From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #787 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Tuesday, July 30 2002 Volume 01 : Number 787 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:47:47 -0600 From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Letters: Mid-Year Observations I am going through e-mail in a total of 5 minutes. To the Tyners--I forwarded your sweet message to Darius. Thank you so much. I wish I had time to respond to so many interesting threads (I have saved several to look at more closely later--including Scott Parkin's really interesting response to institutional repentence), but honestly, all my energy is devoted to my grand-daughter at the moment. But I AM a grand-mother, so age is becoming less and less a factor in distinguishing me from Marilyn Brown. I think if I lost some weight and Marilyn dyed her hair red, we'd be identical. Let's do it, Marilyn!! Brown wrote: > Hi. Just happened to be "lurking" and sorry, Margaret, (although of great > benefit to me) Andrew got us "twins" mixed up again! It is Marilyn Brown, > who is indeed "sixty-something going on sixty") (actually more) (And now > feeling it, actually) to quote the brilliant Alan R. Mitchell and she has > not been on the list for several months trying to catch up with MANY things > (including lots of theatre problems left us by a board walk). And yes, my > GHOSTS OF THE OQUIRRHS is out now from Salt Press/Cedar Fort--and here's > hoping somebody will read it. Nice to see the regulars still posting! > Sincerely, Marilyn Brown - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:54:51 -0600 From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Utopias > The difference is that the Church welfare program works. Have you ever actually had to accept Church welfare? I have and I don't mind admitting that, should the need ever arise again, I would much prefer selling my organs on the black market than to ever so humiliate myself and my family by accepting assistance from the Church. Getting the goods (food, etc.) to the needy (us) worked flawlessly. That wasn't the problem. It was the judging from other members (including the Bishop) that was the humiliating part. It was the RS President going through our garbage to make sure we weren't spending the money on Big Gulp's that was the humiliating part. It was the other kids in the ward calling my children "poor" that was the humiliating part. Give me state welfare anytime. Thom - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 18:59:06 EDT From: DiannRead@aol.com Subject: [AML] Harry Potter Question I suspect this may have been discussed some time ago, before I joined the List, so I request your forgiveness if it was over-worked at the time. An LDS guy I work with informed me today that in her efforts to be authentic, J.K. Rowling "used the actual runes used by Wiccans" for the spells the characters learn and use in the stories. That was news to me--though it won't stop me from enjoying and recommending them. Can any of you confirm that, and if it's true, what's the source of that information? Diann Read San Antonio, TX - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 17:14:43 -0600 From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: Re: [AML] "Choose the Rock" > Music is not neutral. As I understand your examples, you seem to be saying precisely the opposite. You site "Your Song" and it made you and your husband feel.. Would you have necessarily felt that way about that song if you didn't have good memories associated with it? My ex-wife's and my song was "We've Only Just Begun." Since she left me a year ago, I can't listen to it now without getting all choked up and wanting. It is now my least favorite song but a year ago I loved it. What has changed in the meantime? My marriage. IOW, the song was neutral. The only emotion attached to it what I had attached to it. I believe all music is exactly like this: completely, utterly without emotion, sentiment, or meaning except for what we as listeners impose on it. Thom - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 16:49:02 -0700 From: The Laird Jim Subject: Re: [AML] English Departments Etc. on 7/25/02 8:30 PM, Clark Goble at clark@lextek.com wrote: > I don't see why the *use* of postmodernism matter. Why is "politicized > postmodernism" worse than "politicized modernism." There's nothing > inherently wrong with politics nor pushing an agenda. The authors (which I > did read) simply tried to make it seem like there was. However the issue > isn't politicalization but shoddy thinking. If we keep the focus on the > quality of thinking I think the issue goes away. > Politicized postmodernism is worse not because it is postmodernist but because it coopts postmodernist thought and argument into a deceitfully leftist political approach. I know a man who spent 8 years in a GULAG and even though he had a pretty easy time of it he witnessed some awful suffering and wholesale murder of many thousands of people (He wrote a book, too, _Dear America_ but it ain't Mormon Letters because he's still an evangelical--stubborn one, too). He was in the Communist youth movement in the 1930s when they decided to infiltrate religion and schools to bring about their desired change. They realized that they were getting nowhere by operating openly. Postmodernist jargon is a ready way to hide this sort of agenda, because as Sokol's hoax proved the jargon can be laughable and still be taken very seriously. One of my profs a few years back was teaching the whole deconstruction thing but approvingly deconstructed everything to a literally fascist point view (minus the overt racism). When I pointed this out it almost started a fight--he didn't want to be a fascist, though he was. Got unofficially withdrawn from that class suddenly one morning. My greatest criticism of postmodernism and philosophy both is the jargon. It's more offensive in an English department, however, because one would expect English criticism to be written in English. Philosophy comes from all over, so it has a bit more leeway, but is still way too full of jargon. Jim Wilson aka The Laird Jim - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 18:25:53 -0700 From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _Ghosts of the Oquirrhs_ (Review) Oops! My mistake -- sorry. And thanks for the nice thoughts. I once thought that one day I'd be a genius. I have now settled into the comfort of being mildly functional. *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 7/26/2002 at 8:47 AM Brown wrote: >In reply to Jeff Needle's astute review of GHOSTS OF THE OQUIRRHS. > >What can I say? I think Jeff Needle is a genius. My sincere wish for all >Listers is that they would write their own novel and that Jeff Needle would >write a review of it. This is the second one that blows me away. (Just one >teeny correction--replace Camp Floyd with Mercur) Thanks, Jeff! Sincerely, >Marilyn (AKA Margaret) Brown - ----------------------- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 20:38:23 -0700 From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] Millennial Economics D. Michael Martindale disagreed with my statement, namely, > "Richard R. Hopkins" wrote: > > > 6. The law of tithing was given to the Church to replace the United Order. > > There is some scriptural indication that a tithe (10%) represents the > > average amount that we would give back to the community (the excess over our > > needs) if we were in the United Order. He wrote: > The law of tithing has been an eternal principle from the beginning. The > United Order was an economic experiment Brigham Young performed, and in > each city it looked different. The experiment also failed. Tithing, in > fact, was still paid during the time of the United Order, but it was > paid by the various orders. Richard responds: The law of tithing is, of course, an eternal principle, but the United Order was much more than an economic experiment performed by Brigham Young. Check D&C 104. For more about my statement, check D&C 119, and the historical setting of that revelation. About stewardship, I never mentioned the most important aspect about that form of ownership. Stewardship involves a recognition that the earth is the Lord's (and the fullness thereof...that is, the increase). Thus, God owns the earth. All lands and holdings on this planet are really His property. We are merely stewards of that property. That is the economic principle that underlies the United Order and the law of consecration and stewardship. Richard Hopkins - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:37:13 -0500 From: lajackson@juno.com Subject: [AML] Re: "Choose the Rock" John Williams : On the one hand, Eric is right. There is absolutely nothing inherently evil about "music" one way or the other. Drums are drums, harps are harps, and an E minor chord is pretty much the same whether it's played by a drugged up psycho killer or your Aunt Nelly--it's all just sound in the air. _______________ This is correct. By definition, an E minor chord is a certain set of notes at a certain frequency. However, I suspect I could use that innocent little E minor chord in such a way that it would knock your socks off and set your pacemaker back two or three strokes. It wouldn't be the E minor chord's fault. It would be the setting in which I placed it--how I used it--that would make the difference. This is also true with words. Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 23:52:37 -0600 From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Utopias Someone said: >Again, I like the >church's methods of handling poverty and ignorance because however >flawed the decision-makers involved are, they're at least personal, >available, and start from a position of intimate knowledge of the real >situation. Whoever said that may know what they are talking about. They may have knowlege, observation and experience to back it all up. But from my experience that has nothing to do with the truth. The government is ten thousand times more responsive, caring and helpful than the Church. I first asked for help from the government--I think it was after I dropped out of BYU. They asked for medical records, had doctors examine me and had councilors interview me. They (the State government) agreed to pay my tuition and rent while I went to school. After school they (the Federal government) paid me a very small monthly allowance. When I went to a state run mental health clinic they took me without question. I was given medication at very low cost. And given a place to just hang out. The monthly allowance continued for several years after I was married. When my wife graduated and found a good job it ended. When I started at massage school the state government paid my transportation costs. They were also willing to hire readers to help me and paid for a special tape recorder and paid for a membership in special library that puts textbooks on tape for blind and dyslexic students. With their help it has been a huge struggle, but without their help life would have been impossible. I first asked the Church for help about the same time--I can't remember very well. I was having these horribly painful and terrifying flashbacks--I didn't know what was going on with me. All I was really sure of was I was going to die because I couldn't live anymore. I had seen too much and now I was seeing it again and again and again. It was too much. The first time I remember quite well. I went to the Bishop and explained what was happening and made specific requests--I asked for blood tests and psychological help. He said, "No, we can't do that." I asked for help with the same problems several more times over the next few years and was always told the same thing. I also remember the last time quite well. It was a few months before I went to the Timpanogis Mental Health Center. I went directly to LDS Social Services, explained the best I could (my condition had deteriorated and I was wasn't terribly coherant--sometime I get that way now) and asked for help. Same thing--can't do that. To be fair I probably didn't make a very good impression. I had been living on the road for a while and probably smelled of cigarettes. A few years later after I married, my wife was a full-time student and we ran out of money and food. I went to the Bishop--Annette Lyon's dad-- and he had boxes of groceries at my house that night. (I still get tearful about that.) So I'm thinking if we're considering Utopia it will probably look a lot more like the government than the Church. I don't want to give the impression that the Church is wholly negligent. That World Trade Center thing has been hard on me. Too many facets of it were like what I went through in Argentina for three years. There was too much blood to remember. You can't understand, but need to understand, but are too afraid to understand--so you just want to hide and cry. But there's no where to hide. So you just continue along, looking neither to the left nor to the right. Keep your eyes down--and for God's sake--don't stand out. Don't even wonder who will be next--or where. And don't wonder--what--could be next. So the World Trade Center thing has been hard on me. Sometimes I've crumbled and sometimes I've lashed out. I've made a few enemies. I've been a jerk. So I've made a lot of waves and some of them have been really big, and now the Bishop is sending me to a psychologist. My first visit was last week. It's not what I would ask for, but maybe it's what I need. The part that most curious to me--we're talking Church and government--is that all along the way there have been individuals who have helped out. A girlfriend paid so I could get a note from my doctor so I could get into Timp Mental Health. Friends have helped me work out some problems. Right now I'm reading a book that someone one this list gave me--it's helping a whole lot. Maybe it's individuals helping each other out that will be the power in Utopia. Paris Anderson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 00:08:01 -0600 From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: [AML] Re: Unsavory Etymologies (was: "Choose the Rock") >>> bmdblu2@attbi.com 07/25/02 03:37PM >>> > >Not too many people know that this word is derived from a perfectly innocent >acronym that became a word simply because it was easier to say it than say >the letters of the notation on the London police blotter that went along >with the offense of - For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge. First they began >writing in the logs- F._._._. then they began pronouncing it like it >sounds, then people began using it to denote the act of soliciting or >procuring the services of prostitutes. Urban legend. The first acronym is believed to be Seroco, which was an alternative name for Sears Roebuck Company. In any case, there are no acronyms recorded before the late 1800's, and few before World War I. The F-word came to English before the 15th century, and possibly as early as the 13th, from another Germanic language (a Middle Dutch word is sometimes cited as the ancestor of the English word). MBA - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 00:22:31 -0600 From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Utopias >>> dmichael@wwno.com 07/25/02 01:11AM >>> > >What scarcity is that? I live in the most successful capitalist society >ever, and I find very little scarcity when I go shopping. Sure, there >are lots of things I can't afford the instant I get it in my head that I >want it, but the item is not scarce--it's there at the store waiting for >me to figure out how to get the funds to purchase it. > >Those societies that are truly suffering under scarcity are also those >that have eschewed the capitalist system. When economists talk about "scarcity" they're not saying a good is rare or hard to find. Scarcity just means that there is more demand for a good than there is supply. The fact that the goods are in a store with a price tag on them proves that they are scarce. To an economist, corn is scarce in Nebraska, and coal is scarce in Newcastle. MBA - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 08:17:35 -0500 From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Re: Unsavory Etymologies (was: "Choose the Rock") Bill Willson wrote: >Not too many people know that this word is derived from a perfectly innocent >acronym that became a word simply because it was easier to say it than say >the letters of the notation on the London police blotter that went along >with the offense of - For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge. [snip] Actually, this seems to fall into the category of folk etymologies that have no basis in fact. Use of this word dates back at least to the 15th century, according to my dictionary (and may date back a lot further than that--such words often don't make it into written sources nearly as early as they are used in spoken language), and the word appears to have links to Dutch and Swedish. My high school Latin teacher (who was also my mother) once told me that this word was a cognate (cousin) with the English word "pugnacious" (and "pugilist") that is formed from Latin roots. As I recall, the theory is that sounds that descended as "p" in Latin often came down as "f" in Germanic languages (see, for examples, "fish" vs. "piscis"). Similarly for "g" in Latin versus "k" in Germanic. And so the "pug" part of the Latin word "pugnare," meaning "to fight," would come down in Germanic as... But I find no mention of this in my dictionaries (my edition of the Oxford English Dictionary is too early to include the word in question), and so this may simply be another folk etymology. All of which does nothing to invalidate Bill's larger point about the arbitrariness of language... Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not AML-List jlangfor@pressenter.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 11:25:38 -0600 From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] Final Call for Papers - AML at RMMLA in Arizona this Oct The Association for Mormon Letters is sponsoring a session at the October 10-12 meeting of the Rocky Mountain Modern Language Association in Scottsdale, Arizona (See details about the convention at http://rmmla.wsu.edu/callForPapers/call02.asp) Please send proposals to read a paper of 15-20 minutes length to Gideon Burton, who is chairing the session, by AUGUST 3, 2002. All topics relating to Mormon literature will be considered. This is a great opportunity to have Mormon writing discussed in an academic literary forum. Email Gideon directly with your proposal: Gideon_Burton@byu.edu - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 17:20:59 -0600 From: "Clark Goble" Subject: RE: [AML] Postmodernism (was: English Departments Etc.) ___ William ___ | This quote from the essay captures my experience with | postmodernism in the academy: "Some Latter-day Saint and | other religious thinkers find postmodernism helpful | because it helps them identify cultural and intellectual | elements that we have taken for granted because we live | in a world that is very much a creation of modernism, | itself one of the effects of the apostasy." | ___ Colin ___ | Please--I would very much like to get you started on this. ___ Some have argued that when Heidegger deconstructed Plato and tried to return in some ways to the pre-Socratics that he was actually "recreating" a kind of Hebrew approach to the world. I personally think that is pushing it a bit, although I'm not well enough versed on the arguments to say for sure. I know that Levinas, a rabbi and student of Heidegger, tried to reformulate the ideas he'd learned from Heidegger. (He was, as a Jew, deeply distraught by Heidegger's Nazism and apparent anti-semitism) I know Jim Faulconer has argued that the difference between Levinas and Heidegger isn't that pronounced. Thus Levinas misreads Heidegger and "corrects" it with Heidegger's own thought. (Albeit using very Jewish language and metaphors) I don't know how correct this is. However he did point out that the book that argues for Heidegger as a kind of Jewish critique of Hellenism is coming out in English this year. Unfortunately I can't recall the name off the top of my head. I know Caputo has argued similar things relative to Derrida, although Derrida denies having a "mystic Judaism" behind him. However quite a few people, like Umberto Eco, have noted the strong similarities between Derrida with the basic approach of Kabbalism. I think Derrida's response comes as a needed caveat for those emphasizing postmodernism as a return to a Hebrew view over a Hellenistic view. . . .at any rate, unfortunately or fortunately, as you like it, I am not mystical and there is nothing mystical in my work. In fact my work is a deconstruction of values which found mysticism, i.e. of presence, view, of the absence of a marque, of the unspeakable. If I say I am no mystic, particularly not a Jewish one as Habermas claims at one point, then I say that not to protect myself, but simply to state a fact. Not just that personally I am not mystical, but that I doubt whether anything I write has the least trace of mysticism. Insofar there are many misunderstandings not only between Habermas and me, but also between many German readers and me, as far as I can see. In part this is because German philosophers do not read my texts directly, but refer instead to secondary, often American interpretations. For instance if Habermas speaks of my judaistic mysticism he uses a book by Susan Handelman which in my view is certainly interesting, but very problematic regarding the claim that I be a lost son of Judaism. At any rate one never reads immediately. I know very well that one always reads from within certain schemes and mediations, so I do not demand that one read me - as if before my texts you could put yourselves into some kind of intuitive ecstasy - but I demand that one be careful with the mediations, more critical regarding the translations and the detours through contexts that very often are quite far away from mine. (1986 interview F. R=F6tzer conducted on German radio) Having said that though, there are many parallels. And I think that many of the critiques of Hellenism do point out what Mormons might consider effects of the apostasy. At the same time I think that while Hellenism (more particularly neoPlatonism and later Aristotileanism) may have enabled the apostasy, the bigger issue was simply a lack of revelation. When people felt the need to "fill in the blanks" in scripture it led to uninspired dogma. The dogma may have been Hellenistic in nature, but that wasn't the real problem. The problem was the "filling in the blanks." In think I think modern Mormonism is probably wise in how it avoids certain theologicizing tendencies. (As opposed to people like say Orson Pratt or perhaps even B.H. Roberts) At the same time we must read scriptures and when we read them to see what was "really meant" we often read them in terms of a culture that is largely the result of Hellenistic ideas which were foreign to the authors. Having said that though I think that Jewish mysticsm is pretty influenced by neoPlatonism too. So saying someone is "Jewish" doesn't imply that they aren't hellenized. - -- Clark Goble --- clark@lextek.com ----------------------------- - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 18:32:11 -0700 From: "Kim Madsen" Subject: [AML] Marilyn ARNOLD, _Fields of Clover_ (Review) REVIEW Title: Fields of Clover Author: Marilyn Arnold Publisher: Salt Press (imprint of Cedar Fort, Inc.) Year Published: 2002 Number of Pages: 282 Binding: Paperback ISBN: 1-55517-601-1 Price: $16.95 Reviewed by Kim Madsen FIELDS OF CLOVER sets forth its theme in a quote from the Apocrypha included just after the dedication page: "My child, help your father in his old age, And do not grieve him, as long as he lives. If his understanding fails, be considerate. And do not humiliate him, when you are in all your strength." It's a book that tackles some important and timely themes: caring for aging parents, and the ties that bind a family together past all understanding. But in the end it was a book that frustrated me as a reader. "Uneven" would be my one word synopsis. The book reminded me somewhat of Barbara Kingsolver's PRODIGAL SUMMER. It changed point of view in each chapter, moving from the 93 year old Oscar Carpenter and his equally elderly wife, Edith, to each of their three off-spring, as well as some minor characters. The POV shifts weren't confusing, but it was obvious that the author was more comfortable in some minds than others. Some of the characters were fully fleshed out and compelling. Others seemed like little more than plot devices to tie something of an LDS theme into the book. Marilyn Arnold is at her best when writing the rambling thought processes of senile Oscar Carpenter. Edith, his wife, is also brilliantly drawn. In fact, many of Edith's musings were "a-ha" moments for me, making me want to read them again just to savor them. For instance, when she's mentally deconstructing her house and all the items her daughter, Stella, will be forced to sort through and dispose of now that Oscar and Edith have been placed in an extended care facility, Edith thinks about some old army footlockers in the basement. "Edith knew what the lockers contained, even though it had been years since she had bothered to clear their lids and open them. Ghosts, she muttered silently. Like the house itself, those lockers are full of ghosts from a life that died before we did." Arnold has captured the poignant winding down of two lives and deftly uses that passage to reunite the three estranged Carpenter children--Everett, Stella, and Joshua. However, the book is weakest when we spend too much time in Stella's point of view. Stella is a character with definite quirks, but they remained unexplained. Why does she have such poor marriages? She doesn't take much care of her physical self, often described as frumpy through the eyes of other characters. We really want to like her, to empathize with her, but in the end, the information is too scarce to really understand her. We know she writes trashy novels, that she has a history of being late on her pot-boiler deadlines, that she can't keep a marriage together (but whether from poor choices in mates, or her own deficiencies we're never sure), that she keeps dogs. Stella seemed to me the plot-device the author uses to make unnecessary pronouncements that come across in a natural way in the story and don't need to be reiterated to the reader. "On the instant, Stella knew, as if Edith Carpenter had appeared in heavenly robes and said it, the meaning of her parents' long and difficult journey to final release." And then the author tells us what she just spent 279 pages showing us. Moments like that frustrated me and made me less accepting of Stella as a character--a dangerous thing, since most of the book is told through Stella's eyes. But there were many strong moments in the book, moments that made me think about my own responsibilities towards my parents and in-laws. Moments that helped me see beauty in a fully-lived life and clarified what is truly important. One of the best changes of heart in the book comes though the oldest brother, Everett Carpenter. A stuffed-shirt academic, a snob, a satirical critic; one is set to dislike Everett thoroughly. In the end, he was softened by the experience. I liked Everett by the end of the book. He was real. In contrast, my feelings toward Stella remained ambiguous at best. One small time-line issue bothered me throughout the book. Everett, Joshua and Stella are described as "middle aged". Their parents are in their early 90's. If the Carpenter children are in their late 40's and 50's, that means Edith Carpenter started having children in her late 40's and 50's. If the author considers 60's to be middle aged, the children don't ring true. Their concerns with jobs/children/spouses lead me to believe they are in their mid to late 40's, early 50's, but not their 60's. If so, they are the most emotionally stuck and immature 60-something's I've encountered. One would hope life would teach a person more by their sixth decade. Why doesn't the author make this clear? There was no explanation offered as to why the Carpenters married and had children later in life, if indeed that's the author's intent. As a reader, I long for books that create a dream that I don't wake easily from. The age issue was one thing that continually broke into "the dream" for me and made me aware of the author, forcing me to question, to skim back to see if I'd missed something. Another thing that struck me as strange in a book of LDS fiction was the lack of any LDS references. I'm not sure how I feel about it. At first, I was impressed, thinking "at last, a book that weaves the LDS mindset so subtly into the plot, you don't notice it." But by the end of the book, I realized this book only has one very minor LDS character in it, and I was left wondering why the author felt the need to include that. Religion is not a priority in the book, but it is subtly present in the background. I don't mind that--in fact, I cheer it, but I was left thinking "Hmmm. I guess this is not LDS fiction after all." Perhaps that was Marilyn Arnold's goal, to write a book with more "universal appeal". It seems to me that the publishing house and distribution channels of this book may not jive with that goal. Or is it a "western" book--as in the Wallace Stegner western tradition? The book IS set in rural areas of Colorado and Arizona. But the sense of place isn't tremendously important to the book either. It's a book about aging, a human condition that could have taken place anywhere, with any set of cultural beliefs. Maybe that was the author's point. All in all, I would recommend any middle-aged adult with aging parents read the book. I'll bet you're more kind, patient and caring of those parents as a result. What more could an author aspire to--to change the world for the better? - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 14:36:25 -0700 From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: [AML] Kerry Blair Query Friends, I got this from a friend of mine. I've never heard of this author. Does anyone here have information? Thanks! *********** BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE *********** I know you read LDS fiction, which I basically don't. Do you know an author, Kerry Blair? Her most recent one has a giant thumbprint on the cover, called "Closing In", I think. I joined an LDS women's online writing group (gotta do something with myself) out of curiosity. There are several published authors of books, articles, songs, but most of the emails still sound an awful lot like Homemaking meeting. Sigh. Anyway, if you have read her, I'd appreciate comment -- is she just the usual romance/suspense, or can she write? *********** END FORWARDED MESSAGE *********** - ----------------------- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 17:54:06 -0700 From: "Bill Willson" Subject: Re: [AML] Folklore in Our Religion Barbara Hume wrote: >snip > lake of fire and brimstone and the imps with the pitchforks. Maybe that's > why we didn't bother speculating. > > But this! Oh, my gosh! Families forever? What about mean old Great-Grampa > Fisher, who thought the right thing to do was to whale the tar out his > children to prove how godly he was? Plural wives, eh? Well, we'll just see > about that! Will there be libraries there, where we can read all the stuff > we didn't have time to read here? More do the point, will that information > actually stay in our celestial brains, rather than dribbling out like it > does here? Will we be resurrected fat? If we were when we died, that is. > Will the people who think they're the only ones who deserve to go to the > highest kingdom have their own space so they don't have to see the rest of > us? Will I mess up so bad that I will be condemned to that eternal servant > class, and have to endure an eternity of celibacy on top of the decades of > it I've had here? You call that heaven? >snip I have often been caught up in the -What ifs of eternity - and I'll say things like, "If there aren't any libraries - books - dogs - horses - there," Or, "If I can't design and build my own home there," or "if I can't write there," Or "if there aren't any computers and the Internet there, I'm not going!" Once I even said, "If I can't fish there, . . . " I have had quite a time trying to write a novel with spirit prison as one of the major settings, I'm not sure if I've even come close, but I've had a wonderful time speculating. I hope I'll not have to spend much time there, but I would like to see for myself, just how close my limited vision is. Finally I have reached the conclusion that regardless of what we think it will be like in the next life, and no matter how vivid or strong our speculations on what its organization or facilities will be like, we can be absolutely sure about one thing, and that is, even if we don't like it very much, it will be just, and perfect. Regards, Bill Willson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 10:09:21 -0600 From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Request for Prayers I am so sorry, Harlow. My heart goes out to your family. Please know that our prayers are with you. Sincerely, Bill and Marilyn Brown - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:02:44 -0600 From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] Unsavory Etymologies I consider myself fluent in obscene language. When I was younger (about 37) I took pride in being able to say S**t in several different languages (I'm still charmed by that ability). The origin F**k, as Robert Slaven surmised, is Middle German. It comes from the verb Fokkin, I'm not sure of the spelling, which means "to penetrate." Most words which are horrible and obscene have innocuous beginning, such as t**t, g*****j***v**m and sw****7**st. Paris Anderson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:05:40 -0600 From: margaret young Subject: [AML] Invitation to Genesis Thom's post about "We've Only Just Begun" and Harlow's about the tragedy his family is facing have left me really emotional. Thanks for sharing, both of you. Not much more to say. Such things leave us all speechless, don't they? On another note entirely, I thought some AML list members might want to attend the upcoming Genesis meeting. Many of you have expressed an interest in seeing what we do, and August presents a good opportunity. Sheri Dew will be our speaker. The meeting will be on August 4 (it's always on the first Sunday) at 7:00 p.m. at 6710 S. 1300 E. Midvale, Utah. Feel free to invite your friends--especially those who may have a need for what Genesis offers. I'm hoping we will have another accompanist rather than me, because I really am too white to do the music justice. If you know anyone who can play by ear, can play gospel, and would be willing to accept a Church calling which would require monthly attendance at choir practice and Genesis, PLEASE let me know or let Darius (Graytesla@aol.com) know. I feel so inadequate, and would love to turn the responsibility over to someone who can do the music justice. [Margaret Young] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:21:30 -0700 From: "Susan Malmrose" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Utopias > Give me state welfare anytime. Have you ever had to accept state welfare? :) I've had both, and I'd rather go with church assistance now, if the need were to arise again. Of course my experience with church assistance wasn't as horrible as yours. But the feeling of being able to pay it back, of being expected to pay it back, even if it was only via an increased fast offering when able, was a great salve to my pride/self worth. State welfare is not only degrading, but when I was on it, it encouraged you to stay on it, not get off. I think things have changed in the last 12 years, but back then it worked in such a way that if you made too much money, your benefits were cut or dropped, so there was never any way of getting ahead just a little. And as far as I know, the amounts of benefits they give (in WA state) is all based on living standards from the 1970's. I really hope that's different now. Susan M - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #787 ******************************