to blame for Oliver's betrayal, and seeking an alternate course of action which he could have pursued to avoid that betrayal and all the suffering the Saints were then enduring. He is obsessive about his own guilt, and Hyrum spends much of the play trying to distract Joseph from his morbid thoughts. The emotional wrangling almost becomes tedious in its single-mindedness and unnecessary repetition. But just before it overwhelms the reader (I wish I could speak of the viewer as well, but I have not had the fortune of seeing this play produced) Howe shifts to the conflicts between the various memory characters for a welcome change. Finally Joseph is brought to himself by a realization that led to the beautiful and comforting revelation of D&C 122. This realization is spurred by an apology and a plea from Hanson, played by the same actor portraying Caleb. Caleb, not realizing Joseph has seen Hanson instead of him, then takes credit for bringing Joseph out of his depression. (Caleb Baldwin is a direct-line ancestor of mine, and I didn't find the depiction very flattering, though it is dramatically defensible.) This recovery of Joseph's, the climax of the play, suffers from a too-hasty resolution, and weakens the impact of the play. After so much wallowing in depression and despair, such a quick turnaround is not only unsatisfying, but it also strains believability. And though the language throughout the play is delightfully apt, the rough paraphrase of D&C 122 here disappoints. Nevertheless, _Burdens of Earth_ is a play well worth the investment of time or the price of a ticket. It tackles a difficult subject and a near-impossible character in a way that humanizes him. It makes Joseph accessible by bringing him into a smaller perspective, yet it manages to diminish neither the man nor the mantle. And that is no mean achievement. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 11 Feb 2001 08:46:24 -0700 >Now _Escape_ is no great filmmaking. But still I was drawn in wondering >what the heck was going on. What the heck _was_ going on turned out to >be pretty cheesy, a reminder that you also need to be sure to make your >payoff satisfying. But the mystery still drew me in. It seems to me that Escape to Witch Mountain must be based on The People, a series of stories by a Mormon SF writer named Zenna Henderson. A mediocre movie with William Shatner was also based on it, appearing fairly soon after classic Trek was cancelled, as I recall. It also had that actress who played Miri in a Trek episode, but her name escapes me. I like Henderson's stories about a peaceful people from another world who must come here because their planet was dying, then had to hide their abilities because you know how we Earthlings treat people who can do stuff we can't. barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 11 Feb 2001 18:52:09 -0600 At 05:02 PM 2/9/01, you wrote: >I hope this is kosher, but I'm still curious about sales figures. Can any of >you who have published with LDS companies offer any numbers to give me a >sense of what is realistic? > >(Margaret--Deseret Book; Linda--Cornerstone; Rachel--Covenant; Marilyn--CFI) > >I know your books are very different, but it would at least give me some >idea of the range. > >Sean Lucero Sean, Since you asked me specifically I'll try to give an answer. Keep in mind, my book has only been out seven months. I know before Christmas I'd sold around 1000 copies; I don't know where I'm at right now. Plus I'm a first-time author and haven't been able to do much personal promotion--yet. That does make a difference. Bestsellers, such as _Standing for Something_ and _Between Husband and Wife,_ I'd heard reported (I believe on this List) selling around 50,000 copies in a few months. _The Work and the Glory_ also sells "like hotcakes" as do Chris Heimerdinger's _Tennis Shoes Among the Nephites_ books, but I don't know the figures. Another LDS author, Kristen Randle, once told me 5,000 total copies sold was great for the LDS market, but (I believe) it's been several years since she's published with an LDS publisher--she's national now. So I don't know if that's still a good estimate, with the fiction market increasing like it has been. I'm guessing the background for your question is that you have something to market, and are wondering whether to try the national or the LDS market. If so, that's good discussion material. There's advantages to each. The main advantage to LDS publishers is, you don't need an agent to have them look at your manuscript. The main disadvantage to LDS publishers is, you don't have an agent. :-) LDS publishers are known for not giving advances and not *liking* agents, even if you do have one. They may not even work with you if you show up with an agent. Yet without an agent to show you the ropes and work on your side, you're left alone in the contract negotiation process. Now, I don't know if the no-advance issue is true for Gerald Lund, Weyland, and the like, but for everybody else it is. All the major LDS publishers can distribute their products through the major LDS channels--Deseret Book, Seagull, etc. They'll get your book to the LDS book-buying customers. For the record, I queried a number of national publishing houses about _Prodigal Journey_ before accepting Cornerstone's offer. Most came back with: "Get an agent or we won't even look." I didn't try hard for an agent. I decided an LDS publisher was the way for me to go, because they wouldn't require me to take out my LDS references, without which the book cannot stand on its own. (The series is about events leading up to the building of New Jerusalem in Missouri.) In the future I hope to market other books nationally, and will work to find a good agent at that point. I'm not ready to make the jump yet. I'm rambling. This is probably more info than you wanted and less info on what you needed. Hope something in here was worth the effort of reading! Linda Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 09:21:15 -0700 Realistic numbers: >From my experience, short story collections are lucky if they sell 500 copies--unless it's an anthology including a big name like Jack Weyland or Scott Card. A good, fairly typical run for other Deseret Book stuff would be 5,000-6,000 books sold (shelf life being about three years). I take that figure from Gene England, who has reported that his books sold about that number. Covenant, with its remarkable advertising and its attention to the highly marketable romance novel, has shown that it can far out-do that. I believe someone on the list said that _Pillars of Fire_ (not a romance novel, but something VERY well supported by Covenant) had 25,000 pre-sales. Gerald Lund's books (Deseret) have sold over a million. The sales of Dean Hughes WW2 series are in the 100,000's. A Deseret Book publication which sold only 2,000 (such as my _House Withou Walls_) would be considered a fairly poor performance. That's the range, as far as I can tell. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 11 Feb 2001 22:37:48 -0600 [MOD: Long, long ago, before I decided to take over moderating from Ben Parkinson, I put out a call for some guest columns to revive the old "Writer's Angle" column that Ben had occasionally written from time to time. Among other requests I put out was one to Linda Adams, about her experience of writing a book. At the time, she was too busy--but though I have dropped the ball on this, she has not. Thanks, Linda. And if any of the rest of you have particular observations, experiences, etc., that you would like to write up in column format for consideration in this space, please feel free to send them my way.] WRITER'S ANGLE The Journey of Prodigal Journey: my seven-year itch to get into print by Linda P. Adams When people ask how long it took me to write the 500-plus pages of _Prodigal Journey_, I answer, "I'm not sure." It's my second-most frequently asked question. I give this vague answer because the number one question people ask is a desperate, "When's Volume 2 coming out?" (The answer: Summer 2001.) I don't want to scare them by saying, "Oh, Volume One took about seven years." The seven year figure is accurate and inaccurate at once. Yes, from the time I wrote the first chapter in 1993 to the time I held my book in my hands last summer was seven years. The actual writing, however, didn't take up nearly all that time. I'm honestly not sure how long the writing and editing process was. It was put together piecemeal, one tiny bit at a time, writing faster near the end of the process than in the beginning. I stated in the preface to _Prodigal Journey_ that there was a certain chapter that started this whole snowball rolling. It's Chapter 37, "The Stranger," in which my protagonist, Alyssa, is healed of an injury by a man she later discovers is Jesus Christ. I saw the scene as a picture: Alyssa's face looking up, grimy and drawn, as he calls her by name and lifts her up. I wrote it down. After that, I had to find out who Alyssa was, her history, where she was going. Vague, shadowy images formed in my mind about her family and personal relationships. It seemed to me, even that early on, that this scene was a tiny piece of a giant whole; an epic story revolving somehow around the building of the New Jerusalem in Independence. It wasn't written in order at all. First I finished the final chapters of the book, detailing where Alyssa went after her healing, and "met" Peter and his family. More ideas regarding the plot kept coming, and I wrote them down as I had time. At this point in my life, "writing time" was infrequent. Sarah, my third child, was an infant. I'd just had three babies in three years, two still in diapers. Largely because of the actual demands of all the babies, and partly due to a hope of being a "normal" Molly-Mormon style Mommy, I had put all writing completely on hold until I wrote this one fateful chapter. Let me back up a bit. I've always wanted to write. I started writing creative stories in grade school, started writing poetry in high school (horrific verse loaded with teen angst), and took every creative writing class I could manage during my four years at BYU. When the babies started coming (after college), I stopped writing completely. I assumed I couldn't be a Good Mormon Mom and a writer at the same time. This is an issue I still struggle with, though I'm learning how to find balance between the two. I also discovered--with that one chapter--that I couldn't just "stop" writing. It's in my blood; the drive isn't going away, whatever the result. Being published helps. Taking time for writing feels less subversive than it used to. I still feel odd; I don't spend weekends scrapbooking, I'm a terrible housekeeper, and I don't quite fit in any standard LDS cultural mold. Thankfully, I don't mind feeling odd, have grown comfortable with my identity, and never cared for crafts in the first place. But I do talk to my children, all the time, and make sure I'm there for all their crossroads, and do my best at this parenting business. It worked out that the bulk of the manuscript was finished about the same time we got our first real home computer. (Before that, I used spiral notebooks and an ancient 8086 [XT] with a 5" floppy.) We connected to the Internet, and I discovered AML-List. I got up the courage to throw some of what I felt was my better work on a free Geocities site (which I've since moved to Earthlink), including the preface chapters of my book. I still questioned whether to continue spending time on the novel. I questioned my ability to write. Often I thought I should just give up. I spent a good deal of time on my knees and in the temple asking whether this was something I ought to be spending time doing. My answers were clear and refreshing: _keep going_. I don't make this statement to assert I have any extra-special Talent from God. I don't know that. I'm only saying this answer brought me peace, to know He encouraged me to write, that I was on the right path for my life. I also found if I was going to write about the Last Days and the establishment of the New Jerusalem, I had to do a LOT of research. I turned primarily to scripture, which I've searched thoroughly. I also read many books on latter-day prophecy (some spurious, some not), and researched general Mormon folklore on latter-day subjects. I even learned a new word: _eschatology_, the study of the last days before the end of the world as prophesied in scripture. I've also had to learn the myriad of differences between our own, fluid Mormon eschatology, and the more strict interpretation of prophesied events demanded by other Christian faiths. It's been an education. To continue with my publishing history, not long after establishing my web presence, I was contacted by Richard Maher Associates (formerly Richard Maher NE LDS Publishing & Distributing). They were interested in the book. Eric Knight had read the chapters on my website after hearing about it from a post I made on AML-List. It's clear to me that in many direct ways, I have AML-List to thank that this novel is in print today. I also workshopped the first few chapters through an AML-List writer's group offered at that time. With the help of my group, especially critique from List member Scott Parkin, I was able to rewrite the first segments with stronger, more realistic characters and correct some beginner's mistakes. I did sign with Richard Maher, finishing the last missing segments of the manuscript, and going through my first experience of being edited. While working with them eventually didn't work out, it was a helpful experience overall. In January of 1999, they wrote to inform me they would be unable to publish the book for at least two more years due to financial constraints. As this delay was not allowed for in the contract, and since I'd gained enough confidence in my work by this point to feel I could market it elsewhere, I exercised my right to cancel the contract. Although disappointing, by then I was ready to shop the manuscript around. I'd never done this before. It was rejected by over a dozen houses, small and large, including the major LDS Publishers, except for Cornerstone. They showed an interest right away. Still, I deferred accepting their offer until I'd heard from everyone else. They were new, and small, and I'd just been jilted by another small LDS press. I didn't want that to happen again. I explained to Richard Hopkins I was once bitten, twice shy, and he was patient waiting for my answer; he was also patient in explaining he could deliver what he promised. I signed my contract with them by December of 1999. The editing process went well. I felt Richard was able to spot problem areas we had previously overlooked at Richard Maher, and he has a scrupulous eye for fine detail. Finally, after seemingly endless phone calls and e-mails over details--cover design, choosing the series title, last minute edits--in July of 2000 I received the Box: a large package containing author's copies of my 517-page novel. It was a day I thought might never come, the whole publishing process an act of faith for me. This was my witness. I held my own book in my hands. It felt terrific. The scary thing now was, it was _Volume One_. I have to keep producing. I had to outline the next two volumes before we printed the first, to make sure any elements I plan to develop are properly referenced in the first book. I know the story isn't fully told yet, and am as anxious to finish the rest as my readers seem to be to read it. I have days where I feel I've taken on too much, yes. I've had two more children since that first chapter was written, plus two miscarriages. I was pregnant with this fifth child when I opened that box of author's copies; Rebekah was born in September. Large chunks of manuscript have been typed in one-handed while a baby (either Jacob, my fourth, or now Rebekah) nurses in my lap. And behind the scenes, supporting me all the way, has been my loving husband, Steve. He's always been there, waiting to read my rough draft as it spools out of my head, discussing ideas with me, and telling me I'm terrific and that I shouldn't give up. I wrote in the acknowledgements of _Prodigal Journey_ that without him I might stuffed the whole thing through a paper shredder. It's true. In some ways I wonder if I've opened Pandora's box. If maybe I'd be better off if I _had_ chosen the paper-shredder route instead. I wonder if anyone who reads it will notice the attention to detail I strive for, my deeper themes, or how the structure correlates to Jesus' parable of the prodigal son. (This last thing was actually unintentional, something I didn't notice myself until I was nearly finished and searching for the perfect title. I was surprised it was there.) All I usually hear is, "When's the next book coming?" Which is nice, too, of course. I'm working on it. Right after I finish this article. Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 12:25:15 -0700 Sean, we print 300 the first time, and keep reprinting as long as it sells. Usually about 2,000. I love this way of printing because if it doesn't sell you aren't left with stacks of remainders. And you can always do more. Most publishing companies print 5,000 and are happy if they sell that many. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Melissa Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 12 Feb 2001 13:08:24 -0700 On Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:46:24 -0700, Barbara R. Hume wrote: >>Now _Escape_ is no great filmmaking. But still I was drawn in wondering >>what the heck was going on. What the heck _was_ going on turned out to >>be pretty cheesy, a reminder that you also need to be sure to make your >>payoff satisfying. But the mystery still drew me in. > >It seems to me that Escape to Witch Mountain must be based on The = People, a >series of stories by a Mormon SF writer named Zenna Henderson. =20 The movie "Escape to Witch Mountain" is based on the novel by the same = name written by Alexander Key. But it's not impossible that Key was = influenced by Henderson, since he was writing several years after her. The book is quite different from the movie. "Escape" was remade in 1998 or 1999, = can't remember which, but I didn't see all of it...it seemed very different = both from the book and from the first movie. >I like Henderson's stories about a peaceful people from another world = who >must come here because their planet was dying, then had to hide their >abilities because you know how we Earthlings treat people who can do = stuff >we can't. So do I. All her stories are good, some better than others. One that stands out for me is about a teacher complaining about three boys and the "mess" they're making with this imaginative game that turns out to be, = well, more important than she imagines.... Melissa Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Darlene Young Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 12 Feb 2001 12:06:53 -0800 (PST) Thank you for resurrecting the Writer's Angle column. I especially enjoyed Linda's description of the process of coming to accept the place of writing in her life. I too as a Mormon mother have spent hours on my knees wondering if it is OK to spend the time writing that I want to. (If I spent all the time writing that I do praying, think what I'd have written! Not to presume to compare the importance of those two activities in my life . . . ) Anyway, it's so encouraging to read stories of how others have pulled it all off. Thanks. ===== Darlene Young [MOD: Well... I can't really claim to have "resurrected" it. Rather, I'm making the space available. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to line up columns and such in the way that Ben did...but I will promise to give a look at anything anyone sends my way.] __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 12 Feb 2001 13:22:56 -0700 Barbara R. Hume wrote: >> Now _Escape_ is no great filmmaking. But still I was drawn in wondering >> what the heck was going on. What the heck _was_ going on turned out to >> be pretty cheesy, a reminder that you also need to be sure to make your >> payoff satisfying. But the mystery still drew me in. > > > It seems to me that Escape to Witch Mountain must be based on The People, a > series of stories by a Mormon SF writer named Zenna Henderson. What I found disatisfying about Escape was its (to me) inappropriate mixing of genres. What started off as a typical ghost story turned out, in fact, to be a science fiction story. I'm not suggesting that those genres shouldn't be mixed, but Escape did in a _deus ex machina_ way, so that the sf ending seemd tacked on as the easiest way to explain what had been going on. I would have like to have seen more foreshadowing of the real ending, while still making it appear to be a ghost story, so that when the real endings comes, I'm going back over events in the movie and saying to mylelf, "Now, that makes sense." Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gerald G Enos Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 12 Feb 2001 15:48:45 -0700 I remember a movie called 'The People' and yes it is simular to 'Escape to Witch Mountain'. I have always thought that the two stories came from the same source. I, however, had no idea that that source could have been a member of the church. Of course, when I saw them I wasn't a member and that sort of thing would not have caught my attention. Konnie Enos ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sean Lucero Subject: [AML] Re: Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 15:49:27 -0800 (PST) Thank you all for the information. That's helpful. Sean Lucero _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 12 Feb 2001 17:14:38 -0700 > >Now _Escape_ is no great filmmaking. But still I was drawn in wondering >>what the heck was going on. What the heck _was_ going on turned out to >>be pretty cheesy, a reminder that you also need to be sure to make your >>payoff satisfying. But the mystery still drew me in. > >It seems to me that Escape to Witch Mountain must be based on The People, a >series of stories by a Mormon SF writer named Zenna Henderson. A mediocre >movie with William Shatner was also based on it, appearing fairly soon >after classic Trek was cancelled, as I recall. It also had that actress who >played Miri in a Trek episode, but her name escapes me. "Escape to Witch Mountain" was, as mentioned earlier, based on an Alexander Key novel (though it is possible he was influenced by Zenna Henderson, which was also mentioned). A made-for-TV movie of Henderson's "The People" was made in 1972, starring William Shatner and directed by John Korty (who also directed, the same year, "Go Ask Alice," which was based on a book by Beatrice Sparks, known in Utah County for also writing "Jay's Journal," which was based far-too-loosely on the life and death of a Pleasant Grove teen) (whew!). Kim Darby (who did play Miri in the "Star Trek" episode called "Miri") co-starred with Shatner. "Escape to Witch Mountain" (1975) and "Return from Witch Mountain" (1978) were both Disney films; Disney also did a third part, "Beyond Witch Mountain" (1982) as a made-for-TV feature, as well as a 1995 remake of "Escape to Witch Mountain." All of this information and more is free for the taking at the Internet Movie Database (www.imdb.com). It's fun! Eric D. Snider -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 12 Feb 2001 17:37:17 -0700 >What I found disatisfying about Escape was its (to me) inappropriate >mixing of genres. What started off as a typical ghost story turned out, >in fact, to be a science fiction story. I'm not suggesting that those >genres shouldn't be mixed, but Escape did in a _deus ex machina_ way, so >that the sf ending seemd tacked on as the easiest way to explain what >had been going on. I would have like to have seen more foreshadowing of >the real ending, while still making it appear to be a ghost story, so >that when the real endings comes, I'm going back over events in the >movie and saying to mylelf, "Now, that makes sense." H'mmmm. I never assumed it was going to turn out to be a ghost story. Maybe that's simply something you brought to the movie, Thomk. barbara hume - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 15:54:59 -0800 (PST) Since the responses to this query so far have been mainly based on anecdotal evidence (Margaret Young citing England's numbers; Linda Adams letting us know her own), I take it that there hasn't been a 'scholarly' study of the development of the Mormon publishing market. Or has there and nobody on the list has brought it up yet? The reason I ask is that in my field (comparative literature) the study of secondary sources--sales figures, reviews, anthologies, correspondence between editors and authors, etc.--is rather hot right now. Part of the return to 'context' I guess. But also a way for 'minor' literatures to show how European (i.e. English, French, and German) theoretical structures for analzying literature (including genre classifications) come up short when applied to 'minor' literatures because they were conceived within a different market history i.e. publishing conditions, critical reception, modes of dissemination and pedagogy, and reading publics all influence the theories of literature that are produced in the academy. Therefore, any legitimate criticism must take into account the peculiar history of a particular literature (while recognizing that the dominant theories, histories and practices of literary production do often influence the minor literatures as well). Considering that a only a few publishing houses and journals have constituted most of the market for Mormon fiction, it seems like such a study would be manageable at this point in time and that it would be a great resource for authors interested in the Mormon market and to scholars who are interested in weaving those sources into the history of Mormon literature. Since the study of Mormon literature remains a marginal activity (I guess it's up to England and UVSC right now), I'm not surprised that nothing has been done in this field. While I'm too lazy to do it myself, I just wanted to say that I would love to have access to sales figures (say, 2000 all the way back to 1970 or so) for the major fiction titles put out by the various Mormon publishers. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marie Knowlton" Subject: [AML] VIP Arts Playwriting Contest Date: 12 Feb 2001 17:59:56 -0700 The VIP Arts Playwriting Contest 2001 is now underway! The contest is open to anyone, and there is no entry fee. There are no limits on individual entries. Plays must be two hours or less in running length, including intermission. Pages should be numbered. The author's name should appear only on a cover sheet in a separate envelope. Each entry should be mailed separately. Include SASE if you wish your script returned. Plays must be suitable for family audiences. Winners will be given a staged reading and considered for production. Entries must be postmarked no later than midnight, June 30, 2001. Send entries to: Bill or Marilyn Brown, or Marie Knowlton 254 S. Main St., Springville, UT 84663 _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Willson" Subject: Re: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 12 Feb 2001 19:48:58 -0700 All I can say to this sad commentary, is I feel sorry for the spiritually bereft souls who bought this book, only to give it to someone else as a $17.95 Christmas Gift with no intentions of reading it themselves. This is their loss. Personally I feel this book has a vital message, from the living prophet, for the general population of the world. It wouldn't hurt any of the "Know It All " members to read it either. Who knows, someone might get a clue. Regards, Bill Willson ----- Original Message ----- > I'm going to suggest that the publishers will be disappointed. My guess is > that they'll discover that most of the hard-backed copies of this book were > bought as something to give rather than as something to read. A hardcover > book is a better gift than a paperback. Let's see. This would be a good > test case. I'll be delighted if I'm wrong. > > Marvin Payne - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 22:01:17 -0700 >>> rareyellow@yahoo.com 02/12/01 04:54PM >>> > >Since the responses to this query so far have been >mainly based on anecdotal evidence (Margaret Young >citing England's numbers; Linda Adams letting us know >her own), I take it that there hasn't been a >'scholarly' study of the development of the Mormon >publishing market. Or has there and nobody on the >list has brought it up yet? =20 Probably the closest thing to what you describe is: _The Mormon media market_, by Al R. Young, Roger Reynolds, Kenneth A. = Haubrock. =20 Orem, Utah : Cumorah Publishing Company, 1981. =20 It was a _Writer's Guide_ type book, an annotated guide to LDS book, = periodical, and music publishers. It didn't give sales figures, and is, of = course, completely outdated. MBA - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brent J. Rowley" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 12 Feb 2001 22:35:24 -0700 Writing a series seems to be the way to go in the LDS market. In fact that was just about the first question Covenant asked me when I submitted my first book. "Will there be more?" Covenant has done extremely well with just about every series they've published: romance, adventure, youth, adult. Although I'm not with them anymore, my series is still doing okay. (I don't mind sharing statistics with the list.) My total sales at this point (including Covenant and Self Published - 1997 to the present) are approximately 7,000+ of book one, 4000+ of book two, and nearly 2,000 of book three. Not fantastic -- but okay, especially since I was off the shelf for nearly two years and have only been back since June 2000. I'm hoping sales will continue to grow as I re-capture my audience. It appears that each time another volume is added to the series, it helps sell the earlier ones and keeps all the books on the shelf for a much longer period of time. -BJ Rowley - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 13 Feb 2001 01:08:54 -0700 Linda Adams wrote: > I assumed I couldn't be a Good Mormon Mom and a writer at the > same time. This is an issue I still struggle with, though I'm learning how > to find balance between the two. I hope you mean you still struggle with finding the balance, and not that you still struggle with whether you should write or not. My elders quorum president, who has been unemployed for a few months, regaled us with an epiphany after running the entire household for a month: "Housework really sucks," he said. "I mean it really sucks! I remember a bishop telling me once that housework is not a career, and shouldn't have to be for women. Housework is just stuff that needs to get done, and everyone should be pitching in to do it. The woman has as much right to develop herself as a person and not be tied down to all that housework as the man." [Horribly paraphrased, of course.] He said he understood now what his bishop was talking about. No one should have to do that stuff full time. Does that not say it all? > I still feel odd; I > don't spend weekends scrapbooking, Whoop-de-doo. > I'm a terrible housekeeper, You know how many non-writers are also terrible housekeepers? > and I don't quite fit in any standard LDS cultural mold. Good! That's a positive. > But I do talk to my children, all the time, and > make sure I'm there for all their crossroads, and do my best at this > parenting business. That's the only important part anyway. The rest is just "stuff." > Large chunks of manuscript have been typed > in one-handed while a baby (either Jacob, my fourth, or now Rebekah) nurses > in my lap. Now doesn't that evoke an interesting image? > In some ways I wonder if I've opened Pandora's box. You mean like when Moses led the children of Israel out of Egypt? When Jesus came and preached the Gospel? When Abinadi called King Noah to repentance? When Joseph Smith gave the world a new book of scripture? Or how about when John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, George Washington, etc., declared independence from Great Britain? When Mohandas Gandhi walked to the sea and made salt in defiance of the law? When Martin Luther King told the nation about a dream he had? When Ronald Reagan told Gorbachev to "tear down this wall"? The only way to avoid opening Pandora's boxes is to accomplish nothing. > I wonder if anyone > who reads it will notice the attention to detail I strive for, my deeper > themes, or how the structure correlates to Jesus' parable of the prodigal > son. I'll notice (he he he)--you can bet I'll notice! -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 01:43:34 +0900 There is an article by Kieth Merrill in Meridan about his dream of seeing a great, Hollywood-style Mormon movie someday. http://www.meridianmagazine.com/arts/010213film.html Praticularly interesting is his discussion of the Church's abandoned efforts to make a splashy movie about Joseph Smith at one time, and the current independent production of a movie called Eye of the Storm, based on Elder John H. Groberg's book In the Eye of the Storm (Deseret), about his mission in Tonga, which is being "made by Mormons" and is in post- production. I looked it up on IDMB, and learned it is written and directed by Mitch Davis, whose only previous credit is the writer of a 1995 film called "Windrunner", about a troubled kid who recieves football coaching from the ghost of Jim Thorpe. Andrew Hall _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 13 Feb 2001 12:08:32 -0500 Something my distant cousin Eric Samuelson wrote a week or so ago has been nagging away back there where my brain should be. Maybe I don't remember too accurately (not the first time for that!) but I think he said that while the BYU actors at some big competition normally did well, the writers normally did not. And I think the failure of the writers in the big competition was ascribed to their failure to use profanity as liberally as the judges thought they should. Eric, did I read or remember your post incorrectly? Do you really think that is a determining factor? Tony Markham - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 13 Feb 2001 09:19:21 -0800 (PST) Thanks for the information, Morgan. While it may be horribly outdated, at least it could give me a glimpse of the market at that point in time which would be interesting from a scholarly pov. You know, I'm surprised, though, that no one has put together a quarterly Mormon-publishing newsletter--one that includes the music and collectible markets along with print publishing. It seems like every specialized marketing field has its own quarterly $30 -$80 a year publication. I would imagine that part of the reason might be that getting information from the various publishing houses could be difficult since the field is so competitive. Nobody would want to share information that could give a competitor a leg up. Besides, other than the journals (_Sunstone_, _Dialogue- etc.), to my knowledge there haven't been any successfully sustained, subsciption-based, meta-narrative of Mormon culture/people/business type publications. Plus, Mormon authors tend to migrate to other (hopefully, national) markets as well, so I guess I shouldn't be suprised to find out that there isn't a regular Mormon publishing market book/newsletter out there. Of course, _Irreantum_ does provide publishing news which is great because I can't go into an LDS boookstore here in the Bay Area and get a feel for what's been recently published in any of the genres because the stores around here only carry the top couple of titles and rarely stock 'literary' fiction. ~~William Morris - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: [AML] The Role of Reviewers Date: 13 Feb 2001 10:24:25 -0700 With all the talk about the role of reviewers vs. critics recently, I found the following paragraph to be a perfect example of what I consider an excellent review by an amazingly talented young man blessed with artistic insight well beyond his years. "Much humor is to be found in Shakespeare's players, and particularly with the foul, Falstaffian Kemp. ("By St. Lucy's holy armpits!" he swears, amidst other saint-based profanities.) Thom Duncan is altogether perfect in this role, playing it to the hilt and adding yet another dimension of comic black-heartedness to this uncomplicated but intelligent comedy (and tragedy) of errors." The full review of Tim Slover's play _March Tale_ can be found at: http://www.ericdsnider.com/reviews/theater/th252marchtale.php3 Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 13 Feb 2001 10:50:01 -0700 I'm so glad Eric found Beatrice Sparks! I knew her (just an acquaintance) and I was always so amazed that this nationally best selling author lived right there next to Marden Clark (practically) and she remained so "hidden." She was very successful with her writing, but I wonder if she ever considered herself a "writer" and gave talks and toured and wanted to teach classes in writing? I don't think so. Anybody know? Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > A made-for-TV movie of Henderson's "The People" was made in 1972, > starring William Shatner and directed by John Korty (who also > directed, the same year, "Go Ask Alice," which was based on a book by > Beatrice Sparks, known in Utah County for also writing "Jay's > Journal," which was based far-too-loosely on the life and death of a > Pleasant Grove teen) (whew!). - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rachel Ann Nunes" Subject: [AML] Artist Needs Business Manager Date: 13 Feb 2001 09:43:08 -0800 Hello all, Yesterday, I talked to David Lindsley, the very talented Mormon artist who is doing the paintings for my picture book, _Daughter of a King._ He is looking for a business manager to be responsible for promotion, advertising, marketing, ordering, scheduling--everything necessary to sell and market his work so that he can paint. (Especially so that he can finish the fourteen original paintings for *my* book!) Someone is needed immediately! It would be part time at first, but could easily work into full time. David has some big projects in the works, and this is a great opportunity for someone who loves both art and marketing. Details can be obtained directly from David Lindsley by calling his studio in Mapleton at 801-491- 9270. Feel free to forward to any appropriate lists. Thanks, Rachel _______________________ Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) Best-selling author of the Ariana series and This Time Forever Web page: http://www.ranunes.com E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rachel Ann Nunes" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 13 Feb 2001 11:03:05 -0800 I agree with what Linda, Marilyn, and Margaret have already said, but here is my take on the situation. Keep in mind that I know nothing about the nonfiction sales. Most of the adult paperback fiction authors I know at Covenant usually sell between 4,000 to 7,000 thousand books in the first two or three months, and then another 10 to 15 percent (of that total) in books on tape. An editor there told me several years ago that they consider a book a success if they sell out of the first printing (usually 5 to 6 thousand) within a year. One well-established paperback author I know sold around 17,000 in the first few months with a latest novel, and then maybe another 3,000 the rest of the first year. Of course, this is one of the authors who gets a good portion of the advertising dollar. This really makes the difference, though the author has little say over any of it. While Covenant does an excellent job with their fiction, basically they, like every other publisher, have to choose which books/authors to *really* promote. Personal promotion also helps a great deal, but it can't compare with the publisher's marketing dollar. The great thing about the Mormon Market is that your backlist keeps selling. If you are continually publishing, these books don't just disappear from the shelves. In fact, in a six-month period, you can earn as much or more from your backlist as you do from a new release. Other good news is that usually each new release will sell more than the one before as you gradually build a following, or at the very least it will generate sales of your previous novels. For instance, my first novel, printed FOUR years ago in Nov. 1996, still sold over 1,500 copies last year. While each year those sales go down, at least they are still selling--and sparking sales of successive backlist novels. So the question everybody always asks me: Can you make a living by publishing in the Mormon market? Well, don't go out and buy that new Lexus yet, but it is possible--AFTER many years and a immense amount of work. The trick, of course, is to keep publishing regularly. The same goes for the national market, from what I can tell (for most authors anyway). In the end, only you can decide if it's worth the effort. I admit that at times it's very frustrating to work so hard and long for a compensation that often increases too slowly. Like most authors, I keep hoping for a break-away novel that will up my sales. But most of us will agree that we didn't go into writing because of the money; writing IS the reward. Isn't it? Rachel _______________________ Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) Best-selling author of the Ariana series and This Time Forever Web page: http://www.ranunes.com E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jacob Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 13 Feb 2001 12:10:28 -0700 On Mon, 12 Feb 2001 19:48:58 -0700, Bill Willson wrote: >All I can say to this sad commentary, is I feel sorry for the = spiritually >bereft souls who bought this book, only to give it to someone else as a >$17.95 Christmas Gift with no intentions of reading it themselves. This= is >their loss. Personally I feel this book has a vital message, from the = living >prophet, for the general population of the world. It wouldn't hurt any = of >the "Know It All " members to read it either. Who knows, someone might = get >a clue. Based solely on anecdotal testimony, all the people I know who bought the book bought it for themselves *and* read it. Unlike books released by General Authorities or even Apostles, this is a book released by a = sitting Prophet--a rare thing indeed. Most members I know feel almost an = obligation not just to have it, but to read it. Jacob Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: [AML] Irreantum Testimonials Wanted Date: 13 Feb 2001 11:46:32 -0700 The AML is planning a big mailing with a nice brochure to advertise Irreantum and our other services. This is a call for testimonials about Irreantum for possible use as marketing blurbs on our flyer. If you'd be willing, please send your blurb to Chris Bigelow at chrisb@enrich.com. In particular, it would be nice to have comments on why Irreantum is unique, why it's a must-read, what it's contributing to the culture, etc. Some comments along the lines of "It's the New Yorker of Mormon letters" or other comparisons might be nice (if you really mean them, of course). Keep them pretty short, if you would. Include your name, hometown, and title (if no title related to Mormon literature, just put "subscriber"). Thanks in advance! -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: [AML] Irreantum Fiction Contest Date: 13 Feb 2001 12:09:02 -0700 The Association for Mormon Letters is pleased to announce the first annual Irreantum fiction contest. Because Irreantum is a literary quarterly dedicated to exploring Mormon culture, all contest entries must relate to the Mormon experience in some way, either explicitly or implicitly. As long as an entry doesn't exceed 8,500 words, any fictional form will be considered, including short stories and excerpts from novels, screenplays, and play scripts. Any fictional genre is welcome, including literary, mystery, romance, science fiction, fantasy, historical, and horror. The first-place author will be awarded $100, second place $75, and third place $50 (unless the judge determines entries are not of sufficient quality to merit awards). Winners agree to give Irreantum first publication rights. To facilitate blind judging, entries should be submitted with a removable cover sheet that includes the author's name, address, telephone number, e-mail address, and manuscript title*the author's name should appear on no other page of the manuscript. Stories should be double spaced in easily readable type. Entries will not be returned. Submit manuscripts by May 30, 2001, to Irreantum's fiction editor, Tory Anderson, P.O. Box 445, Levan, UT 84639. -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 13 Feb 2001 14:09:06 -0700 One little clarification: John Groberg (my uncle) did NOT suggest that his book be made into a movie, and is refusing any profits from it. Mitch Davis read the book and loved it. Non-members contributed millions of dollars for this thing to be made, and I am anticipating a really wonderful movie. Filmed in New Zealand and produced by Gerald Molen, who also produced _Schindler's List_. Andrew Hall wrote: > There is an article by Kieth Merrill in Meridan about his dream of seeing > a great, Hollywood-style Mormon movie someday. > http://www.meridianmagazine.com/arts/010213film.html > > Praticularly interesting is his discussion of the Church's abandoned > efforts to make a splashy movie about Joseph Smith at one time, and > the current independent production of a movie called Eye of the Storm, > based on > Elder John H. Groberg's book In the Eye of the Storm (Deseret), about > his mission in Tonga, which is being "made by Mormons" and is in post- > production. I looked it up on IDMB, and learned it is written and > directed by Mitch Davis, whose only previous credit is the writer of a > 1995 film called "Windrunner", about a troubled kid who recieves > football coaching from the ghost of Jim Thorpe. > > Andrew Hall > _________________________________________________________________________ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: Re: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 13 Feb 2001 16:18:02 -0500 At 12:08 PM 2/13/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Something my distant cousin Eric Samuelson wrote a week or so ago has been >nagging away back there where my brain should be. Maybe I don't remember >too accurately (not the first time for that!) but I think he said that >while the BYU actors at some big competition normally did well, the >writers normally did not. And I think the failure of the writers in the >big competition was ascribed to their failure to use profanity as >liberally as the judges thought they should. > >Eric, did I read or remember your post incorrectly? Do you really think >that is a determining factor? > >Tony Markham > If I remember, that is pretty much what he said, and I suspect that there is at least a kernel of truth in it. One of my playwriting students submitted a short play to the New Play festival in-- Is it Louisville?? Kentucky??? I'm having a serious senior moment here--about four years ago, and it came back with an almost ecstatic review-- but wasn't accepted. The comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of "modern" terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". If he would care to rephrase the play with some more 'contempory" terminology they would like to see a copy for the following year. I am not aware that he bothered but it was a disturbing communication for me. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Amy Chamberlain" Subject: [AML] Introductions: Amy G. Chamberlain Date: 13 Feb 2001 15:31:21 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0108_01C095D2.0443D900 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, all. I'm a newbie and here are my stats. My name is Amy G. (Giauque) Chamberlain. I grew up mostly in Provo and = did the BYU thing (and therefore recognize many of the names in the AML = Living Room). I got my M.A. in English from BYU in 1995. I served a = mission to Kobe, Japan in 92-93 and lived for a year in York, England in = 95-96 while working on a Ph.D. (did a whole lot of playing and traveling = as well). I'm now living in Taylorsville Utah with husband Peter and = baby Christopher. I work half-heartedly but diligently as a tech writer, = and whole-heartedly as an English instructor for the BYU Extension in = SLC.=20 So do I write? Lots of stuff. I've had a satirical short story circulate = on the internet, which was a fun phenomenon to watch, but I've never = tried to publish. Why? Because I am a COWARD. I am, however, valiantly = chipping away at said cowardice and may one day overcome it completely. = I am a big fan of Mormon writing as well, and fancy myself a good = cheerleader to my writing-inclined friends. Current project: I was involved in an LDS email list about a year ago = and found the list's dynamics fascinating. I became interested in how = these people--mainly women--resolved conflict, what they viewed as = irrefutable authority, and how they dealt with maverick opinions. The = structure of this online community struck me as worthy of study and = analysis.=20 I'm working on the rough outline of an article exploring how this online = community of Mormon women functions, and I'm thinking of Sunstone or = something similar for a possible vehicle. I'm wondering if any of you = have recommendations for books or articles that relate to this topic and = that would give me some useful theoretical background on this subject. = Are there other studies of online communities that are particularly = worth reading, for example? How about studies of authority or conflict = resolution within the church? If anyone's interested, I'd love to have your feedback--positive or = negative--on any stage of this project. Whaddaya think? Be brutally = honest; I can handle it (childbirth has made me tough). Thanks in advance, Amy=20 amyc@xmission.com =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0108_01C095D2.0443D900 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi, all. I'm a newbie and here are my=20 stats.
 
My name is Amy G. (Giauque) = Chamberlain. I grew up=20 mostly in Provo and did the BYU thing (and therefore recognize many of = the names=20 in the AML Living Room). I got my M.A. in English from BYU in 1995. I = served a=20 mission to Kobe, Japan in 92-93 and lived for a year in York, England in = 95-96=20 while working on a Ph.D. (did a whole lot of playing and traveling as = well). I'm=20 now living in Taylorsville Utah with husband Peter and baby Christopher. = I work=20 half-heartedly but diligently as a tech writer, and whole-heartedly as = an=20 English instructor for the BYU Extension in SLC.
 
So do I write? Lots of stuff. I've had = a satirical=20 short story circulate on the internet, which was a fun phenomenon to=20 watch, but I've never tried to publish. Why? Because I am a COWARD. = I am,=20 however, valiantly chipping away at said cowardice and may one day = overcome=20 it completely. I am a big fan of Mormon writing as well, and fancy = myself a=20 good cheerleader to my writing-inclined friends.
 
Current project: I was involved = in an LDS=20 email list about a year ago and found the list's dynamics fascinating. I = became interested in how these people--mainly women--resolved=20 conflict, what they viewed as irrefutable authority, and how they = dealt=20 with maverick opinions. The structure of this online=20 community struck me as worthy of = study and=20 analysis.
 
I'm working on the rough outline of an = article=20 exploring how this online community of Mormon women functions, and I'm = thinking=20 of Sunstone or something similar for a possible vehicle. I'm = wondering if=20 any of you have recommendations for books or articles that relate to = this topic=20 and that would give me some useful theoretical background on this = subject. Are=20 there other studies of online communities that are particularly worth = reading,=20 for example? How about studies of authority or conflict resolution = within the=20 church?
 
If anyone's interested, I'd love to = have your=20 feedback--positive or negative--on any stage of this = project. Whaddaya=20 think? Be brutally honest; I can handle it (childbirth has made me=20 tough).
 
Thanks in advance,
 
Amy 
amyc@xmission.com
 
 
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0108_01C095D2.0443D900-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 13 Feb 2001 17:05:13 -0700 Eric Samuelsen and I have established, via phone mail, that we are still friends. One of the hallmarks of our friendship is that we often disagree, and so it is with some (but not all) of the points that have been discussed in this thread. One last thing I'd like to discuss: Eric Samuelsen: > A B grade suggests, to me at least, that you mean the show well, >hope it succeeds, and hope people will go see it. But to most >readers and most audience members, a B is a failing grade. A B >means people will stay away. A B means the show isn't worth >spending money on. And I reply: So people are interpreting a B grade as a negative thing. I wonder how much of this misinterpretation would be eliminated if the grades were eliminated? It has always been my experience in Utah County that if you say even one negative thing about a show, people think it's a "negative" review. For whatever reason, the negative stuff makes a more lasting impact on their memories, and that's what they recall. That was the case even before I started giving letter grades; the first 100 reviews I wrote were grade-less, yet still elicited the same kind of exaggerated memories. What I'm curious about is whether it is just human nature to regard anything with a negative comment or two as a "negative review," or if it is local to Utah. My theory is that readers were accustomed to "reviews" in the Daily Herald and other local papers that were nothing but plot summaries with generic "go see this play!" taglines. When some reviews actually started criticizing some aspects of the shows, people were alarmed: Since when can a critic be so critical?! This is borne out by letters I would get, where people basically said just that. It became apparent that many regarded a "review" as nothing more than additional publicity for a show. Theaters would call and request that a review be written, it apparently not occurring to them that the review might turn out negative. Does this happen elsewhere? It's one thing, of course, to disagree with a critic's criticisms. But to be surprised that he can even make them...? I haven't reviewed anywhere else, so I don't know what happens outside of Utah County. Any insights? And back to my original point. If people are going to consider a mildly negative review as overly negative, mightn't they do that even without the letter grade? The grade gives them something concrete to remember -- "Oh, that show only got a B" -- but I wonder if the result might be the same anyway. Eric D. Snider - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 13 Feb 2001 17:13:01 -0700 Just curious--I know Marilyn's contest is every other year, due, if I remember right, in July. Is this the year? Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 13 Feb 2001 19:57:35 -0600 > > I assumed I couldn't be a Good Mormon Mom and a writer at the > > same time. This is an issue I still struggle with, though I'm learning how > > to find balance between the two. > >I hope you mean you still struggle with finding the balance, and not >that you still struggle with whether you should write or not. Actually, I know I can't quit writing, because I tried. Didn't work. But I do still struggle with the role itself, yes. When I'm writing intensively (like I am right now) my schedule can be crazy. I can get over-absorbed in my work. I have to work at not doing that to excess. I have plenty of days when I think, "What did I think I was _doing?"_ I'm grateful for the many Priesthood blessings I've had which encourage me forward. I've never once been told by the Spirit _not_ to write. In fact it's always the opposite. Without that knowledge, I doubt I could keep working to publish. Plus it's *always* a struggle for any working Mormon mother--whether it's writing (at home) or a Real Job or Career -- vs. Mothering. It goes back to Pres. Benson's directive of "Mom, come home." If I choose this path, am I still following the prophet? Am I still a good enough parent for my children? Can I actually succeed at *both* things? Really? Because if I have to choose only one, family wins out. Yet OTOH, a friend offered me some of the best parenting advice I've ever heard, years ago: You can be a full-time stay-home mom and _still_ not "be there" for your children when they need you. True. FWIW, I thought _Mr. Holland's Opus_ was one of the most depressing movies, as a writer/artist, that I've ever seen. I don't want that for myself. But my kids are vitally, fundamentally important. But I-- ...you begin to sense the battle. I think male Mormon writers have a slightly less intense struggle, although it's close to the same thing. (Especially since, with the assigned role of breadwinner, it's hard to justify writing full-time if it isn't making money to support the family, which is a non-issue for me.) >"Housework really sucks," he said. "I mean it really sucks! I remember a >bishop telling me once that housework is not a career, and shouldn't >have to be for women. Housework is just stuff that needs to get done, >and everyone should be pitching in to do it. The woman has as much right >to develop herself as a person and not be tied down to all that >housework as the man." [Horribly paraphrased, of course.] AMEN, brother. Anecdote those of you with 4+ children will understand: When my mother-in-law came to help with this baby, she caught up the laundry. As she came up the basement stairs with baskets in hand, she said, "Just the LAUNDRY is a full-time job here!" I said, "I know." That's why we have a basket for each kid, and toss the clean clothes in the right basket. (We're working on teaching them to fold. Not a ton of progress yet.) Iron? What's an iron? At least we can find our underwear... With under 4 kids, it's still physically possible to get laundry "done." After 4, especially 5, forget it. (My plan is by the time each kid is 14, they're doing their own!) And to my husband's credit--even though he's in night school for an MBA two nights a week--I turned over all the laundry to him until this book's done, and nothing is molding and we don't have "pink" socks that should be white. Housework _should_ be shared by everyone who lives in the house. I'm glad I have a husband who comprehends this. Like I said in my article, the first book couldn't have been written without him, and this is a big part of the reason why. > > I'm a terrible housekeeper, > >You know how many non-writers are also terrible housekeepers? Yeah, but my terrible housekeeping is a conscious decision. :-) I actually know how and choose not to, which makes it seem so much worse... > > But I do talk to my children, all the time, and > > make sure I'm there for all their crossroads, and do my best at this > > parenting business. > >That's the only important part anyway. The rest is just "stuff." True, and I put that in the article to stake my claim I'm doing good enough. Not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but that's unattainable anyway. > > In some ways I wonder if I've opened Pandora's box. > >You mean like when Moses led the children of Israel out of Egypt? When >Jesus came and preached the Gospel? When Abinadi called King Noah to >repentance? When Joseph Smith gave the world a new book of scripture? Or >how about when John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, George >Washington, etc., declared independence from Great Britain? When >Mohandas Gandhi walked to the sea and made salt in defiance of the law? >When Martin Luther King told the nation about a dream he had? When >Ronald Reagan told Gorbachev to "tear down this wall"? > >The only way to avoid opening Pandora's boxes is to accomplish nothing. Touche'. Thanks. It's still hard trying to do what I hope to do--establish myself as an author--when I have these five little kids 10 and under. I question my own timing. How it's going to affect my children long-term (whether I succeed at writing or not). Right now my kids are still so little, they don't know it's not exactly ordinary to have a mom who writes books. I'll either be "cool" when they hit junior high or embarrassingly strange... most likely the second, but I've got more practice being weird than being cool, anyway... > > I wonder if anyone > > who reads it will notice the attention to detail I strive for, my deeper > > themes, or how the structure correlates to Jesus' parable of the prodigal > > son. > >I'll notice (he he he)--you can bet I'll notice! >D. Michael Martindale I look forward to that review, and don't worry if it has to be as biting as your review of _Disoriented._ Pick it apart. I've been waiting for someone to do that. (Just don't kill off my sales, okay?? I have a growing family I'm trying to help feed.) <-- How's that for a guilt trip? :-) ...What I really mean here is, I think that although it _looks_ like "popular fiction" from the cover, and reads fast (most readers I hear from report they have trouble putting it down), I believe the text can hold up to critical interpretation as literature. I just find a lot of heavy-duty Literature boring. I can't write that way. Someone else wrote in they wanted to be a virus (was it you, D. Michael?). I want to be a drug. Addictive. Everybody going through withdrawals waiting for their next hit. I also want my writing to hold up to scholarly criticism. But if I have to pick between the two... it's no contest. Linda ------------ Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 00:43:54 -0700 Margaret Young wrote: > John Groberg (my uncle) did NOT suggest that his > book be made into a movie, and is refusing any profits from it. For heaven's sake, why is he doing that? He thinks there's something wrong with being compensated for his work? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 14 Feb 2001 00:46:30 -0700 Richard Johnson wrote: > The comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of "modern" > terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". If he > would care to rephrase the play with some more 'contempory" terminology > they would like to see a copy for the following year. When BYU cuts profanity from a play, that's considered censorship. Isn't forcing a playwrite to use profanity when he doesn't want to, or his play is rejected, as much a form of censorship? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tyler Moulton" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 07:47:03 -0700 Gerald Molen is producing it? Wow. He's produced a good portion of the = blockbusters that have come along in the last 20 years! (Tootsie, The = Color Purple, Rainman, Hook, Jurassic Park/Lost World, . . .) He's also a member of the Church and was born in Montana. I would be = curious if anyone knows more about him. Tyler Moulton >>> Margaret Young 02/13 2:09 PM >>> One little clarification: John Groberg (my uncle) did NOT suggest that = his book be made into a movie, and is refusing any profits from it. Mitch = Davis read the book and loved it. Non-members contributed millions of dollars = for this thing to be made, and I am anticipating a really wonderful movie. Filmed in New Zealand and produced by Gerald Molen, who also produced _Schindler's List_. Andrew Hall wrote: > There is an article by Kieth Merrill in Meridan about his dream of = seeing > a great, Hollywood-style Mormon movie someday. > http://www.meridianmagazine.com/arts/010213film.html=20 > > Praticularly interesting is his discussion of the Church's abandoned > efforts to make a splashy movie about Joseph Smith at one time, and > the current independent production of a movie called Eye of the Storm, > based on > Elder John H. Groberg's book In the Eye of the Storm (Deseret), about > his mission in Tonga, which is being "made by Mormons" and is in post- > production. I looked it up on IDMB, and learned it is written and > directed by Mitch Davis, whose only previous credit is the writer of a > 1995 film called "Windrunner", about a troubled kid who recieves > football coaching from the ghost of Jim Thorpe. > > Andrew Hall > _________________________________________________________________________= - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:54:03 -0500 At 12:46 AM 2/14/2001 -0700, you wrote: >Richard Johnson wrote: > >> The comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of "modern" >> terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". If he >> would care to rephrase the play with some more 'contempory" terminology >> they would like to see a copy for the following year. > >When BYU cuts profanity from a play, that's considered censorship. Isn't >forcing a playwrite to use profanity when he doesn't want to, or his >play is rejected, as much a form of censorship? > >-- >D. Michael Martindale >dmichael@wwno.com > Certainly, but in the case of new play submissions, the producer or dramaturg rules. He who pays the piper calls the tune. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:09:25 -0600 As I follow this discussion with regard to grading, movie reviews, etc., I can't help but draw a parallel with the academic phenomenon of grade inflation. On the one hand, university administrators inveigh against it (to the extent that at some universities, you are called in by the department chair to justify it if you seem to be giving a disproportionately high number of high grades). On the other hand, professors who care about their students are aware that in highly competitive fields, an "average" grade of a C is considered pretty poor, and even a B is not all that good. (In graduate school things get even worse: everything is treated essentially as a full grade lower than it would be if you were an undergraduate, so that a B is the moral equivalent of a C, a C is virtually a failing grade, an A isn't that impressive, and the only way you can get a "psychological A" is by publishing or presenting your paper at a conference.) I think that probably including the letter grade does sharpen the impact of reviews, since it gives something concrete on which the attention focuses. If there isn't a letter grade, then people are left instead to ponder the actual words of the review, which (one would think) would lead to a more measured understanding of what it was saying. On a separate point: If potential theater-goers were actually universally deterred by the relatively minor negative comments in the review Eric cited, I can't muster much faith in them as really being the target audience for the play. I don't think there's an easy way around this dilemma. I like the distinction Terry Jeffress made in an earlier post between a reviewer and a critic--the fact that their purposes, audiences, and qualifications are essentially different. I'm just enough of a commercialist to believe that the reviewer's first obligation has to be to his/her readers. On the other hand... clearly all of us on this List would like to see Mormon drama succeed. Personally, I always find word of mouth to be the most influential factor in determining what I see and don't see--that, and a determined friend who might decide to take me along to a performance. Which may mean that AML-List can be a fairly important venue for promoting the success of deserving dramatic presentations...but I also think it's important (particularly here) to be able to point out negatives as well as positives, what (in the opinion of the person writing) fails as well as succeeds. Hopefully, this can lead to an exchange of opinions, in which both those who like and those who dislike a particular work (or a particular aspect of it) all feel free to express their opinions--and respected in so doing. A hard goal, but one I think is crucial to the development of a true community of Mormon letters. Jonathan Langford Speaking (mostly) for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:12:33 -0600 Linda wrote: >Right now my kids are still so little, they don't know it's not exactly >ordinary to have a mom who writes books. I'll either be "cool" when they >hit junior high or embarrassingly strange... most likely the second, but >I've got more practice being weird than being cool, anyway... To which I respond: That's a good thing, because it will almost certainly be "embarrassingly strange." But that would be true whether or not you were a writer... That's what parents are for, when you're a middle schooler: to be embarrassed about. Jonathan (father this year of our first middle schooler...) jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 14 Feb 2001 09:16:58 -0700 If your novel manuscript is ready, you could win the $1,000 Marilyn = Brown Unpublished Novel Award, which is administered by the Association = for Mormon Letters. Manuscripts must be postmarked by July 1, 2001, and = mailed to: Marilyn Brown Novel Award, 125 Hobble Creek Canyon, Springville,= UT 84663. Please submit manuscripts copied on both sides of the paper and = bound with a comb binding. To facilitate blind judging, put no author = identification on the manuscript and include a sealed envelope containing = your name, address, phone number, and manuscript title. Include a = self-addressed envelope for notification of contest results, and provide = sufficient postage if you want your manuscript returned. The contest, = which takes place every other year, was won last time by Jack Harrell, = whose winning novel manuscript is under contract with Signature Books. = Honorable mentions went to Dorothy Peterson, Laura Card, and Alan R. = Mitchell, whose novel manuscript has been published by Cedar Fort as Angel = of the Danube.=20 -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to = the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT = 84663. >>> "Annette Lyon" 02/13 5:13 PM >>> Just curious--I know Marilyn's contest is every other year, due, if I remember right, in July. Is this the year? Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 09:18:50 -0700 As a member of the Seventy, he thought it would be inappropriate to look like he was somehow "selling" sacred things. His mission was and is sacred to him. Don't you think it gets a little nervous-making when GA's sell books? I've enjoyed a number of books written by GA's (and haven't cared for a number of others), but the sale of such does get into some dangerous and tempting territory. I know John never did book signings for either of his books--both of which I love, by the way. Maybe I'll even mention that he was basically commanded to write _In the Eye of the Storm_ by one of the Twelve. He complied. But don't you think it'd look bad to go into a Deseret Book and have President Hinckley signing copies of _Standing for Something_, then directing you to the cash register? "D. Michael Martindale" wrote: > Margaret Young wrote: > > > John Groberg (my uncle) did NOT suggest that his > > book be made into a movie, and is refusing any profits from it. > > For heaven's sake, why is he doing that? He thinks there's something > wrong with being compensated for his work? > > -- > D. Michael Martindale > dmichael@wwno.com > > ================================== > Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at > http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths > > Sponsored by Worlds Without Number > http://www.wwno.com > ================================== > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 14 Feb 2001 09:34:33 -0700 We were thrilled with the crowds who came to see _I Am Jane_. We added a hundred extra seats for Saturday's performance. But guess what--there was at least one complaint, and it was taken directly to BYU's president, Merrill Bateman. I don't know exactly what the complaint was, though I can guess several possibilities. It'll be interesting to see if the complaint has the power to cancel any more showings at BYU. Sadly, I wouldn't be surprised if that actually happened. It doesn't make me mad, but it's such a disappointment that someone could stop on a difficult issue and refuse to participate in or receive the gift of Jane James's life. One of our cast has really wanted to get the play to the Conference Center. I warned him that the committees who oversee what shows at the Conference Center are extremely conservative. He said, "But Margaret, the stuff in the play is all true, isn't it?" (The events are indeed ALL true, though obviously the dialogue is made up.) This good man then said, "Why should they be afraid of the truth?" When I told James Arrington about this conversation, he said, "Oh! A virgin!" [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:26:31 -0700 Tony Markham, my distant cousin, asked: >Maybe I don't remember >too accurately (not the first time for that!) but I think he said that >while the BYU actors at some big competition normally did well, >the >writers normally did not. And I think the failure of the writers in >the >big competition was ascribed to their failure to use profanity as >liberally as the judges thought they should. >Eric, did I read or remember your post incorrectly? Do you really >think >that is a determining factor? First of all, I want to be clear that nobody has ever said anything like = that to me at ACTF, certainly not that baldly. Tony is essentially = paraphrasing my own subjective impression of why we don't do well. =20 What you see at ACTF is a certain kind of play, or one of several kinds of = plays. =20 Student Play Number One: You get the playwrights who want to be David Mamet, and who write grittily = realistic plays, full of F-words, about businessmen and their wives, who = are extremely rich but it's all so empty, empty. And they're all morally = bankrupt, and they all cuss a lot. What these student writers don't = realize is that Mamet uses this kind of language for his forty and fifty = year old businessmen, because he's saying that they're all basically = juvenile, and the language makes them sound more juvenile. That insight = into human (specifically male) nature is one of the main reasons I love = Mamet's work. (Ron Shelton does the same thing as a filmmaker--his = athlete-characters are all basically potty-mouthed children who have = refused to grow up. Which is why I love films like Bull Durham and White = Men Can't Jump; he's telling the truth about that particular sub-culture). = Student playwrights think using bad language makes them sound grown-up = and sophisticated. It doesn't. It makes them sound juvenile. =20 Student Play Number Two:=20 These plays are by the Tony Kushner wannabes, who are convinced that their = own sexuality, and their own decision to embrace their own sexuality (gay, = in most cases) is the single most compelling subject in the history of the = world, and cause for celebration by all, and they use the F-word a lot = because that's how one celebrates one's sexuality. Often these plays will = also have a political dimension, a la Kushner, suggesting, for example, = that beating Matthew Shepherd to death was really really wrong. The F-word = makes this point strongly too, apparently. Well, I think beating Matthew = Shepherd to death WAS really wrong; can any reasonable person in the world = disagree? What they miss is Kushner's poetry, Kushner's subtlety, = Kushner's theatrical magic. I find these sorts of plays unbearably = tedious, with very few very rare exceptions. =20 Student Play Number Three: The model for this play is Steve Martin's Picasso at the Lapin Agile, and = the way the play works is if you put, for example, Groucho Marx, Gloria = Steinem and Nixon in a bar together, hilarity will ensue. A favorite = comedic moment of such work is to have, say, Nixon, let slip an F bomb, = then clap his hands over his mouth amusingly. In the discussion periods = following such plays, the word 'post-modern' is bandied about. Now, my students aren't interested in these subjects. The packet of plays = we sent this time included a terrific play about working in a nursing home = with Alzheimer's patients, which was generous and compassionate and = heartbreaking. Another play in our stack was about a young married = couple, in which the husband says "I did everything I was supposed to. I = went on a mission, I met you, we got married. And my life sucks. I can = barely get out of bed in the morning, I hate my life so much." Eventually,= he punches her. Terrific, difficult play. Another play in our stack was = a terrific comedy about the world's worst wedding reception. And of = course, none of them used bad language at all. =20 I thought we had some excellent entries and I thought we'd do well. We = didn't. And yet looking at the plays that did do well, it seemed obvious = to me that our plays weren't what the judges were looking for. What the = judges wanted were . . . plays that use the F word a lot. Plays dealing = with certain subjects in certain ways, which are not the subjects or = approaches that interest BYU students. And yet, paradoxically, I think = they are the kinds of subjects and approaches which might do better in the = wider world we live in. =20 Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:35:01 -0700 > >All I can say to this sad commentary, is I feel sorry for the spiritually > >bereft souls who bought this book, only to give it to someone else as a > >$17.95 Christmas Gift with no intentions of reading it themselves. Of course, if you're in *my* family you would have followed a long standing family tradition of buying a book as a gift and reading it (carefully) before giving it away. Got to make sure I'm giving a good gift :-) and saving the gift-receiver the trouble of loaning it to me after he/she has read it. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:40:36 -0700 Eric Snider and I are indeed still friends, and I completely agree that a = hallmark of any friendship is the ability to constructively disagree. =20 That said, Eric says something very interesting in his last post: >Does this happen elsewhere? It's one thing, of course, to >disagree=20 >with a critic's criticisms. But to be surprised that he can even >make=20 >them...? I haven't reviewed anywhere else, so I don't know what=20 >happens outside of Utah County. Any insights? I think this is an interesting question. A friend of mine and I recently = had a conversation in which he said that Mormons are culturally thirty = years behind the times. He didn't mean this comment in a pejorative = sense, but he meant it in a descriptive sense. Movies that were considered= shocking and pornographic thirty years ago--The Graduate comes immediately= to mind--are seen as very mild indeed nowadays. But Mormons tend to = respond to films from a 1970 mindset, and so, of course, contemporary = filmmaking seems utterly depraved. In any case, the gist of our conversati= on was that PTC might want to do a season of top hits from the '70s and = earlier. =20 Utah audiences ARE different. That's why I think we have an obligation to = build an audience. What Provo Theatre Company needs to do is simple = enough--find out what the audience wants and give it to them. Build some = trust. But Tim Threllfall has been beating his head against the wall = trying to figure out how to do just that. =20 I think Eric's point about criticism may be part and parcel with the whole = problem. This is not a particularly sophisticated audience. Utah is = geographically isolated, and Mormonism is culturally isolated (neither of = which is necessarily bad, either). =20 Eric is trying to get the audience used to actual criticism. That's an = important project. I'd urge him to consider 'audience building' as a = corollary of that. Don't give namby pamby reviews, of course. But also = don't allow audiences the short cut of a letter grade. And if you see a = show that you think audiences might enjoy, but that they might not attend = without some prodding--go a little easy, perhaps? Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:05:46 -0700 OK, Margaret, discuss with us what you think the objections could have = been. I attended Friday night and really enjoyed it. I was refreshed by = the frankness, especially on the sexual level--nothing explicit, but = several natural references. Or was the problem with how the Church = leadership was portrayed? One thing that made me wince was having the same = actor play the evil racist mob leader and read the First Presidency = responses to Jane's letters.=20 Chris Bigelow -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to = the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT = 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:13:27 -0800 (PST) --- "Eric D. Snider" wrote: > So people are interpreting a B grade as a negative > thing. I wonder > how much of this misinterpretation would be > eliminated if the grades > were eliminated? > > Does this happen elsewhere? It's one thing, of > course, to disagree > with a critic's criticisms. But to be surprised that > he can even make > them...? I haven't reviewed anywhere else, so I > don't know what > happens outside of Utah County. Any insights? The San Francisco Chronicle has an even more brutal method of rating shows. They use an icon of a man sitting in a chair. The top rating shows the man clapping and laughing and falling out of his seat in hysteria because the movie/play/performance is so good. Other icons include him sitting up and clapping, sitting up but not clapping, and slumped down in his chair asleep. For the lowest rating the chair is empty. Speaking for myself and the Chronicle readers I interact with, the vividness of the icon really influences reading patterns. Since the icon is not placed at the end of the review but generally is near the beginning third of the text (which is flowed around the icon), oftentimes the behaviour of the little man will cause me to not even read the review. If the show stinks, why even bother to read why it stinks? But that's only if I'm reading the newspaper like most people read newspapers. Generally, when it comes to theatre reviews, I try and read the reviews for local companies that I'm interested in (Berkeley Rep. for example). People write in to the Chronicle from time to time and complain that a certain review killed a show. And I seem to recall a rather heated exchange among letter writers a couple of years ago debating the merits of the little man system. Several people felt (much like Eric Samuelson) that the icon caused good shows to be ignored because unless he was falling out of his chair with delight people weren't willing to shell out money for a ticket (and this argument exclusively revolved around the performing arts----films, except for some of the small independent films, don't seem to be much affected by the Chronicles reviews). Of course, the situation is much more complicated here in the Bay Area. There are so many different theatre offerings and, more importantly I think, there are diverse ways to get an opinon about current performances. With all the alternative weeklies and the community and college newspapers you can sometimes find an audience among those readerships. Certainly, because of its circulations numbers, the Chronicle still carries the most weight, but some theatre groups do just fine without heavy coverage and endorsement from the Chronicle. And of course the great thing about Chronicle reviews is that nobody is willing to admit that they depend upon them to make viewing choices. The conservatives (who often live in the suburbs) think it's too liberal of a paper and often rely on their local community paper (these vary but tend to give favorable coverage to local theatre productions) and the liberals think it's too conservative of a paper and rely on the alternative press. Other Bay Area-based AML-listers might have a different take, but that's what I've observed. In short, Eric Snider needs some competitors, and there are more damning things out there than letter grades. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:19:47 -0700 Margaret Young wrote: > We were thrilled with the crowds who came to see _I Am Jane_. We added > a hundred extra seats for Saturday's performance. But guess what--there > was at least one complaint, and it was taken directly to BYU's > president, Merrill Bateman. I don't know exactly what the complaint > was, though I can guess several possibilities. It'll be interesting to > see if the complaint has the power to cancel any more showings at BYU. > Sadly, I wouldn't be surprised if that actually happened. It doesn't > make me mad, but it's such a disappointment that someone could stop on a > difficult issue and refuse to participate in or receive the gift of Jane > James's life. One of our cast has really wanted to get the play to the > Conference Center. Even if the powers that control that venue were to agree, giving you, for instance, total control over every aspect of the show, I would advise against it. It's too big a venue, physically, for your show. Jane would drown in that environment. Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:22:12 -0700 >If I remember, that is pretty much what he said, and I suspect that there >is at least a kernel of truth in it. One of my playwriting students >submitted a short play to the New Play festival in-- Is it Louisville?? >Kentucky??? I'm having a serious senior moment here--about four years ago, >and it came back with an almost ecstatic review-- but wasn't accepted. The >comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of "modern" >terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". Ok, I wasn't going to comment on this thread because I don't have time for an involved discussion, but now I must comment. I know the people at Louisville and this scenario seems highly unlikely to me. Michael Dixon is a very open and fair-minded man, interested in talented playwrights without regard to profanity. Sincerely, folks, for most theatre people there is no "profanity issue." No one has an agenda to make sweet Mormon playwrights write bad things. I do not use profanity in my plays (generally speaking) and I have never been discriminated against or told to include profanity. I have had tremendous success for a young playwright (and hope to keep having success) without *ever* having run into this problem in regards to my work. I had a show that was a finalist at Louisville and was even produced there in 1999 and you know what? My show didn't have profanity, and neither did any of the shows that were produced that evening. Yes, plenty of young playwrights use a lot of profanity in a misguided attempt to "push the envelope" but I submit that it is *inspite* of such juvenile wording and not *because* of it that these plays enjoy success at ACTF. Not having been to ACTF myself I cannot really comment in depth on those proceedings but the turn that this thread is taking has, as you can tell, upset me a bit. As a community we have too much of a penchant for the "victim" stance as it is. Let's just do the work. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Maxwell" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 14 Feb 2001 10:36:57 -0800 Margaret wrote: > Realistic numbers: > Gerald Lund's books (Deseret) have sold over a million. > The sales of Dean Hughes WW2 series are in the 100,000's. My question: Lund has sold over a million books? But that's cumulative, isn't it, for all his books? And it's books sold, right, not books printed? So if there are ~10 books in the "Work and the Glory" series, has each sold over 100,000 copies? And for Dean Hughes' books, are we talking cumulative numbers again? How about numbers per book? - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eileen Stringer Subject: Re: [AML] Re: (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:44:42 -0700 > >When BYU cuts profanity from a play, that's considered censorship. Isn't > >forcing a playwrite to use profanity when he doesn't want to, or his > >play is rejected, as much a form of censorship? > > > >-- > >D. Michael Martindale > >dmichael@wwno.com > > > Certainly, but in the case of new play submissions, the producer or > dramaturg rules. He who pays the piper calls the tune. > Richard B. Johnson Or even discrimination, which more than censorship is punishable by law? Eileen Stringer eileens99@bigplanet.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eileen Stringer Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:56:44 -0700 > Linda wrote: > > >Right now my kids are still so little, they don't know it's not exactly > >ordinary to have a mom who writes books. I'll either be "cool" when they > >hit junior high or embarrassingly strange... most likely the second, but > >I've got more practice being weird than being cool, anyway... Do not despair though, Anne McCaffery's sons thought it was cool to have a mother who wrote books and when peers found out who their mother was that "coolness" trickled down. One son got into the business with her. The possibilities are great for you. :) Eileen Stringer eileens99@bigplanet.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 11:57:36 -0700 > Gerald Molen is producing it? Wow. > He's also a member of the Church and was born in Montana. I would be > curious if anyone knows more about him. > > Tyler Moulton His brother is my dentist. scott - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Russ Asplund Subject: RE: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 14 Feb 2001 12:48:09 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C096BF.0E8D38F0 Content-Type: text/plain I'm glad I'm not the only one who was depressed by _Mr. Holland's Opus_. Even _It's A Wonderful Life_ does that to me in the wrong mood. They seem to say the only way to be a valuable human being is to give up your dreams. I've always hoped to find some way to balance family, church, job and artistic goals. Then again, I'm never very successful at it. Russell Asplund > ---------- > From: Linda Adams > Reply To: aml-list@lists.xmission.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 6:57 PM > To: aml-list@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ > > > > FWIW, I thought _Mr. Holland's Opus_ was one of the most depressing > movies, > as a writer/artist, that I've ever seen. I don't want that for myself. But > > my kids are vitally, fundamentally important. But I-- ...you begin to > sense > the battle. > > I think male Mormon writers have a slightly less intense struggle, > although > it's close to the same thing. (Especially since, with the assigned role of > > breadwinner, it's hard to justify writing full-time if it isn't making > money to support the family, which is a non-issue for me.) > > > > Linda Adams > adamszoo@sprintmail.com > http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C096BF.0E8D38F0 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal = Journey_

I'm glad I'm not the = only one who was depressed by _Mr. Holland's Opus_.  Even _It's A = Wonderful Life_ does that to me in the wrong mood. They seem to say the = only way to be a valuable human being is to give up your dreams. I've = always hoped to find some way to balance family, church, job and = artistic goals.

Then again, I'm = never very successful at it.

Russell = Asplund

    ----------
    From:   Linda Adams
    Reply To: =       aml-list@lists.xmission.com
    Sent:   Tuesday, February 13, 2001 6:57 PM
    To:     = aml-list@lists.xmission.com
    Subject: =        Re: = [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_



    FWIW, I thought _Mr. Holland's Opus_ = was one of the most depressing movies,
    as a writer/artist, that I've ever = seen. I don't want that for myself. But
    my kids are vitally, fundamentally = important. But I-- ...you begin to sense
    the battle.

    I think male Mormon writers have a = slightly less intense struggle, although
    it's close to the same thing. = (Especially since, with the assigned role of
    breadwinner, it's hard to justify = writing full-time if it isn't making
    money to support the family, which = is a non-issue for me.)



    Linda Adams
    adamszoo@sprintmail.com
    http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo




------_=_NextPart_001_01C096BF.0E8D38F0-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tyler Moulton" Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 14 Feb 2001 13:12:34 -0700 >>> Margaret Young wrote: But guess what--there was at least one complaint, and it was taken = directly to BYU's president, Merrill Bateman. I don't know exactly what = the complaint was, though I can guess several possibilities. It'll be = interesting to see if the complaint has the power to cancel any more = showings at BYU. Why do we always cater to those most prone to take offense? (And what = would happen if we stopped?) Tyler Moulton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 14 Feb 2001 13:25:19 -0700 I'll take Chris up on his challenge. (And thank you, Chris, for attending. You should've introduced yourself to me! I'm the redhead.) When we first performed the play, for the Genesis Group, Elders Haight, Groberg, and Samuelsen attended. Elder Haight said he loved it and wouldn't change a word. Elder Samuelsen called it "a sterling performance." But President [Darius] Gray got at least one call complaining about sexual innuendo. The person calling said she had counted four sexual innuendos. My response was, "You mean she only caught four of them?" I actually did remove a couple of them. Keith Hamilton asked me before the performance if he could say (as Isaac returning to Jane after 20 years absence and asking for a bed) "I ain't strong enough to take you on in bed anyway, though the memory sure do bring back sweet memories!" I had already written the "ain't strong enough to take you on in bed..." part, but not the memory part. I said, "Sure Keith. You say that--and look right at Elder Haight when you do." He said it. After the show, I asked, "Well, did you look at Elder Haight?" He answered, "Yep. And I saw him put his arm around his wife and squeeze her in close." Anyway, the sexual "innuendos" are all pretty muted and in a marital context. I suspect the problems the complaintant had were with the fact that, though we don't quote Brigham Young [I took those quotes out, though I did have them in early drafts], we mention that he had some racist attitudes. The other difficult issue is Sylvestor James's excommunication after he speaks up against the lynching of Sam Joe Harvey. In fact, I don't know exactly WHY Syl was excommunicated, only that he was, that the cause was listed as "Unchristianlike conduct" and that it happened within months of the lynching. So that's my take. Christopher Bigelow wrote: > OK, Margaret, discuss with us what you think the objections could have been. I attended Friday night and really enjoyed it. I was refreshed by the frankness, especially on the sexual level--nothing explicit, but several natural references. Or was the problem with how the Church leadership was portrayed? One thing that made me wince was having the same actor play the evil racist mob leader and read the First Presidency responses to Jane's letters. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paynecabin@aol.com Subject: [AML] Grading Shows (was: Theater Is Dead) Date: 14 Feb 2001 15:37:24 EST This actor remembers getting grades from teachers. I didn't like getting them, but never kicked against the pricks because I was a little kid trying to learn something and they were grown-ups who had been to college and were a lot older and very much bigger than I was. I never felt condescended to. Suddenly, reading reviews with grades in them, I do, even if they're "A"s. Two or three stars will always mean "I'm a critic, and this is how much I liked it." A B+ will always mean "I'm the teacher, older, smarter, bigger, and this grade is what you deserve on your way to doing it right." I respect and respond to peers. I get mad at teachers. I don't want to, but elementary school was not my happiest time. I want to learn, but don't want to go back to Baker School with Mrs. Bennett. Marvin Payne - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "ROY SCHMIDT" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 15:23:04 -0700 When he was interviewed regarding _Standing For Something_, (Was it on Larry King?) President Hinckley said he would probably sign some books, but he would do it in his office. So, if I drop off a copy, what are the chances I can get it signed? Any ideas? Roy Schmidt But don't you think it'd look bad to go into a Deseret Book and have President Hinckley signing copies of _Standing for Something_, then directing you to the cash register? " - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] MN "Standing For Something" Due in Paperback Next Month: Kent Larsen Date: 14 Feb 2001 19:04:04 -0500 It took me awhile, but I bought it last summer. For myself. I think it's great. It has reminded me of a lot of things that somehow got lost in life's everyday shuffle. I really like the conversational tone. I like how positive it is, but not because the evil in the world is unacknowledged. Pres. Hinckley acknowledges how tough the world is and then invites us to change our focus. I hope people who bought it to give away found someone that would read it and appreciate it. I also thought it was interesting that Joseph Lieberman was quoted on the back cover. Tracie Laulusa - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 14 Feb 2001 18:36:12 -0700 --------------D103C82E753A77E968E93704 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Marilyn, Do you have any upcoming plays planned that are appropriate for me tobring my 7 & 8 year old? Also, these two have an 8:00 p.m. bedtime due to early schedules around here. A Saturday matinee would be appreciated--that goes for anyone who runs plays appropriate for children. Thanks! LuAnn Brobst Staheli > "The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub where these other two theaters > are and probably gets the same audience as long as they aren't doing the > same shows. Unless it can find something else to set it apart from the > others, the competition may be too much." > > --------------D103C82E753A77E968E93704 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Marilyn,
Do you have any upcoming plays planned that are appropriate for me tobring my 7 & 8 year old? Also, these two have an 8:00 p.m. bedtime due to early schedules around here. A Saturday matinee would be appreciated--that goes for anyone who runs plays appropriate for children. Thanks!

LuAnn Brobst Staheli
 
 

"The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub where these other two theaters
are and probably gets the same audience as long as they aren't doing the
same shows.  Unless it can find something else to set it apart from the
others, the competition may be too much."
 
 
--------------D103C82E753A77E968E93704-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Flashbacks Date: 14 Feb 2001 19:25:32 -0700 Marilyn, I met Beatrice Sparks at NCTE (National Council of Teachers of English) convention last Novemeber in Denver. She seems somewhat frail, but is still writing. She spoke and did autograph sessions at the conference regarding her newest book. Lu Ann Staheli - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 14 Feb 2001 19:33:23 -0700 Marilyn, Is the contest for LDS related novels only? I write adolescent novels and= I'm curious what you're looking for in the contest. Thanks. Lu Ann Staheli - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: cratkinson Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 22:01:33 -0800 (PST) On Wed, 14 Feb 2001 07:47:03 -0700, Tyler Moulton wrote: Gerald Molen is producing it? Wow. He's produced a good portion of the blockbusters that have come along in the last 20 years! (Tootsie, The Color Purple, Rainman, Hook, Jurassic Park/Lost World, . . .) He's also a member of the Church and was born in Montana. I would be curious if anyone knows more about him. ~~~~~~~~~~ I know! Actually, I don't know much about him, except that he's the uncle of my friend Mark Swensen from Orem. Mark was living and working in Hollywood last time I got an update, and can be seen singing "I Am Woman" in the karoake scene in the movie _My Best Friend's Wedding_. (I am now six degrees of separation from just about anyone in Hollywood. I'm IN!) I've heard a lot about "Uncle Gerry" but haven't met him. I understand he's still active in the church and is Spielberg's right-hand-man. Boy, that wasn't very helpful, was it? I'll try to do better next time. -Christine Atkinson _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 14 Feb 2001 23:59:19 -0700 Margaret Young wrote: > As a member of the Seventy, he thought it would be inappropriate to look > like he was somehow "selling" sacred things. His mission was and is > sacred to him. Don't you think it gets a little nervous-making when > GA's sell books? Not to me. But then I'm the type of person who reads the scripture correctly: "LOVE of money is the root of all evil," not, "Money is the root of all evil." I don't consider money evil. I consider money a tool to facilitate honest and legitimate trade so we don't have to drag a pig to the store to barter for eggs, bread and milk. "The laborer is worthy of his hire." If you did the work, you should be properly compensated. Just because people abuse something, doesn't mean the thing itself is evil. The publishing company is keeping the money. Why shouldn't the author? If he doesn't want to profit personally from writing about sacred things, he can donate it to fast offerings or something. But why just let the publishing (or filmmaking) company keep the windfall? What's sacred about that? Have them make the check out to the United Way or something if he doesn't want to look like he's profiting from sacred things. > I know John never did book > signings for either of his books--both of which I love, by the way. > Maybe I'll even mention that he was basically commanded to write _In the > Eye of the Storm_ by one of the Twelve. He complied. But don't you > think it'd look bad to go into a Deseret Book and have President > Hinckley signing copies of _Standing for Something_, then directing you > to the cash register? Hardly the same thing. Receiving just compensation is not the same thing as actively campaigning to inflate the profit. Not that I'd mind if President Hinckley signed my copy of his book. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 15 Feb 2001 01:07:09 -0600 At 00:46 14-02-01 -0700, you wrote: >Richard Johnson wrote: > > > The comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of > "modern" > > terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". If he > > would care to rephrase the play with some more 'contempory" terminology > > they would like to see a copy for the following year. > >When BYU cuts profanity from a play, that's considered censorship. Isn't >forcing a playwrite to use profanity when he doesn't want to, or his >play is rejected, as much a form of censorship? > >-- >D. Michael Martindale >dmichael@wwno.com And how about those writers who don't write profanity simply because they are not accustomed to using/hearing it often enough to know how to make it sound realistic? Are they going to offer correspondence classes in how to cuss? ;-) -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 15 Feb 2001 01:10:51 -0600 At 09:16 14-02-01 -0700, you wrote: > If your novel manuscript is ready, you could win the $1,000 Marilyn > Brown Unpublished Novel Award, which is administered by the Association > for Mormon Letters. Must it therefore be a "Mormon" novel (whatever that is)? -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 15 Feb 2001 01:26:27 -0600 At 10:26 14-02-01 -0700, Eric Samuelsen wrote: >Student Play Number Three: > >The model for this play is Steve Martin's Picasso at the Lapin Agile, and >the way the play works is if you put, for example, Groucho Marx, Gloria >Steinem and Nixon in a bar together, hilarity will ensue. A favorite >comedic moment of such work is to have, say, Nixon, let slip an F bomb, >then clap his hands over his mouth amusingly. Someone on another list I'm subscribed to shared a URL for a website he had found that is billed as a "flame generator," IOW, one is supposed to run some ordinary text through it and have it come out offensive. Based on the before and after example he gave, pretty much all the site does is to insert that word (or a variant, such as its gerund) between every few words in the original text. I replied that I would have hoped for something more, not what most stand-up comics and Hollywood screenwriters seem to consider witty dialogue. However, the site might have a use after all -- let Eric's students run their plays through the "flame generator" site and re-submit them to see if that makes them live up (down) to the standards of the judges . . . ;-) -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 15 Feb 2001 08:56:44 -0500 >>Richard Johnson wrote: >> >> > The comment said that the language was beautiful but that the lack of >> "modern" >> > terminology--read profanity-- made it seem "somehow bowdlerized". If he >> > would care to rephrase the play with some more 'contempory" terminology >> > they would like to see a copy for the following year. In view of Marianne's comment, I may have misinterpreted the critique that was given, but I didn't misquote it. If I hadn't retired right after this happened, I could give you a follow up on whether it was resubmitted and what happened. I suspect we may, one day, hear of the playwright- - a brilliant young man. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 15 Feb 2001 07:20:07 -0700 Odd question for you all-- Has anyone here written an LDS roadshow script, and would you be willing to send me a copy so that I could look at it and understand proper format, conventions, size, etc? I've been asked to help write the roadshow for my ward, and I have not the slightest idea how to produce a useful script. The easiest way to learn is always to see a successful example of the thing you're trying to emulate. Thanks. Scott Parkin [sparkin@airswitch.net] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 15 Feb 2001 08:01:25 -0700 A complaint about I Am Jane?!?!?! But . . . it's a celebration of the = remarkable life of one of our pioneer ancestors!?!?!? I mean, what could = possibly be more faith-promoting?!?!? I would very much like to hope that a complaint or two will be taken with = a grain of salt by the powers that be, who can sometimes be quite = reasonable.=20 Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 15 Feb 2001 09:25:55 -0700 Marianne Hales Harding wrote: > > Yes, plenty of young playwrights > use a lot of profanity in a misguided attempt to "push the envelope" I suspect it's a "depth" and significance issue rather than a profanity issue. Less talented writer may think that by throwing the f-word in every now and then makes their plays significant. But the mere absence of profanity doesn't necessarily mean a play is boring and juvenile. _The Straight Story_ should show once and for all that it is possible to make a popoular G-rated Hollywood movie. No dancing bears, no cartoon characters, just plain, honest, no pretensions of any kind -- just plain, ordinary story-telling with interesting characters and great acting. Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tyler Moulton" Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Date: 15 Feb 2001 09:42:23 -0700 >>> Russ Asplund said: [Speaking of _Mr. Holland's Opus_ and _It's A Wonderful Life_] "They seem to say the only way to be a valuable human being is to give up = your dreams." _______ I confess to responding in the same way at times. I recall reading something once about "losing one's life" and thereby = finding it . . . and there is a fundamental Christian nobility in such = action. There was nothing wrong with George Bailey's wanderlust--his quest = for adventure is one of his most endearing traits--but there was something = very right and profound about setting it aside to save the Building and = Loan--and the good folk of Bedford Falls. Bonhoeffer's explanation of discipleship as the response to Christ's = invitation to "come and die" led him into, but not out of, the Nazi death = camps. And the lives of people like Amy Carmichael, Gandhi, or Mother = Theresa proclaim boldly that selflessness is the higher path. But I'm not convinced that giving up the gifts we've received is a = universal requirement of discipleship. Losing ourselves is. Setting aside = ambition is. Laying it all on the altar is. But sometimes what we place on = the altar is consecrated and entrusted back to us. The gifts we've = received are placed in our hands and hearts to serve Him who gave them, = and if we throw them away in a pious attempt to produce an "acceptable = sacrifice" we may find that we have discarded the very stones that were to = line our personal path of discipleship. I don't think it's about "finding a balance" at all. Balance is for = Buddhists and high-wire jugglers. The call of Christ is to give ourselves = completely. In that giving, all of life becomes devotion, whether we're at = a place of work or of worship, reading with children, or writing a sonata, = singing in the shower, or watching the weather. That's something I believe and am trying to learn. Tyler Moulton (who is way too balanced) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 15 Feb 2001 09:56:38 -0700 I talked to my mother about it, and told her I suspected the complainer was in her age bracket. (That's age discrimination, of course.) Now, be aware that I heard no complaints at all after the show. There were people who said it had changed their lives, others who said, "This is inspired," and a BUNCH of others who said, "This show deserves a better stage!" (Talk to scheduling about that one. They were impossible to work with.) My honest reaction to the complaint--whatever it was: I think we're willing to tell our pioneer stories when we see how faithfully our ancestors endured persecution and natural calamities. But when it's US being the persecutors, we start getting nervous. Now, _Jane_ is not about how some Mormons lynched a black man, nor is it about how Jane didn't get all the temple blessings she asked for. It is about relentless faith--same subject as _Legacy_. The difference is that it's not anti-Mormons blocking the path; it's Mormons. One of the most difficult things we as a people ever do is face up to our own failings--past and present. The saddest thing of all about the complaint and its possible ramifications is that every black member of the cast has faced racism within the Church. For them to finally be able to tell this story and have a predominantly white audience applaud and even weep, suggests more than, "We did a good performance." It suggests, "We got through. They understand something of what it's been like for us." It's like taking a step towards Zion. [Margaret Young] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: [AML] Beatrice Sparks (was: Flashbacks) Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:11:39 -0700 Thank you, Lu Ann. Is she still in Utah? Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- > Marilyn, > I met Beatrice Sparks at NCTE (National Council of Teachers of English) > convention last Novemeber in Denver. She seems somewhat frail, but is still > writing. She spoke and did autograph sessions at the conference regarding her > newest book. > Lu Ann Staheli - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Introductions: Amy G. Chamberlain Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:19:11 -0700 Great to have you aboard, Amy! Only (Carol Quist wouldn't like this = because she's with Sunstone) what about doing your article for = IRREANTUM? Do you know about IRREANTUM? Just throwing it out. The study = about women sounds fascinating. I don't know if the IRREANTUM staff is = interested, but I am. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message -----=20 I'm working on the rough outline of an article exploring how this = online community of Mormon women functions, and I'm thinking of Sunstone = or something similar for a possible vehicle. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:23:16 -0700 [MOD: A compilation of three posts by Marilyn replying to various queries about the contest.] Yes, absolutely! Hooray! This is the year. July 1 is the date, and if you come to the Annual Meeeting (provided you are not living in Maine) we'll give you a list of the rules. Rules are simple. Prepare ms like a book--both sides of paper, bound with a comb binding. Mail with SASE if you want it back. NO IDENTIFICATION on the ms. (You can put your address on front upper left only). Include a SEALED envelope with the title only on the outside, and your name, address, phone and title on the inside. There will be three judges. Good luck! Marilyn Brown LuAnn, I am sorry, but we are just considering "adult-oriented" novels. For one thing, I know nothing about the juvenile market, and it's like a different world to me. Sorry. However, the novel doesn't have to be LDS exactly. The parameters are that it should cover as many of these three as possible: 1) by a Mormon, 2) about Mormons, or 3) for a Mormon audience. Thanks so much for asking! Marilyn Ronn, look at the reply I made to LuAnn. As many as possible of these parameters: 1) by a Mormon, 2) about Mormons or 3) for a Mormon audience. It does NOT have to be a Mormon novel. But it does have to reach for ideals. That's at my own personal insistance. Thanks for asking. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Introductions: Amy G. Chamberlain (Resend) Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:19:11 -0700 [MOD: I understand that this came through with funky characters for many of you, so I'm resending it. Please let me know if this version is odd for any of you.] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C09741.1EE0EEE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Great to have you aboard, Amy! Only (Carol Quist wouldn't like this = because she's with Sunstone) what about doing your article for = IRREANTUM? Do you know about IRREANTUM? Just throwing it out. The study = about women sounds fascinating. I don't know if the IRREANTUM staff is = interested, but I am. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Amy Chamberlain=20 To: Mormon Arts List=20 Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:31 PM Subject: [AML] Introductions: Amy G. Chamberlain Hi, all. I'm a newbie and here are my stats. My name is Amy G. (Giauque) Chamberlain. I grew up mostly in Provo and = did the BYU thing (and therefore recognize many of the names in the AML = Living Room). I got my M.A. in English from BYU in 1995. I served a = mission to Kobe, Japan in 92-93 and lived for a year in York, England in = 95-96 while working on a Ph.D. (did a whole lot of playing and traveling = as well). I'm now living in Taylorsville Utah with husband Peter and = baby Christopher. I work half-heartedly but diligently as a tech writer, = and whole-heartedly as an English instructor for the BYU Extension in = SLC.=20 So do I write? Lots of stuff. I've had a satirical short story = circulate on the internet, which was a fun phenomenon to watch, but I've = never tried to publish. Why? Because I am a COWARD. I am, however, = valiantly chipping away at said cowardice and may one day overcome it = completely. I am a big fan of Mormon writing as well, and fancy myself a = good cheerleader to my writing-inclined friends. =20 Current project: I was involved in an LDS email list about a year ago = and found the list's dynamics fascinating. I became interested in how = these people--mainly women--resolved conflict, what they viewed as = irrefutable authority, and how they dealt with maverick opinions. The = structure of this online community struck me as worthy of study and = analysis.=20 I'm working on the rough outline of an article exploring how this = online community of Mormon women functions, and I'm thinking of Sunstone = or something similar for a possible vehicle. I'm wondering if any of you = have recommendations for books or articles that relate to this topic and = that would give me some useful theoretical background on this subject. = Are there other studies of online communities that are particularly = worth reading, for example? How about studies of authority or conflict = resolution within the church? =20 If anyone's interested, I'd love to have your feedback--positive or = negative--on any stage of this project. Whaddaya think? Be brutally = honest; I can handle it (childbirth has made me tough). =20 Thanks in advance, Amy=20 amyc@xmission.com =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C09741.1EE0EEE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Great to have you aboard, Amy! Only = (Carol Quist=20 wouldn't like this because she's with Sunstone) what about doing your = article=20 for IRREANTUM? Do you know about IRREANTUM? Just throwing it out. The = study=20 about women sounds fascinating. I don't know if the IRREANTUM staff is=20 interested, but I am. Marilyn Brown
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Amy = Chamberlain=20
To: Mormon Arts List
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, = 2001 3:31=20 PM
Subject: [AML] Introductions: = Amy G.=20 Chamberlain

Hi, all. I'm a newbie and here are my = stats.
 
My name is Amy G. (Giauque) = Chamberlain. I grew=20 up mostly in Provo and did the BYU thing (and therefore recognize many = of the=20 names in the AML Living Room). I got my M.A. in English from BYU in = 1995. I=20 served a mission to Kobe, Japan in 92-93 and lived for a year in York, = England=20 in 95-96 while working on a Ph.D. (did a whole lot of playing and = traveling as=20 well). I'm now living in Taylorsville Utah with husband Peter and baby = Christopher. I work half-heartedly but diligently as a tech writer, = and=20 whole-heartedly as an English instructor for the BYU Extension in SLC. =
 
So do I write? Lots of stuff. I've = had a=20 satirical short story circulate on the internet, which was a fun = phenomenon to=20 watch, but I've never tried to publish. Why? Because I am a = COWARD. I am,=20 however, valiantly chipping away at said cowardice and may one = day=20 overcome it completely. I am a big fan of Mormon writing as well,=20 and fancy myself a good cheerleader to my writing-inclined=20 friends.
 
Current project: I was involved = in an LDS=20 email list about a year ago and found the list's dynamics fascinating. = I=20 became interested in how these people--mainly women--resolved=20 conflict, what they viewed as irrefutable authority, and how they = dealt=20 with maverick opinions. The structure of this online=20 community struck me as worthy = of study and=20 analysis.
 
I'm working on the rough outline of = an article=20 exploring how this online community of Mormon women functions, and I'm = thinking of Sunstone or something similar for a possible = vehicle. I'm=20 wondering if any of you have recommendations for books or articles = that relate=20 to this topic and that would give me some useful theoretical = background on=20 this subject. Are there other studies of online communities that are=20 particularly worth reading, for example? How about studies of = authority or=20 conflict resolution within the church?
 
If anyone's interested, I'd love to = have your=20 feedback--positive or negative--on any stage of this=20 project. Whaddaya think? Be brutally honest; I can handle it = (childbirth=20 has made me tough).
 
Thanks in advance,
 
Amy 
amyc@xmission.com
 
 
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C09741.1EE0EEE0-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Sales Figures in Mormon Market Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:35:18 -0700 Writing IS the reward, Rachel. And I was glad to read your comments on the list. I have figured out that my wages for writing have now increased to about 3.2 cents an hour! Appreciate you and your hard work! Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:41:09 -0700 I know I'm overposting, Jonathan, so you'll have to weed out. (Or divide and conquer) But let me stick up for Eric. When we get a B- we still think we're doing okay (not a permission to give B minuses, Eric) but when it hits the C + we go ballistic. (Funny how that is. Average? This show isn't AVERAGE!) Actually, Eric's reviews with the little negative comments, etc., have helped us at the Villa to struggle to get the show readier up front. They have helped us to try harder for that night of the reviewer stuff. It is very nerve wracking, but I do believe Eric's work has helped us to try harder, and as a result, our shows are getting better! Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 15 Feb 2001 11:46:10 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00F4_01C09744.E406E000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable LuAnn, I wish we had matinees. We used to, but we had ten people come. = Our shows start at 7:30 and get out about 9:00 or 9:30. I haven't seen = the present show, THE BOYS NEXT DOOR, but they might like it. Fri., = Sat., and Mon. at 7:30 at 254 S. Main in Springville. Our children's = shows, though are the ones you must let them see! Our Annie had a = matinee, and it was fantastic. BEAUTY AND THE BEAST is next, and you can = call 489-3088 between noon and 6:00 to find out when it will be and when = the auditions for children's theatre are. Your 7 and 8 year olds, if = they are interested, are the perfect age to participate! Thanks so much! = Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message -----=20 From: LuAnnStaheli=20 To: aml-list@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 6:36 PM Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Marilyn, Do you have any upcoming plays planned that are appropriate for me = tobring my 7 & 8 year old? Also, these two have an 8:00 p.m. bedtime due = to early schedules around here. A Saturday matinee would be = appreciated--that goes for anyone who runs plays appropriate for = children. Thanks!=20 LuAnn Brobst Staheli=20 =20 =20 "The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub where these other two = theaters=20 are and probably gets the same audience as long as they aren't doing = the=20 same shows. Unless it can find something else to set it apart from = the=20 others, the competition may be too much."=20 =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_00F4_01C09744.E406E000 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
LuAnn, I wish we had matinees. We used = to, but we=20 had ten people come. Our shows start at 7:30 and get out about 9:00 or = 9:30. I=20 haven't seen the present show, THE BOYS NEXT DOOR, but they might like = it. Fri.,=20 Sat., and Mon. at 7:30 at 254 S. Main in Springville. Our children's = shows,=20 though are the ones you must let them see! Our Annie had a matinee, and = it was=20 fantastic. BEAUTY AND THE BEAST is next, and you can call 489-3088 = between noon=20 and 6:00 to find out when it will be and when the auditions for = children's=20 theatre are. Your 7 and 8 year olds, if they are interested, are the = perfect age=20 to participate! Thanks so much! Marilyn Brown
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 LuAnnStaheli
To: aml-list@lists.xmission.com =
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, = 2001 6:36=20 PM
Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is = Dead

Marilyn,
Do you have any = upcoming plays=20 planned that are appropriate for me tobring my 7 & 8 year old? = Also, these=20 two have an 8:00 p.m. bedtime due to early schedules around here. A = Saturday=20 matinee would be appreciated--that goes for anyone who runs plays = appropriate=20 for children. Thanks!=20

LuAnn Brobst Staheli
 
 =20

"The Villa is south of the Utah Valley hub = where=20 these other two theaters
are and probably gets the same audience = as long=20 as they aren't doing the
same shows.  Unless it can find = something=20 else to set it apart from the
others, the competition may be too = much."=20
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_00F4_01C09744.E406E000-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Moderator call for help (technical) Date: 16 Feb 2001 10:57:31 -0600 Folks, A semi-technical question for those who know more about e-mail software than I: I do a lot of trimming of posts that come in with large amounts of material from previous posts (I know some e-mail software automatically includes the entire text of the message to which a reply is being sent at the bottom of the post). It's hard to do this kind of trimming when posts come through in multi-part MIME format, which, for some reason, comes through on forwarded messages for the List with two sets of text and a lot of code, though when those posts are sent on to me as a subscriber all of that code and multiple versions vanishes. (Both are Eudora software.) So, here are my questions: * Is it likely that any List members are receiving these messages with code and junk, or is that just a function of the way xmission.com forwards these messages to me as moderator? (No one has complained of receiving junk in these messages except when I try to edit them.) * Is there a solution to this--for example, a setting in Eudora that I could use to see these messages in their proper format? (And if so, are there any disadvantages to me in using it?) * Does it make any sense to try to encourage List members not to send posts in multipart MIME format, as we do (for example) with HTML format? (I would want to do this only if some List members are getting these posts with junk in them.) Thanks for your help, and apologies for my technical incompetence... Jonathan Langford AML-List Moderator - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: [AML] Re: Beatrice Sparks Date: 15 Feb 2001 09:17:44 -0700 Marilyn Brown wrote: > I'm so glad Eric found Beatrice Sparks! I knew her (just an acquaintance) > and I was always so amazed that this nationally best selling author lived > right there next to Marden Clark (practically) and she remained so "hidden." > She was very successful with her writing, but I wonder if she ever > considered herself a "writer" and gave talks and toured and wanted to teach > classes in writing? I don't think so. Anybody know? Marilyn Brown She was one of the speakers (maybe even the keynote speaker) at a regional SCBWI (Society of Children's Book Writers and Illustrators) conference several years ago. A very gracious lady. As I recall, her remarks were anecdotal and centered more on her relationships with young people than on writing itself. Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Films Date: 15 Feb 2001 14:12:36 -0600 >The publishing company is keeping the money. Why shouldn't the author? >[who is a GA, in this thread] >If he doesn't want to profit personally from writing about sacred >things, he can donate it to fast offerings or something. But why just >let the publishing (or filmmaking) company keep the windfall? What's >sacred about that? Have them make the check out to the United Way or >something if he doesn't want to look like he's profiting from sacred >things. >[snip] >Receiving just compensation is not the same thing >as actively campaigning to inflate the profit. I agree with D. Michael on this. A note on contracts. This kind of thing (assigning royalties to someone else, such as a charity) can be written in to the contract on signing if you choose. Usually, there's also a clause in the standard contract that gives the author the right to assign royalties elsewhere, if he/she changes their mind later. Also, if you really don't want to see your work ever made into a movie, don't sell that right to the publisher with your contract (under the sub-rights clause, licensing rights to others). Then the film co. has to approach you directly, and you can say no (rather than finding out it's been sold by the publisher without your input). But it makes no sense, just because you personally may not wish to profit from your work, to allow the publisher/filmmakers to keep your rightfully earned share. You can bet the whole wad *they* won't be donating that "extra" profit to fast offerings of their own free will. :-) But *you* can, by putting it in the contract. Actually, the original post said he [Elder Groberg, was it?] wanted it known he didn't *suggest* his book be made into a movie, not that he actually objected. It also said he refused any profits, but didn't say the film co. was keeping them. For all any of us knows, he *is* donating them to a good cause and didn't mind they were making a movie, he just doesn't want to be seen as looking for money. (Frankly, it's really none of our business what he does with it. Is it?) Not that I think he'd have to give up any profits, BTW. But I believe when a person is actually a Church General Authority, they do have to take more care than the rest of us regular-member persons do about the profit issue. GA's do have an influence, and it's pretty much guaranteed that if you are one, and you write a book about a gospel topic, it will sell. I think this falls into the line of "where much is given, much is required," and none of them would want to be seen as (or actually be) exploiting that influence on the members of the Church. Just my 2 cents, Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 15 Feb 2001 14:22:50 -0600 At 02:25 PM 2/14/01, you wrote: >I'll take Chris up on his challenge. (And thank you, Chris, for >attending. You should've introduced yourself to me! I'm the >redhead.) When we first performed the play, for the Genesis Group, Elders >Haight, Groberg, and Samuelsen attended. Elder Haight said he loved it >and wouldn't change a word. Elder Samuelsen called it "a sterling >performance." But President [Darius] Gray got at least one call >complaining about sexual innuendo. The person >calling said she had counted four sexual innuendos. My response was, "You >mean she only caught four of them?" I actually did remove a couple of them. Margaret, Can you help correct me if I'm wrong here? But I'm finding, in my study of African-American literature and culture, an attitude of healthy openness about discussing sexuality. (Very refreshing, actually...) Wouldn't such references or innuendos be not only natural, but true to the culture you're representing? Would it ring false to the Black community if there *weren't* any? As I asked, please fix my ideas if I've gone wrong somewhere... Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 15 Feb 2001 14:52:01 -0600 >Has anyone here written an LDS roadshow script, and would you be willing >to send me a copy so that I could look at it and understand proper format, >conventions, size, etc? >Scott Parkin >[sparkin@airswitch.net] I have to laugh. Not that you're writing a roadshow, but that you're concerned about format, conventions, and size. :-) I've helped to write one, and that tiny assignment gave me the *best* author experience I've had to date, and energized me to dream of writing for real theater someday: People in the audience LAUGHED at my jokes! Nobody knew I'd written them, and granted the actor had good delivery, but they laughed. What a feeling. I made people laugh! That fleeting memory is still an even better feeling than people coming up to me at church to tell me they read my book and couldn't sleep for three days while they were reading it. It was so cool. Okay, I'll quit with that now. It was, like, my Sally Field moment. Forgive me. Scott, it's a *roadshow.* Format: "Type it." Just make sure you label who's speaking the lines somehow and give a list of characters at the beginning. You could put stage directions ("Enter Wilma") in italics or parenthesis like a real script if you want to. Conventions: Be funny. Use original jokes if you can but old ones will do. No profanity, violence, nudity (DUH). Roadshows are camp. (The one I worked on had a witch doctor meets Godzilla or something. Well, it wasn't Godzilla. I honestly can't remember. I don't have the script anymore, or I'd send it.) Juxtaposition of two unlikely things--say, the Flintstones meet Star Trek--work well. Think Saturday Night Live sketches without the sexual references. Size: Ask how long it's supposed to run. If you format it in Courier 12 pt single-space, w/double spaces between speakers (like a conventional script format) you can guess at a running time of about 1 minute per page. 20 minutes, 20 pages. Of course, you're in the heart of Utah Valley, maybe they're more structured about roadshow format, etc., out there than we are in Missouri. Best of luck to you! Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 15 Feb 2001 21:33:05 >Has anyone here written an LDS roadshow script, and would you be >willing to send me a copy so that I could look at it and understand >proper format, conventions, size, etc? > >I've been asked to help write the roadshow for my ward, and I have >not the slightest idea how to produce a useful script. The easiest >way to learn is always to see a successful example of the thing >you're trying to emulate. > It's easy. Write a regular script that you think is good. Then remove all the funny jokes and replace them with lame ones. Then split all the characters into three or four different characters to allow more actors to be involved. Then take out anything that might potentially be offensive to anyone, anywhere. You should now have a pile of barely coherent words that loosely tells the skeleton of a story. If the pile is high enough, you're ready to go. If not, add a few more words randomly to increase the size of the pile. Then require the youth of the ward to be in it, thus encouraging intentionally bad performances from the kids who are resentful at being forced into it. Then cower in the corner and whimper. Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "mcnandon" Subject: RE: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 04 Jan 2001 01:48:30 -0700 Scott, I have written several winning Road Show scripts. I would be happy to send you one if you aren't in too big a hurry. I am in a play and it will take me a couple of days to find the show and copy it off. Let me know. Nan McCulloch - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Travis Manning" Subject: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 15 Feb 2001 15:21:53 -0700 General question: Is there a Mormon criticism? Let me qualify my question by asking, Is there a Mormon critical perspective, such as is comparable in academic rigor to a New Historicism, Psychoanalysis, Moral/Ethical, Reader Response, Deconstruction, Textual Criticism, Humanism, Genre, Archetypal, Formal, New Criticism, these and others, and variations of the same? If "we" (those that are critiquing various forms and genres of text, and subtext -- from a "Mormon" critical perspective) are, is there a Mormon "critical" text out there that would seem to symbolize "a" Mormon criticism? I am not personally aware of such an all-inclusive text and would be interested in knowing of one if it exists. Now, I know the D&C advises members of the Church to seek learning out of the best books, so could a Mormon criticism text -- if it exists -- be considered one of these "best books?" Would a standardized Mormon criticism have value? Second question: If "we" (those that critique texts and subtexts at various critical levels) do not have such a foundation, would it behoove it us to establish one, to perhaps compile essays, articles, statements, chapters of relevant books, and sort of "foundationalize" a Mormon criticism? Or perhaps "we" could commission a Mormon scholar(s) to produce such a text, as their version of a Mormon criticism? Third and final question: Is there value and merit to even establishing a Mormon criticism text or texts -- I mean, is there going to be some greater good that would come from "formalizing" a Mormon, critical, literary perspective that would assist with a greater good, you know, "out there in the world" somewhere? Travis K. Manning "Men and women die; philosophers falter in wisdom, and Christians in goodness: if any one you know has suffered and erred, let him look higher than his equals for strength to amend, and solace to heal." (Jane Eyre) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: [AML] MN Reviewer Pans "The Princess and the Marine": Boston Date: 15 Feb 2001 16:36:10 -0600 From Mormon-News: See footer for instructions on joining and leaving this list. Do you have an opinion on this news item? Send your comment to letters.to.editor@MormonsToday.com Reviewer Pans "The Princess and the Marine" HOLLYWOOD, CALIFORNIA -- Michael Speier, a reviewer for the trade magazine Variety panned this coming Sunday's "The Princess and the Marine," saying that while all the elements were there for a great show, the execution "is all wrong." The film tells the story of Marine Jason Johnson, who is Mormon, and his successful smuggling of a Bahraini princess into the US from the Middle East, where he had fallen in love with her. Speier says that the film suffers from its simplicity. He says that the director replaced the "confusion, fear and anxiety" that the two felt "with stolen kisses and trips to the food court." Speier adds that the roles as written in the script are "much too uncomplicated to be taken that seriously, especially since the possibility of prison -- even murder -- continues to looms large." Overall, he says the film is "simple and comfortable but misses out on the serious inspection of religion and legal wrangling." But the film will likely get a good audience regardless, simply because news reports of the story have been widely published and have captured the imagination of some in the public. Since their ordeal ended, the couple have wed, but Johnson was stripped of his rank in the Marines for his illegal activities. The political asylum case of his wife, Meriam, has yet to be heard. Source: No crown for ''Princess'' Boston Globe (Variety) 15Feb01 P2 http://www.boston.com/dailynews/046/variety/No_crown_for_Princess_:.shtml By Michael Speier See also: Marine Who Brought Bahraini Princess to US is Mormon http://www.mormonstoday.com/000806/P2Johnson01.shtml Story of Mormon Marine Who Smuggled Princess to US to be NBC Movie http://www.mormonstoday.com/010112/P2JJohnson01.shtml >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: [AML] MN BYU theatre students honored at Kennedy Center/ACTF Date: 15 Feb 2001 22:15:55 -0600 From Mormon-News: See footer for instructions on joining and leaving this list. Do you have an opinion on this news item? Send your comment to letters.to.editor@MormonsToday.com BYU theatre students honored at Kennedy Center/ACTF meet PROVO, UTAH -- Several Brigham Young University theatre students garnered honors at last week's Kennedy Center/American College Theatre Festival (ACTF) in Washington, D.C. Richard Clifford was a runner-up in the Irene Ryan Acting Competition for his performance in "Much Ado About Nothing." Five other BYU actors joined Clifford as finalists in the Irene Ryan Acting Competition: Ary Farahnakian, Lesley Larsen, Jesse Harward, Christina Davis and Colleen Hanson. Anne Black won the Barbizon Award in costume design plus a full scholarship to attend a workshop this summer at Fresno State. Jesse Harward also won a scholarship to the Fresno State workshop in improvisational plays. Honors also went to Adreann Sundrud as one of six student director finalists for her direction of "Sy's Girl." BYU theatre and media arts faculty member Barta Heiner won the festival's newest regional award as the faculty nominee for the Actors Center, a teacher development workshop. Candidates for this award must be full-time faculty who continue to perform professionally. Heiner will compete against seven other national nominees for a chance to attend the professional acting workshop to be held in New York City this summer. -###- >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: [AML] MN Is the University of Utah Anti-Mormon?: Deseret News Date: 15 Feb 2001 22:17:45 -0600 From Mormon-News: See footer for instructions on joining and leaving this list. Do you have an opinion on this news item? Send your comment to letters.to.editor@MormonsToday.com Is the University of Utah Anti-Mormon? SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Discrimination against Mormons is an accusation the University of Utah has heard since it passed from church control and became a secular university. In the latest round of complaints, Latter-day Saint student Christina Axson-Flynn claims she was forced out of the theater program because she refused to take God's name in vain. Before Axson-Flynn was accepted into the program, she told teachers she would not use vulgar language. She feels her constitutional rights have been violated because of religious discrimination and has taken her case to federal court. David Dynak, U. theater department chairman, said all students are asked if they object to certain types of language, but there is no agreement to accommodate those objections. All students are required to perform the same scene so teachers can evaluate their work. Axson-Flynn changed the words and passed the class with an A-minus. "The issue was not forced," Dynak said, "Her beliefs, morals, and values were never in question." Jeremy Rische, Axson-Flynn's former classmate, said he recently sang a very anti-Semitic song as part of the musical "Cabaret." "Because I sang that song," Rische, who is Jewish, said, "doesn't mean that I believe what that character is saying." Another LDS theater student, Marjorie Lopez Tibbs said, "Language is the way to depict how things are. But just like I can play a 55-year-old woman, and though I can be that character for a time, that woman is not me, just like certain words in a dialogue are the character's, not mine." L. Jackson Newell, U. dean of liberal education for 16 years, said there are numerous stories of LDS students and faculty who have felt like an oppressed minority and "there is also no end of non-Mormons who have come to the U. excited about it and being in Salt Lake and then lose their enthusiasm, especially families with small children who don't seem to find the community they thought they would." Newell believes regular and official airing of the Mormon/non-Mormon debate is needed. "If you don't do things like that, rumors and interpretations of events tend to multiply and get whipped up into a lot of stuff that makes it difficult to deal with reality," he said. "A crisis results, and at that point the whole education effort gets stifled and even undermined." Erika Thew, editor of the LDS Student Association magazine, "The Century," said many Mormon students are warned by school counselors and parents that they will be corrupted or ridiculed at the U. "There's this kind of undercurrent, but I don't think most kids get caught up in it," she said. "I think people kind of find what they're looking for. But then, I don't think we're as tolerant as we could be, and sometimes we whine and complain about it, but I wish we'd do more about it." Thew, who transferred to the U. from Brigham Young University, said, "Mormon kids who come here from out of state feel the campus is very Mormon, but the Mormon kids who come here from Utah think it's anti-Mormon." Business professor Bill Hesterly, who has two degrees from BYU and has been at the U. for 12 years, said, "Everywhere you go, there is a tension between modern universities and conservative or fundamentalist people. People here have often erroneously attributed what is a typical interaction today of these two elements as anti-Mormon." Source: U. theater department denies bias Deseret News 11Feb01 D2 http://www.deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,250010258,00.html By James Thalman: Deseret News staff writer Religious rift rattles U. Deseret News 4Feb01 D4 http://www.deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,250008728,00.html By James Thalman: Deseret News staff writer The anti-Mormon ccontroversy has enduring history >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 16 Feb 2001 00:46:18 -0800 First, this thread reminds me what I love about Eric Samuelsen's writing, and Marvin Payne's, and Richard Johnson's and AML-List. I get very intimate glimpses of people. It draws my love. On Wed, 14 Feb 2001 (Vowel times day, when I found an all vowel word dictionary http://www.blueray.com/dictionary/) Eric writes: > What these student writers don't realize is that Mamet uses this kind > of language for his forty and fifty year old businessmen, because he's > saying that they're all basically juvenile, and the language makes > them sound more juvenile. About 15 years ago I wrote a story about a man playing elaborate (yea, even harlowicient) wordgames to take his mind off his deep pain as he works. This is a brief section to introduce a comment about juvenile language: >>>>> God is like an 800 number, always a toll-free call away. No, God exacted a toll, a heavy toll. He may strew signs along the highway of life, but it's a toll road. And the price of getting off is two coins. Trip trap trip trap, trip trap trip trap, went the Enoch Goat Gruff. Then the great big ugly troll poked his huge hoary head, up over the side of the bridge, and as he was heeeaving . . . his great, loathsome body . . . up onto the bridge, he roooooooaaared out, "This is a troll toll bridge, and the toll is, that I get to eat you up." And he began gumming Enoch's tummy. "No, no, you great big ugly troll, said the Enoch Goat Gruff. I'll just push you off the bridge." And he pushed and pushed and Pelagoram fell and fell off the bed. And fell and fell, and Felix Culpa my foot. Great big ugly old very beast hairy least troll toll two coins delivered on the eyes. No. No. No. God was good. None the less good for having told Shinehah to divorce him. "Pelagoram, I prayed and I prayed and I prayed, Pelagoram. It was the only option I had left. And it was right, Pelagoram. God told me it was right to divorce you. I got the same feeling I got when I asked if I should marry you. And that was right, too." <<<<< (Excuse the cheesy names. The thread on Mormon Dialogue finally got to me and I would have been ungrateful for my great pioneer heritage had I not taken the opportunity to give thanks for the fine words my forebears contributed to the lexicon) So later in the story it was quite natural to have the character think, "Ours is a celestial marriage, *** **** it to h****." (which in my youth was the profanity next to the f-word) I think having him think that is artistically defensible, but it always felt cheap to me, so when I was looking at it year or so back I changed it to 'd it to h' because the other profanity felt juvenile to me. (The odd thing about it is that that's what Shinehah is trying to do to him--make him a juvenile. She refuses to treat him like an adult, barely like a human (certainly not a humane) being.) There's a lot of profanity in my earlier work that I don't feel comfortable writing now. (Not that my language is particularly pure. Donna had soap on her finger the other night and was chasing me around the bed. "Did you say that?" I steadfastly refused to open my mouth.) Which creates a challenge when I get to the part in the story cycle where my character starts swearing earnestly. I'm thinking of calling that story "Being Blue," or just "Blue" (reference to William Gass's study of pornography/profanity/other stuff _On Being Blue_ which he's read a bit of), and having the torrents of filthy pained language read something like "blue you mother-bluing bluard, blue you to blue, blue, blue, blue, you blue it." If I handle it right that's likely to be a lot more intense than if I actually used the profanity. As for the story I quoted from above, there's a small part I added about 4 years ago where he starts thinking about how he should have married his high school girlfriend, but for a long time I couldn't figure out a name for her. (Names are very important for their symbolic value in my work.) Then this past summer, when my cousin Joe Soderborg was getting ready to go to Wales and do an internship and some Lloyd family history I realized her name is Mari Lloyd because she's full of witty banter (I'd been wanting to name a character Mari Lloyd ever since Leslie Norris explained the tradition of the mari llwd to us (were we reading Vernon Watkins? Glyn Jones?) a Welsh new year's custom of mounting a horse's skull on a stick, jawbone on another, then taking the mari llwd (gray mare) from house to house trading witticisms at each door (hoping to win a drink or two), with the person working the jaw clapping it open and shut to represent the horse's speech (ah dead customs.)) > not the subjects or approaches that interest BYU students. And yet, > paradoxically, I think they are the kinds of subjects and approaches > which might do better in the wider world we live in. > > Eric Samuelsen I think there are ways in which bad language can be used effectively. I mentioned a few weeks ago the scene in "The Covenant Breaker" where the man who molested Brendan shows up in church (is in Elmira NY, which I just heard on the news this morning was where some kid was arrested for bringing 18(?) pipe bombs to high school), sees Brendan, and says, "Oh, God." "No, it's just me, Brendan." It was gratifying and totally unexpected when David Bosworth said, "It's good to be reminded sometimes that when we say that we're taking the Lord's name in vain." It was also quite unexpected, gave me a lot of pause to think about what Brendan is actually saying, when one student wrote in the margin, "That's a pretty b_llsy thing to say." Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 16 Feb 2001 11:12:18 -0700 >But the mere absence of profanity doesn't necessarily mean a play is >boring and juvenile. _The Straight Story_ should show once and for all >that it is possible to make a popoular G-rated Hollywood movie. No >dancing bears, no cartoon characters, just plain, honest, no pretensions >of any kind -- just plain, ordinary story-telling with interesting >characters and great acting. While I agree with your point, I have to say that _The Straight Story_ isn't a movie I would cite to bolster that point. I was bored to tears by the Straight Story. How many completely silent 15 minute shots of an old man on a lawn mower can you have in one movie? I was rooting for a semi to take him out. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Maxwell" Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG, _I Am Jane_ (Performance) Date: 16 Feb 2001 11:21:56 -0800 Eric wrote: > A complaint about I Am Jane?!?!?! But . . . it's a celebration of the > remarkable life of one of our pioneer ancestors!?!?!? I mean, what could > possibly be more faith-promoting?!?!? > > I would very much like to hope that a complaint or two will be taken with > a grain of salt by the powers that be, who can sometimes be quite > reasonable. Something that would help the powers-that-be would be for people who LIKED the play to write or call in support of the show. If when an issue is brought to the attention of a decision-maker, and the only letter in the file is a letter of complaint, the decision-maker will naturally come to a certain conclusion. But if the file contains one letter of complaint and ten letters of support & appreciation, the decision-maker is more likely to see the issue in a truer context. Decades ago, here in the Bay Area, in the days before cable TV & satellite dishes, occasionally commercial TV stations would air portions of LDS General Conference. They wouldn't be making any money on it, since they were airing the sessions as a public service, the FCC rules being different then. Often we heard the admonition to express appreciation to the local broadcasters. Once a member of my ward actually phoned, or wrote a thank-you letter to one of the stations. The member was told that theirs was the ONLY letter received to thank the station for airing Conference. It was not surprising that the stations would often stop broadcasting Conference after doing it once or twice. Regards, Frank Maxwell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Edward Hogan Subject: RE: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 16 Feb 2001 14:59:16 -0500 Does the church still do road shows? We haven't had them in our stake in years, well over a decade I think? How widely are they done now? Ned - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] (Writer's Angle) The Journey of _Prodigal Journey_ Date: 16 Feb 2001 14:41:02 -0600 At 10:42 AM 2/15/01, you wrote: >But I'm not convinced that giving up the gifts we've received is a >universal requirement of discipleship. Losing ourselves is. Setting aside >ambition is. Laying it all on the altar is. But sometimes what we place on >the altar is consecrated and entrusted back to us. Tyler, thank you for expressing this so eloquently. This is what happened to me, but I didn't say it nearly so well. This is still different than what happened to Mr. Holland in _Opus,_ though. >The gifts we've received are placed in our hands and hearts to serve Him >who gave them, and if we throw them away in a pious attempt to produce an >"acceptable sacrifice" we may find that we have discarded the very stones >that were to line our personal path of discipleship. Again, thank you. Exactly. Which is why I have little patience with people who could do amazing things with their talent but don't. Or demonstrate a sort of "Aw, shucks (blush)" attitude about the gifts God blessed them with. Just give the glory back to God, who gave the gift in the first place. Don't apologize for *having* it, or for being aware that you do. The trick is in discovering why you've got it and what God wants you to do with it. All this doesn't, however, always ease the guilt or any feelings of weirdness if your "talent" isn't an everyday garden-variety thing... Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 16 Feb 2001 14:36:58 -0700 On Thu, Feb 15, 2001 at 03:21:53PM -0700, Travis Manning wrote: > General question: > Is there a Mormon criticism? Yes and no. > Let me qualify my question by asking, Is there a Mormon critical > perspective, such as is comparable in academic rigor to a New Historicism, > Psychoanalysis, Moral/Ethical, Reader Response, Deconstruction, Textual > Criticism, Humanism, Genre, Archetypal, Formal, New Criticism, these and > others, and variations of the same? You mention these schools of thought as if they present codified rules for examining a text. For example, to conduct a Freudian analysis of a text, do the following: 1. Examine the text for any long, cylindrical objects: tall glasses, pencils, submarines. 2. Each object found represents the male phallus. Describe how these phalluses demonstrate the main character's sexual frustration (or lack thereof). Some of the biggest literary arguments come from individuals, usually experts in the same school of thought, who disagree about the interpretation of a text. Although all Freudian critics would look for phallic symbols in the text, each critic would probably have a unique perspective on the meanings imbued by those symbols. A critical perspective based on a religion functions quite differently from academic critical schools. The schools you list all have a worldview that reflect a general set of social or academic values. Scholars who align themselves with a school can freely accept some or all of the basic tenets of the school's worldview. The self-named humanist scholars can then battle about whether or not Ayn Rand created the ultimate humanist text with _Atlas Shrugged,_ but no-one can definitively categorize a text as humanist because that would first require scholars to agree on a definition of humanist. On the other hand, religions already have an accepted canon. The governing body of a church -- not a congress of literary scholars -- establishes that church's official worldview. Mormon criticism then comes down to judging how well a text presents the worldview established by the accepted canon of the church. Granted, you can have lengthy arguments about the missionary value of Orson Scott Card's _Lost Boys,_ but who really wants to read about how a particular text lines up with the three missions of the church. > If "we" (those that are critiquing various forms and genres of text, and > subtext -- from a "Mormon" critical perspective) are, is there a Mormon > "critical" text out there that would seem to symbolize "a" Mormon criticism? > I am not personally aware of such an all-inclusive text and would be > interested in knowing of one if it exists. Now, I know the D&C advises > members of the Church to seek learning out of the best books, so could a > Mormon criticism text -- if it exists -- be considered one of these "best > books?" Would a standardized Mormon criticism have value? In a sense we already have a standardized Mormon criticism. Since a Mormon critical perspective would basically apply the canon of the church to the text, the canon of the church becomes the urtext by which all other texts must achieve their value. For the church to canonize a work then becomes the ultimate compliment in the Mormon criticism. > Second question: If "we" (those that critique texts and subtexts at various > critical levels) do not have such a foundation, would it behoove it us to > establish one, to perhaps compile essays, articles, statements, chapters of > relevant books, and sort of "foundationalize" a Mormon criticism? Or > perhaps "we" could commission a Mormon scholar(s) to produce such a text, as > their version of a Mormon criticism? Scholars who also maintain membership in the Mormon church have many publications in all sorts of fields. But in many articles, these scholars use a worldview borrowed from one of the established critical schools to tout the value of Mormon literature. They seem to want the literature accepted not by a unique standard of Mormon criticism, but by some worldly value established outside the church. Here we run into one of the problems that we often discuss on the list: what do we want to achieve with Mormon literature? To consider Mormon literature successful, do we want acceptance from the "gentile" critics, or do we need to establish our own literary tradition that has value only for Mormons. And how do you judge the success of Mormon literature? By popularity? By the number of general authority endorsements? At this point, a collection of the published works of LDS scholars would not define a coherent set of values that others could use as a basis for further criticism. The members of the list cannot even agree on a definition of "Mormon literature." > Third and final question: Is there value and merit to even establishing a > Mormon criticism text or texts -- I mean, is there going to be some greater > good that would come from "formalizing" a Mormon, critical, literary > perspective that would assist with a greater good, you know, "out there in > the world" somewhere? You cannot make a movement out of just a few individuals. I don't think we have a body of quality Mormon literature large enough to justify a unique school of Mormon critical thought. You could argue that we don't need works produced by Mormons to create such a school, that we can just find all the "best book" and subsume them into Mormon literature. Say Hemingway: "Although we can praise Robert Jordan in _For Whom the Bell Tolls_ for his honorable self sacrifice on the battlefield, we must hope that these good works will lead him to accept a vicarious baptism, since he was not able to live long enough to meet the post-war missionaries." For me, the texts come before the criticism. We develop criticism to discuss why literature works and has value. If the literature doesn't exist then we cannot develop a criticism to describe that literature. So to answer your original question, I think we do have an established canon by which we will have to use as a basis for our literary criticism, but we do not yet have a substantial body of quality literature that demonstrate a class of values and topics that we can extrapolate into a unified Mormon criticism. -- Terry L Jeffress AML Webmaster and AML-List Review Archivist - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 16 Feb 2001 17:15:04 -0500 There hasn't been one in the Columbus, OH tri-stake area for at least the 11 years we've been here. From what we've heard, we were in Morristown NJ for the next to the last round of road shows and dance festivals just before that. Tracie -----Original Message----- Does the church still do road shows? We haven't had them in our stake in years, well over a decade I think? How widely are they done now? Ned - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: RE: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 16 Feb 2001 17:21:17 -0500 At 02:59 PM 2/16/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Does the church still do road shows? We haven't had them in our stake in >years, well over a decade I think? How widely are they done now? > >Ned We did them in our Stake last year. They were a little strange. The competition was eliminated and everyone got participation certificates. As a result, one went about twenty minutes overtime, but the quality was, overall, pretty good. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] (On Stage) BYU at ACTF Date: 16 Feb 2001 15:39:18 -0700 On Fri, Feb 16, 2001 at 11:12:18AM -0700, Marianne Hales Harding wrote: > While I agree with your point, I have to say that _The Straight Story_ isn't > a movie I would cite to bolster that point. I was bored to tears by the > Straight Story. How many completely silent 15 minute shots of an old man on > a lawn mower can you have in one movie? I was rooting for a semi to take > him out. Let me second Mairanne's opinion. Profanity, or just about anything else, would have improved _The Straight Story_. At one point Mr. Staight watches a lady hit a deer with her car. She gets hysterical and claims that she hits a deer several times each week. I kept hoping for her to return and take out Alvin, his John Deere lawnmower, and maybe the music editor for his infinite repetiton of the 15-second travel ditty. Imagine a pioneer movie made the same way as _The Straight Story._ THE YOUNG STORY by Anonymous EXT. WINTER QUARTERS - DAY Young children gather water from a stream in a wooden bucket. We follow them back to a camp of white canvas tents. They pass a gathering of men. ON BRIGHAM Brigham Young adresses the croud. He holds a Book of Mormon to his breast and makes his speach. BRIGHAM Gentlemen. The Lord has spoken. We will make our journey west. EXT. WINTER QUARTERS - AERIAL - DAY The saints quickly break camp and form a wagon train. EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - MISSOURI - DAY The wagons roll along. EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - MISSOURI - NIGHT The saints sleep after a long day on the trail. Some fires still burn and make the canvas on the wagons look pale orange. EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - MISSOURI - SUNRISE The wagons roll along. FADE TO: EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - NEBRASKA - DAY The wagons roll along. CUT TO: EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - NEBRASKA - DAY The wagons roll along. FADE TO: EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - WYOMING - DAY The wagons roll along. CUT TO: EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - WYOMING - DAY The wagons roll along. FADE TO: EXT. THE OREGON TRAIL - UTAH - DAY The wagons roll along. EXT. BRIGHAM'S WAGON - UTAH - DAY BRIGHAM This is the place. FADE OUT Maybe I can get Richard Dutcher to direct. Then again, maybe it needs some authentic profanity. -- Terry L Jeffress AML Webmaster and AML-List Review Archivist - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 16 Feb 2001 16:20:29 -0700 Out of curiosity, how many entries has the contest had in the past? Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 16 Feb 2001 19:01:08 -0600 Travis, This general set of questions interests me a lot. It's come up before on the List, in one form or another. I'm by no means an expert on it, but I think I may be one of few currently active List participants who was involved in the discussion at that time, so I'll take a whack at talking some about what the discussion has been like here. A few years back, Mike Austin wrote an essay--I can't remember the title of it, but it was something straightforward like "Toward a Mormo-American Criticism"--delivered at a conference of some sort, which I think won an award from AML that same year. He was arguing, essentially, that Mormon ethnicity provides a perspective that ought to be just as respectable as a basis for writing as any of the other ethnic identities that has received critical attention in recent years. Mike, who was an active participant on AML-List for a while, did a series of columns (I think in 1996) essentially looking at several different contemporary critical approaches, summarizing them for the non-expert (that is, most of us), and speculating about ways those approaches could be harnessed by Mormons. Unfortunately, those items are buried in the AML-List Archives... (That would be a fun project, by the way, if anyone ever had a great deal of spare time: to pull all the AML-List columns and put them on the Web site as articles, similar to the AML-List Reviews Archive.) Going further back, I know there was a famous exchange between Richard Cracroft and Bruce Jorgensen on the sophic and the mantic in Mormon literature. And Marden Clark talks some about a Mormon-based criticism in his collection of essays, _Liberating Form_. I'm sure there's been a lot of other stuff written along the lines of Mormon literary criticism. Most of these approaches, however, seem to be looking at Mormon criticism in terms of developing or adapting critical categories and tools for using in analyzing Mormon literature. Frankly, as a project that interests me less than the question of a universal literary criticism influenced by Mormon beliefs. What purpose does literature have in the cosmos as seen in Mormon eyes? That's a question that interests me a lot, and one I think everyone who professes a serious interest in Mormon letters ought to tackle, at least in personal terms--and that we all ought to talk about more in Mormon literary and artistic circles. I think Mormon theology implies some possible answers that are both similar to and different from ideas that artists and critics have been throwing around from the time of Plato/Aristotle on down. However, I'm also congenitally suspicious of attempts to arrive at premature closure. I think I had an exchange with Ben Parkinson on the List on at least one occasion about this, if I recall correctly. So my prejudice is against any attempt to label something as "the" Mormon criticism, but rather toward encouraging Mormon literary scholars from every different critical school and approach to talk and write about the connection between their own critical theory and practice and Mormonism. Providing forums for this type of discussion would, I think, take us much further in Mormon letters than any attempt to arrive at a formalized "Mormon" literary scholarship. For one thing, I doubt that Mormon literary scholars would agree on any such label (there are too many, working with too many divergent approaches), and for one group to start calling itself "the Mormon criticism" would I think be taken (perhaps rightly) as an attempt to coopt a religious label for essentially political purposes. "One Lord, one faith, one baptism" should not, I think, be taken to the point of "one literary criticism." It's my belief that one of Mormonism's cultural quirks, not always a positive one, is an attempt to arrive at consensus and closure in areas far removed from doctrine and religious practice; but in areas like literary criticism I think it's important to let a certain diversity flourish, in the interests of seeing what we can learn from each other. So personally I'd favor a great deal of discussion of literary criticism from Mormon perspectives, but would resist any attempt to label any particular critical approach as "the Mormon criticism." Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jacob Proffitt Subject: [AML] Responsibility to Your Gifts (was: Writer's Angle) Date: 16 Feb 2001 18:35:21 -0700 On Fri, 16 Feb 2001 14:41:02 -0600, Linda Adams wrote: >Which is why I have little patience with people=20 >who could do amazing things with their talent but don't. Why don't you have patience with people who could do amazing things with their talent and don't? Why assume that people not actively developing their talents are being negligent just because they are not improving = their most obvious or public ones? I am curious because I think I have a = talent for writing. I think I could develop that talent if I wanted to. Right now, that talent is almost exclusively reserved for the email lists I = pursue and the documents I create for clients (technical specification documents for their approval). I suspect that with a little pushing, I could do amazing things. But I don't push. I think that my reasons for not developing this talent are sufficient. I stopped feeling guilty that I'm not actively working to hone my writing. Obviously, I did not do so lightly or without contemplation and prayer. = So my question is, why the guilt trip for those of us who don't make the = same choices you (plural) do? Can you have an artistic talent and let it lie dormant while you take care of other priorities? I don't mean these as personal questions for Linda. She just happened to bring up the = questions I've been pondering for a while. Mainly, why all the pressure to = produce? Jacob Proffitt - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] Re: Request for Help: Road Show Date: 16 Feb 2001 19:25:43 -0600 Ned Hogan: Does the church still do road shows? We haven't had them in our stake in years, well over a decade I think? How widely are they done now? _______________ It's been about five years here. They are a lot of work. I would like to refute Eric D's comment about how lousy they are, however. I must admit to having seen, over the years, some outstanding and hillariously funny road shows. Trouble is, you usually have to sit through 9 or 12 others to get to the good one or two. :-> Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff Needle Subject: [AML] Margaret Young Date: 16 Feb 2001 21:24:46 +0000 Our own Margaret Young, and her writing partner Darius Gray, were in San Diego this evening (Friday) for a book signing. It was just great and we had a terrific visit. They were promoting their book, "One More River to Cross," which I've reviewed here. It was a fine time. Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "jana bouck remy" Subject: [AML] Up for Review Date: 16 Feb 2001 19:07:38 -0800 7F00,0000,0000Here's a rather long list of books available to AML-Listers. If you want to know how to get involved in the review program, please read the guidelines:<. Please send your review requests to the List address < with "private" in the subject line. Your request will not go out over the List, but will be forwarded to me. I will select one reviewer for each title. If you have questions, please contact me: < Thanks! Jana Remy AML-List Review Editor ---------------------- Up for Review Deseret Book: The Kingdom and the Crown, Vol. 1: Fishers of Men By Gerald Lund In an ancient land in a time foretold by prophets, a babe was born beneath a shining star. Thirty years later, Jesus of Nazareth began teaching a message of hope, peace, and love. He claimed to be the Son of God, and his words and his life would change the world. In Fishers of Men, the first volume in the new series The Kingdom and the Crown, bestselling author Gerald N. Lund transports us to the days of Christ's mortal ministry and invites us to experience the emotions and events of those extraordinary times. Reports of Jesus of Nazareth have reached the ears of David ben Joseph, a merchant in Capernaum, who has waited and watched for the Messiah ever since a special, starlit night thirty years ago. He and his family decide to see for themselves whether or not the rumors are true and journey to hear Jesus. Though David is quick to accept Jesus as the Messiah, the rest of his family is more cautious. His wife, Deborah, and his son, Simeon, leaders in the rebellious Zealot movement, look for a Messiah that will crush the Romans with power and the sword, not one preaching a message of love and forgiveness. Meanwhile, reports of Jesus have reached into the very heart of Jerusalem, and both the powerful Sadducee Mordechai ben Uzziel and the Pharisee Azariah are growing uneasy with the news. Though they hold opposing political views, both agree that something must be done to stop this man from Nazareth before he gets out of hand. However, in Mordechai's own household the influence of the carpenter from Nazareth begins to create conflict. Children of the Promise, Vol. 5: As Long As I Have You By Dean Hughes, The war is over, and the Thomas family is slowly coming back together at home in Salt Lake City. But that doesn't mean all is well in Zion. Alex seems to be doing fine, but more and more often he wakes up with nightmares from the war. In addition, what he thought would be an idyllic life with Anna and their son, Gene, brings a variety of new challenges. Bobbi is in love with Richard, but she still struggles to know if she should marry him-especially since he can't seem to deal with a harrowing experience he had at sea. Wally, getting stronger every day after his experience in a Japanese POW camp, finds that adjusting to civilian life isn't as easy as he had thought. And Lorraine, the girl of his dreams, is engaged to someone else. LaRue, more mature and not so boy-crazy, wants to go to school back east, but her parents aren't happy about the decision.Beverly is thrilled that her family is coming home, but she doesn't always understand how they think or the decisions they make. She's also having to confront another challenge-boys. And finally, Alexander and Bea have their own problems to overcome. President Thomas is ready to fulfill his dream of a vast business enterprise run by his children. But, as Sister Thomas tries to make him see, the children may have different plans. In As Long as I Have You, the final volume of the Children of the Promise series, author Dean Hughes presents a moving picture of what life was like for an ordinary LDS family at the end of World War II. Prelude to Glory, Vol. 4: The Hand of Providence By Ron Carter, Ron It's the sweltering summer of 1777, and flamboyant British General John Burgoyne has been sent by King George III to command a force of some eight thousand British and German troops in the war raging in the rebellious American colonies. His task? To proceed south from Quebec and lay siege to and capture Fort Ticonderoga. With the British thus in charge of the important Lake Champlain-Hudson River corridor, Gentleman Johnny reckons it will be a simple matter to proceed to Albany and join his force with those of General William Howe and Colonel Barry St. Leger. Together, they will mount a campaign to cut the New England states off from those farther south, then one by one defeat them. With little understanding of the rugged, heavily wooded terrain he will have to cross and taking for granted the help he enlists from the ferocious Mohawk Indian tribe, Burgoyne assembles an elaborate camp and begins his march on Fort Ticonderoga. When the Americans abandon the stategically located fort without firing a shot, it looks as though Burgoyne is well on his way to accomplishing his purpose and securing for himself the military fame and glory he dreams of. What he hasn't foreseen is the determination of the American forces. Under the heroic leadership of General Benedict Arnold, they give their more highly trained British foes all they want and more, and in the decisive Battle of Saratoga, the upstart Americans claim an unlikely victory--one that changes forever the history of the world. Told through the now familiar characters of Billy and Eli, and filled with heart-pounding action and true stories of intrigue, bravery, and patriotism, volume 4 of Prelude to Glory captures the hig h adventure of America's struggle for independence--a quest that would have surely failed, had it not been for the intervention of the hand of Providence. Second Wind: Variations on a Theme of Growing Older ByTom Plummer "All of life leads to memories," writes Tom Plummer in Second Wind "The infant has no memories, just energy. The aged person has no energy, just memories." Memories, reflections, and observations on life: these are the "variations on a theme of growing older" that make up this insightful book. Plummer begins by applying his wry and lively wit to an examination of some of the signs and symptoms of aging. (Do you make note of where you lay things in your bedroom at night so you won't trip on them when you make nocturnal trips to the bathroom? When you open the newspaper, do you turn to the obituaries first?) "Reflections on Conducting My Virtual Funeral" describes the author's wish to maintain control of his last good-bye via holographic image. "A Lament for Two Aging Voices" is a comic A-to-Z poem cataloguing "old age blights," designed to be read aloud "preferably by two people in their mid-fifties or older." "Steady or Not, Here I Come" poses the question, "Why can?t I wear my house slippers to the mall?" Then Plummer flips the coin and discusses with candor and piercing clarity some of the more painful aspects of growing older. For example, he asks a friend who has dealt with diabetes since childhood what the upside of his pituitary tumor might be; she looks him squarely in the eye and says, "Now you can begin to live in reality." Facing reality eventually leads through lamentations and defiance to a reassuring conciliation. "Above the Canopy of Stars" expresses hope for the love and grace that can transcend the difficulties of the later years of life. In all, this poignant, funny, unflinching look at growing older is a must- read for adults of any age! Kirtland: A Novel of Courage and Romance By Susan Evans McCloud "A year ago I never would have dreamed that this moment could happen. Why, it has been little more than six months since I returned from my visit to Georgie in this place and discovered that my husband--who had forbidden me to touch it--had read Joseph Smith's Book of Mormon from cover to cover and was in his heart converted. This I had not expected. He had shown no previous interest, while I had. Perhaps if Georgie had not been so enthusiastically devoted to the new cause, if she had not virtually glowed when she spoke of that book--perhaps if I had not experienced that night outside my parents' house when Joseph Smith had prayed for my young brother, and I had felt for myself the gentleness and power of the young prophet's spirit" For Esther Parke Thorn, there is no "perhaps." The gospel is a fundamental and pivotal part of life, even when it means leaving behind family and friends to follow the Saints to Kirtland in hope of a new life. Kirtland--which picks up where Susan Evans McCloud's Palmyra left off--continues Esther's story and will further endear you to this charming woman who courageously faces the challenges, heartbreaks, and triumphs of the early Saints. Celebrate with Esther as she is baptized, and then witness through her eyes the building of the Kirtland Temple, the persecution of the Saints in Ohio, and the start of yet another journey. Along the way, Esther's own life is changed as she experiences the wonders of new life, the sorrow of death, the joy of conversion, and anguish as others fall away. Through each of these challenges, however, her own character is sharpened and refined, and her spirit is filled with courage and love. Fans of Susan Evans McCloud will enjoy this second novel in her moving series and will look forward to future stories about Esther, her young family, and her four best friends. Standing on the Promises, Book 1: One More River to Cross By Margaret Blair Young and Darius Aidan Gray The opening novel in a trilogy of historical novels about black Mormon pioneers. Born into slavery, Elijah Abel was destined to become one of the few Saints of African descent to receive the priesthood before the policy concerning Negroes was in place. In fact, Elijah was ordained to the priesthood by Joseph Smith himself. He served three missions for the Church and remained an active member of the Third Quorum of the Seventy until his death. Jane Manning James was born free but was still subject to mistreatment at the hands of a white minister in her youth before converting to the Church under miraculous circumstances. It became her privilege to live among prophets. She resided with Joseph and Emma Smith and later with Brigham Young. When she died, Joseph F. Smith delivered a stirring tribute at her funeral. These and other remarkable stories, until now lost to history, are brought forth in this sweeping saga--Standing on the Promises. From marvelous beginnings, through nearly unendurable hardships, to the bursting forth of more light with the revelation on the priesthood in 1978, the story of African-American Latter-day Saints is deeply affecting, one that will resonate with members of the Church everywhere. Sarah By Orson Scott Card In Sarah, author Orson Scott Card uses his fertile imagination and uncanny insight into human nature to flesh out a unique woman-- one who is beautiful, tough, smart, and resourceful in an era when women get short shrift in life as well as in the historical record. Sarah takes on vivid reality as a woman desirable to kings, a devoted wife, and a faithful follower of the God of Abraham, chosen to experience an incomparable miracle. Set in the splendor and excess of Egypt and the starkly beautiful desert landscapes of the Sinai peninsula,Sarah is an altogether believable and provocative drama. This first novel in a trilogy on the women of Genesis illuminates the hardships and the triumphs of a woman destined for greatness. Praise to the Man By Larry Barkdull In this moving piece of historical fiction, best-selling author Larry Barkdull looks at early Church history through the reminiscences of W. W. Phelps. A newspaper reporter from the Midwest travels to Salt Lake City to conduct a lengthy interview with an aging Phelps, who is on his deathbed. The interview becomes the vehicle for reviewing the events surrounding the expulsion of the Mormons from Missouri, Phelps's oscillation in his loyalty to the Prophet, and Joseph Smith's own personality and behavior. As the interview progresses, W. W. Phelps, friend and confidant of Joseph Smith, confesses his treachery to Joseph and to the faith. He describes his excommunication, his painful repentance, and his ultimate rebaptism following heartfelt correspondence from Joseph. In a poignant scene, Phelps expresses his devotion to the Prophet and describes the writing of the stirring hymn "Praise to the Man." This novella is one that will bring increased understanding of Phelps's role in the early Church and additional insight into the life of Joseph Smith. Nothing More Heroic: The Compelling Story of the First Latter-day Saint Missionaries in India By R. Lanier Britsch Elder B.H. Roberts wrote, "There is nothing more heroic in our Church than the labors and sufferings of these Brethren of the mission to India." R. Lanier Britsch shares those labors and sufferings in this history that reads like a vivid story of a dedicated traveler and missionary. Written from the perspective of Amos M. Musser, a former assistant Church historian and one of the seventeen full-time missionaries to India in the 1850s, this book follows the elders' efforts to penetrate the almost unbreakable social and religious shell of British India. On This Day in the Church: An Illustrated Almanac of the Latter- day Saints By Richard Neitzel Holzapfel, Alexander Baugh, Robert Freeman, 0000,0000,0000and Andrew H. Hedges 7F00,0000,0000Did you know that on April 1 Gordon B. Hinckley was sustained as the fifteenth President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (1995), the first single sister missionaries were called (1898), the Church announced reaching the five-million-member mark (1982), the Second Quorum of the Seventy was first announced (1989), and general conference was held in the Conference Center for the first time (2000)? Or that both BYU football coach LaVell Edwards and NFL great Steve Young were born on October 11 (1930 and 1961, respectively)? Or that folk hero Orrin Porter Rockwell died on June 9 (1878), the same day that folk hero J. Golden Kimball was born (1853)? In On This Day in the Church: An Illustrated Almanac of the Latter- day Saints, these and other intriguing entries give readers a daily potpourri of important events for each of the 365 calendar days of the year. Founded on exhaustive research and complemented by stunning photography, this book gives each day of the year its own unique significance in the Church's dynamic history. Entries highlight facts about past and present General Authorities, the early Saints, and other luminaries from Church history. Readers will learn about significant events in the history of the Restoration, temple building, and missionary work, as well as little-known facts about well-known Latter-day Saints. >From the First Vision to the dedication of the Conference Center, this one-of-a-kind volume takes readers on a daily journey through the fascinating story of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Joseph F. Smith: Portrait of a Prophet By Richard Neitzel Holzapfel and R.Q. Shupe In creating Joseph F. Smith: Portrait of a Prophet, Richard Neitzel Holzapfel and R. Q. Shupe spent hours researching and collecting hundreds of images and photographs--many of which are previously unpublished--to present this "photographic scrapbook" of the prophet Joseph F. Smith. Chronicling his life in a new way, this book introduces us to a more personal side of President Joseph F. Smith. While his contributions to the Church and his missionary accomplishments are legendary, and his gospel knowledge led people to name him a great "preacher of righteousness," there was another side to Joseph F. Contained in these pages are pictures of the many houses he lived in, tender images of his children, scenes from his vacations, and intimate moments of family life. Stories from personal letters and diaries are presented alongside the images, allowing us glimpses into important moments of Joseph F.'s life. Witness the tender reunions between Joseph F. and the Hawaiian people he served on his mission. Grieve with him at the death of his beloved firstborn daughter. Marvel at his profound spirituality as he records the revelatory Vision of the Redemption of the Dead. Though Joseph F. endured persecution and pain, his strength and commitment shine through every portrait. More than just a biography and more than just a collection of photographs, Joseph F. Smith: Portrait of a Prophet presents an intimate picture of a man who served as one of the great prophets of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Ashley and Jen By Jack Weyland Seventeen-year-old Ashley Bailey has it all. With her perky personality, good looks, impressive GPA, and cheerful attitude, she is the "perfect teenager." That's why everyone is surprised when Ashley begins hanging out with Jennifer Hobbs. Jen runs with the renegades at school, hates church, and comes from a broken home. Everybody know's she's trouble. But things aren't always what they seem. Ashley has a dark secret. And there's another side to Jen that's struggling to emerge. In his latest entertaining novel, author Jack Weyland explores once again the fun and frustration that are part of growing up while he also illuminates a secretive and destructive behavior that plagues a surprisingly large number of young women. Covenant Communications: Haven By Anna Jones As a young woman, Gwen Evans turned her parents' old farmhouse in north Wales into a cozy bed-and-breakfast. As she shares her simple LDS faith with her guests, their lives are touched in lasting ways. Megan and Charlotte are her first LDS guests, who come to do genealogy even though their comfortable lives at home in Utah are threatening to dissolve. Gwen's other guests include a small English family, whose father has suffered a devastating loss, and three young cousins who are hiking through Europe together despite their long-held mutual animosity. Then there is Edward Anderton, a widower who has returned to Haven many times over the years, drawn to Gwen's warmth and cheer. But, can she return his affections when she is determined only to marry a man who shares her faith? Gables Against the Sky By Anita Stansfield It has been nearly two decades since Alexa Byrnehouse and Jess Davies married and started a family, and their twins, Emma and Tyson, have now grown to young adulthood. The Byrnehouse-Davies family is one of the richest in Australia, known for its exceptional handling of horses and abandoned boys. Boys like Michael Hamilton, who seems born for trouble. Still, he holds a special place in Alexa's heart--and the loves Emma helplessly, hopelessly from a distance as he works in the stables. Will their two worlds, now so far apart, ever come together? In prose as vivid as the blue Australian sky, author Anita Stansfield expertly fashions a powerful saga of passion, betrayal, forgiveness, and ultimate redemption. In the end, when lives and virtue are threatened, true love and commitment are put into perfect perspective--and a happy ending is guaranteed Light in the Storm, by Chris Heimerdinger Ben Wylie is a man driven by many ambitions--riches, success, recognition--often at the cost of his own family. But one December night he takes a fateful turn and finds himself fighting for his life in a cold and hostile place. Here, amidst mysterious shadows and voices, and unseen enemies in the darkness, he discovers his most driving ambition of all: to reach his family alive. Author Chris Heimerdinger brings us his most moving story to date, the tale of one man's journey of self-discovery on a brutal, icebound landscape, and his family's desperate search to find him before it's too late--an adventure that reveals the unexpected potential of the spirit, and the limitless powers of God. CFI: The Wine-Dark Sea of Grass By Marilyn Brown (no summary available) Gibbs-Smith: Girlfriend You Are The Best A Fable For Our Times By Carol Lynn Pearson (no summary available) A Strong Man A Fable for Our Times By Carol Lynn Pearson A magical tale of a strong man who learns that giving his heart makes all the other giving he must do possible. Day-Old Child and other Celebrations of Motherhood By Carol Lynn Pearson This gift collection of Pearson's most popular thoughts will appeal to mothers of all generations. Bristone Films: What About Me? By Lisa J. Peck A children's picturebook tells the story of little Brookie who feels that she has no special talent. The heartwarming ending shows her family's love for her. "Well-behaved women rarely make history" --Laurel Thatcher Ulrich - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Request for Help: Road Show Date: 17 Feb 2001 09:38:36 -0700 Alert. Does this Ed Hogan have anything to do with the square dance person? (Who used to live in Denver at one time?) Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 12:59 PM > Does the church still do road shows? We haven't had them in our stake in > years, well over a decade I think? How widely are they done now? > > Ned - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn Brown Novel Award Date: 17 Feb 2001 09:52:38 -0700 Annette, there were sixteen full-length novels last year. Thanks so much for your interest. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ruth Starkman Subject: Re: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 17 Feb 2001 08:18:26 -0800 (PST) I was too young to have any opinion about Donny Osmond or his music in his heyday and I must say I'm agnostic about him now, or perhaps just entirely ignorant. But it does look like he's borne the brunt of a particularly maligned era of pop. Seen among the some of the cultural wreckage of the early '70s, he looks pretty good. Even his detractors are beginning to come around a bit. Encl. an article that might have already been posted, but I read it just recently. http://www.salon.com/people/feature/1999/09/21/osmond/ --Ruth Starkman - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brent Hugh Subject: [AML] Music of the Human Genome Date: 17 Feb 2001 14:09:29 -0600 To celebrate the recent announcements about sequencing the human genome, I decided to try making some music from the genetic code. I downloaded genome sequences from the internet and, using software I wrote, translated the human genetic code directly into musical notes and melodies. Then I processed the melodies in various ways using the usual type of music software. The end result is a trance-like and surprisingly melodic kind of music. You can hear "Music of the Human Genome" at http://mp3.com/Brent_D_Hugh The music is free for the listening in near-CD quality MP3 format (lower-quality, smaller versions are also available, so that modem users can listen instantly). --Brent +++++++++++++++++ Brent Hugh / bhugh@mwsc.edu +++++++++++++++++ + Missouri Western St College Dept of Music, St. Joseph, MO + + Piano Home Page : http://www.mwsc.edu/~bhugh + + Free MP3 Christmas Music : http://mp3.com/piano + ++ Music of the Human Genome : http://mp3.com/brent_d_hugh ++++ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ruth Starkman Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 17 Feb 2001 08:19:56 -0800 (PST) > > The San Francisco Chronicle has an even more brutal > method of rating shows. They use an icon of a man > sitting in a chair. The top rating shows the man > clapping and laughing and falling out of his seat in > hysteria because the movie/play/performance is so > good. Other icons include him sitting up and clapping, > sitting up but not clapping, and slumped down in his > chair asleep. For the lowest rating the chair is > empty. (snip) > > Other Bay Area-based AML-listers might have a > different take, but that's what I've observed. In > short, Eric Snider needs some competitors, and there > are more damning things out there than letter grades. > > ~~William Morris William Morris' comments make sense to me, but I have to admit I'm one Bay Area resident who's a lifelong slave to the "little man in a chair" reviews. Growing up, my family had whole dinner conversations regarding the "little man." 1979: Should we go see _Being There_? I'd not wanted to because the "little man" had been only sitting up and clapping (= B+), but I loved the film and still do. Nowadays I rarely read The Chronicle, preferring the NYTimes and local alternative and eletronic press for entertainment reviews, yet I still find myself thinking twice before spending my $8 on a movie or $23-45 on a play if The Seated One is not jumping out of his chair. This doesn't mean I couldn't fight back and form my own opinions. It's just that old habits die hard, and with respect to theater, small venues may not have the material mass to help audiences overcome such habit. --Ruth Starkman - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: Re: [AML] Introductions: Amy G. Chamberlain Date: 17 Feb 2001 16:50:36 -0700 <<>> I don't personally see much direct connection to the creative literary = arts in the project Amy described, but it would be up to Irreantum's essay = editor. If you want to test a query, e-mail it to irreantum2@cs.com. Chris Bigelow -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to = the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT = 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Responsibility to Your Gifts Date: 17 Feb 2001 17:55:37 -0600 At 07:35 PM 2/16/01, you wrote: >Why don't you have patience with people who could do amazing things with >their talent and don't? Why assume that people not actively developing >their talents are being negligent just because they are not improving their >most obvious or public ones? Ah, I see I didn't state that very well. I was afraid I hadn't. I wasn't thinking about people in your shoes, Jacob, who have put thought into it and are waiting for the right "season" to develop what you know you have (and as an aside, I believe you're right--yes, you can write well). I was talking about something completely different. I meant I get tired of the attitude, especially among Mormon women, of either a "false humility" of denying their talents--"Oh that? That isn't very good, oh that was nothing," or the (rampant) lack of self-esteem that disallows such people to believe in themselves, causing them not to use their talents at all--"Oh, I can't do anything." Does that make more sense? I think many Mormon women are afraid to say when they think they've done well (at anything) for fear of being "prideful" or boasting. These are the ones who have trouble accepting any sort of compliment. Tell them they look nice, they come back with "Oh, I just threw this on." Tell them they put together a nice program, they question you or refer the compliment elsewhere--"so & so really did all the work." Try it Sunday; give any 10 sisters a sincere compliment and see how they respond. It may surprise you. I find this to be a serious deficiency in character which denies the love Heavenly Father has for these sisters, and prevents us as a sisterhood (or as a people) from pooling all this talent and really getting something done. Hard words, I know. There are lots of reasons this syndrome exists, many complex, but it can be overcome with effort. I know, because I used to be there. Does that explain better why I run out of patience? It's a denial of our value as children of God. It's intentionally hiding our light under bushels. That's a far, far different thing than waiting for the right time to develop a talent. (I'm waiting for a time--retirement probably--when I can learn to paint. I think I could paint, if I had lessons, and I would like to paint. That's not something I'm supposed to work on right now.) >Can you have an artistic talent and let it lie >dormant while you take care of other priorities? I don't mean these as >personal questions for Linda. She just happened to bring up the questions >I've been pondering for a while. Mainly, why all the pressure to produce? Yes, sure you can. It's also more than likely you're developing other talents while taking care of those priorities. :-) I'm not sure there is pressure to produce artistically, from the LDS community; I'm not sure what you mean there. In fact, if you do, you'll be questioned. My pressure has mainly been an internal thing driving me forward. Then we could get into a discussion about which talents are valued more highly than others in our culture, and why... But I'm tired. Linda ========= Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: [AML] _The Straight Story_ (was: On Stage, BYU at ACTF) Date: 17 Feb 2001 19:19:45 -0700 > On Fri, Feb 16, 2001 at 11:12:18AM -0700, Marianne Hales Harding wrote: > > While I agree with your point, I have to say that _The Straight Story_ isn't > > a movie I would cite to bolster that point. I was bored to tears by the > > Straight Story. How many completely silent 15 minute shots of an old man on > > a lawn mower can you have in one movie? I was rooting for a semi to take > > him out. Ouch. How could anyone wish harm on sweet, old Richard Farnsworth? I have to say that I loved the movie. I think that "The Straight Story" is a small masterpiece; one of the finest films of the past couple of years. Richard Farnsworth is (was; still is, I hope) a genius. The man can convey more with his eyes than most actors can with a five hundred word monologue. I loved the slow pace, the subtlety, the unadorned gentleness, humor, and honesty of the film. Of course it was slow. It was about a very old, slow-moving man riding across the country on a very old, slow-moving lawn mower. One of my biggest gripes about modern filmmaking is that everything happens so fast, that too often the time isn't taken to properly develop a character, a relationship, a theme. That's why I love movies like "The Bicycle Thief" and "The Seventh Seal" and "A Man for All Seasons" and "Trip to Bountiful." Give me the slow-paced charm of "Snow White" over the hyper-stimulation of "Tarzan" any ole' day. So much depends, of course, on what we are looking for in a film. I had this discussion with a group of friends not too long ago. Many of them go to the movies to be entertained. That's not what I go for. If I want to be entertained I'll rent "The Mask of Zorro" or "Ferris Bueller's Day Off" or some such thing at Blockbuster. But if I'm going to go to the trouble and expense of hiring a babysitter and spending $5.00-$7.00 on a movie ticket, I don't want to be just entertained. I want to be *moved.* "The Straight Story" did that; it moved me. I just wish there were more films like it. Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN Sean Covey's 'Seven Habits for Teens' Joins Bestsellers: Kent Larsen Date: 17 Feb 2001 23:35:22 -0600 Larsen 16Feb01 A4 [From Mormon-News] Sean Covey's 'Seven Habits for Teens' Joins Bestsellers NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- The Seven Habits of Highly Effective Teens by Sean Covey, former BYU quarterback and son of guru Stephen R. Covey, made the Publishers Weekly Children's bestseller list for February, putting Covey's book once again on the bestseller lists. Like his father's management classic, Sean Covey's book continues to sell well, even though it isn't as recent as most bestsellers. The other Mormon titles appearing on bestseller lists have continued to drop down the lists, and off of some altogether. Orson Scott Card's "Enders Shadow," on recent bestseller lists after a paperback edition was introduced, has dropped off the lists, and the hardover of his new book, "Shadow of the Hegemon" remains on just two lists. Meanwhile, Anne Perry's "Whitechapel Conspiracy" dropped off the USA Today list, but joined the New York Times' list, possibly reflecting the Times' delay in publishing the results of its survey. The current titles on bestseller lists are: Nothing Like it in the World, by Stephen Ambrose A history of the building of the transcontinental railroad in the US. Ambrose, a highly regarded historian, details the involvement of Mormons in building crucial portions of the road, including the driving of the "golden spike" in the heart of Mormon territory. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 29 29 Barnes & Noble (Feb 16) Top 100 9 14 BooksAMillion (Feb 16) Non-Fiction Hardcover 9 8 New York Times (Feb 18) Non-Fiction Hardcover [Independents - 9; Chains - 10] The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, by Stephen R. Covey This ten-year-old personal management classic is still selling strongly. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 62 64 Barnes & Noble Top (Feb 16) Top 100 115 101 USA Today (Feb 15) 5 5 Wall Street Journal (Feb 9) Business Shadow of the Hegemon, by Orson Scott Card The second novel in Card's new series about Bean, Ender's shadow. In this novel, Bean is the tactical genius who wins the Earth for Ender's brother, Peter, the Hegemon. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 9 3 Amazon.com (Feb 14) Fiction Hardcover 20 16 New York Times (Feb 18) Fiction Hardcover The Whitechapel Conspiracy, by Anne Perry Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 20th novel about the detective. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 17 - New York Times (Feb 18) Fiction Hardcover [Independents - 19; Chains - 15] The Seven Habits of Highly Effective Teens, by Sean Covey Personal management concepts for Teens, written by the son of Personal Management guru Stephen R. Covey. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 5 - Publishers Weekly (Feb) Children's Nonfiction >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] _Boys Next Door_ (was: Theater Is Dead) Date: 18 Feb 2001 20:54:30 -0700 Regarding the question about bringing young children to this play, I don't recommend it. I haven't seen this particular production (yet, although I plan to), but I did see the same play many years ago, even with the same director. It was _wonderful_. But this very powerful show may be a bit heavy for little kidlets. One example: one character has an abusive father, and the scene with him is a bit harrowing. There's also some language in it--not lots, and always appropriate to the moment and character, but more than I'm willing to expose my young kids to. I do, however, plan on penciling it on my calendar and finding a babysitter so my husband and I can go see it. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ (was: On Stage, BYU at ACTF) Date: 19 Feb 2001 19:03:41 Sharlee Glenn: >I have to say that I loved the movie. I think that "The Straight Story" is >a small masterpiece; one of the finest films of the past couple of years. >Richard Farnsworth is (was; still is, I hope) a genius. Richard Farnsworth, afflicted with cancer, committed suicide last year. "The Straight Story" (and its accompanying Oscar nomination) were the capstones on his long, respectable career. Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: [AML] _The Straight Story_ (was: On Stage, BYU at ACTF) Date: 19 Feb 2001 09:40:22 -0700 >Imagine a pioneer movie made the same way as _The Straight Story._ > You know, it's interesting that you should bring up pioneer stories in conjunction with the Straight Story because the feeling I got watching this movie was similar to the feelings I get when watching many pioneer plays--will he hurry up and die already?!?!?!?!? Marianne Hales Harding PS I loved the PIoneer Story movie. It's very good to laugh this heartily in the morning :-) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 12:10:36 -0700 After all the wonderful comments on the Straight Story, I was looking forward to seeing it. When I got it, I thought it was too slow. I understood WHY it was slow, but I thought it lost much dramatic impact by making the same effect repeatedly. I know it's hard to create a bunch of new images to create such an effect, but artistically that seems to be what would make that movie really good. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 13:01:50 -0700 >I have to say that I loved the movie. I think that "The Straight Story" is >So much depends, of course, on what we are looking for in a film. I had >this discussion with a group of friends not too long ago. Many of them go >to the movies to be entertained. That's not what I go for. If I want to >be >entertained I'll rent "The Mask of Zorro" or "Ferris Bueller's Day Off" or >some such thing at Blockbuster. But if I'm going to go to the trouble and >expense of hiring a babysitter and spending $5.00-$7.00 on a movie ticket, >I >don't want to be just entertained. I want to be *moved.* > >"The Straight Story" did that; it moved me. I just wish there were more >films like it. I would agree with that, just not the part about the Straight Story being moving. I'm not against slow paced films. _Finding Forrester_ was incredibly slow paced and thoughtful but I enjoyed it tremendously. I enjoyed being invited into that world and invited to contemplate it. I don't think it was clear what exactly we were supposed to be contemplating on those long lawn mower shots in The Straight Story. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: [AML] Hitchin' a Ride! Date: 19 Feb 2001 13:04:25 -0700 WANTED! MWM seeks space available in (or on) a vehicle headed to AML Conference on Sat. Feb 24. MWM in question resides in Orem -- Utah County. Please contact personally at: bronsonjscott@juno.com or 801.226.7876 Thank you. J. Scott Bronson--The Scotted Line "World peace begins in my home" "Anybody who sees live theatre should come out a little rearranged." Glenn Close - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeffrey Needle Subject: [AML] Robert NEWELL, _Word History for Latter-day Saints Volume 1: Preexistence to the Promised Land_ (Review_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 12:09:20 GMT Review =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Robert R. Newell, Ed. D., "Word History for Latter-day Saints =96 Volume= 1=20 Preexistence to the Promised Land" 2000, Granite Publishing and Distribution Paperback, 696 pages + bibliography + index, $29.95 Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle Take the idea and run with it. History, as a discipline to be studied, = is a fractured, disorganized series of events with little to unify them = other than the ongoing conflicts that both raise, and raze,=20 civilizations. Enter the gospel of Jesus Christ in all its extent and=20= variety. Could this be the missing element in the telling of history? =20= Could this be the golden thread that unites events past, present and=20= future? This is the underlying theme of this book. Beginning with a thorough, and fascinating, exploration of the topics=20= "God and the Universe" and "God and Man," Newell surveys the intricacies= =20 of LDS belief as taught in Latter-day scripture. He does not neglect th= e=20 amazing scientific advances in cosmic studies, showing how they can=20 support and enlarge Gospel teachings. Newell then brings us through recorded history, detailing man's early=20= religions, his early explorations and empires, and lands us in the=20 Palestine of Jesus Christ. His journey brings us through the Middle=20= Ages, the rise of the Roman Catholic Church, the Reformation, and finall= y=20 into the arrival and growth of the sons of Lehi on the American=20 continent.=20 Charts and graphics are abundant and, apparently, original. Believing=20= the old adage that "a picture is worth a thousand words," Newell showers= =20 us with illustrations of such complex ideas as the relationship of God t= o=20 "intelligences," and the idea of eternal progression. Each chapter=20 contains abundant maps to give the reader a visual understanding of the = period covered. Newell displays some nice knowledge when it comes to the distinctions in= =20 the theologies of Christendom. For example, he knows the difference=20= between "the virgin birth" and "the immaculate conception," a distinctio= n=20 that often escapes many non-Catholics. His discussion of the the Counci= l=20 of Nicaea borders on misunderstanding, continuing to frame the=20 distinction in terms of different "persons" rather than substance, or=20= essence, but he finally brings it back to a better view of the doctrine.= Newell's writing style is not aimed at the professional historian, but=20= rather at the level of the everyday reader who wants to understand the=20= flow of history in the context of LDS belief. Although the book is=20 lengthy, it reads easily and keeps the reader's interest nicely. I do however, have a few problems that I'd like to address. The first=20= has to do with typography. An example can be found on pages 62-63. =20= Moses 7:13-23 is cited, beginning in the middle of the last paragraph of= =20 page 62, and continuing to the first full paragraph of page 63. A=20 quotation mark begins the quote on page 62, but no quotation mark begins= =20 the first full paragraph on page 63, so the reader has no idea that the = scriptural citation continues beyond the previous paragraph end. =20 Finally, at the end of the next paragraph, there is a closing quotation = mark and a footnote marker pointing you to the reference. The typestyle= =20 is no different from the base text; it should be set off somehow, so tha= t=20 the reader can distinguish between the author's words and those being=20= cited. The second concern has to do with sources. All authors use sources, and= =20 Newell acknowledges their contribution to his work. Cites from these=20= sources are footnoted, but the footnotes appear at the end of each=20 chapter (I suppose their endnotes, after all), rather than at the bottom= =20 of each page. Among his sources are such luminaries as Sidney Sperry an= d=20 Robert J. Matthews, names familiar to Latter-day Saints as their books=20= are available at Deseret Book. But among the sources is one Einar=20 Erickson, Ph. D. Frankly, I'm not sure who he is. A little information= =20 is given about him, but no real credentials. I informally counted twelv= e=20 references to Erickson. The endnote simply indicated he was citing=20 personal correspondence between Erickson and Newell and his wife. Had=20= the notes been at the bottom of each page, rather than at the end of eac= h=20 chapter, it might have been easier for the reader to judge the=20 credibility of the source. (The lack of chapter headings at the top of = each page makes the finding of the notes more difficult.) Just a little more on sourcing. Several chapters are heavily dependent = on the work of the Durants. The notes refer almost exclusively to them.= =20 Such single sourcing is considered problematic by some scholars. And=20= Newell even cites sources that are considered prophetic in other=20 denominations. Ellen White, the prophetess of the Seventh-day Adventist= =20 Church, is sourced without clear identification of her denominational=20= affiliation. All in all, this is a worthwhile book for the non-scholar who has an=20= interest in the flow of history from a Latter-day Saint perspective. =20= Inasmuch as this is Volume 1, I assume Newell is proceeding with the=20= project. Given the range of history of Volume 1 (Preexistence to the=20= Promised Land), I am looking forward to his treatment of American histor= y=20 and the period of the Restoration. I assume this will be part of Volume= =20 2. This book will make an interesting addition to the home library. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 14:39:14 -0700 Ruth Starkman wrote: > > I was too young to have any opinion about Donny Osmond or his music in his > heyday and I must say I'm agnostic about him now, or perhaps just entirely > ignorant. I thought the Osmonds were just so much fluff until I heard their album "The Plan" a rock and roll version of the Plan of Salvation, where they wrote the songs themselves. After that, I became covinced that these guys were much more talented then they had previously appeared. I still think it could work as a sort of LDS Rock Opera, like the Who's Tommy. Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: RE: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 17:52:45 -0500 Maybe it's because you saw it on a little screen. I think it would loose a lot of visual effect in a move to a smaller screen. I saw it in an old, nostalgic looking theatre on a big screen and thought it was wonderful. The whole time he was driving that tractor with such determination, I thought about what an inward journey he had to take as well. I wonder if knowing it was based on a true story influenced how much I enjoyed it. And, like others, I think Richard Farnsworth was wonderful. Tracie L. -----Original Message----- After all the wonderful comments on the Straight Story, I was looking forward to seeing it. When I got it, I thought it was too slow. I understood WHY it was slow, but I thought it lost much dramatic impact by making the same effect repeatedly. I know it's hard to create a bunch of new images to create such an effect, but artistically that seems to be what would make that movie really good. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Kellene Adams Subject: Re: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 16:21:13 -0700 I have to chime in here. I, too, feel that this album is truly inspired. I was young (junior high) when I heard it, but it never failed to move me and there was some great gospel principles included. . . Kellene Adams > I thought the Osmonds were just so much fluff until I heard their album > "The Plan" a rock and roll version of the Plan of Salvation, where they > wrote the songs themselves. After that, I became covinced that these > guys were much more talented then they had previously appeared. I still > think it could work as a sort of LDS Rock Opera, like the Who's Tommy. > > Thom Duncan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 19 Feb 2001 17:13:45 -0700 The film was a masterpiece of understatement, which in itself is a miracle coming from the King of Pretension, David Lynch (anyone else see Blue Velvet?) That's why I liked it so much. Slow? In the sense that we didn't see a lot of cuts, maybe. But I don't think that anyone camera shot stayed too long on one scene. I never found myself thinking, "Cut away already!" Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 19 Feb 2001 17:21:06 -0800 (PST) --- Jonathan Langford wrote: > A few years back, Mike Austin wrote an essay--I > can't remember the title of > it, but it was something straightforward like > "Toward a Mormo-American > Criticism"--delivered at a conference of some sort, > which I think won an > award from AML that same year. > Most of these approaches, however, seem to be > looking at Mormon criticism > in terms of developing or adapting critical > categories and tools for using > in analyzing Mormon literature. Mike Austin's essay _The Function of Mormon Literary Criticism at the Present Time_ is available at Gideon Burton's excellent Mormon Literature Website at: http://humanities.byu.edu/MLDB/austin01.htm Also available at the site are the essays by Jorgensen and Cracroft that form the background for the Austin essay (which Jonathan also references in his post). I would also recommend a second essay by Cracroft that breaks the history of Mormon literature into literary periods and attempts to define the 'geist' of each period. Last semester I wrote a paper for a class (Nation, Memory, and Diaspora) that attempted to show how the definition and treatment of these literary periods has shaped the 'current' literary moment of the past three decades. It was not a very successful work, but a side product of it was that I came to conclusions about Mormon criticism similar to those that Jonathan and Terry have expressed in their previous posts. Mormon criticism is an intersection where Mormon theology and history and culture, where Mormon worldviews meet up with other critical approaches and practices. What I love about this particular intersection is that the Mormon elements in it keep me from walling myself off in some effete, literary camp, ignorant of more 'populist' tastes. I find that I can't ignore the products and readers of the home literature movement, just like I can't ignore the backsliders, and the iron-rodders, and the crazy gospel hobbyists. This is not to say that I have to give equal voice and ear to all the speakers, but as a category, 'Mormon' brings with it literary texts and histories, readers and authors that keep me from the sort of hermetic thinking that, in my opinion, plagues too many critics. Which is why I can't abandon the idea of Mormon criticism even though I find it rather messy. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 19 Feb 2001 20:25:43 -0700 Are there any criticisms based on other religions? From my BYU years I remember all the different critical theories, but I don't recall anything Jewish-based, Buddhist-based, etc. The other only group I can think of that has its own criticism is African-American, but Mormons hardly count for that type of ethnic group. So is there any precedent for wanting a Mormon criticism? Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Responsibility to Your Gifts Date: 19 Feb 2001 20:25:19 -0700 Tyler wrote: >But I'm not convinced that giving up the gifts we've received is a >universal requirement of discipleship. Losing ourselves is. Setting aside >ambition is. Laying it all on the altar is. But sometimes what we place on >the altar is consecrated and entrusted back to us. Absolutely. I do think that there may well be situations where someone is required to give that kind of sacrifice, although they are extremely rare, in my opinion. The paradox is that we are required to be _willing_ to sacrifice any and all gifts ("lay it on the altar" as Tyler says) if that is what the Lord happens to require of us personally, even if that sacrifice is never asked for. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 00:02:06 -0700 I went to see "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" over the weekend, and one = of the coming attractions previewed was "Brigham City," "the compelling = new drama from Richard Dutcher, the director of the hit film 'God's = Army'." The movie looks like an ordinary murder mystery: someone is murdered in a = small town; there's never been a murder there before; the outside world is = encroaching on this place that everyone thought was safe; maybe someone = we've known all our lives is a murderer. What makes the trailer interesting= is all the images and references that speak to Mormons: The town is Brigham City, in Kirtland County, Utah Guitar playing "Come, Come Ye Saints" The sheriff starts his day kneeling in prayer People call the sheriff "Bishop" 17 bishops in town laying on hands Wilford Brimley: "Nothing attracts a serpent like a paradise" You can download the trailer from: http://www.brighamcitymovie.com/ . And = be sure to search the credits for names of AML-List members. MBA - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: [AML] Times Article Date: 19 Feb 2001 23:33:28 -0500 I just wanted to bring to attention what probably is current in Utah but which we hear from the _New York Times_. This is an article which deals with the language by which we do-- or don't-- identify ourselves. http://www.nytimes.com/2001/02/19/national/19MORM.html Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Theater Is Dead Date: 20 Feb 2001 06:19:19 -0700 Ruth Starkman wrote: > I have to admit I'm one Bay > Area resident who's a lifelong slave to the "little man in a chair" > reviews. Growing up, my family had whole dinner conversations regarding > the "little man." 1979: Should we go see _Being There_? I'd not wanted to > because the "little man" had been only sitting up and clapping I always thought the Siskel and Ebert "thumbs up/down" rating system was too restrictive. Sometimes they would admit to struggling over whether to recommend or not recommend a borderline film. I figured a four-star sort of system was better, because it gave the critic greater latitude in rating the films/plays. But maybe Siskel and Ebert had the right idea after all. In the end, all most anyone ever heard about or paid attention to was "thumbs up" or "thumbs down." I would guess they helped a lot of films be more successful that way that wouldn't have received the coveted four stars. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Slow-moving Films (was _The Straight Story_) Date: 20 Feb 2001 06:47:35 -0700 If we're starting a list of good slow-moving films (I'd suggest _The Trip to Bountiful_ if someone else hadn't already), I have to include Billy Bob Thornton's _Sling Blade_. A slow-paced film about a mentally deficient man who killed his mother in his teen years when he caught her committing adultery. The pace is slow, but not once are you bored. The tension slowly creeps up, almost palpably, as it plods toward its harrowing climax--which climax is also a study in how violence can be horrific without appearing on the screen: not one drop of blood or gore. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] OSMOND, Donny, _This Is the Moment_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 06:52:58 -0700 Thom Duncan wrote: > I thought the Osmonds were just so much fluff until I heard their album > "The Plan" a rock and roll version of the Plan of Salvation, where they > wrote the songs themselves. After that, I became covinced that these > guys were much more talented then they had previously appeared. I still > think it could work as a sort of LDS Rock Opera, like the Who's Tommy. Good analogy, since both "The Plan" and "Tommy" are more oratorio than opera. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 08:01:23 -0700 I would like to chime in with those who love The Straight Story. I think = it was easily the best movie of the past five years. And I don't find it = a bit boring. =20 There's this one great moment in the movie when you see a long shot of = Farnsworth on his lawnmower, driving down the highway, then pan up to the = sky. At this point you know exactly what's going to happen. They're = going to pan back down again, and we'll see how much progress he's made. = It's such a filmmaking cliche--pan up to a neutral image, then back down = again to show passage of time. Instead, though, Lynch pans back down . . = . and Farnsworth's hardly moved ten feet. I laughed out loud. Such a sly = commentary on the way Hollywood wants to force pace. =20 It is truly a David Lynch film. He has such a love for American weirdness,= and loves to linger on oddball moments and images. But it's also a movie = with great affection for its subjects. My wife and I saw it with my father-in-law and a brother-in-law. My F-I-L = is elderly, in poor health, and hasn't been to a movie in ten years. My = B-I-L has worked as a comedian professionally and is a very hip, active = guy. My F-I-L absolutely loved the movie. My B-I-L was polite about it, = but clearly found it pretty boring. Maybe the fact that I love this movie = so completely suggests that I'm not very hip. Or (shudder) that I'm = getting old. I don't think so, though. I just think it's a wonderful movie. And those = of us who love it, are right. Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] _Boys Next Door_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 09:49:39 -0700 I agree with Annette. It's very well acted, but don't bring kidlets. Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Shelly Choong" Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 08:44:28 -0800 > I went to see "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" over the weekend, and one of the coming attractions previewed was "Brigham City," "the compelling new drama from Richard Dutcher, the director of the hit film 'God's Army'." First off, I loved "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon". It was so innovative and fresh. I really liked the strong women in this movie. Michelle Yeoh was incredible. I'm sorry she wasn't nominiated for an Oscar. Great story. But I'm curious about Dutcher's new film, "Brigham City". When I was watching "God's Army" on video, I saw the trialer for "Brigham City". It mentioned a Feb. 2001 release. I've been watching for it. I live out in the sticks of Washington State and I hope we get to see it on the big screen. One theatre showed "God's Army" for one night, but I was busy and had to settle for the video. If any of you hear of "Brigham City" coming to Washington state, would you please send me a note? You can e-mail me personally at schoong@sprintmail.com if necessary. Thanks, Shelly (Johnson-Choong) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Responsibility to Your Gifts Date: 20 Feb 2001 11:15:41 -0700 Good, Linda. There is also the factor that we may have many talents but choose to focus on one to bring that one into high polish. Thanks for a good look at this subject. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > > Ah, I see I didn't state that very well. I was afraid I hadn't. I wasn't > thinking about people in your shoes, Jacob, who have put thought into it > and are waiting for the right "season" to develop what you know you have > (and as an aside, I believe you're right--yes, you can write well). I was > talking about something completely different. [snip] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] _Boys Next Door_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 18:21:00 > >I agree with Annette. It's very well acted, but don't bring kidlets. >Marilyn >Brown > > I would agree with the admonition not to bring kids, but not for the reasons Annette mentioned. She said there was some mild profanity in the play, which, if there was, I missed it. One character accused another of saying "the 's' word" -- but I didn't hear him say it. If he did, it was in the midst of some commotion and wasn't a big deal. (Perhaps Marilyn can correct me if there actually is more profanity than that.) At any rate, I would leave the kids at home simply because they'd be bored with the show, and it would be over their heads. Kids over 10 might be mature enough to understand the characters and appreciate the things being said. Eric D. Snider P.S. I thought it was good, by the way. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 18:44:51 >But I'm curious about Dutcher's new film, "Brigham City". When I was >watching "God's Army" on video, I saw the trialer for "Brigham City". It >mentioned a Feb. 2001 release. I've been watching for it. I live out in the >sticks of Washington State and I hope we get to see it on the big screen. >One theatre showed "God's Army" for one night, but I was busy and had to >settle for the video. > >If any of you hear of "Brigham City" coming to Washington state, would you >please send me a note? You can e-mail me personally at >schoong@sprintmail.com if necessary. > I haven't seen the new "BC" trailer, but I'm told it's different from the one that was attached to the "GA" video. That one was a rush job -- the movie was only about half-filmed when they made it -- and was dreadful and embarrassing. I assume the new one is better. Feb. 14 was the original date for the film's release, but it has been pushed back to April 6. April 6 is a Friday, which is the normal day for movie releases, but of course April 6 is also a significant church date. If Richard Dutcher chose it for that subtextual reason, I'm disappointed in him. The reason for the delay, I assume, is simply that it wasn't done in time. Shooting wrapped at the very beginning of November, and I wouldn't be surprised if post-production took longer than Dutcher expected. Quite a few more theaters than showed "GA" have signed on to show "BC." The current list is at http://www.brighamcitymovie.com/theaters.html . It will undoubtedly expand to other cities after its initial release, assuming it does well enough at the box office. Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 12:31:28 -0700 (MST) > When I got it, I thought it was too slow. I > understood WHY it was slow, but I thought it lost much dramatic impact by > making the same effect repeatedly. I know it's hard to create a bunch of > new images to create such an effect, but artistically that seems to be what > would make that movie really good. > > > Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Oh, well - can't please everyone. After reading so many people dig into the Straight Story, I'll add my voice: I thought it was one of the few masterpieces of cinema I have ever seen. Absolutely wonderful. One of the few movies I can claim have actually made an impact on my life. I loved it and I reccomend it to everyone I can. Eric Samulesen has already extoleld its virtues more eloquently than I can, but I wills ay that the pace was perfect, IMHO. But others disagree - but they aren't me and if they didn't like it, that's fine by me. -Ivan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: [AML] Irreantum Testimonials (Urgent Plea) Date: 20 Feb 2001 15:39:30 -0700 Pretty please, could a few of you provide the AML with a testimonial blurb about why you like Irreantum, why it's unique, how it's contributing to Mormon culture, how it compares with other Mormon or nat'l publications, etc.? We're looking for fresh, compelling, personal viewpoints that will help others get interested in the magazine. We didn't receive any AML-List responses to my earlier request, but 4-6 good blurbs would REALLY help strengthen the AML's marketing brochure. Please send your blurb to chrisb@enrich.com. (Include your name, hometown, and title, even if just "subscriber.") Chris Bigelow -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] Apocalyptic LDS Lit Date: 20 Feb 2001 15:40:51 -0700 I'm brainstorming LDS literature titles that have dealt with end-of-the-world, apocalyptic, last days, millennial, or second-coming scenarios. Marny Parkin gave me the following list (thanks!). Can anyone add to this or comment on which of these have been more prominent? (Card's work has obviously had more national attention. Which have been more popular among LDS?) Thanks Gideon Burton Adams, Linda. _Prodigal Journey_. Cornerstone, 2000. (first of series) Anderson, Glenn L. _The Millennium File_. Horizon, 1986. Blackwell. Pamela. _Ephriam's Seed_. Salt Lake City: Onyx Press, 1996. (first of series) Tarr, Kenneth R. _The Last Days: The Gathering Storm_. Cedar Fort. (first of a series) These titles are post-nuclear holocaust stories, not last days: Card, Orson Scott. _The Folk of the Fringe_. West Bloomfield, Mich.: Phantasia Press, 1989. (short stories) Lund, Gerald. _The Alliance_. Deseret Book, 1983. Others: Belnap, Joseph E. _The Coin's Edge_. Granite Publishers, 1998. Hunter, Wayne. _Millennial Run: An LDS Novel to Celebrate the Year 2000_. Richard Maher Sales, 2000. Marcum, Robert. _Angel of Armageddon_. Bookcraft, 1992. (sequel to the following) Marcum, Robert. _Dominions of the Gadiantons_. Bookcraft, 1991. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: maryjanejones@att.net Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 22:46:00 +0000 Eric D. Snider wrote: > I haven't seen the new "BC" trailer, but I'm told it's > different from the one that was attached to the "GA" > video. That one was a rush job -- the movie was only > about half-filmed when they made it -- and was dreadful > and embarrassing. I assume the new one is better. I think the new trailer is better than the one Eric D. didn't like. You can download versions of the unembarrassing trailer here: http://www.brighamcitymovie.com/trailers.html FYI, I work for Excel Entertainment Group (which is distributing Brigham City). I saw a rough cut, and can enthusiastically say that this is a very, very good movie. It kept me thoroughly entertained, intrigued and challenged all the way to the end. And they don't pay me to say that either. Mary Jane Jones - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 17:34:34 -0800 (PST) "The Straight Story" is David Lynch's most extreme example of counter-cultural filmmaking, very much in the tradition of "Blue Velvet." That is, the culture has become so dominated in the '90's by sex and violence that it takes a movie so determinedly virtuous, so "straight" to shock people, to get their attention. Lynch is up to his old subversive tricks, this time from another stylistic direction. (NATIONAL REVIEW, William Buckley's conservative Catholic magazine, proclaimed in 1990 that Lynch was a great conservative director, and I tend to agree.) ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] The Name of The Church (Deseret News) Date: 20 Feb 2001 19:53:23 -0600 [From the Deseret News, Monday, February 19, 2001] LDS leaders aim for altered name The emphasis is urged on Christ and not Mormon By Gustav Niebuhr New York Times News Service The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which has long been concerned that it be understood as a distinctively Christian institution, will step up efforts to discourage use of the term Mormon Church and instead emphasize the name Jesus Christ in references to the church, Elder Dallin H. Oaks said in an interview Thursday. It will urge that the church be called first by its full name and then, in subsequent references, the Church of Jesus Christ. The church will also urge that it not be identified by two other labels common in Utah, the Latter-day Saints Church and LDS Church. The decision at a meeting of the church's top leadership, also taken with an eye to the international news media interest the church expects to attract during the 2002 Winter Olympics in Salt Lake City, will primarily affect how the church's officials refer to the institution, especially in dealings with the news media, and how missionaries refer to the church in their work overseas. But church leaders also hope to encourage members at large to do likewise. "I don't mind being called a Mormon, but I don't want it said that I belong to the Mormon Church," said Elder Oaks, a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, which, together with the church's three-member First Presidency, exercise the highest level of authority within the 11 million- member church. Elder Oaks said the church would not discourage use of the term Mormon for church members, although he said it officially prefers that they be known as Latter-day Saints. Nor, he said, will the church seek to change names like the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, the Mormon Trail and the Book of Mormon. The word Mormon is taken from the book, where it refers both to a geographical area and also to a prophet of that name. He said the decision, taken by the First Presidency and the Quorum of Twelve, but not yet announced to church members, needed to be seen in context, as a "deliberate reaffirmation" of a long effort in favor of wider use of the church's full title. "We haven't adopted a new name of the church," Elder Oaks said, noting that Mormons regard the full name as having been revealed by God to Mormonism's first prophet, Joseph Smith. "We have adopted a shorthand reference to the church that we think is more accurate." Jan Shipps, a non-Mormon expert on the church who is professor emeritus of history and religious studies at Indiana University-Purdue University Indianapolis, said efforts to discourage the use of the term Mormon Church represent "the desire of Latter-day Saints - and not just the leadership - to be understood as a Christian tradition." Although the church has always seen itself as Christian, she said, its image has been "cloaked" by distinctive practices - like building temples, as Mormons still do; referring to members as "the gathering of Israel," as church leaders once did; and, most controversially, sanctioning polygamy, which the church ended more than a century ago. In recent years, Shipps said, an evolution in language within the church has been under way, so that Mormon as a noun is being replaced by "an adjective, as in Mormon Christian." "That's a dramatic shift that's taking a very long time," said Shipps, the author of "Sojourner in the Promised Land: Forty Years Among the Mormons" (University of Illinois, 2000). Although the LDS Church members tend to be highly regarded among a wide public for their emphasis on family ties and personal rectitude, the church's teachings are viewed critically by other churches, especially by evangelical Protestants, who say much of LDS theology - dealing with God, the Trinity, salvation and the nature of the Christian church itself - falls outside orthodox Christianity. The church, for example, teaches that God has a physical body, that members may progress toward "deification" after death, and that in founding the church, Joseph Smith was "restoring" true Christianity. Three years ago, the Southern Baptists, holding their annual convention in Salt Lake City, began an effort to evangelize LDS Church members. On a more subtle level, the Presbyterian Church (USA) published a study guide in 1990 to show Presbyterians where Mormons part company theologically with Protestants. "At first glance, they seem to be like us," the guide stated, noting that the two churches use similar terms for theological concepts. "But we will see in this study they are not like us." In 1995, the church altered its logo so that "Jesus Christ" appears in larger letters. More recently, the church's public affairs office released a statement bluntly saying there was nothing officially called the Mormon Church. None of this controversy seems to have impeded the church's rapid growth, particularly overseas, where a majority of the world's 11 million Mormons live. (Utah claims 1.6 million Mormons, or about 15 percent of the total.) But the overseas growth has also put pressure on the church to pay closer attention to what it wants to be called. "And," said Elder Oaks, who is a former Utah State Supreme Court justice and, before that, was president of Brigham Young University, "this is brought to focus and given a kind of timeline by the Olympics, when we're going to have an invasion by your associates in the media the likes of which no continental Western city has ever had before." Church officials say they expect close to 10,000 journalists in Salt Lake City for the Olympics. Elder Oaks said church leaders decided it was possible to begin using the abbreviated name of Church of Jesus Christ because no other major Christian body in the United States had laid claim to it. (Some have come close, as in the Christian Church/Disciples of Christ, the Churches of Christ and the United Church of Christ.) He said it was possible that some churches might take exception to the Mormons using the abbreviated name. "This decision is right-oriented, not result-oriented," Elder Oaks said. "We're only trying to do what the Lord wants us to do." # # # ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: Re: [AML] MN Is the University of Utah Anti-Mormon?: Deseret News 11Feb01 D2 Date: 20 Feb 2001 18:05:33 -0800 (PST) I have mixed feelings about this. The University of Utah's theater department is a blessing to the state. Charles Morey is a very shrewd, talented director and Pioneer Memorial Theater is a delight. I also enjoy the more adventerous fare at the Babcock Theater downstairs (just saw their production of "Lulu", liked it but wondered how it escaped the notice of cultural commissars like the Eagle Forum.) And Ms. Axon-Flynn's complaints sound like she is confusing the depiction of evil with the endorsement of it, a common mistake among the close-minded. (And I don't think it's a coincidence that Tim Slover has recently been hired by the U.) On the other hand I do think there is an low-grade animus against the church there: not so much hatred as agressive indifference. Eugene England famously said 20 years ago that he was told in confidence that the English department would not hire an active LDS person. Today, you can search high and low for such a person in the humanities and liberal arts programs and come up pretty short. And don't tell me this is just because the U. recruits faculty nationally; every university takes steps to make sure they have good relations with the local community, and this may include hiring practices. ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions.yahoo.com/ - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 20 Feb 2001 15:43:57 -0700 Who can tell what the most popular or noteworthy titles in LDS publishing have been in the category of the thriller? I'm not talking about mystery thrillers nor necessarily about sci-fi, but page-turner action novels, perhaps with spies, international plots, technology--that sort of thing. I believe Gerald Lund's Alliance is one. Others? Gideon Burton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Alan Rex Mitchell" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Straight Story_ Date: 20 Feb 2001 20:41:07 -0700 > It is truly a David Lynch film. He has such a love for American weirdness, and loves to linger on oddball moments and images. But it's also a movie with great affection for its subjects. Maybe the fact that I love this movie so completely suggests that I'm not very hip. Or (shudder) that I'm getting old. > I don't think so, though. I just think it's a wonderful movie. And those of us who love it, are right. > Eric Samuelsen I'm puzzled by Eric, Ivan, AML and other critics who loved the show. All I can come up with is that these type A people encountered beauty and boredom for the first time--and beauty won! Myself, I have taken numerous soul-searching trips...one in a truck that broke down so many times that dozens of people on lawnmowers past me. I've noticed the seasons changing. I've known people like the character, people like the ones he met on the road. This is because I go hometeaching ocassionally. Maybe because the movie was so much like the life I have known, I understood it well. But it wasn't a "great" movie in my book. It was a PBS movie. I'd rate it slighty better than Swamp Thing. No wait--that had Adrianne Barbou... Alan Rex Mitchell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Preston Hunter" Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Apocalyptic LDS Lit Date: 20 Feb 2001 23:06:28 -0600 You might find our page useful: "Science Fiction and Fantasy Books Published in the LDS Market" http://www.adherents.com/lit/sf_ldsmarket.html Marny and I work exchange info and make sure we don't duplicate work. She has an extensive bibliography, but doesn't have plot summaries, so I put some on this page. (And for fun, post-apocalyptic action in Salt Lake City written by a non-LDS author, check out Roger Zelazny's novel Damnation Alley.) Preston www.adherents.com ---------- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 20 Feb 2001 22:10:22 -0600 At 04:43 PM 2/20/01, you wrote: >I'm not talking about mystery >thrillers nor necessarily about sci-fi, but page-turner action novels, >perhaps with spies, international plots, technology--that sort of thing. I >believe Gerald Lund's Alliance is one. Others? Well , FWIW, my book has been described as "all of the above," in one way or another. I'm a bit low on international plots, but there are spies and secrets and technology and it's frequently described by others as "a page-turner." But I also emphasize character development, so maybe it doesn't quite fit... parts of it fit the description and other parts don't. Hm. You decide. Adams, Linda. _Prodigal Journey_. Cornerstone, 2000. (first of series) Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Maxwell" Subject: [AML] _Escape to Witch Mountain_? (was: Flashbacks) Date: 20 Feb 2001 23:14:48 -0800 Thom wrote: > What I found disatisfying about Escape was its (to me) inappropriate > mixing of genres. What started off as a typical ghost story turned out, > in fact, to be a science fiction story. I'm not suggesting that those > genres shouldn't be mixed, but Escape did in a _deus ex machina_ way, so > that the sf ending seemd tacked on as the easiest way to explain what > had been going on. I would have like to have seen more foreshadowing of > the real ending, while still making it appear to be a ghost story, so > that when the real endings comes, I'm going back over events in the > movie and saying to mylelf, "Now, that makes sense." Are you sure, Thom, that you're describing "Escape to Witch Mountain"? I think you might be talking about another Disney film back in 1980, "Watcher in the Woods". It starred Bette Davis and David McCallum. Here's how it's described in the Internet Movie Database: http://us.imdb.com/Title?0081738 "When a normal American family moves into a beautiful old English house in a wooded area, strange, paranormal appearances befall them in this interesting twist to the well-known haunted-house tale. Their daughter Jan sees, and daughter Ellie hears, the voice of a young teenage girl who mysteriously disappeared during a total solar eclipse decades before... " IMDB lists "Watcher"'s genre as "Horror", but I remember there's a science-fiction explanation at the end of the flick. I also recall reading that the Disney folk had a hard time making this film work -- probably because of the mixture of genres that you describe. Regards, Frank Maxwell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 21 Feb 2001 02:17:26 -0700 Gideon Burton wrote: > Who can tell what the most popular or noteworthy titles in LDS publishing > have been in the category of the thriller? I'm not talking about mystery > thrillers nor necessarily about sci-fi, but page-turner action novels, > perhaps with spies, international plots, technology--that sort of thing. I > believe Gerald Lund's Alliance is one. Others? I think Michael Ritchey's _Disoriented_ tends in that direction. P.S. My 14-year-old daughter read _Disoriented_ and enjoyed it very much. I'm trying to talk her into writing a review of it. Only time will tell if I succeed. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 21 Feb 2001 02:26:46 -0700 "Eric D. Snider" wrote: > Feb. 14 was the original date for the film's release, but it has been pushed > back to April 6. April 6 is a Friday, which is the normal day for movie > releases, but of course April 6 is also a significant church date. If > Richard Dutcher chose it for that subtextual reason, I'm disappointed in > him. Why? I think cute little tricks like that are fun. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eric Eliason Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Apocalyptic LDS Lit Date: 21 Feb 2001 10:34:14 -0700 Gideon, Parley P. Pratt's "Angel of the Prairie" short story (the First Mormon Short Story btw, "JS and the Devil" was more of a mini-drama) provides a fairly detailed vision of the millennium as does Nephi Anderson's _Added Upon_. My sense is that earlier fiction was much more scarce but more focused on hope for millennial utopia rather than the horrors of the Last Days. In _Added Upon_ last days horrors are barely mentioned at all and in "Angel of the Prairies" they are skimmed over quickly to get to the hopeful vision. Blackwell, Lund, Marcum, and Card seem to focus on the plight of good people in a bad world situation, while Pratt and Anderson focus on good people in a good world situation. [Eric Eliason] - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cory Maxwell" Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] LDS Thrillers Date: 21 Feb 2001 10:43:01 -0700 Gideon: I can think of a few other titles Deseret Book and Bookcraft have done in the thriller genre, though I believe The Alliance is probably the most successful. Robert Marcum has done several action/adventure kinds of novels. I've not read them all, but he's published the following titles: Dominions of the Gadiantons Angel of Armageddon The Sting of the Scorpion (these three are essentially a series) Death of a Tsar The Orlov Legacy White Out Gerald Lund also did a novel entitled Leverage Point (with Roger Hendrix) that probably fits in this genre. Covenant probably has some titles that would be considered thrillers, but I'm not as familiar with their books. Cory Maxwell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 21 Feb 2001 11:43:38 -0700 >"Eric D. Snider" wrote: > >> Feb. 14 was the original date for the film's release, but it has been pushed >> back to April 6. April 6 is a Friday, which is the normal day for movie >> releases, but of course April 6 is also a significant church date. If >> Richard Dutcher chose it for that subtextual reason, I'm disappointed in >> him. > >Why? I think cute little tricks like that are fun. > Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but to me it seems like an attempt to produce subconscious affinity for the film, trying to get people to think (at least in the backs of their minds), "April 6 is an important date in the church. This movie, which has to do with Mormons, comes out on that day. This movie must be an important Mormon film." It lends more of an "official and church-sanctioned" air to the movie than it should have. But I'm perfectly willing to let it just be a coincidence, or even if it's not, to believe that Dutcher was just being playful or something. Perhaps Mary Jane Jones, of Excel Entertainment, can shed some light on why that date was chosen? I might add that about eight other movies are scheduled to be released that day, which makes it a very unwise choice from a marketing standpoint. Eric D. Snider -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] _Escape to Witch Mountain_? (was: Flashbacks) Date: 21 Feb 2001 11:56:14 -0700 Oops, my bad. I WAS confusing Escape with the Bette Davis film. I'll now climb back under my rock to lick my wounds. Thom Frank Maxwell wrote: > Thom wrote: > > >> What I found disatisfying about Escape was its (to me) inappropriate >> mixing of genres. What started off as a typical ghost story turned out, >> in fact, to be a science fiction story. I'm not suggesting that those >> genres shouldn't be mixed, but Escape did in a _deus ex machina_ way, so >> that the sf ending seemd tacked on as the easiest way to explain what >> had been going on. I would have like to have seen more foreshadowing of >> the real ending, while still making it appear to be a ghost story, so >> that when the real endings comes, I'm going back over events in the >> movie and saying to mylelf, "Now, that makes sense." > > > Are you sure, Thom, that you're describing "Escape to Witch Mountain"? I > think you might be talking about another Disney film back in 1980, "Watcher > in the Woods". It starred Bette Davis and David McCallum. > > Here's how it's described in the Internet Movie Database: > > http://us.imdb.com/Title?0081738 > > "When a normal American family moves into a beautiful old English house in > a wooded area, strange, paranormal appearances befall them in this > interesting twist to the well-known haunted-house tale. Their daughter Jan > sees, and daughter Ellie hears, the voice of a young teenage girl who > mysteriously disappeared during a total solar eclipse decades before... " > > IMDB lists "Watcher"'s genre as "Horror", but I remember there's a > science-fiction explanation at the end of the flick. I also recall reading > that the Disney folk had a hard time making this film work -- probably > because of the mixture of genres that you describe. > > Regards, > Frank Maxwell > > > > > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stephen Goode" Subject: Re: [AML] _Escape to Witch Mountain_? Date: 21 Feb 2001 11:01:14 -0800 Frank, Thom's description fits both movies. They both had a similar formula: a supernatural mystery, kids with strange powers, ESP, telekinesis, objects with strange sybmols, quirky senior citizens, and out-of-this-world endings. _Escape to Witch Mountain_ had a _deus ex machina_ ending, but in my opinion, _Watcher in the Woods_ did not. I liked "Watcher" so much more than "Escape." I haven't seen the more modern remake of "Escape" but I saw the original as a child. Even then, I disliked the switch from what I would have classed as a horror movie into what was really a sci-fi movie. I think "Watcher" made the transition more smoothly, and even the sci-fi ending had more of a horror feel. Rex Goode _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] Prayer Request for Eugene England Date: 21 Feb 2001 12:04:48 -0700 Sobering news for all who know and love one of the most important people in Mormon letters. Last night Eugene England collapsed and this morning had emergency brain surgery. A tumor and cyst had been putting pressure on his brain--apparently responsible for his recent physical and emotional decline. They removed the right frontal lobe of his brain this morning. The good news is he is already gaining consciousness and can move his left foot. To what extent he will be able to recover mentally is unknown. Please join his former BYU colleagues and his many many friends in praying for his restored health. Gideon Burton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eileen Stringer Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 21 Feb 2001 15:18:09 -0700 > > Feb. 14 was the original date for the film's release, but it has been pushed > > back to April 6. April 6 is a Friday, which is the normal day for movie > > releases, but of course April 6 is also a significant church date. If > > Richard Dutcher chose it for that subtextual reason, I'm disappointed in > > him. > > Why? I think cute little tricks like that are fun. > > -- > D. Michael Martindale > dmichael@wwno.com I have no problem with that as a release date and quite frankly had Eric D. not noted it, I would have not made the *connection* if there is a connection to be made, maybe just a coincidence. By the way, what does determine movie release dates? Eileen Stringer eileens99@bigplanet.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 21 Feb 2001 23:04:31 > >By the way, what does determine movie release dates? > > It's up to the studios and the marketing wizards. Some of it has to do with the seasons, and what genres of films typically work best. Action/adventure films do better as summer blockbusters, while Oscar hopefuls are for fall and later in the year (so they're fresh in voters' minds when nominations come out mid-February). The time of year we're in now is for lousy movies -- the ones that have no chance of getting nominated for anything, so who cares if anyone remembers them. Freddie Prinze Jr. movies come out in January or February, as do movies that don't fit anywhere else (romantic dramas, less bombastic action movies, etc.). The pre-summer season is where "Brigham City" is. Movie-goers are gearing up for summer, thinking about all the heavily hyped, cool-looking flicks on their way, and they're going to the movies more than they do in the winter. As I mentioned in another post, though, several other films are also due out April 6 -- more than a typical week has. So in that regard, the date is a bad choice for "Brigham City," because it may get crowded out. On the other hand, "BC" kind of has its audience built in, and maybe competition from other new movies that weekend won't affect it. Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brent J. Rowley" Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 21 Feb 2001 16:15:57 -0700 > >I'm not talking about mystery > >thrillers nor necessarily about sci-fi, but page-turner action novels, > >perhaps with spies, international plots, technology--that sort of thing. = I > >believe Gerald Lund's Alliance is one. Others? Linda Adams wrote: > > Well , FWIW, my book has been described as "all of the above," in= one > way or another. WELL ... ... ALAWTH, (as long as we're tooting horns) ... MY= books have ALSO been described as "all of the above" and fit the description perfectly. "Page-turners" is the most common phrase I hear from readers= (next to maybe: "I couldn't put it down.) Rowley, BJ. _My Body Fell Off!_. Golden Wings, 2000. (volume one of the= Light Traveler Adventure Series) Rowley, BJ. _Silver Hawk's Revenge_. Golden Wings, 2000. (volume two of the Light Traveler Adventure Series) Rowley, BJ. _Missing Children_. Golden Wings, 2000. (volume three of the= Light Traveler Adventure Series) And let me take this opportunity to announce my newest addition to the ever-growing line of Youth/Young Adult, Action/Adventure Fiction. Rowley, BJ. _Sting!_. Golden Wings, 2001. (release date March 15th) If you're interested, here's a copy of the backliner: Sting! Stephen Ray Fischer, otherwise known as Sting, has a very annoying= little =91thing=92 about him. He can=92t seem to touch anyone without shocking them=97literally. Even with rubber-soled shoes and standing on plain dirt or cement, everybody gets zapped. It=92s not serious, of course. Kids do it all= the time. But not ALL the time. Now, as a junior in his small town high school, Sting=92s schoolmates= have long since learned to keep a wide berth, and as a result, true friends are= hard to come by. The taunting and teasing are relentless, especially when Sting= =92s little =91stings=92 start getting a little out of hand. After a curious incident with a high voltage power line, Sting finds= he=92s suddenly becoming more and more electrically charged. Lights turn off and= on, clocks spin like wall fans, radios and TVs change channels. Something very= weird is happening, and Sting has no idea what it is or what to do about it. He=92= s becoming dangerous to be around. There=92s even talk of having him put away. Only one girl, a newcomer named Connie Phillips, has compassion for the walking, human lightening bolt. And her father, a retired scientist with a= very mysterious past, takes the supercharged Sting under his wing and into his confidence has he works secretly on his =91project=92 in the garage. Then life starts getting complicated. Sting=92s jolted and electrocuted= peers want to teach him a lesson he=92ll never forget. Some unnamed government= agencies from the big city want Sting locked up for scientific study. Angry church members want him Ex'd. And a smooth talking businessman=97with= bodyguards=97wants to =91employee=92 Sting for reasons he can=92t even imagine. And if that=92s not enough, Mr. Phillips=92 project=97a top secret,= uniquely modified, VERY supercharged Corvette Stingray=97has suddenly disappeared. Vanished! And all fingers point to Sting Ray Fischer. -BJ Rowley - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "ROY SCHMIDT" Subject: Re: [AML] Robert NEWELL, _Word History for Latter-day Saints Date: 21 Feb 2001 16:32:57 -0700 Jeff, Einar Erickson was a very popular lecturer in the 1970's and early 1980's. He was a dynamic speaker, and produced any number of tapes of his talks. They may still be available at Deseret Book, where a bought a couple five or six years ago. While he has a lot on interesting insights, I have come to the conclusion that many of his conclusions are dead wrong. For example he argues that European Jews who rejected the idea of rebuilding the temple in Jerusalem became subject to Hitler's ovens because of that rejection. I currently put him in the same category as Cleon Skousen, Duane Crowther, and Hyrum Andrus. Great entertainment, but don't take them too seriously. If Newell relies very much on Erickson, I can't have too much confidence in his scholarship. Roy Schmidt >>> Jeffrey Needle 02/19/01 05:09AM >>> The second concern has to do with sources. All authors use sources, and Newell acknowledges their contribution to his work. Cites from these sources are footnoted, but the footnotes appear at the end of each chapter (I suppose their endnotes, after all), rather than at the bottom of each page. Among his sources are such luminaries as Sidney Sperry and Robert J. Matthews, names familiar to Latter-day Saints as their books are available at Deseret Book. But among the sources is one Einar Erickson, Ph. D. Frankly, I'm not sure who he is. A little information is given about him, but no real credentials. I informally counted twelve references to Erickson. The endnote simply indicated he was citing personal correspondence between Erickson and Newell and his wife. Had the notes been at the bottom of each page, rather than at the end of each chapter, it might have been easier for the reader to judge the credibility of the source. (The lack of chapter headings at the top of each page makes the finding of the notes more difficult.) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 21 Feb 2001 17:28:51 -0700 (MST) Rachel Ann Nunes has a couple of books, the first one being _Love to the Highest Bidder_, published by Covenant (sorry, I don't have the date--but I know Rachel can fill us in on this--). I read the first one, and it is a thriller, if "thriller" means that it has spies and things. Not much technology that I remember, though-- but it is also a romance *and* it's inspirational. What else could you ask for? ;) (Personally, I didn't think it could be done, but Rachel did it nicely.) I would guess Lynn Gardner's books would fall into a similar category, but I haven't read those. --Katie Parker - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff Needle Subject: Re: [AML] Prayer Request for Eugene England Date: 21 Feb 2001 17:12:42 +0000 Thanks for sending this news -- very sad indeed. He will be in my prayers. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff Needle Subject: Re: [AML] Robert NEWELL, _Word History for Latter-day Saints Date: 21 Feb 2001 22:08:31 +0000 At 04:32 PM 2/21/01 -0700, you wrote: >Jeff, > >Einar Erickson was a very popular lecturer in the 1970's and early >1980's. He was a dynamic speaker, and produced any number of tapes of >his talks. They may still be available at Deseret Book, where a bought >a couple five or six years ago. > >While he has a lot on interesting insights, I have come to the >conclusion that many of his conclusions are dead wrong. For example he >argues that European Jews who rejected the idea of rebuilding the >temple in Jerusalem became subject to Hitler's ovens because of that >rejection. Unbelievable. How could he come to such a conclusion? >I currently put him in the same category as Cleon Skousen, Duane >Crowther, and Hyrum Andrus. Great entertainment, but don't take them >too seriously. > >If Newell relies very much on Erickson, I can't have too much >confidence in his scholarship. > >Roy Schmidt I didn't mention this in the book, but Erickson is Newell's brother-in-law. This may have something to do with the number of entries in his book. Thanks, Roy, for the feedback. Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] Update on Eugene England Date: 22 Feb 2001 08:57:01 -0700 Update on Eugene England: 2/22/01 Eugene England underwent brain surgery on Wednesday, February 21, to remove cysts and a tumor. For some time he had been suffering from blinding headaches and had experienced a general emotional and physical decline that had concerned family and friends. On the evening of Tuesday, February 20, his brain began hemorrhaging and he suffered a paralysis on his left side. For several hours Wednesday morning doctors removed two golf-ball sized cysts from the area behind his eye, and partially removed a tumor. This required removing the right front lobe of his brain. Whether the tumor is malignant will not be known until the pathology report comes back on Friday. There is a possibility of full physical recovery. However, the area of the brain affected controls personality, and there is concern as to whether he will return to his normal self. As of early Thursday, his wife reported that Gene was conscious, that he could move his left leg but not his right hand, and that he was coherent enough to ask questions, give out accurate phone numbers to handle some business, and to joke about his slurred speech. The family is encouraged but tensely awaits the pathology report. Eugene England is well-known and well-loved for his many writings and frequent speaking on Mormon subjects. Recently retired from BYU, he resumed teaching Mormon literature at Utah Valley State College where he is now Writer in Residence. The many people whom he has taught and inspired continue to pray for as full a recovery as possible. For further information about Eugene England's career, see his biography at the Mormon Literature Website: http://humanities.byu.edu/mldb/b-englae.htm Gideon Burton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Margaret Young Subject: [AML] Update on Eugene England Date: 22 Feb 2001 09:14:32 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------04CEA994633280AA283CD691 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What follows is Karen England's report of her father-in-law's condition and exactly what happened. We all have Gene in our prayers. --------------04CEA994633280AA283CD691 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.EMAIL1.BYU.EDU by EMAIL1.BYU.EDU (PMDF V6.0-24 #45325) id <01K0ELECW5LS93D25N@EMAIL1.BYU.EDU> for mby@email.byu.edu (ORCPT margaret_young@byu.edu); Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:55:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from mail-web.uvsc.edu ("port 16104"@mail-web.uvsc.edu [161.28.224.158]) by EMAIL1.BYU.EDU (PMDF V6.0-24 #45325) with SMTP id <01K0ELEAFBHQ923TFD@EMAIL1.BYU.EDU> for margaret_young@byu.edu; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:55:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from MAIL-WEB-Message_Server by mail-web.uvsc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:53:51 -0700 Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.2.1 Content-type: message/rfc822 X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 "Robert COUSINS" , "Karen DODWELL" , "Tamara FRITZE" , "Steve FULLMER" , "Dorice GALBRAITH" , "Laura HAMBLIN" , "Larry HARPER" , "Bonnie KYBURZ" , "Rick MCDONALD" , "KATHRYN MCPHERSON" , "Lee A. MORTENSEN" , "Julie OVERMAN" , "Kirk RASMUSSEN" , "Linda Shelton" , "Joe STRANGE" , "Paul TANNER" , "Deb THORNTON" , "Charles VOGEL" , "Jans WAGER" , "Jen WAHLQUIST" , "Laurie WOOD" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Many people have inquired about Gene's health so I am writing this to = update you on the current situation. Tuesday night mom and dad went to the = symphony, which dad had a hard time staying awake for. He had been = sleeping a lot in the past few weeks, and his depression wasn't improving. = About 1:30 in the morning he work up with terrible pain in is head, became = sick and couldn't use his left side. Mom managed to pull him out to the = car and get him to the hospital where they did a CAT scan. The results = showed some kind of growth with massive bleeding in his brain so they = ordered an MRI. She called me at 3:38 and asked me to come to the = hospital. I arrived at 4:15 as they were taking him in for the scan. Our = biggest concern at this time was whether the growth was operable or not. = At 5:30 doctor Reichman came in and showed us the scans. Dad had about = five cists the size of golf balls in his right temporal lobe with massive = bleeding. To our great relief the doctor said this was operable with = minimal permanent damage other than some peripheral eyesight lost. He said = he did not see a tumor but did not rule it out since there was so much = bleeding. They operated immediately and by nine the doctor reported that = the operation went smoothly but that they had found a tumor and did not = know if it was malignantor benign. Lab results will tell us in about two = days. Naturally we were greatly relieved to have him survive the night but = tempered by this new development. As the anesthesia wore off that day Gene = regained consciousness and was able to recognize people by voice since he = could hardly open his eyes. In a semi-couscous state he asked what had = happened to him and expressed great concern about his job, teaching, = students, and other work obligations, as well as small attempts to be = humorous. He has limited use of his left side, which may be the result of = permanent damage due to the hemorrhage or temporary due to the swelling of = his brain. Preliminary signs are encouraging that he will regain much of = his motor skills within a week, but that is still a best case recovery. = Some of you know that Gene has suffered from major, uncharacteristic = depression for the last four months. Many of us thought this may have been = due to a chemical imbalance aggravated by work or delayed response to the = conditions leaving BYU. Since the temporal lobe deals with emotions it is = easy to conclude that the tumor is responsible for his past behavior. I = asked the doctor about this and he said they may be related but then again = they may have nothing to do with each other. There is no direct correlation= . He did say that if Charlotte had delayed bringing him in, Gene would = have died that night. Regardless of the news regarding the tumor, we are = grateful for the work the doctors have done for him and that he is alive. = We appreciate all of the calls of sympathy and support from friends and = ask for your prayers and hope.=20 Mark England markengland41@hotmail.com --------------04CEA994633280AA283CD691-- - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 22 Feb 2001 03:21:35 -0700 PRODIGAL JOURNEY by Linda Paulson Adams Volume One of "Thy Kingdom Come" June 2000, Cornerstone Publishing and Distribution Trade paperback, 517 pages "A First Novel You Can Love--and Hate (for Reasons of Envy)" Five hundred and seventeen pages consumed in a few days. Need I say more? Adams has managed to write an LDS character novel that: (a) doesn't have a Mormon as the character being studied (b) hits the perfect balance between including LDS references and not beating us over the head with them (c) virtually never gets maudlin (d) depicts all sorts of wretched behaviors and conditions of humanity (e) develops the character magnificently (f) develops the plot at the correct pace, neither boringly too slow, nor unbelievably too fast (g) crafts a near-future America that is reasonably believable (h) has relatively few LDS characters, who actually have some unflattering traits, and don't even try to convert the main character to the Gospel (i) has nifty speculative elements to it (j) won't let you put it down And she does it all in her first--repeat--first published novel. Don't you hate it when that happens? Alyssa Stark is an abused teenager. But Adams doesn't tell the reader that in as crass a way as I just did. The first chapter introduces us to the concept in a subtle way as Alyssa plays with Peter, a lifelong friend of the family not quite two years older than her: "What happened?" he called as he got closer. "I fell into some kind of hole," she said. "The grass was long and I didn't see it coming." Peter reached her, panting with the exertion. "How bad is it?" "I heard it snap." Her voice broke. "It hurts bad." Her lower lip trembled and she tried to blink back tears, but a few spilled out anyway.... "Hey there, don't cry," he said. "We'll have you fixed up soon. It'll be all right." He stood, shifting his weight from foot to foot, scratching his elbow nervously. She still looked at the ground, visibly shaking, but not making a sound. Finally she sniffed and said, "I ripped my T-shirt too." "So?" He sat down near her, pulling his knees up and wrapping his arms around them. "I think we've got bigger worries than that. Huh?" He tried a small laugh. She looked up. "You don't understand. This was brand new. I ripped it on this stupid dead branch when I fell." She shoved the branch away angrily, wiping her tears with her hand and sniffing. "It's just a shirt." He shrugged.... "She'll probably never let me wear a T-shirt again. I finally got her to let me have one. Now I'll be lucky if I ever get to play outside again."... She smiled, but then a shadow came over her face. "Peter, you have to promise not to tell," she whispered. "Well, gee, it's obvious you're hurt," he said. "We need to get you some help." "No, dummy. I mean you can't tell anybody that you saw me...you know...cry." Her face flushed red as she said it and she looked away. "What's the big deal? You're hurt pretty bad." "Alyssa Stark never cries," she said, straightening herself up as much as possible. She winced. "Never." Remember, the reader has no clue at this point what kind of a family Alyssa has. That information is revealed gradually, while remaining completely true to Alyssa's point of view. She doesn't think anything about her situation that's unbelievable. She takes longer to realize that her family life is abnormal than the reader does. She deals with her tribulations in believable ways, but ways which are spelled out matter-of-factly in her own words, without any hint that there's something unnatural about what she does. But deep down she knows there has to be a better life for her, and she longs for the day when she can legally escape her abusive mother. That day comes when she leaves for college in the ultra-urban and ultra-corrupt environment of Central City. This book is divided into three parts, reflecting three major divisions in Alyssa's life. Part One is excellent. By now the reader is hooked and is completely immersed in Alyssa's life. Part Two carries the ball well from Part One, until about halfway through. Part One shows very little signs of being speculative fiction. But the speculative nature of the book comes forth with a vengeance in the middle of Part Two. Alyssa, trying to deal with her past and with the death of her weak but kindly father, gets involved with drugs. But the drug she chooses is much more than what it seems. Strange things begin to happen, things which she assumes are hallucinations, but are clearly more substantial than that. This sudden rush of speculative elements seems to break the carefully crafted atmosphere of the story, which felt pretty mainstream up to this point. A bit more foreshadowing of this would probably have helped keep the flow smooth through this part of the book. But it's a minor flaw. It's not like there were _no_ indications that strangeness was on its way, especially if you read the foreward and the prologue. More reflective of Adams' novice status as a published author are the sudden proliferation of references backward in time to things Alyssa had done, just at the moment we needed to know them because they were becoming important to the story. The first one that jumps out at the reader is the knife: Walking alone in Central City at night could be dangerous, in spite of computerized surveillance in public areas. She would be in a group, but still, there might be danger. Murder, theft, and outright rape were illegal, of course, even if many of the things that tended to cause them were not. One of the first things Alyssa had purchased on arriving at college was a small pocketknife, a swichblade that was short, sharp and ready to defend her in an instant. She took a weaponry class that first summer and learned how to use it, should she ever have to. She carried it on the rare occasions when she went out alone.... She had never used the blade, but she put it in her pocket anyway, before leaving. She fingered it in her pocket as she went down the apartment stairs, careful not to press the button, slightly apprehensive about what she would find ahead of her. This is a much more egregious violation of the principle of foreshadowing. This information should have been conveyed when it happened, not when Adams needed us to know in the story. We should have watched Alyssa purchase the knife, heard her thoughts as she decided to, witnessed her weaponry class, seen on two or three occasions how she carried the knife with her, fingering it carefully, feeling apprehensive about being out alone in Central City. All these absent scenes would not only have avoided the "Oh, by the way..." feeling of being told about the knife after the fact, but they were missed opportunities for greater characterization. Adams does this several times with various pieces of information. The book could have used one more draft where these instances were identified and woven into their proper position in the timeline so their revelation to the reader felt natural and not forgotten until needed. But again, these were defects easily overlooked, because the life of Alyssa Stark means too much to us by now for us to worry about it. Alyssa learns that, harrowing as her life had been, others have had it much worse, and that she is able to sink even lower than she has been and does. She reaches the point where she can recognize that, even as an abused child, she was a still a rich spoiled kid and had a lot to learn about life. Whether she will be able to rise above her upbringing and learn those needed lessons is the question the reader longs to have answered. Friend Peter's family joins the LDS church early on in the story, but the event is again subtlely handled, so the reader probably wouldn't even notice it was the LDS church they joined were this not an LDS novel. Friend and roommate Debra (and a black woman, although the book makes no big deal of this fact), is also an LDS member. The clues are there to discover, but again they are subtle and probably helped by the fact that we are expecting some LDS people to show up. In fact, lots of things happen that are significantly LDS, but practically none of it is directly named as such. Adams hits the perfect balance in this, as she should, since the point of view character knows nothing about the church, knows little and cares nothing about religion, and wouldn't notice any of this stuff. There was one scene that I had a lot of trouble with: a brief appearance by the Savior. Not that I object to having the Savior be a character in a book. But I didn't think the circumstances warranted it. There was a miracle involved, and the miracle was handled at least as well as the one in the film _God's Army_, but I didn't think any justification existed for the Savior to be involved. The scene is a vital plot point and sets up another vital plot point to come. But something needs to be adjusted for the reader to feel like the scene is one that might actually happen. And there was one character I couldn't accept. One relationship, actually, since the character was okay. Peter's fiance is a very unlikeable, if tragic figure. Too unlikeable, because I found it completely unbelievable that Peter would have remained attracted to her long enough to become engaged to her. Her unlikeable aspects are necessary to the plot, but she needs to have some positive traits brought out as well, so we can accept that the relationship would happen in the first place. Something's got to appeal to Peter besides that pretty face. But overall, _Prodigal Journey_ was a wonderful reading experience. The characterization was masterful and moving. The plot was structured with the confidence of an expert. The book wraps up Alyssa's prodigal journey both in a satisfying and a yearning way. No neat, tidy package ending, even for the elements of the story that are supposed to be wrapped up in this first volume of a series. But the hope of positive outcomes is held out like an olive branch peace offering, even as many threads are left dangling in the wind for future volumes to tackle. If this is Linda Adams first published novel, what wonders do we have in store for us in novels to come? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 22 Feb 2001 11:26:14 -0700 To the AML List I would like to invite you all to a performance of an evening of Mormon = drama: Three Women; three short plays of mine about Mormonism and women. = These plays will be performed in the Little Brown Theatre, across the = street from the Villa Theatre in Springville UT, 239 S. Main. The = performance dates are Feb. 22, 23, 24 and March 1, 2, 3. Tickets are = available at the door, and cost $7. $6 for students and seniors. =20 The three plays which make up this trilogy are called Bar and Kel, = Community Standard and Judgment. Bar and Kel was recently published in = Irreantum. (I've changed the title slightly--one of the actresses told me = that Kel spells her name with one L, and who am I to argue?) Each play is = performed with a cast of three actresses. We did the three plays at BYU = in 2000, and the director of that student production, Wendi Keller, has = directed this one as well. Bar and Kel tells the story of two women, Barbara Bartlett and Kellie = Frandsen, who decide to make a project out of reactivating a woman who has = just moved into their ward. Kel, the more thoughtful of the two, begins = to have some doubts about some aspects of the project. =20 Community Standard is about Janiel, who has been called to serve on a jury = charged with determining the community standard for indecency--a pornograph= y trial. Over the course of the play, the experience causes her to = reflect over her own very troubled marriage. =20 Judgment is about three roommates at BYU, Mildred, Brittany and Sharon. = Sharon is concerned about Mildred, who has apparently flipped out, and = tries to reach out to her, while Brittany is far more worried about not = flunking out of school. =20 A number of you on the List have been kind enough to support new LDS drama = in the past--I am deeply grateful. I hope that those of you who are able = to do so will come see Three Women. =20 Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 22 Feb 2001 12:33:34 -0700 Eric-- What age qualifies one for the senior discount? It seems to me that as I come closer and closer to that golden number, it keeps moving away ahead of me! The only place I know that still gives a senior discount at 55 is a pretty bad restaurant where I don't want to eat anyway-- barbara hume Tickets are available at the door, and cost $7. $6 for students and seniors. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 22 Feb 2001 10:13:32 -0700 I love it when I drama person writes a novel! Great dialogue. Well, Michael, thanks for the terrific review! It's one of the books I've promised myself to read. If it's this great I'll recommend it to my book group! Marilyn - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: maryjanejones@att.net Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 22 Feb 2001 21:35:51 +0000 April 6 was chosen as the release date for Brigham City because: a) It is far enough in advance of the summer blockbuster season to stand a chance at getting booked in theaters outside the Wasatch Front. b) It gives Richard Dutcher enough post-production time to finish the movie well (with soundtrack, color timing, etc.) The film's originally slated release date was Feb 14, but that ended up not giving Richard enough post-production time. And to answer your observation about other films opening... c) Yes, there are several other films opening on April 6, but there are other films opening on any other date we could have chosen. Based on the information available at the time, we decided that the films opening April 6 posed no greater threat of competition than films opening on any other date within our range. And that's about it. The fact that April 6 is also a significant date in church history was a pleasant coincidence. But thanks for attributing to us so great an understanding of the LDS subconscious, Eric... Mary Jane - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 22 Feb 2001 15:37:10 -0600 At 04:21 AM 2/22/01, you wrote: >Five hundred and seventeen pages consumed in a few days. Need I say >more? Gosh, thanks, D. Michael. This review means a lot to me coming from you. The errors you pointed out are valid, and maybe can be worked on in future revised editions. :-) I agree with those points, and thanks for bringing them to light. I'm blushing, though, from everything else you said, especially after you ripped _Disoriented_ to shreds (guess you won't live that down!), which I haven't read yet myself. <> Let's talk about this. I find that readers either like this part a lot, or react much as you did. It happens to be the first scene I wrote, the scene that got this whole snowball rolling downhill, so to speak, so I'm not changing it. I also have my reasons, and it's not just to "convert" Alyssa to the church later on. Sure, the miracle could have been performed by anyone with the Priesthood. But why _not_ Jesus himself? Doesn't He care deeply for each of us, on a personal and individual level? That's one question I'm asking by including this scene the way it is. In fact, one of the underlying themes of the book is the reality of God, whether one believes in Him or not. He is there loving us. One character in the book, Andrew (Peter's brother), reacts to Alyssa's healing story in a similar way--"Why would _he_ do that for _her_ when we have all these problems here and we're supposed to be the special, faithful ones?" (Andrew is already struggling, but that will be developed more in the second book.) You mentioned the knife. What's funny about that is, she actually needed the knife only 'way later in the book (towards the end, when she's in the forest? that part) and I had to figure out how she got it. I could've written that better, you're right. I thought of doing exactly what you suggested--writing in her buying it, etc.; at the time we were worried the manuscript was already too LONG for a first novel/unknown author, and it just kept going, and going, and going... Anyway, in a way the introduction of the knife detail where it is was supposed to prep the reader for her having it at the end when she needed one. So I didn't *quite* get it right. This will help me for next time! The next book, also, contains many more LDS references and goes more in-depth with my LDS characters; I hope to be able to balance that out, because it does contrast with the way it's presented in the first book. Working on it. (Which I have to get back to *right now,* actually... I'm not checking mail often lately.) In the beginning and for a long time with this manuscript, I avoided outwardly calling the Church by its name, but a different writers' group called me on that and said it was chicken not to. They were right. Don't hide what you are. (I liked the way Richard Dutcher put it in his _Irreantum_ interview.) But I'd like to think nonmembers can read this without feeling proselyted, since that's not my point in writing at all. Hopefully, the second & remaining books will provide a window into our culture without the "proselyting" effect as well, although the LDS elements will be far more obvious. They have to be, in order to tell the story like it is. Thanks again, D. Michael! Linda Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Frank Maxwell" Subject: [AML] Audio- or Videotaping the AML Scholarly Conference? Date: 22 Feb 2001 14:04:36 -0800 Are there any plans to audio- or videotape this Saturday's AML Scholarly Conference in Salt Lake City? I'm sure there are many of us outside of Utah who can't come but who'd still like to hear the presentations. (Not to mention those at the conference in one session who can't go to the other concurrent session.) Maybe the AML can do what Sunstone does, and tape the sessions, selling the tapes for a nominal cost. If I were there, I'd be happy to help. Frank Maxwell - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "ROY SCHMIDT" Subject: Re: [AML] Robert NEWELL, _Word History for Latter-day Saints Date: 22 Feb 2001 16:17:39 -0700 Jeff, You can help me with this. It has been quite a while since I listened to his tapes, so this is by memory. Erickson claimed that a group of Jews, mostly from Eastern Europe, had signed a declaration that was anti-Zionist, denied the need to rebuild the temple or establish a homeland for the Jews. He then pointed out that the areas where Holocaust hit hardest, Poland etc., was the areas inhabited by these anti-Zionists. I am sure I have some of this incorrect, but that is the gist of the argument. He is a cousin of Victor Ludlow at BYU. (I think you know him.) Victor holds a Ph.D. from Brandies where he studied Jewish history and religion. I talked to him about Einar's claim, and Victor was not very kind in his response. In a nutshell, there is plenty of evidence that Hitler decimated the Jewish people in these areas, but no evidence that he did for THAT reason. Does this ring a bell with you at all? Is the declaration a fact of history, or is the entire thing of whole cloth? Roy >>> Jeff Needle 02/21/01 03:08PM >>> At 04:32 PM 2/21/01 -0700, you wrote: Roy wrote: >While he has a lot on interesting insights, I have come to the >conclusion that many of his conclusions are dead wrong. For example he >argues that European Jews who rejected the idea of rebuilding the >temple in Jerusalem became subject to Hitler's ovens because of that >rejection. Jeff responded: Unbelievable. How could he come to such a conclusion? - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Christopher Bigelow" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 22 Feb 2001 17:01:37 -0700 What time does it start? Should we call in advance and pay for tickets by credit card, to guarantee = a seat? -------- For a sample copy of IRREANTUM, a Mormon literary quarterly, send $4 to = the Association for Mormon Letters, 262 S. Main St., Springville, UT = 84663. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff Needle Subject: Re: [AML] Robert NEWELL, _Word History for Latter-day Saints Date: 22 Feb 2001 19:10:50 +0000 Boy, this is a good question. There have always been Jews who believe that the expulsion from the Promised Land was a punishment from God and that they will NOT return to Israel. Most prominently, a small groups of such Jews, many rabbis, met with Louis Farrakhan, in seeming agreement with Farrakhan's modified, though still negative, views of the Jews and the state of Israel. In fact, these Jews feel that, should God want them back in Israel, He'll do it himself, no need for airplanes, etc. They view the current Jewish population in Israel as traitors! Anti-Zionist indeed. But as to the agreement you mention below, no, I've never heard of it. I don't know anything about those areas of Polant. I could do some research on it to see what I can learn. I'm very interested in this. Thanks for the update, Roy. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 00:54:41 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" wrote: > These plays will be performed in the Little Brown Theatre, across the street from the Villa Theatre in Springville UT, 239 S. Main. I'd like to hear the logistics of how you went about getting this play produced, including what it was like to do it at the Little Brown Theater. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 23 Feb 2001 01:30:27 -0700 Linda Adams wrote: > Sure, the miracle could have been performed by anyone with the Priesthood. > But why _not_ Jesus himself? Doesn't He care deeply for each of us, on a > personal and individual level? That's one question I'm asking by including > this scene the way it is. In fact, one of the underlying themes of the book > is the reality of God, whether one believes in Him or not. He is there > loving us. One character in the book, Andrew (Peter's brother), reacts to > Alyssa's healing story in a similar way--"Why would _he_ do that for _her_ > when we have all these problems here and we're supposed to be the special, > faithful ones?" (Andrew is already struggling, but that will be developed > more in the second book.) I'm glad to hear you have a reason for using Christ, and not just throwing him in for effect or a quick solution to a conversion. That shows you're a competent author. The problem is, it's not apparent when the scene happens, so the reader doesn't know if you're being competent or not. One idea I had, and you can decide if this sounds any good or not, is to downplay who it is during the miracle scene. That's done simply by removing the reference to his hand and wrist wounds. Spreading out the revelation of who it is would soften it. It would also, I think, make the scene where she sees the portrait in the Richardsons' home even more powerful. It would also allow you to have Andrew react with his skepticism immediately after the reader realizes who the healer was, thereby showing the reader that the author recognizes that Christ making a visitation is out of the ordinary. Then the reader can feel the author is competent and an explanation will be coming at some future point. You can have any unbelievable thing happen in your story as long as you have the characters react to its unbelievableness so the reader knows the author recognizes the problem. Of course, you also have to justify it eventually, or the reader will feel cheated. But the sooner after the unbelievable event you get a "What the heck?" reaction from a character, the better. The longer a reader reads with a skeptical raised eyebrow, the worse for you. Good writing is such a balancing act! > You mentioned the knife. What's funny about that is, she actually needed > the knife only 'way later in the book (towards the end, when she's in the > forest? that part) and I had to figure out how she got it. I could've > written that better, you're right. I thought of doing exactly what you > suggested--writing in her buying it, etc.; at the time we were worried the > manuscript was already too LONG for a first novel/unknown author, and it > just kept going, and going, and going... Anyway, in a way the introduction > of the knife detail where it is was supposed to prep the reader for her > having it at the end when she needed one. So I didn't *quite* get it right. > This will help me for next time! Even though technically this scene did foreshadow the actual use of the knife, it still _felt_ like an "Oh by the way" situation. As a reader, I already had that feeling before I read on to discover when the knife would actually be used. I can understand your concern as a first time author that your book might seem to drag on and you'd want to shorten it up. But I hope it's success has given you the confidence to know that the character you created is interesting enough that the readers _do_ want to hear about the things she does that reveal facets of her personality. And mentioning those events (buying the knife, carrying it with her, fingering it) wouldn't take all that many lines to include anyway: certainly no more lines than the "Oh by the way" scene used. If you show something happening in real time, in chronological order, no reader on earth can complain that it was a contrived or misplaced scene. It's just what happened then. > The next book, also, contains many more LDS references and goes more > in-depth with my LDS characters; I hope to be able to balance that out, > because it does contrast with the way it's presented in the first book. > In the beginning and for a long time with > this manuscript, I avoided outwardly calling the Church by its name, but a > different writers' group called me on that and said it was chicken not to. > They were right. Don't hide what you are. Balance isn't a set number of references. Balance is what is honest for the book. Alyssa knew nothing about the church--so little she couldn't even recognize the signs of her roommate being a disciple. In volume one, balance required very little in the way of references. Volume two will have its own set of requirements based on what the POV characters know. If they know the name of the church, then you say it without apology. If they're members, then LDS references abound all over the place, because that's what the characters know. > Hopefully, the second & remaining books will provide a window into > our culture without the "proselyting" effect as well, although the LDS > elements will be far more obvious. If you write honestly, they won't appear as proselyting to any but those with a chip on their shoulder--and they'd only be happy if you wrote anti-church stuff. Writing honestly means you tell what would really happen based on who the characters are and what the circumstances are, not based on what would maximally "promote faith." (Personally, I think the best faith-promoting stories are the honest ones anyway.) -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 07:56:31 -0700 The play begins at 7:30. Unfortunately, we're not set up to process credit card orders. I = apologize for the inconvenience. We're recommending that people just come = to the door. We don't anticipate a sold-out performance. Eric=20 - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 07:57:33 -0700 Our senior discount is available to anyone who can make a plausible case = for one. 55 sounds good to me! Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rachel Ann Nunes" Subject: Re: [AML] Apocalyptic LDS Lit Date: 23 Feb 2001 09:18:10 -0800 > Tarr, Kenneth R. _The Last Days: The Gathering Storm_. Cedar Fort. > (first of a series) The sequel _The Last Days Volume Two: Zion's Trail_ was released last December. Not on the Gideon's list is John McRae's _A Place Near Kolob_ and sequels (1999). And also Marsha Newman's trilogy _The Lightning and the Storm_, _A Love Beyond Time_, and _Fire and Glory_ (Wellsping Press, 1989). About Pam Blackwell's novel _Ephraim's Seed_. A friend I trust read about 100 pages of it and said the story line wasn't bad. It begins after a great economic cartel has gained control of the world and even the LDS Church in Utah. My friend thought the story went a little slow, however, and it was so full of language errors--nearly every fourth or fifth sentence--that he gave up reading. He couldn't see how the novel was based on scripture, which really annoyed him. Given this recommendation, I'm not likely to pick one up. Can anyone else verify this? Rachel _______________________ Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) Best-selling author of the Ariana series and This Time Forever Web page: http://www.ranunes.com E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rachel Ann Nunes" Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 23 Feb 2001 09:31:10 -0800 > Rachel Ann Nunes has a couple of books, the first one being _Love to the > Highest Bidder_, published by Covenant (sorry, I don't have the date 1998 _Framed for Love_ (1999) and _Love on the Run_ (2000) are the sequels. _Love on the Run_ uses a good deal more technolgy than the others--mostly spy stuff. > technology that I remember, though-- but it is also a romance *and* it's > inspirational. What else could you ask for? ;) (Personally, I didn't think it > could be done, but Rachel did it nicely.) Thank you, Katie! Rachel _______________________ Rachel Ann Nunes (noon-esh) Best-selling author of the Ariana series and This Time Forever Web page: http://www.ranunes.com E-mail: rachel@ranunes.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 22 Feb 2001 23:42:56 -0600 At 11:13 AM 2/22/01, you wrote: >I love it when I drama person writes a novel! Ha ha, this is very, very funny, Marilyn! Actually, it's a fiction person writing drama. You just happened to read my two (and only two, unproduced) plays first. And I love writing drama. But I'm a fiction writer first. Actually, maybe a poet first. But poetry's harder to get anybody to read... I hope you take it to your book group! Let me know! Linda Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 12:35:54 -0700 THREE WOMEN starts at 7:30 and will play tonight (Friday) Sat. and next Thurday, Friday and Saturday at the Little Brown Theatre, 239 S. Main in Springville, and the cost is $6, 7? I can't remember. Anyway, we are excited to have you come! No reservations needed! Marilyn - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: [AML] Directions to AML Scholarly Conference Date: 23 Feb 2001 12:32:47 -0700 (MST) It's been a whole year - and I'm presenting again - but I can't remember the directions to the AML conference on saturday! anyone have good set of directions from Provo? email me at iaw2@email.byu.edu --ivan - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "ROY SCHMIDT" Subject: Re: [AML] Robert NEWELL,_Word History for Latter-day Saints Date: 23 Feb 2001 13:14:45 -0700 Keep me posted, Jeff. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: RE: [AML] Directions to AML Scholarly Conference Date: 23 Feb 2001 14:03:00 -0700 To Westminster College from Provo: I-15 North Turn right onto I-80 East Get off at the Sugar House / 1300 East exit Turn Left (North) Go through one stoplight Watch for entrance to Westminster on your left Address: 1840 South 1300 East The Gore Auditorium is one or two buildings south of the main administration building that has the circular drive in front of it. You'll see people walking toward it. Another way to find it is south of the tennis courts three or four buildings on your left. It's a very small campus. Gideon Burton - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 13:16:50 -0700 The way I usually make a plausible case is to shuffle uncertainly up to the ticket window and request the ticket in a quavering voice. barbara hume At 07:57 AM 2/23/01 -0700, you wrote: >Our senior discount is available to anyone who can make a plausible case >for one. 55 sounds good to me! > >Eric Samuelsen > > > >- >AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature >http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Travis Manning" Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 23 Feb 2001 16:33:11 -0700 >From: Jonathan Langford > >Travis, > What purpose does literature have in the cosmos as seen in >Mormon eyes? That's a question that interests me a lot, and one I think >everyone who professes a serious interest in Mormon letters ought to >tackle, at least in personal terms--and that we all ought to talk about >more in Mormon literary and artistic circles. ************************** What if we devoted next year's AML Conference to looking at critical perspectives, at a "Mormon" perspective . . . . Though, perhaps the Brethren, now, would prefer we refer to a "Mormon" criticism as a "Church of Jesus Christ" criticism -- I am in no way attempting in being sarcastic here, just pondering on the recent NYT article. Are we going to change the name of the Association for Mormon Letters to something else? Should we? (I'm getting sidetracked.) ************************ >So my >prejudice is against any attempt to label something as "the" Mormon >criticism, but rather toward encouraging Mormon literary scholars from >every different critical school and approach to talk and write about the >connection between their own critical theory and practice and Mormonism. >Providing forums for this type of discussion would, I think, take us much >further in Mormon letters than any attempt to arrive at a formalized >"Mormon" literary scholarship. ********************************** I think employing a variety of critical perspectives may be the way to go for Mormon criticism. "Seek ye learning [critical perspectives] out of the best books . . . ." Perhaps "a" Mormon critical perspective could *be* a combo of many. *********************************** >"One Lord, one faith, one baptism" should not, I think, be taken to the >point of "one literary criticism." It's my belief that one of Mormonism's >cultural quirks, not always a positive one, is an attempt to arrive at >consensus and closure in areas far removed from doctrine and religious >practice; but in areas like literary criticism I think it's important to >let a certain diversity flourish, in the interests of seeing what we can >learn from each other. ********************************* Amen, brother. And "I say these things humbly . . ." to quote Richard Cracroft who used to close my senior seminar class on Mark Twain at the Zoo, in this manner; but, if anyone *were* to write "a" critical Mormon perspective, he, along with Eugene England, could be co-authors. My prayers go out to Prof. England at this time. Travis K. Manning "Men and women die; philosophers falter in wisdom, and Christians in goodness: if any one you know has suffered and erred, let him look higher than his equals for strength to amend, and solace to heal." (Jane Eyre) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 23 Feb 2001 19:22:59 -0700 D. Michael's review was pretty much on target. The book had the strengths he listed as well as the exact weaknesses that bothered me, too. The biggest one was that Peter's fiance definitely drove me nuts, not because she was such a bad person but because I didn't believe for one second that Peter would really fall for her. She was so transparent. And the miracle scene bothered me, too--which is ironic, since that's the scene that Linda says came to her first, that the book was built around. Although I understand why it's there, I don't think it worked. On the other hand, I wasn't bothered by another one of D. Michael's complaints, that information is given for the reader's benefit w/out showing the scenes earlier as they happen (such as with the knife). One reason it didn't bother me is that we're already talking about a pretty hefty sized book here. The knife issue alone would have taken at least three or four scenes to remedy by D. Michael's standard, and he says there are many more information pieces like it, adding a significant number of pages. It might have been nice to see her buying the knife and mention enrolling in a class for using it, but actually showing all that (especially the class itself) would have made the story drag. I think Linda did a pretty good job getting a lot of information in quickly to keep the pace going so the reader keeps reading. That alone is is a pretty impressive feat, since many readers won't give a book a chance if it's more than an inch thick. And this book is significantly more than an inch thick! Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 23 Feb 2001 20:04:29 -0600 Eric Samuelsen: Our senior discount is available to anyone who can make a plausible case for one. 55 sounds good to me! _______________ So, if I limp and bring a cane ... ? (That *is* what acting is all about, isn't it?) Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 24 Feb 2001 00:35:34 -0600 At 13:16 23-02-01 -0700, you wrote: >The way I usually make a plausible case is to shuffle uncertainly up to >the ticket window and request the ticket in a quavering voice. > >barbara hume I had no idea you could play someone so different from yourself so convincingly. -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ronn Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] Directions to AML Scholarly Conference Date: 24 Feb 2001 00:36:45 -0600 At 12:32 23-02-01 -0700, you wrote: >It's been a whole year - and I'm presenting again - but I can't remember the >directions to the AML conference on saturday! > >anyone have good set of directions from Provo? > >email me at iaw2@email.byu.edu > >--ivan Yes: be careful not to make any wrong turns. As Bob Hope said when guesting on D&M, "Provo is not the end of the world, but you can see the edge from there." -- Ronn! :) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeffrey Needle Subject: [AML] Antonio FELIZ, _Out of the Bishop's Closet_ (Review) Date: 24 Feb 2001 03:11:36 GMT Review =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Antonio A. Feliz, _Out of the Bishop's Closet, second edition 1992, Alamo Square Press Paperback, 199 pages, $12.95 Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle This may well be the most difficult review I've ever written. And it = must be said at the outset that my reporting of the contents of this boo= k=20 in no way implies an endorsement of these ideas. The blurb on the front cover proclaims this book to be =93The daring=20= Testimony of Faith of a gay Mormon High Priest.=94 I purchased the book= =20 about a year ago at a library book sale, not knowing when I=92d ever get= a=20 chance to read it. My assumption was that it was just another=20 anti-Mormon tract written by a dissatisfied ex-member. As such, it held= =20 minimal interest. But I decided to read it and get it out of the way. I have strong mixed= =20 feelings about this book and its author, and hope to express these=20 feelings in a fair and compassionate way. Antonio (Tony) Feliz is a High Priest in the Church of Jesus Christ of=20= Latter-day Saints. A graduate of BYU, he works for the Church in variou= s=20 capacities including service in the Church Welfare System. He has a=20= lovely wife, three children, a nice home, and a good position in his war= d=20 teaching young people. Oh, he=92s also gay. He knows it. No one else = does. And thus begins his struggle. I=92m not sure what the mechanism is, but it seems that others saw his=20= sexual orientation early on, including one priesthood leader who=20 confronted him directly. Of course, Tony denied the charge, but knew=20= inside himself that he had to finally discover his true identity. After= =20 years of struggle, he extends a business trip to San Francisco and hooks= =20 up with a gay man with whom he has a sexual relationship. In this=20 encounter, he claims to discover who he really is. Now he must face the fact that his entire life is about to change. His = marriage is finished, and of course he must resign his Church callings=20= and his employment with the Church. But he=92s willing (although not=20= happily) to do all this in order to be true to himself. In the process of doing some research in the Church archives, he runs=20= across some information concerning Joseph Smith, Wilford Woodruff, and=20= others, that bothers him. He begins to read the early documents to=20 support the idea that same sex unions can be blessed as well as=20 heterosexual unions. He also reads in the early documents the idea that= =20 women were ordained to priesthood during Joseph Smith=92s years. Both=20= practices were discontinued after Joseph=92s death. He finally leaves his family behind in Utah and moves to California to=20= start his new life. The remainder of the book contains his rather=20 mystical road to self-discovery and peace of mind. His journey leads hi= m=20 to Kansas City, where he is confirmed in both the Roman Catholic and RLD= S=20 Churches, within weeks of each other! Central to Feliz=92s premise is that priesthood authority can be exercis= ed=20 outside the auspices of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.= =20 He believes that the endowments he received while in the Church are stil= l=20 with him, and he needs no permission to continue exercising this=20 authority. As he distances himself more and more from the modern-day=20= Church, he finds himself more and more attracted to the raw religion of = the early Joseph Smith days. Readers will find much to dispute in this moving and sometimes-complex=20= narrative. Feliz intertwines his story with lengthy, and sometimes=20 repetitive, journeys into his own psyche. His appeal to New Age-type=20= therapies and indoctrinations left me wondering just where he=92d end up= . =20 He finishes his journey in a metaphysical wonderland of inner journeying= =20 and radical introspection. =20 Issues of gender and sexual orientation continue to challenge Christian = churches. What are they to do with the =93others=94 in their midst? Ho= w=20 does an institution that declares behaviors sinful accommodate those who= =20 find those same behaviors natural? The problem is not unique to=20 Mormonism, and the presence of =93others=94 is very likely understated.= One of my biggest problems with evaluating this book is my complete=20 distance from Feliz. I=92m Anglo, he=92s Hispanic. I=92m straight, he=92= s gay. =20 I=92m a non-Mormon, he=92s Mormon (despite his excommunication, he consi= ders=20 himself =93Mormon=94 in every sense of the word). I had to try to put m= yself=20 in his place, and I was not successful. As I read the book, I reflected more and more on the title, =93Out of th= e=20 Bishop=92s Closet.=94 As he proceeded in his journey, the phrase change= d=20 slightly, but perhaps significantly =96 it became =93Out of MY Bishop=92= s=20 Closet.=94 Was this some acknowledgment that he had placed himself in t= his=20 position, that his homosexuality was a choice on his part, rather than a= n=20 inbred orientation? I don=92t think so, but it at least reflect his=20= growing understanding of the importance of coming to terms with his=20 dilemma and facing it responsibly. One cannot avoid recognizing a deep anger in Feliz, an anger that is yet= =20 to be fully healed. He seems to be well on his way, as he expresses=20= forgiveness toward those who have wronged him, and begs forgiveness from= =20 those he has wronged. But alongside this anger is a peace within himsel= f=20 that he=92s finally living out the life that he feels reflects who he=20= really is. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 24 Feb 2001 16:49:12 -0700 Brent, Are the other books in the series also set in Payson? I teach at Payson Jr. High and when My Body Fell Off came out I put a copy in my classrom library. The kids LOVED having a book set in their own home town. Someone loved it so much, they stole the book! Oh, well. I just found a replacement copy on ebay and it will go onto the shelf next week. Lu Ann Brobst Staheli - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 25 Feb 2001 06:34:33 -0700 Barbara Hume wrote: > >Our senior discount is available to anyone who can make a plausible case > >for one. 55 sounds good to me! > > > >Eric Samuelsen > > The way I usually make a plausible case is to shuffle uncertainly up to the > ticket window and request the ticket in a quavering voice. A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, before I was even old enough to be a missionary, my girlfriend was flying somewhere. I told her I couldn't make it to the airport to say goodby (a lie). I then put on an Albert Einstein-looking wig, grubby clothes, and shuffled up to her at the airport like some ancient homeless bum looking for a handout. She bought it hook, line and sinker. Maybe I'll try that at the box office. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] Apocalyptic LDS Lit Date: 25 Feb 2001 19:59:50 -0700 Rachel asks: About Pam Blackwell's novel _Ephraim's Seed_. A friend I trust read about 100 pages of it and said the story line wasn't bad. It begins after a great economic cartel has gained control of the world and even the LDS Church in Utah. My friend thought the story went a little slow, however, and it was so full of language errors--nearly every fourth or fifth sentence--that he gave up reading. He couldn't see how the novel was based on scripture, which really annoyed him. Given this recommendation, I'm not likely to pick one up. Can anyone else verify this? I can. . . I had a chance to look at the manuscript and later the finished book. As a recovering apocalyptic :) I don't much like the setting. . .assumptions. . . . conclusions, nor the style much. Pam is a sincere person and I hope the best for her though. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 25 Feb 2001 13:40:14 -0600 >I'm glad to hear you have a reason for using Christ, and not just >throwing him in for effect or a quick solution to a conversion. That >shows you're a competent author. The problem is, it's not apparent when >the scene happens, so the reader doesn't know if you're being competent >or not. > >One idea I had, and you can decide if this sounds any good or not, is to >downplay who it is during the miracle scene. Oohhhhh..... In my original drafts that's how I DID IT. You don't have to believe me, but it's true. Editors thought the scene would have more impact with more detail. (BOTH publishing houses I worked with.) This is probably the most reworked scene in the book. Everybody wanted to stick their fingers in it, change this or that phrase. Most of the time I said "no" and changed it back to "my way." However, I thought it worked okay with the increased detail, so I made the changes. Originally, she just noticed a scar on his hand and asked why he couldn't fix it if he could heal her completely; he answered simply, "It's very old." And that was it. The scar wasn't described as it is in the published version. It could've been from anything. Stinks to hear it might have worked better my original way! <> Yeah. >I can understand your concern as a first time >author that your book might seem to drag on and you'd want to shorten it >up. Yeah; this stems from a marketing rather than artistic common sense, though. The first publisher I worked with wanted to break if off right as Alyssa collapses at Peter's doorstep (about 450 pgs) to make it shorter. It's a risk for any publisher to print a LONG work by a new author; I'm glad Cornerstone was willing to take it and allow me a more complete ending. >But I hope it's success has given you the confidence to know that >the character you created is interesting enough that the readers _do_ >want to hear about the things she does that reveal facets of her >personality. And mentioning those events (buying the knife, carrying it >with her, fingering it) wouldn't take all that many lines to include >anyway: certainly no more lines than the "Oh by the way" scene used. True, true. I'll watch for these in the next book. Calling attention to it will help me "flag" them so I can go back and fix it. >Volume two will have its own set of requirements based on what the POV >characters know. If they know the name of the church, then you say it >without apology. If they're members, then LDS references abound all over >the place, because that's what the characters know. Yes. I've had some readers tell me I need to give Alyssa a Book of Mormon pretty quick! :-) (It's tongue in cheek, not like the people who call Covenant wanting to know where the Nephite cave is, but still, they're concerned for her eternal welfare!) I'm hoping, with any such elements the book may require, to achieve the honesty of, say, _The Apostle_ as far as presenting what the characters believe. (Now there's a slow-moving film if I ever saw one; but it sticks in your mind afterward like buckwheat pancakes stick to your ribs.) _Saint Maybe_ by Anne Tyler is another excellent example of an honest portrayal of religious belief. >If you write honestly, they won't appear as proselyting to any but those >with a chip on their shoulder--and they'd only be happy if you wrote >anti-church stuff. Writing honestly means you tell what would really >happen based on who the characters are and what the circumstances are, >not based on what would maximally "promote faith." (Personally, I think >the best faith-promoting stories are the honest ones anyway.) >D. Michael Martindale Good points. As always, I appreciate your input. Since my goal in writing has never been "to promote faith," as some other LDS authors seem bent on, I'm hopeful I can come through with that honesty. If your faith is promoted, great. If you lost sleep, had to struggle with tough issues, good, I made you think. But when the goal of telling the story becomes to increase faith, to prove a value, that's when you get cheesy didacticism. Something I strive to avoid. Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN Mormon News Introduces Bestsellers in LDS Bookstores: Kent Larsen Date: 24 Feb 2001 17:47:01 -0600 Larsen 23Feb01 A4 [From Mormon-News] Mormon News Introduces Bestsellers in LDS Bookstores NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- Trying to fill a void in news about Mormon books, Mormon News today introduces a bestseller list of those books sold in LDS bookstores. The list of 15 books and other LDS products attempts to show which books are selling best in the LDS market. However, the current list is based on information from fewer than 40 stores, a figure we hope to improve on in the near future. Meanwhile, on the national bestseller lists, all the Mormon-related titles stayed on at least one list, except for Sean Covey's "Seven Habits of Highly Effective Teens," which appeared on the lists briefly last week, possibly because of a bulk sale. Most of the titles are slipping on the lists, except for Stephen R. Covey's "Seven Habits of Highly Effective People," which jumped this past week. The current titles on bestseller lists are: Nothing Like it in the World, by Stephen Ambrose A history of the building of the transcontinental railroad in the US. Ambrose, a highly regarded historian, details the involvement of Mormons in building crucial portions of the road, including the driving of the "golden spike" in the heart of Mormon territory. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 28 29 Barnes & Noble (Feb 22) Top 100 18 9 BooksAMillion (Feb 22) Non-Fiction Hardcover 12 - Booksense (Feb 22) Non-Fiction Hardcover 13 9 New York Times (Feb 25) Non-Fiction Hardcover [Independents - 9; Chains - 13] The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, by Stephen R. Covey This ten-year-old personal management classic is still selling strongly. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 54 - Amazon.com (Feb 22) Amazon.com 100 25 - Amazon.com (Feb 22) Non-Fiction Paperback 62 62 Barnes & Noble Top (Feb 22) Top 100 96 115 USA Today (Feb 22) 4 5 Wall Street Journal (Feb 16) Business Shadow of the Hegemon, by Orson Scott Card The second novel in Card's new series about Bean, Ender's shadow. In this novel, Bean is the tactical genius who wins the Earth for Ender's brother, Peter, the Hegemon. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 11 9 Amazon.com (Feb 22) Fiction Hardcover 27 20 New York Times (Feb 25) Fiction Hardcover The Whitechapel Conspiracy, by Anne Perry Perry's Inspector Thomas Pitt returns to 19th-century London for Perry's 20th novel about the detective. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 23 17 New York Times (Feb 25) Fiction Hardcover [Chains - 20] Bestsellers in LDS Bookstores: 1. Lamb of God (Video) - LDS Church Distribution 2. Teachings of Gordon B. Hinckley 3. Teaching by the Spirit by Gene R. Cook 4. Between Husband and Wife: Gospel Perspectives on Marital Intimacy by Stephen E. Lamb & Douglas E. Brinley 5. Teachings from the D&C and Church History (Video) - LDS Church Distribution 6. Legacy (Video) - LDS Church Distribution 7. The Little Book of Big Ideas About Love by Elaine Cannon 8. A Quiet Heart by Patricia T. Holland 9. Revelations of the Restoration: A Commentary on the Doctrine and Covenants and Other Modern Revelations by Joseph Fielding McConkie and Craig J. Ostler 10. Beginning Reader Book of Mormon - LDS Church Distribution 11. Believing Christ: The Parable of the Bicycle and Other Good News by Stephen E. Robinson 12. Children's Songbook Words and Music (CD) - LDS Church Distribution 13. The Light Within: What the Prophet Joseph Smith Taught Us About Personal Revelation by W. Jeffrey Marsh 14. The Kingdom and the Crown, Vol. 1: Fishers of Men by Gerald N. Lund 15. Story of the Walnut Tree by Don H. Staheli, Illustrated by Robert T. Barrett >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "mjames_laurel" Subject: [AML] UVSC Children & Literature Conference Date: 25 Feb 2001 22:01:03 -0700 Hello everyone: I've been asked to pass on this information about an upcoming conference to be held at UVSC in late March. I believe the cost is aproximately $90. Some of the presenters include Orson Scott Card, Ruth White (author of Belle Prater's Boy and other books) Chris Crowe, Rick Walton, Louise Plummer, Kristen Randle, and several others. If you'd like more information, e-mail Carol Lynch Williams at carolthewriter@yahoo.com, or see the contact information below. ***** For information on costs and registration, contact > Margie Green at (801) > 377-8750, or by email at: greenma@uvsc.edu > > > Forum on Children and Literature > Thursday, March 29, 2001 > > (This is the tentative schedule) > > 8:15 to 8:45 Registration Check-In and Continental > Breakfast > > 9:00 to 9:15 Opening Nancy Peterson Theater > > 9:15 to 10:15 Keynote Address > The Mystery of Imagination > Zilpha Keatley Snyder > > 10:30 - 11:30 Workshop Session A > 213 B Hopeful Books: Characters Who Do More Than > Survive Kristen Randle > 213 C Creating an Honor Book Bethanne Andersen > theatre Where Do I Get My Ideas? Zilpha Keatley > Snyder > > 11:40 to 12:40 General Session > Imagination Unliited: The 5-Minute a Day Journal > Louise Plummer > > 12:40 to 1:30 Lunch > > 1:15 to 2:00 Book Signing > > 2:10 to 3:10 Workshop Session B > 213 A "An Overview of Balanced Literacy" - Brad > Wilcox > 213 B "The Best of Fact and Fiction for > Intermediate Grades" - Nancy > Livingston > 213 C "Stories Are Everywhere" Rick Walton > > 3:20 - 4:10 General Session: Favorite Picks > Nancy Peterson moderator > > UVSC bookstore - Cathy Rakisits > Read Leaf Bookstore - Margy Layton 489-1390 > BYU Bookstore - Janice Card 378-3730 > UVSC Library - Rama Chamberlin > Orem Library - Pat Bezzant > Stephanie Corrigan - UVSC ext 8587 > > > > Friday, March 30, 2001 > > 8:15 to 8:45 Registration Check-In and Continental > Breakfast > > 9:00 to 9:10 Welcome > > 9:10-10:10 Keynote > Readers & Imagination: Why Children Are Better > Readers Than Adults" - > Orson Scott Card > > 10:20-11:20 Workshop Session C > Creating Fiction from Reality Ruth White > The Birth of a Picture Book Brad Wilcox > 213 C "The Best of the New Books in Children's > Literature" - Pat Bezzant > > 11:30 to 12:30 Workshop Session D > 213 A "Looking for the Silver Lining in Bleak YA > Books" - Chris Crowe > 213 B "Sharing the Experience: Book Clubs for > Children" - Nancy Peterson > 213 C "Writing and Illustrating Children's Books" > - Mark and Caroline > Buehner > > 12:30 to 1:30 Lunch > > 1:15 to 2:00 Book Signing > > 2:10 to 3:10 Workshop Session D > 213 A "The Publishing Game" - Rick Walton > 213 B "What's up with Harry Potter?..." - > Katherine Farmer > theatre "1,000 Ideas an Hour: Helping Your > Students Be Better Writers" > > 3:20 - 4:00 Closing Session > "Imagination from the Past: Identifying Today > with the Young People of > Yesterday" - Ruth White - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 26 Feb 2001 10:06:54 -0700 D. Michael wrote: >I'd like to hear the logistics of how you went about getting this >play >produced, including what it was like to do it at the Little Brown >Theater. Three Women was produced about a year ago in a student production at BYU. = The director of that production, Wendi Keller, graduated last spring, and = was subsequently hired by Bill Brown as production manager for the Villa = and Little Brown. The logistics couldn't be easier. Bill asked me if I wanted to do that = show in that space, and I said yes. I can't say enough good things about = what Bill and Marilyn are accomplishing there in Springville. As for the theatre, I love the Little Brown. What a lovely small space. = The only difficult part of the whole experience is that Wendi Keller = absolutely killed herself trying to do two jobs at once. I feel badly = about that; it might have been better if I'd directed the second production= . But I didn't have the time. =20 Eric Samuelsen - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 26 Feb 2001 10:01:40 -0700 I'm peeking, so how can Samuelson be honest? Just wondering. Anyway, let me tell you that this is one of the best productions we've had at the Villa. We love it. Wendy Keller is a super director. We have hired her full time now at the Villa, and she is really remarkable. A hard worker. Gets in there and does all production things, like climb ladders and hook up lights! Come and see her work with this show. It's a well-written show--makes you think--it's a zinger. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > "Eric R. Samuelsen" wrote: > > > These plays will be performed in the Little Brown Theatre, across the street from the Villa Theatre in Springville UT, 239 S. Main. > > I'd like to hear the logistics of how you went about getting this play > produced, including what it was like to do it at the Little Brown > Theater. > > -- > D. Michael Martindale > dmichael@wwno.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] BLACKWELL, _Ephraim's Seed_ (was: Apocalyptic LDS Lit) Date: 26 Feb 2001 12:09:05 -0700 >About Pam Blackwell's novel _Ephraim's Seed_. A friend I trust read about >100 pages of it and said the story line wasn't bad. It begins after a great >economic cartel has gained control of the world and even the LDS Church in >Utah. My friend thought the story went a little slow, however, and it was so >full of language errors--nearly every >fourth or fifth sentence--that he gave up reading. He couldn't see how the >novel was based on scripture, which really annoyed him. Given this >recommendation, I'm not likely to pick one up. Can anyone else verify this? I did a review of this book for the AML-List a couple of years ago and I pretty much panned it. The book is not particularly well-written, it's poorly made and edited, and it bears all the hallmarks of a self-published book. I thought it failed both as Mormon cultural mirror and as science fiction. I thought it didn't live up to the promises it made to the reader. In other words, I didn't think it was a very good book. As for whether I can recommend it...the answer isn't as obvious as it might seem. It's a Mormon apocalyptic thriller (and yes, the pace does pick up about half-way through such that "thriller" actually becomes a fair claim), but I don't like Mormon apocalyptic thrillers--or at least none that I've seen so far. My biggest problem (beyond some weak writing and absolutely terrible physical production) was that the book made some assumptions about Mormon cultural beliefs that I found objectionable and inaccurate. I don't believe the way the book seems to think that I should, and that pushed me outside the ideal audience for the book. But I say all this and more in my AML List review, which is available at http://www.xmission.com/~aml/reviews/b/B199732.html Scott Parkin - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 26 Feb 2001 16:50:34 -0700 >>The way I usually make a plausible case is to shuffle uncertainly up to >>the ticket window and request the ticket in a quavering voice. >>barbara hume >I had no idea you could play someone so different from yourself so >convincingly. >-- Ronn! :) And I had no idea you could be so gallant! barbara >- >AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature >http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] BLACKWELL, _Ephraim's Seed_ (was: Apocalyptic LDS Lit) Date: 26 Feb 2001 17:04:48 -0700 Scott and Marny Parkin wrote: > My biggest problem (beyond some weak writing and absolutely terrible > physical production) was that the book made some assumptions about > Mormon cultural beliefs that I found objectionable and inaccurate. Was there no attempt to explain the assumptions, or did the author seem to assume that all Mormons would share her ideas? The reason I ask is that I'm working on a Mormon apocalyptic screenplay, where I attempt to explain the assumptions I make within a Mormon context, which I hope will provide enough of an explanation to allow for a successful and willful suspension of disbelief on the part of the reader. Thom - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brent J. Rowley" Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 26 Feb 2001 19:34:44 -0700 LuAnnStaheli wrote: > Are the other books in the [Light Traveler Adventure] series also set in Payson? I > teach at Payson Jr. High > and when _My Body Fell Off!_ came out I put a copy in my classrom library. The > kids > LOVED having a book set in their own home town. Someone loved it so much, they > stole the book! Book Two (Silver Hawk's Revenge) starts in Orem and works its way across the US, with some significant action in Who-Knows-Where, Colorado, and ultimately ending in the Caribbean portion of the Bermuda Triangle, near Puerto Rico. No Payson action ... Sorry. Book Three (Missing Children) takes place mostly in Provo/Orem and BYU, with some action in San Antonio, Texas, and the grand finale in downtown Salt Lake City. Hey, I've got to spread the wealth, don't you agree? > Oh, well. I just found a replacement copy on ebay and it will go > onto the shelf next week. On E-Bay?!! Oh, I'm hurt. Crushed. You sure it wasn't Amazon or B&N? Latter-Day Harvest, maybe? Gosh -- I can't believe any right-thinking individual would actually part with their very own copy -- on E-BAY!!! (sob) Oh well. I'm glad you at least found a replacement. -BJ Rowley - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] DUTCHER, _Brigham City_ Date: 26 Feb 2001 17:15:58 -0600 >>If any of you hear of "Brigham City" coming to Washington state, would you >>please send me a note? You can e-mail me personally at >>schoong@sprintmail.com if necessary. >Quite a few more theaters than showed "GA" have signed on to show "BC." >The current list is at http://www.brighamcitymovie.com/theaters.html . It >will undoubtedly expand to other cities after its initial release, >assuming it does well enough at the box office. > >Eric D. Snider Chiming in late as usual-- If you go out to the website, you can sign on for a mailing list they have that will keep you posted on theaters coming to your area. This worked for us for _God's Army_ coming to the Kansas City area, and we're signed up again for updates on this one. In our area the initial 2-show booking was extended several weeks due to good turnout. We also got free sneak preview tickets for being on the mailing list--I don't know if they'll do that again, but it was very nice! A free first-run movie, and Mormon besides, who can beat that? Linda ---------- Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 26 Feb 2001 22:01:15 -0600 Annette, thank you. At 08:22 PM 2/23/01, you wrote: >D. Michael's review was pretty much on target. The book had the strengths he >listed as well as the exact weaknesses that bothered me, too. The biggest >one was that Peter's fiance definitely drove me nuts, not because she was >such a bad person but because I didn't believe for one second that Peter >would really fall for her. She was so transparent. And the miracle scene >bothered me, too--which is ironic, since that's the scene that Linda says >came to her first, that the book was built around. Although I understand why >it's there, I don't think it worked. I'm curious, would you like to put into words why it didn't work for you? What bothered you about it, exactly? This is the one part of the book I find people either love or hate. I'm very interested in finding out what I could have done better. Also with Jackie (Peter's fiance), was she transparent because the reader mostly saw her in her natural element--without Peter--and not enough with him (except when they argued)? I'd like to know how I could have improved her also. I don't think I illustrated the contrast I saw in her behavior as well as I could have. She was a very different person around him, hiding her bad habits/sins very well. (Again, doing so would have added pages and pages and pages; I skipped the fluffy romance-budding stuff and cut to the conflict.) I saw Peter as a rescuer--pre-programmed to "rescue" girls that remind him in some way of his first love, Alyssa. Maybe it's like the knife element D. Michael brought up. I'm guessing this section of the book may have needed scenes that weren't written in, but which happened; for example, Peter's clear answer to prayer that he should propose to Jackie (which later changed, confusing him, so he doggedly pressed on with it despite uncertainty). Anyway, if you'd like to elaborate, I'd very much like to listen. This is the kind of commentary I've been waiting for, actually, which I haven't had much of. It will help me improve on future books to know where this one wasn't working. (I'm very much aware this is my first novel, and I'll probably look back on it later and wonder how it even got in print in the condition it was in.) Hearing "I loved it!" might pat me on the back, but it doesn't do much for improving my craft! Thanks! Linda ======= Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:21:10 -0700 Annette Lyon wrote: > On the other hand, I wasn't bothered by another one of D. Michael's > complaints, that information is given for the reader's benefit w/out showing > the scenes earlier as they happen (such as with the knife). One reason it > didn't bother me is that we're already talking about a pretty hefty sized > book here. The knife issue alone would have taken at least three or four > scenes to remedy by D. Michael's standard, and he says there are many more > information pieces like it, adding a significant number of pages. Not so. It didn't need to take any more lines than what the current approach took. The information only needed to be reported when it happened. I wasn't asking for long, drawn-out scenes showing the events live. > That alone is is a pretty impressive feat, since many readers won't > give a book a chance if it's more than an inch thick. And this book is > significantly more than an inch thick! The question to ask yourself is, how bad do you want to reach the audience who chooses their books based on how thin they are? If I'm not enjoying a book, comic book thickness is too long. If I am enjoying it, I want it to go on forever. I'm drawn to thick books. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:46:27 -0700 Linda Adams wrote: > Editors thought the scene would have more impact with more > detail. (BOTH publishing houses I worked with.) Ah, but Alyssa was rather out of it at the time, so not showing a lot of detail would have been true to the POV. >This is probably the most reworked scene in the book. Miracle scenes are tough scenes to write. When critics said negative things about _God's Army_, what scene did many of them talk about? The miracle scene. > Everybody wanted to stick their fingers in it, > change this or that phrase. Most of the time I said "no" and changed it > back to "my way." Good on you. > Originally, she just noticed a scar on his hand and asked why he couldn't > fix it if he could heal her completely; he answered simply, "It's very > old." And that was it. The scar wasn't described as it is in the published > version. It could've been from anything. This may have worked for me--maybe. It's too late to tell now. > Stinks to hear it might have worked better my original way! Now, it can't entirely stink to know you were right all along. > _The Apostle_ ... (Now there's a slow-moving film if I ever saw one; but it sticks > in your mind afterward like buckwheat pancakes stick to your ribs.) One of those great slow-moving films. A film that immerses you in a world you're not familiar with. I was listening to the soundtrack CD of _Conan the Barbarian_ today. That film really gets to me. Not because the story doesn't have a lot of problems--it does. But because the film immerses you in that fantasy world so completely--and the music has a lot to do with it. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: Re: [AML] BLACKWELL, _Ephraim's Seed_ (was: Apocalyptic LDS Lit) Date: 27 Feb 2001 07:37:48 -0700 Thom Duncan wrote: >Scott and Marny Parkin wrote: > >>My biggest problem (beyond some weak writing and absolutely >>terrible physical production) was that the book made some >>assumptions about Mormon cultural beliefs that I found >>objectionable and inaccurate. > >Was there no attempt to explain the assumptions, or did the author >seem to assume that all Mormons would share her ideas? The reason I >ask is that I'm working on a Mormon apocalyptic screenplay, where I >attempt to explain the assumptions I make within a Mormon context, >which I hope will provide enough of an explanation to allow for a >successful and willful suspension of disbelief on the part of the >reader. I don't think there was any meaningful attempt to explain the cultural assumptions. The author seemed to believe that her assumptions were shared by all her readers about how things would go down in the last days. Odd things happened for no apparent reason than because they were evil, and we all know that the last days will be populated by evil people performing evil acts for completely unknowable, insensible reasons. I disagree with that whole premise--especially in a book that claims science fiction as one of its genres. In science fiction (and most all non-absurdist fiction) things happen for reasons. If you state that the entire United States has been conquered and brought under control of the UWEN (the despotic international government), then you have to give me a reason why that occupying force then specifically establishes a border around Utah that's patrolled by attack helicopters and armed guards. If you tell me that Utah has been designated a "containment zone" (aka "internment camp") for Mormon dissidents (aka, anyone who still calls themselves Mormons even after religion has been outlawed by the new state), then I have a reason for the border and internal military force. If you don't give me any reason, then I sit there scratching my head and wondering why an international government would establish internal borders within a conquered nation. The author's assumptions seems to be that it's simply given that the saints will be persecuted again at the last days, so there's no need to give a reason for it; it's enough merely to show it, because all Mormons will accept that that's simply how it will be in the last days. I'm not arguing with whether she's right in her prognostication (I think the oppression will a great deal less obvious, personally, but that's only my opinion--I don't subscribe to the "final days of Nauvoo" theory of the last days). She may well be doing preemptive journalism of the real events of the last days--I don't dispute the possibility or the creative anticipation. What I'm arguing is that she never gave me a reason for a completely insensible action by the bad guys. They were evil simply because they were evil, therefore they committed acts that would harm Mormons just because that's what evil people do. There were no reasons at all. Even an internal comment by POV that the UWEN was doing weird things for no apparent reason would have addressed the issue and let me know that the author was aware of the logic hole but would address it later would have provided some satisfaction (the famous "Hollywood logic"). But the author rarely gave reasons for anything. She just hit the checklist items of the alarmist right-wing international conspiracy theory, and apparently assumed I would accept that as given with no justification. But I must say this--four years later I still have strong feelings about the book. In that sense, it was extraordinarily successful and engaged me as a reader. I would just argue that it did it in a negative way. So... Do me a favor and at least have pseudo-reasons for major events. I don't have to accept that the reasons are good, but having reasons shows me that the author thought the issue out and leaves me the reader with a simple agree/disagree choice about what I'm reading. If you give no reasons at all, you leave me confused and distracted, and knock me completely out of your story to no good purpose. FWIW. Scott Parkin - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 27 Feb 2001 09:06:23 -0700 Eric, thank you for your great message! Yes, we absolutely adore Wendi Keller. She is such a blessing! And it was fun to see you there a couple of times, although I never got to say hi, as you were concentrating so much. As you're doing your teaching, etc. up there in the drama department, maybe you can just help us noise around the next contest which is closing on June 30? This last one was a clear decision for the BYU student who won. Students are welcome to submit. (And you are, too). Thanks so much, Eric! Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] SAMUELSEN, _Three Women_ (Performance) Date: 27 Feb 2001 09:09:19 -0700 That is FUNNY, Michael. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, before I was even old enough > to be a missionary, my girlfriend was flying somewhere. I told her I > couldn't make it to the airport to say goodby (a lie). I then put on an > Albert Einstein-looking wig, grubby clothes, and shuffled up to her at > the airport like some ancient homeless bum looking for a handout. She > bought it hook, line and sinker. > > Maybe I'll try that at the box office. > > -- > D. Michael Martindale > dmichael@wwno.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] A Mormon Criticism Date: 27 Feb 2001 09:18:47 -0700 Very interesting, Travis. Were you there Saturday Feb. 24? The topic has already gone out for next year's meeting--"Walking the Cultural Tightrope: Mormon Writers and Their Audiences." But of course "topics" are just big umbrellas, and it seems to me that criticisms are an important feature of getting works to audiences. Let's hear it for the criticisms that "oil" the transfer of literature to its audiences. I am right now assigning you a paper on the message you are cooking. Okay? Marilyn Brown - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] How Was AML Conference? Date: 28 Feb 2001 02:35:22 +0900 [MOD: I ditto this request.] So, is anyone going to tell us how the conference on Saturday went? Who won the annual awards? Andrew Hall _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 27 Feb 2001 13:03:04 -0700 (MST) >The > biggest > >one was that Peter's fiance definitely drove me nuts, not because she > was > >such a bad person but because I didn't believe for one second that > Peter > >would really fall for her. She was so transparent. And the miracle > scene > >bothered me, too--which is ironic, since that's the scene that Linda > says > >came to her first, that the book was built around. Although I > understand why > >it's there, I don't think it worked. > > I'm curious, would you like to put into words why it didn't work for > you? > What bothered you about it, exactly? This is the one part of the book I > > find people either love or hate. I'm very interested in finding out what > I > could have done better. I know you weren't asking me, but I'd like to throw in my $.02-- First off, the scene with the Savior didn't bother me. As long as there is a good reason for his appearance that will show up later, I think it works fine. I would agree with the other opinions voiced here that you don't want to go around throwing him in for no good reason. But I found the scene moving. FWIW, I also was moved by the appearance of the Savior in _Testament_, the new film showing on Temple Square, and I know not everyone here liked that, either. I didn't appreciate many aspects of the film, but for me the scenes with the Savior, both in the film and in _PJ_, drove home the idea of the personal nature of the Savior's love for us. It was something I needed. But, that scene in _PJ_ wasn't the most powerful, for me. My favorite is the scene where Alyssa has that dream and sees Bert. > Also with Jackie (Peter's fiance), was she transparent because the > reader > mostly saw her in her natural element--without Peter--and not enough > with > him (except when they argued)? I'd like to know how I could have > improved > her also. I don't think I illustrated the contrast I saw in her behavior > as > well as I could have. She was a very different person around him, hiding > > her bad habits/sins very well. (Again, doing so would have added pages > and > pages and pages; I skipped the fluffy romance-budding stuff and cut to > the > conflict.) I saw Peter as a rescuer--pre-programmed to "rescue" girls > that > remind him in some way of his first love, Alyssa. Maybe it's like the > knife > element D. Michael brought up. Yes, some of that might be the case. We never do see much in the way of anything positive between them. Another thing is that she seems so *completely* bad. There are two major things about her that I remember: she whines and wants her way with everything, and she sleeps around. Oh, and she lies like a rug. The girl really has no redeeming qualities except a pretty face. (And what she did with the ring at the end; I thought that was a good touch.) Maybe if she just lied about her Church activity and her sleeping around, but was completely nice and agreeable around Peter, instead of whining and being so demanding--? Maybe she would have been more believable then. At least then I could understand his liking her. But it still doesn't feel right that way, either. I mean, when there's a "bad" character around, why does he or she have to do the worst possible things to show how evil he or she is? In this case, having Jackie sleep around and make her little videos seems stereotypical. She's bad; therefore, she must sleep around. Couldn't there have been something else that made her bad that didn't involve the standard sleeping around, drinking, doing drugs, robbing a bank, etc.? I would like to see her more carefully crafted than this. But this is a tough situation, because on the one hand you want her to be obviously bad and wrong for Peter. You don't want to make her likable, and then disappoint us readers by taking her away from him so he can have Alyssa instead. You want her to be bad, so we're glad she's gone. And you don't want to make her just a little bad, like just a little whiny, or really whiny but really trying to do better. You can't justify Peter dumping her over that. We'd all feel sorry for her and we'd be mad at him. So she has to do something really bad. And it has to be something fairly quick, too, or else it would take up too much of the story. So what else is there for her to do? I don't know. Maybe you could have come up with something else. Maybe not. It's been several months since I've read the book, and I don't have it in front of me now, but I don't really remember Peter being a rescuer-type. Maybe it came through and I forgot. What I do remember is wondering what he saw in this whiny chick who made him buy this huge ring! > I'm guessing this section of the book may have needed scenes that > weren't > written in, but which happened; for example, Peter's clear answer to > prayer > that he should propose to Jackie (which later changed, confusing him, so > he > doggedly pressed on with it despite uncertainty). > Maybe, as you say, showing that these things happened might have helped. Anyway, she's not a terrible character. She serves her purpose and adds some extra interest to the story. But seeing her surrounded by so many fuller characters and scenes, I feel like I got gypped as a reader. I think she could have been drawn just as well as some of the other characters you've got in there. (This is a compliment. Overall I really *love* the book!) --Katie Parker - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Travis Manning Subject: [AML] Kirby Article on Eugene England Date: 27 Feb 2001 21:19:52 (GMT) Robert Kirby did a funny piece on his friendship with our dear friend, Eugene England. Salt Lake Tribune Article: KIRBY: Laughter Can Be the Best Rx For a Sick Pal http://www.sltrib.com/2001/Feb/02272001/utah/75121.htm - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dallas Robbins" Subject: [AML] Awards at the Conference Date: 27 Feb 2001 22:54:57 -0000 The conference was great. I'll have more to say later, but here are the awards as I recall. Award for Novel: "Standing on the Promises Vol 1: One More River to Cross" by Margaret Blair Young and Darius Gray Award for Short Fiction: "Caution: Men in Trees" by Darrell Spencer Award for Drama: "I Am Jane" by Margaret Blair Young Award for Essay: "Standing for Something" by Gordon B. Hinckley Award for Devotional: "The Quiet Heart" by Patricia Holland Award for Criticism: Benson Parkinson and his work for the AML-List Honorary Lifetime Member of AML: Richard Cracroft Dallas Robbins, cloudhill@hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] LDS Thrillers Date: 27 Feb 2001 18:04:04 -0700 Brent, It was ebay all right. Sorry. I'm trying to collect inexpensive books on tape for my classroom (inexpensive since I don't get school money to pay for them, yet I receognize their value to all readers.) So, I won an auction for Book 2 on tape and Book 1 came with it in paperback as part of the deal. Lu Ann - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 27 Feb 2001 18:51:10 -0700 My problem with the miracle scene is rather personal. As a writer, I feel very hesitant to put words into God's mouth or "make" him do anything. To do so feels rather pompous--a creator (artist) telling the Creator what to do. How can any of us really _know_ what Christ would say or do? While I have no problem with authors inventing dialogue for historical figures (like Joseph Smith, where we can find significant documentation to wager a decent guess), I cannot use the same standard for diety. In other LDS books (not in Linda's), I have cringed at certain answers to prayers the characters have, because I feel that God would _never_ have answered that way. One book in particular by a very popular writer had a such an answer. I felt it flew in the face of everything the Church teaches, yet it was portrayed as coming straight from above. Perhaps that's one reason I enjoy Fantasy so much--it's easier to put words into a god-like character's mouth, and be a step removed from the "real" thing. (I'm recalling something Scott Parkin said on the fantasy panel at the Mormon Writer's Conference, which I totally agreed with.) For me, the miracle scene would have been more comfortable had the healer been an angel--anyone, from Moroni to Michael to one we've never heard of--rather than Christ himself. That would have created a distance. Maybe I'm a bit odd here, but that's why I I think that's why I disliked the scene so much. Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN Morning News Briefs: Kent Larsen Date: 27 Feb 2001 20:12:58 -0600 [This excerpt from Mormon News mentions an unusual application of LDS art.] Set Designer Bill Demos, 69 SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Former New York set designer Bill Demos died February 25th of congestive heart failure. An LDS Church member, Demos was a native of Provo, Utah, where he suffered from rheumatic fever as a child. After serving an LDS mission in Hawaii and attending BYU, Demos worked on the sets for the first LDS temple film. For 17 years he lived in Manhattan, where he met and married Anna Ernst in 1964. But at age 32, shortly after he married, Demos suffered a stroke that left him paralyzed on the left side. He then moved to Provo, where his wife, Anna taught at BYU, while he stayed at home. Anna died in 1991 of cancer. Bill Howard Demos Salt Lake Tribune 26Feb01 P2 http://www.sltrib.com/02262001/obituari/74795.htm >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] Biography/Autobiography Symposium Date: 27 Feb 2001 21:36:22 -0700 I received a flyer in the mail today with the following information. Note the lunch registration deadline at the bottom. Marny Parkin LIVES OF THE SAINTS: WRITING MORMON BIOGRAPHY AND AUTOBIOGRAPHY 17 March 2001 140 Joseph Smith Building Brigham Young University Open to the public--admission is free. A symposium sponsored by the Joseph Fielding Smith Insitute for Latter-day Saint History (8:00-8:30 a.m.) Pick up name tags and prepaid lunch tickets. Display tables by the Smith Institute, BYU Studies, and BYU Press. (8:30-10:30) Opening Plenary Session Keynote address: "The American Context of Mormon Biography," Scott E. Casper "A Joseph Smith for the Twenty-First Century," Richard L. Bushman (10:40-noon) Concurrent Sessions ***Sources: Putting Lives in Context "A Verifiable Life: What It Took to Resurrect Lewis Barney, 1808-1894," Ronald O. Barney "Giving Life to Lifeless Histories: Reconstructing the History of a Scantily Documented Ancestor," Keith A. Erekson ***Publishing Biographies and Autobiographies: Desktop or Press? "Desktop Publishing: Simplifying Autobiograpical and Biographical Publishing," Leslie A. Marchant "Notes on Publishing a Few Hundred Mormon Biograpnies and Autobiographies," Gary L. Shumway ***Auto/Biography: Fact and/or Fiction? "Oh Say, What Is Truth in Mormon Life Story Writing?" Morris A. Thurston "_Sweet Cottonwood_: Writing the Family Novel," Edward A. Geary (12:15-1:35) Plenary Session Luncheon Sponsored by the Association for Mormon Letters and the Mormon History Association "Sorting Out Private and Public Lives: Spencer W. Kimball and Emmeline B. Wells," Edward L. Kimball and Carol Cornwall Madsen (1:50-3:10) Concurrent Sessions ***Is a Life a Sermon? "Uses and Abuses of Mormon Biography: Sidney Rigdon and William McLellin as Object Lessions," Steven C. Harper "The Case of Virginia Sorensen: When Your Saint Is Also a Sinner," Susan Howe ***Digital Mediated Biographies "Digital Mediated Biographies: Technologies, Strategies, and Costs," Larrie E. Gale "Family History on Video--and on the Cheap," Dale Cressman "Publishing Biographies to the Web: Your Word Processor Will Do," S. Todd Stubbs ***Using Family Sources to Document Local and Regional History "Decoding a Daily Diary: Clues to Community Life in Lehi in the 1870s," Cherry B. Silver "Can I Be Objective?: Using Family Sources in Historical Writing," Jessie L. Embry (3:20-4:10) Closing Plenary Session "Reflections on Mormon Biography," Davis Bitton and David J. Whittaker Select from the following sandwiches. If you want more than one box lunch, please put the number of each choice. All lunches include a choice of beverage (soda, juice, or bottled water) and a brownie. ____ Roast beef and pepper jack cheese, with chipotle mayonnaise on a kaiser roll, served with southwestern pasta salad ____ Chicken salad on a croissant, served with fruit ____ Veggie wrap (assorted vegetables, grated cheese and ranch dressing) ____ Total lunches ordered, @ $8.50 each ____ Total enclosed Name____________________________________ Please make checks payable to the Association for Mormon Letters and send to: Susan Howe 3126 JKHB English Department Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 Checks must be RECEIVED by 6 March 2001. Pick up your lunch ticket at the Smith Institute display table the morning of the symposium. If you prefer, you may purchase your own lunch at the BYU Food Court, on the floor below the conference luncheon, and bring it upstairs. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] AML Session at RMMLA Convention--Call for Papers Date: 27 Feb 2001 20:53:18 -0800 I'm chairing the AML session at RMMLA in Vancouver BC this October (11-13, I believe). If you're interested in presenting please send me a proposal. You must be an RMMLA member by April 1 in order to present. The deadline for proposals is March 1, but I don't have to get the program in that soon, so I'll take proposals a little later than that. (In the words of one of my favorite guilty pleasure TV show, "Welcome to Ancient Studies. I'm not much of a stickler for attendance. In fact, I sometimes get called away myself.") I thought the deadline was the middle of March. Gae Lyn Henderson is co-chair and we discussed a theme--though I'm not sure we need one, as none of the sessions in the call for papers list one. A broad theme is Extending the Tradition, which is a broad theme for the last two or three AML Conferences. Following are the guidelines for presenters from the RMMLA website. I note that list-member Jason Steed has proposed a special session on "The Novel into Film" (Jason Steed, 4505 Maryland Pkwy., Box 455011, Las Vegas, NV 89154-5011; jpsteed@hotmail.com; 702-454-0250; fax 702-895-0908) (BTW, Jason, you can chair one session and present at another.) You can send proposals for the AML session by snail mail to Harlow S. Clark, 955 S. 500 E., Pleasant Grove, UT 84062; or e-mail me at harlowclark@juno.com; 801-785-4481 Harlow S. Clark http://rmmla.wsu.edu/rmmla/callForPapers/call01.asp One does not have to be a member of RMMLA to propose a paper, but one must become a member by April 1 to appear in the program. Paper proposals based on a 300-word abstract and a 50-word description are due to the session chair no later than March 1, 2001. You will be notified of the chair's decision by March 15. Members may submit different papers to different session chairs, however, no one may read more than one paper at the convention. If you have a paper accepted in more than one session, please decide which one you will give, and notify the chairs, as well as the RMMLA Secretariat of your choice. If we discover a duplication and are not able to reach you, we will have to choose for you. Chairs are discouraged from accepting papers from more than two members of his/her home institution or two members of the same institution, unless the focus of that session is somehow related to the institution or unless the third presenter from that institution is replacing another presenter who had to cancel at the last moment. No one's name may appear on the program more than twice (i.e. as chair and presenter, or twice as a chair). Service as Alternate Chair is not factored into the count. Members who propose papers are expected to attend the convention to read at the scheduled time. The Program Committee does all possible to vary the day/time a session meets from year to year, and to accommodate scheduling requests based on extraordinary circumstances, but not all requests can be granted. If you have a paper accepted for the convention, please plan to attend and share your research/work. Please notify the chair and the RMMLA Secretariat immediately if you find you are unable to present, so that a replacement might be found. It is the policy of the RMMLA not to have papers read in absentia, except under extraordinary circumstances. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 28 Feb 2001 01:17:07 -0700 katie@aros.net wrote: > Maybe if she just lied about her Church activity and her sleeping > around, but was completely nice and agreeable around Peter, instead of whining > and being so demanding--? Maybe she would have been more believable then. At > least then I could understand his liking her. > > But it still doesn't feel right that way, either. I mean, when there's a "bad" > character around, why does he or she have to do the worst possible things to > show how evil he or she is? In this case, having Jackie sleep around and make > her little videos seems stereotypical. She's bad; therefore, she must sleep > around. Couldn't there have been something else that made her bad that didn't > involve the standard sleeping around, drinking, doing drugs, robbing a bank, > etc.? I would like to see her more carefully crafted than this. Sleeping around is good--although the video was a bit much. Lying about church activity and sleeping around would have been plenty for us to not want Peter to stay with her. Have sleeping around be a real weakness for her that she's done for a long time and is trying to overcome and feels horrible about not succeeding yet. That would make her more sympathetic, rather than her current belligerent attitude toward chastity. She could feign a belligerent attitude for her friends so she doesn't feel like a prude in front of them, as long as you make it real clear it's a front and not her true feelings. This could strengthen the poignancy of her hope that marrying Peter will help her overcome her promiscuousness, since the reader won't believe it will succeed--especially with the deception she surrounds it with. I think a person like her would obey the Word of Wisdom. She's already got a nasty weakness of the flesh, so she compensates by strictly obeying a commandment in another area of the flesh. Then make her very pleasant with Peter, so we are torn between liking how well they go together and how her secret life makes us want Peter to run as far from her as he can. > And it has to be something fairly quick, too, or else it would > take up too much of the story. I don't think doing my suggestions above would take any longer than what currently happens in the story. You won't need to show more things, just different things. > It's been several months since I've read the book, and I don't have it in front > of me now, but I don't really remember Peter being a rescuer-type. Maybe it > came through and I forgot. No, that aspect of Peter didn't come through at all. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: [AML] Job Opening, SUNY-Delhi Date: 28 Feb 2001 12:50:24 -0500 Anybody on the list facing graduation soon and the prospects of a job= search? If you are, or know of someone who may be interested, I am chair of t= his year's search committee. Delhi is a small town with an excellent public sch= ool system, an active branch (two full sets of missionaries!) and fairly close to= the Palmyra and Boston temples. Nobody "owns" classes, so if there is so= mething in the catalog you want to teach, you will have the opportunity. The fo= llowing job description will appear in the Chronicle of Higher Ed soon, but I hav= e permission from personnel to circulate it electronically as well. Pa= ss it on as you see fit. The State University of New York at Delhi invites applications for th= e following anticipated vacancy: Composition/Humanities Faculty (tenure-track, full-time term appointm= ent). Ph.D. preferred. This position will have =BD teaching and advising d= uties off-campus with a local corporate partner. We are looking for a cand= idate with a composition background and the ability to teach introductory course= s within a general humanities program. Candidate=92s secondary interest is open= but could include: literature, drama, art history, music history, studio and/or= performing arts, public speaking, philosophy or film. Normal teaching load is 1= 2 hrs. per semester. Send cover letter, vita, and three letters of reference to= : English Search Committee Box 6, SUNY Delhi, Delhi, NY 13753. Tony Markham - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Linda Paulson ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ (Review) Date: 28 Feb 2001 13:51:37 -0700 When Linda asked me for specifics about Peter and Jackie, I had to stop and think through it (for one thing, it's been several months since I read it). I realized that "transparent" wasn't the best adjective to describe Jackie. Granted, she's transparent to the reader, but she is not outright evil around Peter. I agree with Katie's assessment of the problem--Jackie didn't have any redeeming qualities. I didn't see anything at all that explained how Peter was ever drawn to her. She did nothing but whine and demand her way. I would have perferred her to be more likeable the first few times we see her, so there's more sympathy for Peter's feelings toward her. Maybe even refer to their early courtship and some sweeter times, or something really kind or charitable she did for someone. Anything to make it more real that Peter would give her a second look, as well as give Jackie an additional layer or two (she's pretty one-dimensional right now--even villains are 100% bad). I don't agree with Katie that Jackie's evil actions are stereotypical, but that's just me. I think the story demanded something very strong to make the reader want to scream at Peter to run the other way. Quite frankly, Linda, all your other characters were so well put together, that when Jackie didn't live up to the rest of them, she stood out. That says something good about your craft! Annette Lyon - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott and Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] Life, the Universe, & Everything XIX Schedule Date: 28 Feb 2001 15:40:25 -0700 It's time once again for Life, the Universe, & Everything XIX, the science fiction and fantasy symposium at BYU. The symposium will be March 1-3 (the weekend after the AML conference) and it's FREE (except the Saturday banquet). Guests of Honor are Harry Turtledove, Tracy Hickman (LDS), and Jeanne Cavelos. Below is a pretty-much final schedule, although the panels and presentations for the art, create your own world, and workshop tracks are not listed (see the web site). Registration will be in WSC 3228, where there will be a white board for last-minute changes. For more information, see http://www.jps.net/helgem/ltue/ Marny Parkin LIFE, THE UNIVERSE, & EVERYTHING XIX Thursday, March 1, 2001 10:00-10:50 Opening Ceremonies 11:00-11:50 Main Address: Jeanne Cavelos Noon-12:50 Creating memorable villains: Using Disney, Shakespeare, etc. as role models (Using media and literary villains to show what makes a memorable villain) Noon-1:50 The oral storytelling tradition (2 hrs) (A presentation on oral storytelling, what it is, its history, etc.) 1:00-1:50 LOTR: The godfather of fantasy? 2:00-2:50 Q&A: Tracy Hickman Repeating History: Why does SF Media reflect and shadow real Earth history? (Why does SF media choose to reflect and shadow Earth history rather than create its own?) 3:00-3:50 Reading: Tracy Hickman Making writing workshops work (What makes a good writing workshop? How can you keep one going, etc.) Digital film making and streaming media on the internet (Panel discussion on what is on the Internet. Where the Internet is headed, how to use the Internet to show your films.) 4:00-4:50 Role-playing 101: So you want to play a game? (Basic role-playing technics that will help your gaming be more enjoyable, and make you a better player.) Copyright and the writer (What you as a writer need to know about copyright laws and your responsibility) 5:00-5:50 Music in SF&F (The role of music in science fiction and fantasy media) Arthur C. Clark and 2001: a look back (A look at Clark's _2001_ from the perspective of the year 2001.) 6:00-6:50 Networking for writers: how to do it and does it work? (What the writer needs to know about networking, what to do, what to avoid. How to make it work for you.) The best science fiction and fantasy for children and young adults (A look at the best science fiction and fantasy books for children and young adults.) 700-9:00 Reception (a grand reception for all guests, participants, and attendees.) Friday, March 2, 2001 10:00-10:50 From Apollo to the Space Shuttle and beyond: postulating the future of space travel (Where space travel may be headed, and where it can go.) From Captain Underpants to Harry Potter: Writing Children's and YA Novels (A look at the growth of science fiction and fantasy books for kids. Why they're so popular, and why they're so well written.) 11:00-11:50 Main Address: Tracy Hickman FOUGHT LIKE DRAGONS: SCI-FI FANTASY AND MORMON THOUGHT Noon-12:50 Playing Games as a way to get story ideas (games that can help you write, how they can help you write, and if they should be used to help you write.) Roddenberry's legacy: Star Trek and Beyond (A look at the Star Trek series, Earth, Final Conflict, and Adromeda. Also, what lies ahead for Roddenberry) 1:00-1:50 What you need to look for when you edit (Tips, tricks, etc. To help you edit your own work better.) Role-playing: Being a good player (tips and tricks) 2:00-2:50 FOUNDATIONS OF STORY (Tracy Hickman) SF&F on the stage: How to make it work and do you want to? (Science fiction and fantasy on the stage, in parody, musical, etc.) 3:00-3:50 Reality is in the details: It's the little things in your story that make it memorable (the details we often miss when we write that add depth and flavor to your story) Tricks to making your own movies (programs that work, techniques, tips and tricks to making your own movie look better.) 4:00-4:50 From dry fact to drama: using both fact and fiction in alternate histories and historicals (how to blend both fact and fiction into a seamless whole to create a good story) Music in SF&F Films: A characteristic sound? (It has been said that SF&F soundtracks have no characteristic sound. Dr. Perry gives his view of this, with illustrations.) 5:00-5:50 How to tell a good ghost story (How you tell the story is as important as the story itself. Tips to telling a ghost story that will keep the audience on the edge of their seats) writing to a deadline (how to make the deadline, set goals, work to meet a deadline) CYOW RPG: Creating a believable and fun world in which to role play 6:00-6:50 Writing fantasy for the LDS market Marketing your screenplay/play 7:00-7:50 DragonComet writing contest award ceremonies Cabaret 8:00-9:30 Fantasy and Medieval Fashion show Saturday, March 3, 2001 8:00-10:00 Killer Breakfast: Star Bores Episode II with Tracy Hickman 10:00-10:50 Historical perceptions of magic The Pirate Panel: Pirates in SF&F 11:00-11:50 Main Address: Harry Turtledove Noon-12:50 The heart of darkness: How dark should your villains be? Anime: The joy of Japanese Animation 1:00-1:50 Q&A: Harry Turtledove Live or Die: The Players' Guide to Guerilla Dungeoing 2:00-2:50 Reading: Harry Turtledove Creating story ideas: Where to look and tools to help Putting it together: The little things your costume needs to succeed 3:00-3:50 Web publishing: Where to do it and why? Space Education Center presentation Creating your own Jedi costume 4:00-4:50 Diction, Dialog and Dialect: Is how your character speaks as important as what they say? Evil reformed: The new anti-hero in SF&F Media (Forever Knight, Angel, Xena, etc.) 5:00-5:50 Casting call: blending fictional and historical characters in your novel Makeup demo Star Wars Episode 2: Separating fact from fiction 6:30-8:00 Medieval Banquet (tickets required) Sponsored by the Quill and the Sword 8:00-9:00 Charity Auction (All welcome. Donations appreciated.) - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm