From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #331 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Tuesday, May 22 2001 Volume 01 : Number 331 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 13:21:15 -0600 From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Cinema "Barbara R. Hume" wrote: >=20 > >_The Graduate_ is, imo, an excellent example of how a disgusting story > >(an older woman having a affair with a younger man, her daughter's > >fiance) can be done with elegance and taste. >=20 > Thom, would it be a disgusting story if it were about an older man having > an affair with a young woman? Or would that be "perfectly normal"? >=20 If I was the older gentleman, and the younger woman was Brittney Spears, it would be perfectly normal. I kid. I kid. But what's really disgusting about Mrs. Robinson and the Dustin Hoffman character is not just the age: but the fact that she's married and the young man is her daughter's fianc=E9. If they were both single, I wouldn't see anything disgusting about the relationship. - --=20 Thom Duncan Playwrights Circle an organization of professionals - -------------------------- Shameless Plug - ------------------------------- Don't miss the Playwrights Circle Summer Festival at UVSC! *J. Golden* - a one-man play by James Arrington, starring Marvin Payne *SFX5* - 5 original short science fiction plays *Peculiarities* - a new full-length play by Eric Samuelsen For more information about the Playwrights Circle and our summer festival: http://www.playwrightscircle.com - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:53:34 -0700 From: "Stephen Goode" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormons as Flawed I'm sure that everyone recognizes that there are no perfect Mormons. It's completely doctrinal and everyone would gladly pay lip service to it. There seems to be, however, some minimum standard of circumstance in which a Mormon must find himself in order to be considered a good role model. Despite all that we say, doctrinally, about the fact that we all have the status of sinner, there is a sense that some of us make better role models than others. I agree with what Michael Martindale said about where to look for role models for overcoming certain things, but it isn't common among Mormons to want to look there. Some of the factors that influence us, unfairly in my opinion, in assessing who our role models ought to be, are: * Calling -- the higher the calling, the better the role model * No "past" -- the cleaner the admitted past, the better the role model * Beauty -- outward appearance is supposed to be irrelevant, but from all I've seen, it is highly relevant to a great many people * Nature of struggles -- if you've overcome the effects of a medical condition, you're a definite hero, but if what you've overcome is sin, you're questionable Being acquainted with a host of people who are working to overcome distasteful and very un-Mormonlike addictions, a large part of the struggle is the struggle to feel like they fit in with the perfectly plastic personages they meet at church. It is little wonder that many wonder if the promises of the gospel can possibly relate to them. My past is pasted all over the Internet. I own multiple websites and internet resources for Latter-day Saints struggling with a variety of challenges, and I tend to tell my story there. Often, I get email from someone who has visited my sites taking me to task for not whitewashing my life as a good Latter-day Saint is supposed to do. In addiction recovery methodology, the penchant for appearing better than you really are is called, "acting in." "Acting out" is the terminology for acting on your addiction. For example, an alcoholic is addicting out when he is drinking or looking for a drink. Acting out is when the boundaries that should surround your behavior collapse. It's like the fence around you and your behavior has fallen. Acting in is when you build the fence too tightly around yourself and therefore tightly control yourself. It is a highly-judgmental mode, because the only way you can successfully restrict your own thoughts is to restrict the thoughts and behaviors of others, which falls into the realm of unrighteous dominion. It's as compulsive as acting out, hence the term in Alcoholics Anonymous, "dry drunk." So-called perfect Mormons are most likely "dry drunks" as it pertains to any number of vices against which a person expresses no tolerance but inwardly wants more than the people who have embraced it want it. If you're ever going to write fiction about an addict of any kind, you need to understand acting in. If your characters only act out, they will not be believable. See my essay on acting in at http://www.springsofwater.com/songsandjoy/actingin.shtml . Warning: it contains frank admissions by a Mormon with apparently no great shame about his past--namely me. Rex Goode _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 15:38:08 -0600 From: Chris Grant Subject: Re: [AML] Mormons as Flawed Thom Duncan writes: >Years ago, a book was done by a BYU professor (I wish I >could remember the title). He interviewed many families >identified by their respective Stake Presidents as "ideal" >Mormon families. Your description of the methodology suggests that you are thinking of _Effective Mormon Families: How They See Themselves_ by William G. Dyer and Phillip R. Kunz (or, perhaps, the slightly revised version entitled _10 Critical Keys for Highly Effective Mormon Families_). Dyer and Kunz "wrote to selected stake presidents . . . and asked them to identify fifteen families they felt were `the best families in their church jurisdiction.'" (p. 3.) >Guess what he found out. These pillars of the stake broke >virtually every stereotype we've come to expect from such >families. In the majority of cases, for instances, family >home evening (as an organized lesson) was rare. Dyer and Kunz found that 66% of respondents "always or usually held a weekly family home evening" (p. vii). They state that this 66% probably only includes those families holding a "pre-formatted `meeting'" (p. 20). >By some, films were enjoyed because of their artistic >qualities, not because of their ratings. Perhaps I have simply overlooked it, but I can't find anywhere in their book that Dyer and Kunz report these effective families saying this. The only thing related to movies and ratings I found is where Dyer mentions that some of the students in the BYU Stake he presides over say "everyone misses some meetings or goes to an R-rated movie. It's no big deal". Dyer and Kunz reply: "While we might agree about . . . the lack of earthshaking consequences for going to an occasional R-rated movie, what we do see--very clearly--is that relativity is a slippery slide. Young people who don't have clear boundaries on their behavior and who keep waffling about what is or isn't important can be backed over the edge into serious transgression in a remarkably brief period of time." (p. 166.) [...] >If the program (e.g., home teaching, early morning scripture >study,) didnt' work for a particular family, they replaced it >with something else. Dyer and Kunz report that 93% of these effective families "always accepted Church jobs" (p. vii). I would imagine that that includes the job of being a home teacher. Or did you mean that these effective families stopped letting *their* home teachers visit *them*? Chris Grant - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 13:25:31 -0600 (MDT) From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] WEYLAND, _Ashley and Jen_ (Review) Quoting "D. Michael Martindale" : > katie@aros.net wrote: > > > In an interview quoted in a paper posted > > there, he even states that he doesn't try to be a great writer and use > literary > > techniques and so forth. He feels that this can get in the way of the > story. > > So he may be aware of more of this sort of thing than we give him > credit for. > > Sorry, but that sounds like a cop out to me (and I am at your mercy > assuming that you've passed on the intent of his quote correctly). Am > I > to honestly believe that all the great writers who developed literary > techniques over the centuries were working hard to develop something > that would make their stories worse? Well, no. But I do agree with him that sometimes writers who concentrate on their techniques (Weyland specifically mentions symbolism) can make their stories harder to read. The semester that I was an English major, I noticed a general snootiness about many of the students (including myself) and faculty--that we were wonderful because we could write something so "well" and bury meaning so deeply that the only people who would understand it were other English majors. It's my impression that this is the sort of thing that Weyland wants to avoid. >If Jack Weyland really believes > what this quote attributes to him, then he doesn't understand literary > techniques. > > How would you like to overhear your doctor say, "I just think those > surgical techniques they taught me in medical school get in the way of > the operation"? Those literary techniques are the tools of the trade. > If > Jack doesn't want to use the tools of the trade, why is he in the > trade? > Frankly, I consider that attitude to be an insult to all writers who > struggle to master the tools of their trade. Maybe, to continue your analogy, Jack is an herbal therapist, not a surgeon. He's not necessarily trying to do the same thing, even if the end result (healing people) is the same. > >I'd > > really like to read something of his and thoroughly enjoy it, without > being > > able to pick out irritating passages where he takes literary shortcuts > that, > > unfortunately, look just like "something Jack Weyland would do." > > You are proving my point, Katie. I'm not asking Jack Weyland to stop > being Jack Weyland. I'm asking him to be a better Jack Weyland with > the > more experience he gets. No one is impressed with somebody who does > the > same thing year after year and never improves. > Sure. The point I originally meant to make was that Weyland is at least aware enough of literary techniques, or some of them, to have consciously decided not to use them. But to me, making your writing more seamless and overloading it with symbolism are two different things. Maybe he thinks they are the same and has chosen to have none of it (in which case he doesn't understand them as well as I've given him credit for). But I really think that his books would improve considerably if he'd just do simple things like making his backstories less heavy-handed. And I don't think he'd alienate any of his audience if he did this. He'd probably gain a larger one. And he doesn't need symbolism if he doesn't want it; not for what he's trying to do and who he's trying to reach. (Glad I could help prove your point while I was at it. :) Since he sells well anyway, I doubt he has any reason to think that his "techniques" aren't working. Only English major-type weirdos like us are the ones who complain. Which is why I don't understand why his English major- type editors don't complain, too. - --Katie Parker katie@aros.net - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 15:49:23 -0600 From: Steve Subject: Re: [AML] Female Writer Wanted on 5/21/01 11:22 AM, RichardDutcher@aol.com at RichardDutcher@aol.com wrote: > We (Zion Films / Excel Entertainment) are looking for a female, returned > missionary writer to do a spin off novelization of "God's Army". Please me > call ASAP 344-8764. > > Thanks! > Emily Pearson Hi-- Just curious, why female RMs? (I write music so I wouldn't be in the running anyway) Steve - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 10:17:45 -0600 From: "Alan Rex Mitchell" Subject: Re: [AML] John BENNION, _Falling Toward Heaven_ (Review) Martindale wrote: > The relationship between Howard and Allison makes absolutely no sense. > These people should not be together. They know they should not be > together. They irritate the bejeebies out of each other. There is > literally nothing to base their relationship on. Even the physical > attraction they feel for one another wouldn't hold up over time against > the pressure of their utter incompatibility. They are in love simply > because the author says so, and there is no other justification for > their relationship. While I absolutely agree with the above comment, reading it made me wonder if the incompatibility was something Bennion was driving at. I took it as symbolism of a relationship encumbering the author and Mormonism. The issue--Can Howard and Allison coexist?--becomes for me a question of whether Howard's deep cultural Mormonism can live with the intellectual academia of the Modern PC World (of both Bills Gates and Clinton). Allison is a computer geek with beautiful long legs and the daughter of academia--perhaps the archetype of success in the present world. Howard can WANT her, but can he LOVE her? It appears he can make love to her in spurts if she accepts (although doesn't embrace) the quirkiness of his history imprinted on his pysche. Is there a message here? Can Allison (Babylon) love Howard? Unlike her earlier lovers, he has soul--that deep feeling of who he is and how much the Old Testament God Of The Desert (OTGOTD) must disapprove. If men are toys, then Howard must be the ultimately weird doll--the doll that is not for everyone, but has something GI Joe and Ken don't have. Like what? Like the OTGOTD thing and the cajones to work two bittery cold winter days full of snow, dead pickup batteries and other various and sunder entropy, to successfully pull an otherwise stillborn calf from it's mother and call it the best two days of his life. A job only the children of Ephraim could love. That striving is likely what Allison admires, even while fearing the whole two days for her fragile life. Allison can and does embrace Howard's mother, who might represent the Sonja Johnson OTGOTDless wing of Mormonism (although Mom has a kinder gentler voice than Sonja.) So they negotiate their living arrangements throughout the book. (And you thought politics made strange befellows.) Think symbolism! Think of the struggle for acceptance; e.g., statehood, or the struggle for the 2002 games, or PC compatibility. Or the struggle to get published in the NY market, et cetera. Are these relationships incompatible, as Martindale suggests? In the book, their own child has birthing complications, and Howard vows allegiance to the OTGOTD for the hope of its life. But the child was stillborn and Howard's imagination projects the child's promised life into a future and far better place. Howard relates to Allison his dreams of billions of children and a managing creation in a planet in a galaxy far far away. Allison (Babylon) cuddles up to him, perhaps realizing her vulerability, and lets him ramble because she hasn't his imagination. Alan Mitchell - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 18:31:29 -0500 From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Up to the Limit Folks, By my count, this message brings us up to 30 for today. (I may fit another one in, on the theory that as a moderator's message this one doesn't count.) There's quite a few still left in my in-box. I haven't followed strict chronological order in sending out posts I've received. Rather, I've tried to keep things moving ahead with some of our currently-in-process threads. Assuming that the pace drops off, I should be able to get some of those already-received posts out in the next couple of days. If a post you have made doesn't make it out, feel free to query and/or resend. Jonathan Langford AML-List Moderator - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 04:03:49 GMT From: Jeffrey Needle Subject: [AML] HOLZAPFEL & SHUPE, _Joseph F. Smith, Portrait of a Prophet_ (Review) Review =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Richard Neitzel Holzapfel & R. Q. Shupe, "Joseph F. Smith, Portrait of a= =20 Prophet" 2000, Deseret Book Company Hardback, 375 pages, $25.95 Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle In a time when biographies of Church presidents are easily available, on= e=20 always wonders why another book seems necessary. How much can you say=20= about a person that hasn't already been said? Focusing on this=20 interesting man in various forums in the Church advances the cause for a= =20 new book, but doesn't entirely justify it. Mere repetition does not=20= constitute praise. The authors of "Joseph F. Smith, Portrait of a Prophet" make their=20 intentions clear at the outset: "This work is primarily an effort to produce a 'Joseph F. Smith=20 photographic scrapbook,' highlighting some of the wonderful images from = an impressive visual record of his life. It is not an effort to supplan= t=20 the existing historical efforts of previous authors who provide details,= =20 insights, and interpretations of his labors and ministry." (from the=20= Introduction) True to their word, the first 265 pages of this book are richly populate= d=20 by a genuinely interesting photographic record of Pres. Smith and the=20= people who surrounded him. Also included are photographs of his wives, = and reproductions of letters written by, and to, him. The remaining pages contain a record of the tributes delivered at the=20= spring 1918 General Conference, the first after Smith's death. They=20= contain wonderful reflections of those who knew him best, those who=20 served with and under him. One of the disappointments in this book is the repetitious nature of the= =20 narrative that surrounds the photographs. In my opinion, a little of=20= this stuff goes a long way. An example: an account of Smith's experienc= e=20 with personal loss begins on page 47 with a 22-line recitation of the=20= deaths of his various wives and children. Then there is an extended=20= discussion (pages 48-54) of the death of his daughter Mercy Josephine. = Yes, losing a child is a terrible thing, but so much material seemed a=20= bit overdone. The book is filled with endless cites from his personal letters. Many o= f=20 these cites really add nothing to the larger story. I found myself=20 becoming impatient with the inevitable repetition when one is quoting=20= extensively from private correspondence. Now, all this may very well be appropriate for this kind of book. If=20= this approach makes Pres. Smith seem more human, more approachable, then= =20 perhaps it is a good approach. Having said this, we now confront the important question, "Should I run = out and purchase this book?" It is, after all, $25.95 plus tax. I'm=20= guessing most of us are faced with the problem of too many books to buy = and not enough money to spend. "Joseph F. Smith, Portrait of the=20 Prophet" is not a bad book. It is, in fact, a good book that fills a=20= niche. The authors make no secret of their intention -- a photo-album o= f=20 the life of Pres. Smith. And this is accomplished very nicely. But it = is also filled with endless, often repetitious, citations from his=20 correspondence. I would have liked more historical detail. But then=20= again, this isn't a work of history, it's a family photo album. Given these limitations, I recommend the book to those who want a=20 single-volume snapshot of a wonderful man who led the Church through=20= difficult times. - --=20 Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 May 2001 10:29:19 -0500 From: "Frank Maxwell" (by way of Jonathan Langford ) Subject: Re: [AML] Mormons as Flawed Jonathan, On my last post to AML-List, I cc'd Thom, since I was responding to his ideas. He apparently sent his reply (see below) directly to me, instead of to the AML-List. I'm sending it to you in case he neglected to resend it to the AML-List. Thanks, Frank M. Frank Maxwell wrote: > > P.S. to the Moderator: Hope the anecdotes aren't too off-topic. Can we > consider this kind of story-swapping an embryonic form of literature? > Perhaps a personal essay in vitro? To us creative types, we can turn anything into story fodder . But to further tie Frank's excellent essay into literature: I think it goes to show being a writer to the Mormon audience isn't as easy as it may at first seem. We need to decide which kind of Mormons we'll be writing to. Jack Weyland writes to Laurels, young Mormon girls. Rachel Nunes writes mostly to Mormon women, but only Mormon certain Mormon women (Mormon feminists, for instance, are probably not going to like her books). Levi Petersen writes to the "literary" Mormon and anyone who is a fan of just plain good writing. And so forth. I've had similar experiences to those Frank talks about, where my brand of Mormonness came as a shock to people. When I worked for the LAN Times, one young reporter approached me and said, "Thom, you are much more evolved than any other Mormon man I know." She was referring by evolved to my attitude about women's rights. She had gotten the impression that all Mormon men were opposed to the advancement of all women as anything other than wives and mothers. I laughed it off by telling her I have four daughters and they won't let me be a chauvinist pig but there was hidden pain in that response: the pain being that my Church was so perceived by this women and others I came to know. - -- Thom Duncan Playwrights Circle an organization of professionals - -------------------------- Shameless Plug - ------------------------------- Don't miss the Playwrights Circle Summer Festival at UVSC! *J. Golden* - a one-man play by James Arrington, starring Marvin Payne *SFX5* - 5 original short science fiction plays *Peculiarities* - a new full-length play by Eric Samuelsen For more information about the Playwrights Circle and our summer festival: http://www.playwrightscircle.com - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 11:35:59 -0600 From: LuAnnStaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Donny Osmond Concert Tracie, Where is "here"? Donny has always been gracious and done incredible concerts everywhere I've seen him. Lu Ann Tracie Laulusa wrote: > Donny Osmond was in concert here last night. I didn't go, but I'm listening > to the radio and the DJs are taking calls about it. Apparently it was a big > hit. Fans are saying it is the best concert they've ever seen. And people > who waited around for autographs are saying how gracious and wonderful Donny > is. Amazing success. > > Tracie Laulusa > > - > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 08:45:05 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Devil's Advocate I have been accused on occasion of being a devil's advocate. So I decided, since I've been accused of it anyway, I might as well do some real advocating for the devil... That devil, he's a pretty cool guy. He'll point out all sorts of alternate choices you may have never considered before. He wants to maximize your experience here on earth--make sure you've experienced as many things as possible. And when you're in a lurch, he really comes through for you. Just listen to these satisfied customers: Cain: "The devil helped me get this really cool mark. It keeps me from getting murdered." King David: "The devil hooked me up with this righteous babe called Bathsheba. We had one rip-roaring time, me and her." Laman and Lemuel: "If it wasn't for the devil, we might never have seen that cool angel, or got a buzz when our brother Nephi touched us. The devil encouraged us to murmur when Nephi broke his bow. That way we didn't have to do anything about it, and he was the one who had to go make a new one and find some lunch." Adam: "The devil was decent enough to approach my wife Eve first, otherwise I might have been the one cursed with enduring childbirth. As it is, I only have to sweat a little as I till the land. I'll take that any day!" Eve: "Screw the devil!" [Hey, how'd that one get in there?] Judas Iscariot: "The devil helped me earn 30 pieces of silver. What a guy! Can't wait to hook up with him in O.D." King Noah: "Two words: Abinadi kabob." Moses: "The devil helped me hone my pride, so I didn't have to lead the children of Israel into the promised land and battle all those Canaanites. Poor Joshua got stuck with that gig. The devil also showed me that nifty film of outer darkness. Beat "Scream 3" all to hell (literally)." Zacharias: "When that angel said we'd be having a baby, the devil made me doubt and ask for a sign. The angel struck me dumb. I didn't have to listen or talk to my wife Elizabeth for nine months! Thank you, devil." Noah: "The devil talked me into leaving all those dinosaurs behind. Now scientists think a comet killed them. Beelzebub--what a practical joker!" Eric Samuelsen: "The devil keeps making me think I'm feeling the spirit when I listen to heavy metal music. That way I don't have to listen to Afterglow (brrr!)" Eric Snyder: "The devil made me lambast that Villa Theater play." Thom Duncan: "The devil helps me keep things stirred up on AML-List, otherwise it would get pretty boring around here." Marvin Payne: "The devil made me do a play by Thom Duncan." Harlow Clark: "I could never write those long, mind-numbing messages without the help of the devil. He's my muse." Barbara Hume: "The devil made me write romance." Jack Weyland: "The devil made me write at all." Rachel Ann Nunes: "If you call my books romance, you can go to the devil!" Gerald Lund: "I got all my pointers on how to depict Joseph Smith in 'The Work and the Glory' from Old Scratch himself." Orson Scott Card: "I am the devil." Richard Dutcher: "The devil's going to make me film an R-rated movie yet, you wait and see." J. Golden Kimball: "The devil made me say it, dammit!" Jeff Needle: "The devil keeps my AML review score high. Only cost me one soul to do it." Linda Adams: "I wish the devil would help me finish volume 2." Chris Bigelow: "All the agents I queried _are_ devils." Jonathan Langford: "All I know is I'm having a devil of a time keeping this list under control." D. Michael Martindale: "The devil's making me take over the AML writers conference for science fiction fans. No wait, that wasn't the devil, that was Scott Bronson." - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:27:48 -0500 From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] MN New Products: Mormon History and Doctrine: Kent Larsen From: Kent Larsen To: Mormon News Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 23:00:00 -0500 Subject: MN New Products: Mormon History and Doctrine: Kent Larsen 18May01 A4 [From Mormon-News] Mormon History and Doctrine NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- Several books on Mormon history and doctrine are among the new products this week. Morris Shirts' account of the Iron mission, Brigham Young's attempt to process iron ore in Southern Utah, is being released by BYU in both hardcover and paperback editions and the University of Illinois Press has released a new paperback edition of Edwin Firmage's classic legal history of the early LDS Church, "Zion in the Courts." Meanwhile, Griffin Books, the paperback imprint of national publisher St. Martins Press, has released Coke Newell's "Latter Days" in paperback. That "Latter Days" has been released in paperback is a strong vote for the book, which came out in hardcover last year just after President Gordon B. Hinckley's "Standing for Something." But unlike President Hinckley's book, "Latter Days" didn't attract much attention from LDS Church members, instead selling to the general public. New and recent products: A Trial Furnace: Southern Utah's Iron Mission by Morris A. Shirts and Kathryn H. Shirts Brigham Young University Publications Book; University Publisher; NonFiction; Mormon Subject and Author A history of Brigham Young's attempt to start an iron processing facility in Cedar City Utah. Saving Adam by L. Smith Cedar Fort Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Subject and Author $19.95 Story of a foster child, thought to be "retarded." who is brought into a caring family that meets more than just his physical needs. Race Against Time by Willard Boyd Gardner Covenant Communications Book; LDS Publisher; Fiction; Mormon Subject and Author $14.95 Story of an non-Mormon police officer's unwitting trip back in time where he saves a group of Mormons from a Missouri mob. Arise & Sine Forth: Talks from the 2000 Women's Conference Deseret Book Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Subject and Authors $44.95 Talks from the 2000 Women's Conference, including talks by Kathleen H. Barnes, Merrill J. Bateman, John Bytheway, Sheri L. Dew, Virginia U. Jensen, Ardeth G. Kapp, Coleen K. Menlove, Margaret D. Nadauld, Virginia H. Pearce, Mary Ellen Smoot, Emily Watts 52 Nice Things to Do to Make Someone Happy by Jeri-Lynn Johnson Deseret Book Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Subject and Author $14.95 Includes 52 practical, thoughtful things you can do to lift a friend's burdens, let him know you are thinking about him, brighten her day, or confirm your friendship. Zion in the Courts by Edwin Brown Firmage and Richard Collin Mangrum University of Illinois Press Book; University Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Subject and Author $21.95 New paperback edition of now-classic look at legal challenges to the LDS Church throughout its history. Latter Days: An Insider's Guide to Mormonism, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints by Coke Newell Griffin Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Subject and Author $14.95 Newell's look at the history and beliefs of the LDS Church, with the non-Mormon reader in mind. Encompasses the whole of human history, from before the creation to the present, presenting Mormon doctrine along the way. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 11:44:46 -0600 (MDT) From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] Mormons as Flawed D. Michael Wrote: > How about if we remember that there has been only one perfect person, > all recent assertions on this list to the contrary notwithstanding. I'll be contrary - Christ was to only person to be perfect his entire life, without once sinningbut the scriptures refer to several people as perfect (and despite the fact perfect can be translated many ways - they are really only facets of one meaning - whole, complete, etc. all still mean perfect.) I don't want to get into to theological an argument, so let me put a literary spin on this. I am not inspired by tales that show that we're all frail and can never be perfect - because all I get out of that type of story is "why even bother." Why can't we show that it is possibel to become perfect (eventually)? That at least (for me, and others I know) lets me know the goal is attainable. For example: Genesis 6:8-10 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God (no he wasn't perfect his whole life, he got drunk, etc. - but he did become perfect) Job 1:1-2 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil. Job 1:7-9 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? Job 2:2-4 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause. (Okay - so he complained a lot, but I don't buy the argument he's a mythical figure, or that the tale is allegorical). Alma 27:27 And they were among the people of Nephi, and also numbered among the people who were of the church of God. And they were also distinguished for their zeal towards God, and also towards men; for they were perfectly honest and upright in all things; and they were firm in the faith of Christ, even unto the end. Alma 50:37 And it came to pass that in the same year that the people of Nephi had peace restored unto them, that Nephihah, the second chief judge, died, having filled the judgment-seat with perfect uprightness before God. (these last two do ot indicate a perfectness in all aspects of their lives = but they show it is possible to be perfect in some areas). - --Ivan Wolfe - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 03:22:36 -0600 From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _Wine-Dark Sea of Grass_ (Review) THE WINE-DARK SEA OF GRASS by Marilyn Brown 2000, Salt Press 397 pages Reviewed by Morgan B. Adair How could good people do something so horrible? When that question was = first asked by those investigating the killing of over 120 immigrants in = the tragedy known as the Mountain Meadows Massacre, the response was = denial: "We didn't do it. It was the Indians." Once the essential facts of = the Massacre came to light, anti-Mormon writers provided a different = answer: "They were not good people." With the ball back in the Mormon = court, the next phase was rationalization: "It was not such a bad thing." = There was an army approaching. We were in a war. Members of the Fancher = train (and the preceding wagon train, the "Missouri Wildcats") incited the = Indians to uprising, and they had to be killed to placate the Indians. The Massacre has been dealt with in anti-Mormon fiction, but Marilyn = Brown's _The Wine-Dark Sea of Grass_ is the first novel that I'm aware of = that focuses on the Massacre from the Mormon perspective. Another novel = was just released: _Ferry Woman: A Novel of John D. Lee and the Mountain = Meadows Massacre_, by Gerald Grimmett, Limberlost Press. Yet another is = forthcoming: _Red Water_, by Judith Freeman (author of _A Desert of Pure = Feeling_), possibly from a major publisher. Brown has made an effort to make her story historically accurate, but = sometimes accepts rumors that put the immigrants in a negative light. = Take, for example, the rumor that the "Missouri Wildcats" poisoned a = spring, resulting in the death of livestock. Proctor Robinson died after = skinning one of the dead cattle, the poison supposedly being transmitted = when he rubbed his eye. This rumor circulated after the massacre as an = example of the outrages committed by immigrants traveling through Utah = that incited the Mormon anger that was misdirected against the Fanchers. = The authoritative source on the massacre, Juanita Brooks's _The Mountain = Meadows Massacre_, notes that a much more likely explanation is that = Robinson died of a bacterial infection from skinning a decaying carcass, = and that the cattle died of natural causes. Nevertheless, Brown treats = Robinson's death as if caused by the Missourians. As one reads through the list of names and ages of those killed in the = Massacre (http://www.mtn-meadows-assoc.com/inmemory.htm), one notices that = the party consisted mostly of young families. For the most part, Brown = depicts the party as a faceless crowd, "like a river." The one exception = is a man and his pregnant wife that the protagonist, Jacob, talks to on = the road. Coincidentally, this is the man that Jacob is expected to kill = in the massacre. Members of the immigrant train were disarmed, then = walked, single file, back toward Cedar City. After walking a short = distance, the command was given to halt, and each of the Mormons was to = kill the immigrant at his side. Brown's description of the massacre = doesn't capture the horror of the tragedy. Most of the people killed are = part of the faceless crowd. When the order was given, Jacob "saw the men = of the Fancher train thudding to the ground." His attention immediately = turns to the man he is supposed to kill, who is attempting to wrest = Jacob's gun away from him. For Jacob, what was to be a massacre suddenly = became a struggle for his life. The killing of this man, the only one of = the immigrants who is not faceless, is done in self-defense. The man dies = asking that question, "How could. . . ." Brown correctly places John D. Lee near the front of the column, behind a = wagonload of sick and wounded immigrants. Jacob is shocked when he sees = Lee killing them, but realizes that no one who could tell what happened = could be left alive. In depicting the Massacre, Brown could take a lesson from Spielberg's = _Saving Private Ryan_. The opening scene, perhaps the most effective = depiction of the horror of war ever made, succeeds by giving many details = in rapid succession. In comparison, Brown has given us a wide-angle view. = Details of the massacre that Brown could have drawn on have been preserved = in the accounts of both the Mormon participants and children who survived. = For example, Mary Elizabeth "Sallie" Baker was 5 years old at the time of = the Massacre: "Sallie Baker recalled she was sitting on her father's lap when the same = bullet that killed him nicked her ear, leaving a scar forever. The = bloodshed was imprinted on Sallie's memory for the rest of her life. Only = her words can begin to describe her feelings. She was eighty-five years = old and still remembered: "But even when you're that young you don't forget the horror of having you = father gasp for breath and grow limp, while you have your arms around his = neck, screaming with terror. You don't forget the blood curdling war = whoops and the banging of guns all around you. You don't forget the = screaming of the other children and the agonized shrieks of women being = hacked to death with tomahawks. And you wouldn't forget it, either, if you = saw your own mother topple over in the wagon beside you, with a big red = splotch getting bigger on the front of her calico dress. . . . "One of the Mormons ran up to the wagon, raised his gun and said, 'Lord my = God, receive their spirits, it is for thy Kingdom that I do this.' Then he = fired at the wounded man who was leaning against another man, killing them = both with the same bullet. "A 14 year-old boy came running up toward our wagon, and the driver, who = was a Mormon, hit him over the head with the butt end of his gun, crushing = the boy's skull. A young girl about 11 years old, all covered with blood, = was running toward the wagon when an Indian fired at her point blank." = (Anna Jean Backus, _Mountain Meadows Witness: The Life and Times of Bishop = Philip Klingensmith_, pp 136-7.) Brown shifts the point of view of the narrative several times in the = novel. Each chapter begins with the name of the character from whose point = of view that chapter is told. Brown could have used this technique to make = a very powerful book, just by including one more point of view, that of = one of the members of the Fancher party. Imagine seeing the massacre from = the point of view of a 5 or 6 year-old child whose lack of comprehension = of events only adds to the terror they feel. Then imagine how they would = feel, after watching their family killed by the Mormons, being given to a = Mormon family to be cared for. Although the cover of the book and my review thus far might lead you to = believe that _The Wine-Dark Sea of Grass_ is a novel about the Mountain = Meadows Massacre, that is not really the case. The Massacre is a backdrop = to the actual story, a story of obsessive love between Elizabeth and John = D. Lee, and between Jacob and Elizabeth, who ends up marrying Jacob's = father, J.B. Polygamy complicates many of the marriages in the novel, just = as it did in real life. Much of the novel seems to be from the romance = genre, so I'll have to leave that part of it for someone more familiar = with that genre to review. Finally, a note on the printing. While the book is nicely bound and has an = attractive dust jacket, there are problems with the printed text. There is = almost no bottom margin--the text comes within 1/4 to 1/8 inch of the = bottom of the page, and on many pages, the text is printed slightly = crooked. While I enjoy reading history, I believe literature has a greater = potential to let us imagine the feelings and motivations of others and = explore human complexity. In telling the Mountain Meadows story from the = Mormon point of view, Marilyn Brown has told us that this horrible thing = happened, that good people did it, and somehow they continued to be good = people. I'm confident that the answer to how this could happen could be = found by unraveling the complexities of human nature, but I haven't found = that answer yet. - - AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #331 ******************************