From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #760 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Wednesday, July 3 2002 Volume 01 : Number 760 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 10:19:49 -0700 From: "jana" Subject: [AML] Selected AML-List Reviewers Here are the reviewers for the 6/15 list of available books. If you were selected, please send me your smail mail address. There are still titles available, so if you'd like to review a book, please drop me a line. Thank you, Jana Remy AML-List Review Editor mailto:jana@enivri.com - ------------------- > The Hero > By Ron Woods Sharlee Glenn > > A Disciple's Life: The Biography of Neal A. Maxwell > By Bruce Hafen Ryan Orrock > > The Day Alma Died > By B.V. Cheyenne Andrew Hall > > Nauvoo: A Place of Peace, A People of Promise > By Glen Leonard Randall Larsen > > A Thousand Souls > By Lee Nelson Jeff Needle > > Ghosts of the Oquirrhs > By Marilyn Brown Cathy Wilson > > Fields of Clover > By Marilyn Arnold Kim Madsen > - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 14:52:08 -0600 From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Satan Figures Scott said (with snips): In my version of Lucifer's paradise there would actually be plenty of pretty much everything . . . The end result being that people simply have no need to adapt, no need to change. . . . Keep people in paradise, and they're unmotivated to do much of anything--either good or evil. They never actually leave the starting line. Sounds good at first, but I see a problem with it. From what we know, it looks like Lucifer didn't really "get" the plan at all. If he had, he wouldn't have bothered to tempt Adam and Eve, and instead would have let them sit in the garden forever, much like Scott is proposing Lucifer would have wanted us to. *That* would have messed up the plan. But somehow he thought that getting rid of their garden paradise would fit into his own purposes. I tend to side with D. Michael and others who believe that the force concept was real, for many of the reasons already posted. Annette Lyon - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 15:48:10 -0500 From: "Preston" Subject: [AML] Box Office Report June 28 Feature Films by LDS/Mormon Filmmakers and Actors Weekend Box Office Report (U.S. Domestic Box Office Gross) Weekend of June 28, 2002 Report compiled by: LDSFilm.com [If table below doesn't line up properly, try looking at them with a mono-spaced font, such as Courier - - Ed.] Natl Film Title Weekend Gross Rank LDS/Mormon Filmmaker/Actor Total Gross Theaters Days - --- ----------------------------- ----------- ----- ---- 2 Minority Report 21,590,412 3,001 10 Gerald Molen (producer) 73,424,800 8 The Divine Secrets of the 4,051,483 2,167 24 Ya-Ya Sisterhood 55,388,642 34 The New Guy 115,103 136 52 Eliza Dushku (lead actress) 28,972,187 36 ESPN's Ultimate X 94,655 38 52 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 2,783,978 43 Murder by Numbers 36,208 103 73 Ryan Gosling (lead male actor) 31,874,869 47 Cirque du Soleil: Journey of Man 17,102 7 787 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 13,442,928 62 The Other Side of Heaven 8,311 12 199 Mitch Davis (writer/director) 4,602,102 John H. Groberg (author/character) Gerald Molen, John Garbett (producers) 79 The Singles Ward 4,326 5 150 Kurt Hale (writer/director) 803,286 John E. Moyer (writer) Dave Hunter (producer) Cody Hale (composer) Ryan Little (cinematographer) Actors: Will Swenson, Connie Young, Daryn Tufts, Kirby Heyborne, Michael Birkeland, Robert Swenson, Wally Joyner, Lincoln Hoppe, Gretchen Whalley, Sedra Santos, etc. 98 Mark Twain's America 3D 121 1 1459 Alan Williams (composer) 2,235,063 It's kind of fun to watch "Minority Report" and "Lilo & Stitch" jockey it out for position, as the numbers are so consistently equal between them. "Lilo & Stitch" tends to gross more during the week when entertainment for children home from school for the summer is at a premium. However, on the weekends, "Minority Report" performs better and came in at the number 2 spot, behind the new release "Mr. Deeds". Just for the record, the 2-week ticket gross for "Minority Report" brings Latter-day Saint producer Jerry Molen's career total U.S. box office gross to over $1,745 billion. We have nothing to say about "Mr. Deeds," but Adam Sandler's NEXT feature film will be of some interest to this column. Sandler's nemesis in that film, titled "Punch-Drunk Love" (Fall 2002 release), is a quartet of four Latter-day Saint brothers from Utah -- played by the Stevens brothers (who actually are Latter-day Saint brothers from Utah). ON TELEVISION: On Wednesday, June 15th, Latter-day Saint filmmaker Tasha Oldham's critically acclaimed documentary "The Smith Family" premiered nationwide as the season's first episode of the PBS series "POV." On Sunday, June 30th, the already-taped Pearl Awards was broadcast on television in Utah. AUDITIONS: Open auditions for Tucker T. Dansie's latest short film "Quarters & Rocks" will be held on Saturday, 13 July 2002, 1:00-5:00 PM in Salt Lake City. More information here: http://www.tuckertdansie.com/auditions Latter-day Saint filmmaker Mark Potter has announced his production company's first feature film, "Suddenly Unexpected," a comedy about missionaries. Filming will take place in Houston, Texas in October 2002, for an expected 2003 theatrical release. Open auditions will be held in Houston, Texas on August 3, 2002 from 9 am to 1 pm at 10200 Autumn Meadow and in Provo, Utah on August 5, 2002 from 1pm to 6pm at the Holiday Inn Provo, 1460 S. University Ave. This will be a non-SAG production. SINGLES WARD: "The Singles Ward" will soon be appearing in theaters in Nevada, California, and other locations. The comedy, which cost about $425,000 to make, has already grossed over $803,000 at the box office, having played in Utah, Idaho, Hawaii and Arizona. "The Singles Ward" is scheduled for DVD/video release in November. The DVD will feature a hilarious audio commentary track on which Kurt Hale, the director promised to point out the movie's flaws. (Flaws? What flaws??) THE R.M.: As of this writing, casting is nearly complete for Kurt Hale and Dave Hunter's follow-up film "The R.M." (which is NOT a sequel). The lead actor will be Kirby Heyborne, one of the supporting actors in "The Singles Ward" (he is the roommate who received his mission call to Idaho). The lead actress is a talented newcomer who makes her feature film debut with "The R.M." The Job-like story will feature cameo appearances by Utah Jazz owner (and movie theater mogul) Larry H. Miller and Utah senator Orrin Hatch. THE WORK AND THE STORY: Nathan Smith Jones is now in Utah finishing work on the hilarious mockumentary "The Work and the Story," which tells the mostly fictitious tale of four young Latter-day Saints racing to become the first to make the world's first Great LDS Feature Film. Richard Dutcher stars, along with writer/director Nathan Smith Jones and California-based Latter-day Saint actors Jen Hoskins and Eric Smith. The director points out that although the characters are Latter-day Saints, the humor of the movie will be appreciated by anybody. The film skewers Hollywood and filmmaking, and anybody with some familiarity with movie-making (that includes pretty much EVERYBODY in our media-drenched society) will understand and enjoy "The Work and the Story." VUISSA: Hot off the success of his award-winning short film "Roots & Wings" (which will soon be available on video), Christian Vuissa begins filming this week on his next, and final, student film as a BYU student. Titled "Unfolding", the film is a drama about a young woman coming to terms with the past. The musical score consists of Rachmaninoff music arranged by Latter-day Saint composer (and ldsfilm.com co-webmaster) Thomas C. Baggaley, performed by 4 cellos. LITTLE SECRETS: BYU graduate Blair Treu's feature film "Little Secrets" opens nationwide in just about two weeks. Distributed by Columbia TriStar, the movie is a family-friendly film about young people. "Little Secrets" stars young actors who are prominent from national TV series and movies: Evan Rachel Wood, Michael Angarano, David Gallagher and Vivica A. Fox. The supporting actors are Latter-day Saint/Utah actors, including: Jan Gardner, Rick Macy, Paul Kiernan, Tayva Patch, Micah Schow, Caitlin E.J. Meyer and Danielle Chuchran. The director of photography is Latter-day Saint cinematographer Brian Sullivan, and the composer is Sam Cardon ("Brigham City", "Mysteries of Egypt"). Jerry Stayner ("The Testaments of One Fold and One Shepherd") is the editor. ALSO OPENING IN AUGUST: Neil LaBute's long-awaited book adaptation "Possession", starring LaBute's fellow BYU graduate Aaron Eckhart; Kels Goodman's historical epic "Handcart," a romantic drama set amidst the Martin Handcart Company pioneer trek; Joseph Osborn's "No Dogs Allowed" starring Dalin Christiansen and a slew of other Utah/LDS actors; and "Serving Sara," starring non-LDS actors Matthew Perry and Elizabeth Hurley, with Latter-day Saint actress Alaina Kalanj in a small role. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 15:16:54 -0600 From: "Clark Goble" Subject: RE: [AML] Satan Figures ___ Jim ___ | This derives from the fact that I don't believe in the | existence of force at all--and I believe freedom or agency | is the foundation of the whole universe. From that | context the only way to destroy agency is to make human | life "outcome-based education." No matter what you do you | pass. Every soul of us. ___ Well that "freedom is the foundation of the universe" certainly has a long respectable history in Mormon thought. I think it probably was most clearly presented by the Pratt brothers in what I think was basically a Stoic notion of matters and spirits. (Some people, like Blake Ostler, think I ride the Stoic horse far too much though - so I should add that as a caveat) Anyway even if freedom is the ultimate foundation you still can only choose based upon what is presented to you. Basically your freedom consists of accepting or rejecting a presentation. Given that all you need for a more traditional notion of Satan is that he limit what is presented to you. So I think that what you describe and the view you oppose it to are actually quite similar. The bigger question is whether he could have passed all of us. As many people have pointed out about our education systems, merely passing kids doesn't mean they know how to read. Likewise passing people in the divine test doesn't give them a divine nature. So I'm not sure this really resolves my problem with Satan. However. . . ___ Jim ___ | Strangely enough 2/3 of the class voted to stay in a normal | school and 1/3 voted for Wild & Crazy HS. One girl wanted | to got to Force HS, and considering what a "Molly Mormon" | she was it was astonishing that she didn't understand the | gag. ____ This is interesting and does possibly suggest a little. However if we are the 2/3 that had the view we don't want to "just pass us" then why would we pick it when the choice was presented again? I should add that I sympathize with the girl who wanted the "force HS." I think that if it is freely chosen there is nothing wrong with a school that forces you to reach your limits. Indeed I've consciously chosen situations for that myself. I guess it depends upon what you want. If you want to progress that being forced to do things you'd prefer not is often helpful. I don't think it really equates to Satan's plan though. Further the very fact that we portray there being a kind of "vote" on Satan's plan is interesting. We have these two mythic views. One is a more traditional war in heaven that I think partakes a bit of traditional Catholic and Jewish angeology. Satan leads a rebellion of some sort to try and take over heaven. The other view is that it was more a war of words and persuasion. I think something like the former is more necessary to seeing Satan cast down the way he is. However even then you have the interesting question of, "how could Satan think he could win a war with God?" There have been interesting stories along these lines. I remember one by Steven Brust called _To Reign in Hell_. And of course the all time classic is Milton, although I don't find his portrayal of "big fish in a small pond" thinking for Satan very persuasive. It seems like the Mormon view of Satan has all sorts of subtle issues that just don't make sense. All of these would be great fodder for an author. Of course a more allegorical use might be a bit more theologically palpable. As I think I said earlier in this thread, I was somewhat disappointed in the Alvin Maker series that Card had such an unbelievable Satan figure. Indeed the Satan figure is but one step removed from a more "platonic essence" and God in his Alvin Maker series never seemed very Mormon either. ___ Jim ___ | My own "devil" has plenty of shades of the real one, but | in large part he's based on an Etruscan myth in terms of his | powers, etc. Then I cursed him into an inanimate object and | he can only influence through lies, having no power without | a wielder, which gives the wielder has power of him, which he | cannot long abide. ___ Which Etruscan myth is that? One of the Faustus like legends ala the tale of Verbio? I have to admit that I always like the stories of devils that arise through mistaken identity as well. That doesn't fit the Mormon stories but does add a cautionary tale. For instance there is a tale I just found about a someone asking some Gypsies who their creator was. They cry out "duvel" which I gather is from the same root as dues and simply meant God in their language. But of course it sounds like the English "devil" and the poor gypsies got yet more bad press. Apparently this thing goes on quite a bit. And let us not forget the various more pagan beliefs whose thought-systems just didn't even line up with Christianity which were interpreted as diabolical powers in light of Christianity. Perhaps I'm the only one. But I love these stories of how mixing of cultures leads to these interesting religious judgments. I'm enjoying reading various histories of the Renaissance where the influx of Roman and Greek ideas did this and led to renaissance magic and the like. You end up with these syncristic views that make no real sense and then get judged by the main body. Hermeticism which was a syncristic mix of Hellenistic philosophy and Egyptian religion was often attacked by Egyptian priests much as hermeticism was by Christian priests 1500 years later. One the most sensical vies of Satan I've read actually is the Gnostic one. Say what you will about gnosticism, but at least Satan made a little sense. He is almost a competing God who thinks that matter isn't all bad. The Satan figure there is a demiurge who creates all of the material world. Indeed, considering how much I like this world, I have to sympathize with him over the Gnostic true God who views matter as bad. I like the play that the film _The Matrix_ does on this in which the demiurge and idealistic god seem to switch roles in various ways. ___ Jim ___ | The thing about Old Scratch offering Jesus all the kingdoms of | the earth wasn't much of a temptation to Jesus. He knew that | Satan doesn't own them or control them. He just lies a lot | and makes people think he has power. ___ The thing is though that Jesus had the veil of forgetfulness just as we did. How much did he know and when did he know it? But you're right, the tempting of Jesus is kind of interesting in its own. Makes you think that if Satan knew what had been done on other planets that the best thing to do was to try and keep Jesus ignorant and happy and make sure Pilot let him go. So Satan's motivations during Christ's mortality don't make much sense to me either. That's what is so interesting about Satan as a literary figure. As with most conspiracy theories, Satan has to be both incredibly smart and well informed while simultaneously stupid and ignorant. That's why I think Satan figures are so hard to pull off for the modern mind. In most literature Satan is just a literary necessity. He's whatever is necessary for the hero to take the next step in his journey. Satan seems always defined in terms of the story of the hero. He's never given any kind of consistent motivation. It's the same with conspiracies and satan figures in literature in general. The bad guys just don't make any sense. They exist purely to allow the hero to move to the next scene. This is somewhat unfortunate since there is so much real evil in the world. Further that evil has lots of interesting stories. Instead we want the "archetypal" "easy" evil that is somehow unbelievable when examined closely. As I mentioned this is why of late "evil" has become "irrational." Madness is the modern form of evil. Of course there is precedence for that - that was pretty much the Stoic view. - -- Clark Goble --- clark@lextek.com ----------------------------- - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #760 ******************************