From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #515 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Tuesday, November 13 2001 Volume 01 : Number 515 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2001 20:23:03 -0700 From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Writing Rant Take a "blitz person" who gets stuck at a certain level of quality because they are immediately "famous" and making money. Sometimes they rest on their laurels. Marilyn Brown Or worse, their quality drops. I've seen this too many times to count--where the author's first book or two are ten times better than the stuff they publish later (thanks to name recognition which generate sales). Annette Lyon - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 17:04:08 -0700 From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] Created Spiritually? Here's the second half of what I wanted to say with my post on this: With _Homeschool Genesis_, I used to go for a walk, where the chapters would arrive "whole." Then I would just go and write them down. Much of my poetry comes the same way. Out of Mormondum this is called channelling :). Of course we don't call it that, but we don't know HOW to call it. C. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 12:20:18 -0500 From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Album Featuring MoTab Song Debuts at No.1: Deborah Carl 11Nov01 US NY NYC A1 Album Featuring MoTab Song Debuts at No.1 NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- "God Bless America," a hastily compiled album of patriotic songs that includes the Mormon Tabernacle Choir's "The Star Spangled Banner," debuted at No.1 on the Billboard 200 on October 24th. The album, compiled by Columbia Records, features 15 songs including Celine Dion's studio version of "God Bless America" which she sang live during the "America: A Tribute to Heroes" telethon and John Cougar Mellencamp's previously unreleased live acoustic version of "Peaceful World." Also included is the Mormon Tabernacle Choir's 1965 rendition of "The Star-Spangled Banner." "God Bless America" sold 180,975 copies the first week and a portion of the proceeds will go to the Twin Towers Fund. Sources: 'God' shoots up the music charts Philadelphia PA Daily News (Hollywood Reporter) 26Oct01 A2 http://dailynews.philly.com:80/content/daily_news/2001/10/26/features/FALB26 F.htm By TAMARA CONNIFF: The Hollywood Reporter Charts: Patriotic compilation beats out Ozzy, Enya and Ja Rule Live Daily 24Oct01 A2 http://www.livedaily.citysearch.com/news/3848.html by Jon Zahlaway: LiveDaily Staff Writer See also: MoTab Recording to Support September 11th Victims http://www.mormonstoday.com/011012/A1MoTabRecording01.shtml >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 12:38:30 -0500 From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN The Lord's Daily Presence in Our Lives: Deseret Book News Release 10Nov01 UT UT SLC A2 The Lord's Daily Presence in Our Lives SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- As members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we believe in miracles, in the presence of God in our daily lives blessing us, his children, with love, patience, understanding, or just about anything we may need. Often that presence is manifest in small, almost indefinable ways. Sometimes, that presence is much more pronounced. Jay A. Parry looks at those latter manifestations in "Everyday Miracles: True Stories About God's Hand in Our Lives" (Eagle Gate, $12.95). Recounting in more than 60 stories the experiences of people worldwide who've felt the divine intervention of the Lord, Parry offers a collection of simple, yet life-changing stories -- everyday miracles -- which come as a natural consequence of the Lord's promise that his Spirit will always be with us if we keep our covenants and remain faithful. "These miracles that follow the faithful are recorded in journals, news clippings and family histories," he writes, "as well as in memories and in hearts. Most miracles go unnoticed by the world at large, but those who experience them cannot deny that the Lord's hand is ever ready to bless and comfort us." "Everyday Miracles" tells of spiritual promptings, warnings and protections, each experience offering a message of hope and encouragement that will help the readers deal with difficulties in their own lives. Source: The Lord's Daily Presence in Our Lives Deseret Book News Release 10Nov01 UT UT SLC A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2001 15:21:34 -0700 From: "Nan McCulloch" Subject: [AML] Will 9/11 Impact Arts? In a panel discussion on _The Arts during a Time of National Crisis_at = Harvard University singer James Taylor said the Sept. 11 terrorist = attacks should make people think about what in the American lifestyle is = worth defending. He said that he has become more concerned about his = audience's reaction and what state they are in. This coupled with the = stunning meeting between government leaders and Hollywood concerning = what Hollywood can do to help with the war effort, has caused me to = wonder how 9/11 will change the way Mormon writers write. =20 Nan McCulloch Draper, UT - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 13:14:20 -0700 From: kathy_f@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Fluff On Fri, 9 Nov 2001 15:21:15 -0700 "Sharlee Glenn" writes: > > Come to think of it, I'm not sure that I really like the cotton > candy/meat > analogy. There is a time and a place for cotton candy. To me fluff > is not > just sugary and sweet, it is dishonest, false, easy, and often > sloppy--more > like jello pudding mixed together with cool whip trying to pass > itself off > as mousse. > > Sharlee Glenn > glennsj@inet-1.com Then how does one explain the one aspect that is frequently left out of this discussion? That of the witness of the Spirit about eternal truths to the readers of particular stories such as "The Touch of the Master's Hand" and "Free the Birdies" (which, btw, was written and given as a sacrament talk, not a publishable story)? This is my personal measure of fluff. To some these stories and others like them are banal, dishonest, false, easy, sloppy and any other label one feels like applying to satisfy their feelings about a piece. But for me, it's whether or not the Spirit reaches a heart that is in need of something that particular story has at that particular time. And it does with these, and with many others. I'm not talking about warm fuzzy emotions. I'm talking about witness. _Saturday's Warriors_ opened up opportunity for discussion with my children in a very fun way. We enjoy it. We still sing "line upon line" at our house, and my husband and I were singing in the car the other day, "I take some paper in my hand..." (don't know the title to either song, but we know all the words.) We were also lamenting the last line, and saying how much we hated it, but within the context of the story line we understand why it's there. The lyrics talk about something important, something many youth feel -- wanting to be great, but fearing that they never will be. That's a legitimate, honest struggle nearly every youth has in or out of the church. The natural man vs the spiritual man. Is it banal? I don't think so. We watch our "My Turn on Earth" video at our house as well. The kids still enjoy it and the songs have a lot of gospel truths in them that are just right for my younger kids. The music gets my babies dancing, and it brings a good spirit into the home. That last factor counts very high with me! I personally thinking the ending drags remorselessly, but there's a lot there that is very good. Yet on this list it's been referred to as fluff. By your definition, Sharlee, I don't find any of the four pieces I've mentioned in this post as fluff, and each one of them has been labeled so by others here. The problem still remains, no matter what name we give it, what some consider fluff and what others considers fluff continue to remain different. It's a personal evaluation. I am in hearty agreement that real literature has to have standards, and I am grateful that that is so. Maybe the problem isn't what's fluff, but what was the intent of the author? Was the author aiming for great literature? The great Mormon musical? The great Mormon sacrament meeting talk? Or were they aiming for something else? I think Barbara Hume is right on. "...Writing is about communication, not solely about meeting arbitrary standards of 'artistic merit.' Just as it isn't right for only beautiful people to find marriage partners, it isn't right for only ultra-talented people to be able to express themselves in writing. After all, a woman can find more happiness with a plain but kind-hearted man than with a self-centered Adonis." I love this analogy. Boy, do I love it! "The Touch of the Master's Hand", "Free the Birdies," _Saturday's Warrior_, _My Turn on Earth_, and others like these are of value because they do what they were intended to do -- communicate the creator's thoughts and feelings to those who are interested in hearing it. Maybe the standards of great literature are being misapplied to these works and others like them. Which begs the question, does everything that's produced have to meet certain artistic standards, or can we just be seeking to share a feeling, an experience, an "ah hah!" moment in a way that will help others experience the same thing vicariously, and if we're lucky, by the Spirit? Maybe the answer isn't changing the term from fluff to banal or superficial or all the other synonyms Todd listed, but recognizing that not everything is intended to be great literature in the first place. Much like this post. I frequently wonder what the English professors and educated members on this list think of the organization of my posts. I'm essentially uneducated. I never even came close to finishing college, and spent most of my reading hours with my head in a work of fiction, some good, some really lousy. But I write anyway, risking censure on many levels, because I think my opinion has as much merit as everyone else's here. Just because I don't have the education to express myself perfectly does not make what I have to say of no worth. By the same token, I also think some of the things that have been labeled fluff have worth as well. For me, if the Spirit touches a heart through the medium of a story such as "Touch of the Master's Hand", than that story has a place. Maybe the problem is we are defining what has a place in Mormon Letters by a standard that should only be applied to Mormon Literature? Kathy Fowkes Mesa, Arizona kathy_f@juno.com ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 13:22:38 -0700 From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Repenting of Stories Todd Petersen wrote: > The issue is this: if I write a book that > destroys testimonies, but I think that those people were just weak > and should have stayed away from it. Am I responsible? No, you are not. Is Joseph Smith responsible for the people who have been killed in his name and because of someone's misinterpretation of passages in the BofM. Let's > take it up a notch. We all believe that God speaks to people, > right? What if God told you that your book was not righteous, that > it has done damage, or what if the Prophet told me that? I would remind the Prophet that when he starts telling plumbers about the evils of their profession, he can warn me. > We might > ignore a local leader, or we might not, but at what point would we > accept the condemnation and try to mend our ways? Surely those > who have said that this isn't really a concern of theirs don't > think that this kind of thing is never a concern at all? And didn't > Eugene England demonstrate a kind of heroism in this regard on > more than one occasion? I don't call it heroism. It may have been pragmatism, it may even have been fear, but I'm not sure I would call it heroism. Of course, all the foregoing opinions are entirely hypothetical. I would like to think that I am firm in my convictions but, were the Prophet to chastise me for some writing, I would probably confess every sin I had ever done and promise to never so much as write my name ever again. Thom - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 12:55:26 -0800 (PST) From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Created Spiritually? - --- robert lauer wrote: > I think this "movie" and "full-formed character" experience flows > naturally > from the sub-conscious mind. (Did anyone on the list ever take > screenwriting > classes under Max Golighty at BYU? He was really into "writing from your > > subconscious.") The determining factors in what exactly flows from the > subconscious is, first of all, what we take into our mind (our > perceptions) > and, second of all, our interpretation of these perception--the > conceptions > and abstractions that we develop from the information our physical > senses > feed us. This makes sense to me, but I also have experienced (as has Rob in a part I snipped out and apparently many others on the list) the phenomenon Eric describes. One of the things I wonder is if these characters are ghosts of modernism. Shades of a world that has become fragmented, where we get bits and pieces of others lives. I wonder if we experience the writing of 'characters' differently than those who wrote pre-novel, than those who wrote about heroes and gods. While certainly Shakespeare and many of the Greeks wrote complex characters, I wonder if we create them 'psychologically.' Do we experience them differently because of the novel, the rise of bourgeois culture, the emphasis on self, the city, the emphasis on product? I mean, the subconscious has only been around for little more than a century---or I should say our understanding of it as such. Humankind has always created characters. And I'm sure that Gilgamesh and that trickster the coyote seemed very real to the cultures that told stories about them. And yet, the psychologicalizing of characters, the accumulation of back story and detail and the way they come and speak to us, the way we have to find out about them seems to me to be very modern. The act of writing is all about telling a story. I don't think that that has changed. But perhaps the way our mind goes about creating that story has. Shoot, there's so much about the way the mind works that we don't know, especially when it comes to creative processes. Anyone out there know the latest research in this field? I think there must be something to the idea of spiritual creation, not in the Platonic sense, but perhaps in that our spirit interacts with our mind and body (and all those things we take into them) to create characters and stories. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Find a job, post your resume. http://careers.yahoo.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 02:51:19 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Re: Writing Groups I hate to put a cloud on everyone's enthusiasm, but I predict that this ad hoc, voluntary "writers group" idea will not work. Not enough people will respond with offers to read and critique to provide well-rounded feedback that isn't heavily biased toward specific people's personal tastes, and eventually the idea will fizzle out. This is why something like WorLDSmiths is needed. This is why, complaints vented here notwithstanding, required reading in a formal group is the only workable long-term solution. It's my experience that everyone wants their manuscript to be read and critiqued, but no one wants to read and critique other people's manuscripts. With the first flush of excitement over the idea presented here on AML-List, a few people will read a few announced manuscripts, but the excitement will die quickly, and so will the idea. A better solution, I think, would be to recruit enough committed members so WorLDSmiths _can_ be divided up into groups with specific focuses, so members aren't required to read things they have no interest in. This has been proposed within the group, but so far there haven't been enough active members to make that feasible. Our participation has been enough to keep a single viable group alive. One must remember that there is no free lunch. If you're asking people to commit time and effort to read and give good feedback on your writings, how in the world can you expect such a thing if you're not willing to reciprocate? Furthermore, reading and critiquing someone's else's work is not downtime from your own writing. You can learn at least as much about good writing critiquing the work of others as you can having your own work critiqued. Or you can go it alone and have me tear your book apart after the fact in an AML-List review. (And I will!) - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 13:28:53 -0700 From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] Fluff Sharlee GlennWrote: > Come to think of it, I'm not sure that I really like the cotton candy/meat > analogy. There is a time and a place for cotton candy. To me fluff is not > just sugary and sweet, it is dishonest, false, easy, and often sloppy--more > like jello pudding mixed together with cool whip trying to pass itself off > as mousse. As the author of the foundation analogy (and at least part of the cotton candy/meat discussion), let me extend this thought, because I think you make an important distinction here that I'm not sure has been clearly articulated elsewhere. If an author *knowingly* writes dishonestly and tries to claim that the work is something that the author knows it isn't, that author invites a level of scrutiny and judgement that demands they be called on the carpet for their arrogance to claim as true that which they know to be false. This is lying and is not to be tolerated from any author, in my opinion. Such a claim should be challenged and debunked. But that requires a knowledge that the author is actually dishonest, not just wrong. Mock mousse is exactly that--a knowingly lower quality substitute for something else. A faux product. Those who believe that gelatin and whipped topping can be combined to create an actual mousse are at least uneducated, and probably can't tell the difference between the real thing and the faux concoction. That makes them at worst silly, and certainly proves their gastronomic naivete. Many are wrong who are not dishonest. But it doesn't make them evil. Yet the effort is repeatedly being made to claim that the author of the bridge story (or the violin story or the footprints poem) set out to intentionally misdirect or subvert the real faith of readers, to lead them into false paths of stupidly or dangerously narrow interpretation. I just don't accept that claim. Are they bad artists? I think so. Does reading their work and finding value in it prove that one's own understanding is small, that one's own spiritual foundations are weak or corrupt or dishonest? I don't think so--too big a leap in my mind. Todd Robert Peterson provided an interesting list of alternatives to "fluff" that describe it as generally trite or overdone--or even banal. What his list doesn't do is say that the stuff is inherently evil, only that it has little or no value in his view. I couldn't agree with him more on that issue; fluff is, by definition, that which is without meaningful substance. Absolutely! Right on! A complete waste of time for the reader. But that's a relative judgement for each individual reader, in my opinion. Are there things that are of absolutely no worth? Probably, but not nearly as many as I think most would like to claim. My contention comes down to two specific issues: 1) that which is of no value to one reader can have value to another reader even if the thing *is* hackneyed, trite, unartistic, overdone, or banal--the reader's own context plays an important role in determining the ultimate value of the work; and 2) I am convinced that there is very little that is evil unto itself, and while I both accept and agree with condeming a work for its lack of artistry of literary merit, I have a hard time making an absolute condemnation of any work as a thing of no worth and an utter evil (apologies to Romans 14:14). Intentional misdirection is evil and a sin. I don't believe that all authors accused of that intentional misdirection are actually guilty of it; I believe most are either honestly unsophisticated or are merely trying to tell a simple story instead of a complex one. Perhaps indicative of a lack of artistic talent or literary ability--and nothing more in the vast majority of cases. Scott Parkin - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 02:53:38 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Re: Writing Groups (was: Writing Rant) Konnie Enos wrote: > > I believe that is what > Wordlsmiths is all about. I thought of joining but with my output I > don't think I can meet the requirements of posting one story and two > short stories a month and some criticing (but I don't remember that > amount, I'm not much of a critic, and I can't spell without my spellcheck > either), then there is the time invovled. Konnie, you misunderstood the requirements. You don't have to submit three works by yourself each month. You read and critique three works from other members each month. You have total control over how often you submit your own work--as little as never, if you like. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 11:17:09 -0600 From: Jhtod@aol.com (by way of Jonathan Langford ) Subject: [AML] Jeni GROSSMAN, _Benealth the Surface_ (Review) Jeni Grossman; Beneath the Surface =E2=80=93 a mystery; Covenant= Communications, Inc., 2001; softcover; 271 pages; 1-57734-828-1 USA; $14.95= =20 Reviewed by Julia H. Todd This book can be read purely for entertainment; it=E2=80=99s a well told= mystery. On the other hand, the author skillfully weaves a story about= people's struggles to find out who they are and their relationships with= God and organized religion.=20 The story is told through the lives of people in the small town of= Griggsberg and a mystery revolving around the quarry. When the quarry= flooded years earlier a beautiful lake was created. Property values around= the lake increased and the dusty quarry town became a lush summer resort. A= Christian college moved from Kansas City to the town and The Church on the= Hill was built. The only people not happy with this development were the= Bennigans, Fiona and her three children. Their husband and father, Liam,= drowned when the quarry flooded. The family is convinced the flooding was= not an accident. Fiona=E2=80=99s face bears a scar from a petrol bomb= thrown at her by Protestants in her Irish homeland. She wears the scar= proudly in honor of her troubled country.=20 A body floats to the lake's surface. Solving the murder reopens the= questions about the flooding of the quarry and exposes deceit and actions= that the town's most prominent citizens thought were long buried.=20 Craig Dennison is the pastor of the Church on the Hill. The= nondenominational church is the center of the social and religious life in= the small town of Griggsberg. Dennison=E2=80=99s almost 16 year old= daughter Hannah is the main character. She is responsible for her= rebellious younger brother during her parents=E2=80=99 frequent trips out= of town to speak and sing a church conferences, political rallies and= television programs. Hannah searches for meaning beyond the show and= spectacle.=20 The LDS connection comes with the Spencer family. Jared Spencer is Hannah's= age. Hannah carefully watches the Spencer family and wishes she could= =E2=80=9Ccuddle into a bed full of brothers and sisters.=E2=80=9D Jared and= Hannah have conversations about what's important in life and in a= relationship with God.=20 The mystery of the quarry, lake, and body get solved. Hannah's quest is= still going on at the end of the book. This book is definitely worth the= money and the time reading it. I look forward to more books from Jeni= Grossman.=20 Julia H. Todd=20 =20 - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 10:25:36 -0800 From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: Re:[AML] Aliens in Mormon Lit. Aliens in Mormon Lit, hmmm. Sci-Fi is a genre that allows a great deal of imagination in creating all kinds of aliens, cultures and "strange new worlds". One thing I've noticed is I've never run across a Sci-Fi novel that has the aliens believing in the basic religions or God(s) that the peoples on earth believe. There always seens to be an assumption that beings on another planet would have their own unique set beliefs and deities. It would be intriging to have a set of aliens who look say, like E.T. who have the complete gospel-priesthood, temple ordinances, etc. and a set of earth astronauts landing on their planet and realizing these beings are essentially LDS. Maybe an attitude of "you can't get away from them, they're everywhere!" If the space explorers were LDS it would be interesting to get the reaction about fellow brothers and sisters who look really different. On the other hand, having basic humanoid beings with the gospel could have great story possibilites too. Much of TV Sci-Fi loves to explore the writer's different fantasies about sex and union among the planets-The different Star Treks, Lexx, Roswell, Farscape. It seems a current theme is, "when do we get to a new planet and when can I have sex?" Imagine landing on a planet that is living the gospel in an advanced state and has no chastity problems of their own free will and choice. The frustration level of off planet visitors could be interesting-serpent in paradise sort of thing. Or how similar some things could be to we LDS and how different other things are-maybe how an advanced LDS culture got rid of their "fluff". Sounds like the possibilities are many. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 10:14:30 -0700 From: "Mary Jane Jones" Subject: [AML] Success in Movie Making (was: MN Pacific Island Films...) >Cole Capener (from Bob Hughes) wrote: >The fascinating thing about all these new "Mormon-themed" film projects = is=20 >that they ignore movie economics. I would bet big bucks that God's = Army,=20 >despite grossing over $2.5 million actually produced very little profit = for=20 >the film maker. Brigham City, I understand, was a financial failure. As = a=20 >producer of a film that grossed over $3 million but resulted in my = losing=20 >90% of my investment, I know something about the business side of the = film=20 >business--something all these rose-colored glasses wearing wannabes = don't=20 >seem to appreciate. In the prevailing distribution arrangements, it is=20 >difficult for producer/director-types to make any money without an=20 >exceptional box office. God's Army's box office numbers are probably as = good=20 >as can be expected for Mormon-themed films--and it's just not good = enough. _____ I would argue that not all Mormon-themed films ignore movie economics. = Even if a film doesn't make it's money at the box office, the game is far = from over. =20 I am not privy to all the actual percentages of the films we at Excel have = distributed, but I do know that any film, if concieved correctly, has = several markets from which it draws revenue: theaters, video, television, = etc. Those can happen in the US AND in international markets. As long as = costs are kept under control, even niche films can be profitable for = everyone involved. When a film like GA does $2.6M at the box office, distributor (Excel) and = producer (Zion Films) get about half of that to split amongst themselves = and cover the costs of P&A (prints and advertising). GA only cost $300K = to make (and around another $200K to market). Also, the film shipped = 100K+ videos (at around $10 each), which means around another $1M to be = divided among those involved. GA is now being prepped for Latin American = theaters, and is also being marketed to international television (not to = mention the novel, which hits stores this week). All of those markets are = gravy for films that earned their money back at the box office (like GA = did). So far, BC is playing the way most films do (even big-budget Hollywood = fare). It cost more than GA to make, and it was expected from the start = that the most likely scenario would be that it would make money at video = and in international markets. BC is still playing in cities across the = country, and is booked to open in new cities over the next few months. = There have already been unsolicited inquiries about international markets, = and there hasn't been any move to video yet. So the jury is still out. A zillion factors go into the marketing of any film, many of which are = determined or guided by choices made when the script was greenlit and the = film produced. Films that fail can do so because of how it was made = (topic/theme, budget size, qualitative issues, casting) or how it was = marketed (messaging, poster art, advertising budget, trailer, PR, = promotions, video cover) or both. The public is very astute and has a lot = of things vying for its attention. Films not only compete with other = films, they compete with television, plays, school, work, church and good = old fashioned family time. For someone to decide to arrange their = schedule and budget to include a particular film, they consider a lot of = factors. Understanding how to pierce through all that noise (once a = picture is made and assuming it is worthwhile) is what we are specializing = in at Excel. It's true that a lot of people with "rose colored glasses" jump into the = film business. That has always been the case and the Mormon film market = will be no different. But even people who know what they are doing suffer = from rose colored glasses to some degree because of ever changing market = conditions and public whim (look at the number of duds that people who = should know better come up with). It's still a much better investment = than a trip to Las Vegas....if you're prepared. Hope that helps... Mary Jane Jones Media Relations, Excel Entertainment Group - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 16:35:53 -0700 From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Writing Rant On Fri, 09 Nov 2001 16:40:16 -0700 Barbara Hume writes: > Funny how we writers don't seem to want to write. [snip] > Amazing how attractive a task like unplugging the > sink becomes when you have a writing deadline. I > wonder if ... actors ... behave in this manner? Oh, absolutely. I should be memorizing my own play right now. Instead I'm sitting here looking at email and contemplating food. scott - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:16:27 -0700 From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: [AML] Giving Critiques (was: Fluff) On Thu, Nov 08, 2001 at 10:46:58AM -0800, jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net wrote: > If you published writer types are going to invite us wannabes to, > "come on in the water's fine", don't dunk us under the water first > thing, let us dog paddle for a little while at least before we have > to sink or swim. If you want advice, you just have to ask. If you want me to look at your manuscript, you just have to ask. If you want my opinion on the current political situation, you just have to ask. If you want my recipe for caramel-coated popcorn, you just have to ask -- but you should also have an enormous check ready, making it worth my while to break my vow of secrecy. Now if you decide that I might have some nugget of wisdom from which you might benefit and do ask me, you could receive any number of answers. I might respond: "I like it," "I don't like it," "I don't know," "I don't have the time right now," or "I believe that when looking at your protagonist's journey through the cave, we can come to a more complete understanding of the involved themes using a combination of postmodern and Freudian interpretations. First the Freudian interpretation would have us apply a metaphor of birth, an emergence from the the womb. . . ." But everything changes once you get your manuscript printed, bound, and available for sale from the bookstore shelves -- even the electronic shelves. A book on the shelf says, "I have entered a commercial enterprise and want to compete with others. I have a good product and you should choose my product over other similar products." Before publication, anything can happen. I might have the opportunity to convince you that since archaeological evidence shows no evidence of horses on the American continent before Columbus, you might want to drop the horses -- and the horseshoeing blacksmith -- from your story set in the Book of Mormon. Once you put that book in print, I no longer have the opportunity to influence you or your manuscript's content. You have convinced a bunch of people that you have a worthwhile product. The editor believed in your product. The marketing department believed in your product. The bookstore believed in your product. In the store, your book probably sits within ten feet of some masterpiece of literature. Maybe Shakespeare, Milton, Dickens, Joyce, or Hemingway. To me, you should not only judge a work based on its own content, but also against the content of books in similar genres and against the entire tradition of Western literature. If you write a stream of consciousness novel, you have to accept that people will compare your novel to James Joyce's works. If you write a fantasy, someone will compare your work to Tolkien's. If you have a book on the shelf. You have not only jumped into and tested the waters, but you have swum across the channel and started to make your way up the opposite bank. The ink sits in your book, and you can't take any of it back. I feel duty bound to tell your potential audience just what they will encounter if they choose to invest in your product. I still try to put my opinions in as nice a way as possible -- you never know when the author will read your review. After venting my unsolicited opinion, I realized that Kathy might have only meant that she wants some leeway for comments made here on the list. I say, well of course. I really appreciate the way this list considers the content of my posts. In spite of modern spell-checking technologies, I cannot seem to post without making some sort of typographic or grammatical boo boo. How kind of you all to take my meaning and not try to disarm my argument by pointing out the flaws of the arguer's typing skills. So after all that, I invite one an all into the water, where the temperature swings from hot to cold and back again, but at some point, you'll feel really comfortable. - -- Terry Jeffress | If a book is not worth re-reading, it is | not worth reading. -- Samuel Johnson AML Webmaster and | AML-List Review Archivist | - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 16:53:28 -0700 From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Fluff At 02:31 PM 11/9/01, you wrote: >Some other terms that are synonymous with banal are: bromidic, clich=E9d,= =20 >commonplace, corny, hackneyed, musty, overused, overworked, platitudinal,= =20 >platitudinous, shopworn, stale, stereotyped, stereotypic, stereotypical,=20 >threadbare, timeworn, tired, trite, warmed-over, well-worn, worn-out. > >If we say this: the master's hand ditty is cliched or hackneyed, or trite?= =20 >Does that change the nature of our responses? Interesting that you define the term thus. That isn't what I thought we=20 were talking about at all. But one thought occurred to me when I looked at= =20 your list of terms. The first guy who said someone was "mad as a wet hen"=20 said something quite clever. I mean, have you ever seen a wet hen? The=20 thing fluffs and squawks and prances and becomes the figure of outrage. Now= =20 that the metaphor is dead and no longer calls up this image, it's trite,=20 cliched, and so on. Could it be that the overuse that reduced the simile to= =20 meaninglessness was actually a compliment to the aptness of the phrase? >barbara hume, accused by academics of not being profound but enjoying life= =20 >to the max anyway - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #515 ******************************