From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #882 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Monday, November 4 2002 Volume 01 : Number 882 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 20:46:27 -0700 From: "Lee Allred" Subject: re: [AML] Laurel Thatcher Ulrich and BELLESILES, _Arming America_ >>However some scholars (and some bloggers) could not confirm >>the existence of many sources Bellesiles cited. ...Such as the records he used that were destroyed in the 1906 San Francisco earthquake. :) An article that heavily quotes the findings of the Ulrich committee can be found at National Review Online. (http://www.nationalreview.com/seckora/seckora102802.asp) I'd be curious as to whether Ulrich's study of Mormon history played any part in her committee review work (particularly in light of Belliesiles' possible use of records from "a Mormon branch library"). Even a casual knowledge of early Mormon historical events would lend skepticism to Belliesiles' book: the Battle of Crooked River in Missouri (fought with firearms); the pistol given the Prophet in Carthage jail; and gunsmith Jonathan Browning (operated gun smith shops in Nauvoo and Odgen), called by Brigham Young to serve as basically a service missionary for a couple years or so in Winter Quarters manufacturing rifles for the companies of Saints headed to Zion. - --Lee Allred leea@sff.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:05:16 -0800 From: Yeechang Lee Subject: Re: [AML] Laurel Thatcher Ulrich and BELLESILES, _Arming America_ R.W. Rasband says: > Michael Bellesiles, professor of history at Emory University, has > resigned after having been accused of academic fraud. He wrote > "Arming America", a book which argued that there was no widespread > gun ownership in early America, contrary to conventional wisdom. [...] > A member of the committee is Laurel Thatcher Ulrich of Harvard > University, the noted Pulitzer-Prize winning LDS historian. As it happens, a small but crucial section of the committee's final public report discusses LDS genealogical libraries, materials available at them, and policies for their access. Dr. Bellesiles claimed so-and-so; as with many other aspects of his claims, the committee (and I daresay Sis. Ulrich brought an unusual level of insight here) found that it was not so. Yeechang, who saw a film version of _A Midwife's Tale: The Life of Martha Ballard_ during Richard Bushman's American Revolution class in college - -- Deep Thoughts @ PERTH ----> * 8:56pm up 22:01, 9 users, load average: 6.79, 6.50, 5.74 183 processes: 165 sleeping, 7 running, 11 zombie, 0 stopped CPU states: 11.9% user, 5.3% system, 28.5% nice, 0.1% idle - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:07:14 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Book of Mormon Movie Casting Call JLTyner wrote: > > Actually, the thing I notice about these casting calls seems to be: > NO SAG ACTORS WILL BE ACCEPTED! > > Why? Because they have to be paid more? And for all you folks > on the list who are big supporters of organized labor-What say you? That's the part of the call that I understood. When dealing with union cast or crew, you've got a myriad of restrictions and costs that are unnecessary. Unions provided a crucial service to workers in history, but for the most part, they've outlived their usefulness and have become a drain on society. There are exceptions (e.g., writers are still in desperate need of the power they have through a united front), but they are exceptions in our modern society. For big Hollywood studios who are dealing with zillion-dollar budgets, the union rules are fine--they make sure the money gets spread arouond better, and those studios can afford it. But for the small, independent producers, union rules inflate the cost of productions that can't afford cost inflation and provide no useful service in return. > I understand the need to save some bucks, but I'm curious-All > you folks that are involved in casting-be it for plays for or by > LDS people or in the emerging cinema end of Mormon Letters- > Is it standard practice not to cast SAG members, and if so, why? > Strictly financial? Or are there other components to such a policy? Well, I gave my reasons, and they are primarily economical. It would be my standard practice to avoid unions like the plag were I producing films right now. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:23:48 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Getting Started with LDS Screenwriting Linda Adams wrote: > the format of screenwriting baffles > me. What are the basic differences between a screen script and a dramatic > script (which I understand how to do)? What do all those puzzling > abbreviations mean? (I've learned a few: CU is close-up, INT is interior, > EXT is exterior.) How important are the physical descriptions, camera > angles, close-ups, long shots, music in the background, and where is all > that supposed to go in relation to the dialogue? Is it my job to come up > with all that, or the director's? You're describing a shooting script. You don't write a shooting script the first time around. You write a "try-to-get-someone-to-buy-me" script. These scripts don't have any camera instructions and only enough other information to get the point across. You're right--the director WILL work out the details, and only be annoyed if you try to tell him his job. What your spec script should do it make the story as exciting as possible, just like you would with a novel. You write your scene descriptions to make them readable and evoke the images you want your potential buyer to see while reading. Then you just write dialog, with barebones instructions on how to say things or what to be doing while saying them (actors get just as annoyed if you tell them how to do their job). So Richard is mostly right: just write from your gut. There is a standard format to write in, but it's pretty simple for that first version of the script that you want to shop around. Learn it, then write from your gut. > --Might be an incredibly boring scene there, but is that *what* you do? Is > that enough? Or do I have to add: Trash on all the tables. Noisy. All but > one table is clean and empty. Two registers are empty. Employees standing > around doing nothing to move the line along. One employee obviously slow. > Yada yada ya. I'd think all that is included by just saying, "McDonald's. > Lunchtime." And the director can come up with those details that add to his > interpretation of my script. Do as much as you need to paint an intriguing picture, and no more. That description may actually be a good thing. When you write the script, your goal is to SELL, not to make the movie. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 09:00:39 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Lee Benson on _Charly_ Melanie Dahlin wrote: > > Today, many psychologists see Freud's ideas as > "half-baked"; however, he set the foundation for others to build upon. That is > why Freud is the father of psychology. Not necessarily because his ideas and > style are accepted, but because he paved the dirt road. I believe Weyland, and > others like him, have done the same. Let's give them credit for their efforts. This is the same argument people give me for why I should love Microsoft and Windows. The computer industry needed standardization, and Windows did it. Yes, the computer industry needed standardization, but it could have standardized on anything--Windows was hardly necessary to accomplish that. There were much better products out there, but they weren't being promoted by a ruthless, legality-bending sociopath. The computer industry didn't standardize on the best operating system. It standardized on the operating system that would make Bill Gates rich, because he cheated to get it there. And we've all been suffering for it ever since. Someone needed to break the "Mormons won't buy LDS novels" mindset. It didn't need to be Jack Weyland. It could have been anybody. Jack Weyland happened to be the one who did. Now let's not push the analogy too far (remember the "Bridge" thread)--I'm not claiming Weyland is a ruthless, legality-bending sociopath. But what good did it do to create the LDS novel market with writing that was mediocre at best, which level of quality has been perpetuated to this day with only recent signs of recovery from that trend, and driving away many people who otherwise might have enjoyed LDS literature, creating a self-fulfilling mindset that Mormons only want certain types of novels, and making it orders of magnitude more difficult to write good literature and get it published? Why couldn't someone who could write blaze that trail? That question is two-edged. Why indeed couldn't someone else do it? Because no one else tried. Jack Weyland didn't do LDS literature any good, in my opinion, but he nonetheless earned the right to blaze that trail, because he DID it. He was successful because he had no competition. The good writers weren't writing stories that could jump-start the LDS fiction market. We (notice how I include myself in that group) only have ourselves to blame for Jack Weyland. LDS film should have turned out differently. The trail blazer there knows how to make a movie. And yet he's lamenting that the same trend is happening in LDS film that happened in LDS fiction. Is it inevitable that Mormons will crave mediocre but feel-good stories? Or did the trend in LDS fiction corrupt LDS film in its infancy? Have Mormons been brainwashed by LDS literature into looking for the same stories in all storytelling media? I don't know. I only know that I don't like Bill Gates and I don't like Jack Weyland stories and I am tentatively predicting I won't like the film "Charly." - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 08:47:20 +0000 From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] More Mormon Movies If 2000 was the start of LDS cinema, 2001 saw an excellent step-forward with Brigham City and The Other Side of Heaven, and 2002 is the year of the so-so low-budget movies (Singles Ward, Out of Step, Charly, and Handcart), 2003 might be the year of Book of Mormon movies. There are two Book of Mormon-related movies scheduled to be released in 2003, both still in pre-production, both set to cover 1st Nephi, and both hoping to be the first in a series. Looking at the LDSFilm.com website, I see the newly announced "Book of Mormon Movie", will be directed by Gary Rogers, who mostly has done advertisements and has been an assistant director on a few TV shows, and produced by two of the producers of Charly. Then there is "A Voice from the Dust: Journey to the Promised Land", directed by Peter Johnson, who has directed some Church movies, including The Mountain of the Lord and the remake of Man's Search For Happiness, as well as some children's movies for HBO and the Disney Channel. Besides two business-type producers, it is produced by Scott Swofford and the Director of Photography is Reed Smoot, both of whom have been behind numerous IMAX films, as well as Legacy and The Testaments. It was originally announced as an IMAX film, but now it will be a regular film. The script is by Neil Newell, who co-wrote a bunch of plays with Max Golightly and C. Michael Perry, and teaches writing at BYU. What do you film-type people think? Which one do you have higher expectations for? Looking at the people involved, the Voice from the Dust project looks like it will be more professional. Neither group strikes me as particularly creative, however. A second question: Preston, thanks so much for your weekly box office reports. Looking at the recent one, I started wondering about budget vrs. box office of the LDS films so far. I looked through your website and found some information, but am still lacking other information. Here is what I found: Budget Box office gross God's Army 300,000 2.6 million Brigham City 900,000 854,000 (before video sales) (I saw a wide variety of reports on Brigham City's cost, from 600,000 to 1.2 million. What is right?) Other Side 7 million 4.7 million Singles Ward 400,000 1.25 million Out of Step 200,000? ? Charly 800,000? 388,000 in three weeks Handcart 300,000 56,000 in two weeks. Mary Jane Jones, Richard Dutcher, Preston, can you correct any of my figures? Andrew Hall Fukuoka, Japan _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 09:31:03 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Book of Mormon Movie Casting Call There are lots of people who know way more about this than I do, but a = couple things are true. Utah is a Right to Work state, which means that = you can use non-union personnel in films shot here. That's why Touched by = an Angel was shot here. (Rule of thumb: the louder the producers trumpet = the Family Values of the project, the more likely the producers are to = mistreat and underpay the talent and the crew.) In Utah you can get away = with paying non-union workers less than scale. So in answer to your = question, yeah, I think the point of a non-SAG casting call is to keep = costs down. Young actors trying to get a break into the industry are = vulnerable enough and desperate enough that you can really take financial = advantage of them I have a student who had one full day on the Singles Ward set, had a = speaking role, and was paid a total of one dollar. She's not the only = one; lots of the actors in small speaking roles were treated equally = shabbily. That sort of behavior is, as it happens, legal in the state of = Utah. It's grotesquely immoral, IMO, especially since now, with the = financial success of the film assured, the producers could make it up to = her and the many others in the film who were also taken advantage of. = Don't hold your breath.=20 This casting call, though, for the Book of Mormon film, well my heck. = Practically every word is a red flag. "No SAG actors": in other words, we = have no plans to treat actors fairly, or pay anything close to a standard = working wage. So who can possibly have written a Book of Mormon screenplay= , which, you never know, may well have involved actually reading the Book = of Mormon, and from that come to the conclusion that, in filming it, it's = okay to grind in the faces of the poor like this? I mean, lots of = filmmakers make the decison going in that they're not going to behave = ethically, but, uh, this is a film based on the Book of Mormon. It gets better. "We only want good looking people": in other words, we = plan to be as sexist as Hollywood at its worst,and also historicity be = damned. They're announcing both a casting call AND a release date, and = they're, what, a year apart, something like that? How may I count the = ways in which these yokels have proved that they have no idea what they're = doing? Prediction: their script is a first-draft, by non-writers. Their = director maybe has done a couple of local commercials. They're going to = cut every corner they can, financially and ethically. People get ready, = there's a train wreck comin'. Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 12:16:09 -0700 From: Marny Parkin Subject: [AML] Call for Panelists at BYU SF&F Symposium If anyone is interested in being on a panel or giving a presentation=20 at Life, the Universe, & Everything XXI, please contact Charlie=20 Harmon at directly. The symposium will be held February=20 12-15, 2003, at the Wilkinson Center at BYU. Guests of Honor are=20 Patricia Wrede, Esther Friesner, and Orson Scott Card (Thursday=20 only). For more information, see the web site at=20 http://humanities.byu.edu/ltue. Marny Parkin >To: ltue@yahoogroups.com >From: c2h@aol.com >Mailing-List: list ltue@yahoogroups.com; contact ltue-owner@yahoogroups.com >Delivered-To: mailing list ltue@yahoogroups.com >List-Unsubscribe: >Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 21:54:51 EDT >Subject: [ltue] Call for writing track panelists >Reply-To: ltue@yahoogroups.com > >This is a tentative list of panels. >What I do is list all the panels I would LIKE to have. Then I list all the >panelists who have expressed an interest in being on that panel. >THEN, i will cull down the list. I will remove panelists, and remove panels= =2E >So, if you see your name on a LOT of panels, you won't end up on all of the= m. >I try and keep panelists to six or fewer panels. (I DO make exceptions for >some people, like the GOHs. ) >So, if you would like to be a panelist, let me know. > >Also, these and the CYOW panels are (or soon will be) listed on the web pag= e. > The other tracks will be added as soon as possible. >So check it out! http://humanities.byu.edu/ltue > >Charlie > > > >TOLKIEN PANELS > >**>>The OTHER Tolkien: Farmer Giles of Ham and other tales by Tolkien >(Paul N. Hyde, Steven C. Walker, >**>>LOTR: A Moral Tale: Is LOTR a moral tale? And if so, whos morals? >What Christian influences went into LOTR? What can we learn today from the= se >books? >(Ruth Hanson, > >>Light and Dark images in LOTR: The use of light and dark, good and evil >images in Tolkien=92=C4=F4s trilogy, and what they represent >(Paul N. Hyde, Steven C. Walker, Heather Monson, Ruth Hanson, > >>LOTR: Coming of Age in Middle Earth: > >>Anti-heroes: Frodo and Gollum >(Ruth Hanson, > >>Tolkien=92=C4=F4s Children: How JRR Tolkien influenced generations of= writers and >filmmakers. > > >STORYTELLING: and STORY TELLING: > >** >>How to tell a good tale: Tips and tricks to telling a good tale >(Ken Rand, > >>Fairy Tales: =92=C4=FAthings that go bump in the night=92=C4=F9 the= original horror >stories? > >>Written vs oral storytelling: How they differ and are similar. > 1) how to do them well. > 2) What can one teach the other? >**>>Writing a gripping first chapter, or writing hooks that catch their >interest >(Ann Chamberlin, Susan Kroupa, Krys Morgan, > >>Following through: You have a good hook. Now keep their attention >(Ann Chamberlin, Krys Morgan, Ron Morgan, >**>>SF/F as social commentary >(Ann Chamberlin, Ruth Hanson, >**>>Moral Themes in Fantasy and the concept of Good and Evil in SF/F (Proba= bly >compared or contrasted to modern morality) >(Ann Chamberlin, Ruth Hanson, Susan Kroupa, > >>The =92=C4=FAmeaning=92=C4=F9 of stories: >"The Uses of Enchantment" by Bettelheim, and a few even better books by >Robert Bly, do interesting work with Fairy Tales. I'd like a panel for >something similar, possibly using a familiar story like Sleeping Beauty, or >television programs, or LOTR. >(Ann Chamberlin, Ruth Hanson, > >>Mystical storytelling. Using cards, guinea pigs, and other means to com= e >up with story ideas. > > >WRITING for WRITERS: > > >>What do SF writers fear? Arthur C. Clarke has been quoted to >say that SF isn't about futures we want, but about futures we fear. The >gothic interpretation of SF and counterexamples to Clarke's notion. >(Barbara Hume, > >>Career building--what do I do AFTER I publish a story? >1) how do I use this publication in pitching other stories, >2) SFWA membership, yes/no and why?, >3) special problems for writers of >both sf and f, >4) how not to tick off the editor who first published >you >(Susan Kroupa, Ron Morgan, >**>>Attending cons as an unknown pro: >1) what's different about attending a con in "pro" mode as opposed to "fan" >mode >2) how can you meet editors, agents and other life forms at cons, >3) which specific cons have the best chances for helping you--in terms of >panels presented, contacts available, etc. >(David-Glenn Anderson, Ken Rand, Susan Kroupa, > >>Economics of writing professionally >(Ann Chamberlin, > >>Security, identity and privacy in the second Web decade. Knowledgeable = u >sers and local experts on technical, social and legal issues- >1) anonymity vs. authentication, >2) data security, privacy, free speech etc. >3) favorite techno-dystopias from Huxley and Orwell to Stephenson, Drake >etc, and the likelihood of such becoming reality. > >>Copyright vs FanFic. The rights of the original vs the rights of the fa= n > >>Changing technology. Going from 1.4 MB to 140 GB. How changing technolo= gy >affects writers and their writing. >(Ruth Hanson, > > >ABOUT WRITING: TECHNIQUES and GENRES: > > >>"What are you afraid of?" the practice and theory of horror. >(Michael R. Collings, Ruth Hanson, >**>>The importance of genealogy in fantasy fiction >(Krys Morgan, Ruth Hanson, > >>Military sf (fan/reader oriented) >1) who's good, who's popular, etc. >2) Classifications in the subgenre. Realism, story telling etc. >3) Stories and authors that transcend the subgenre vs. those that reinforc= e >it. >4) Earliest roots (Lensman), transitional growth (Laumer, Pournelle, Drake= , >S.M. Stirling), recent (Bujold, Moon, Weber, Turtledove). >5) Borrowings and "winks" between authors. Influence of editors, >particularly Jim Baen. >6) Historical conflicts re-created in sf (Byzantium, Korea). "Military >fantasy" (Moon's "Paksennarion") as a >related subgenre. >(Ruth Hanson, > >>Military and sf (semi-academic oriented): military sf as a useful (or >useless) distillation of actual military knowledge and history. >1) What is the applicability to actual problems (e.g. the current war on >terrorism). >2) What are some of the true and false "lessons" gained from novels primari= ly >intended as entertainment. >3) Impact of personalities and individual character on the conduct of war. >(Ruth Hanson, >**>>Writing Passive Voice: its use and abuse >(Ann Chamberlin, Barbara Hume, Ruth Hanson, Krys Morgan, >**>>Enchantment and worldbuilding: building a believable magic >(Ruth Hanson, Susan Kroupa, Krys Morgan, > >>Lightening the suspense: Humor in fantasy and science fiction writing >Sometimes a little levity can lessen the tension of the plot. Sometimes it >just makes for a good read. But you must be cautious when being funny. >**>>Chicks in Chainmail: The =92=C4=FAnew=92=C4=F9 female warrior >(Barbara Hume, Susan Kroupa, > >>Types of Humor in SF: What are good ways of using humor in your writing. >Situarional and verbal. > >>From idea to story: You have a great idea. How do you turn it into a gr= eat >story? >(Ruth Hanson, Krys Morgan, > >>Building Plausible Futures >The internet could continue to make "power to the people" more real... Or >lead us to an Orwellian dystopia. >Nanotech, stemcells, cloning, wearable computers, implanted computers, >depleted resources, increasing understanding... could lead to several kinds >of Utopia, or disaster, or a Vinge singularity. What can we expect? > > >WRITING for CHILDREN and YA: > > >>Writing for children: a market for kids, or for parents? >(Pat Castelli, > >>Writing for children: You have a good book. Now what? Getting your no= vel >published and noticed. >**>>SF for YW Writing for the growing =92=C4=FAtween=92=C4=F9 market. >(Laura Swift, Pat Castelli, > > >WRITING an EDITORS and PUBLISHERS view: > > >>Selecting and Editing an anthology: An insider=92=C4=F4s view As= writers, we=92=C4=F4ve >submitted to anthologies. Editors speak of what it=92=C4=F4s like to put= =20 >one together > >>SF: An editor=92=C4=F4s view > >>What editors look for in a story > >>Proper manuscript protocol From cover sheets to follow-ups, things you >should know about submitting a story/novel >(Ruth Hanson, > >>Local Publishers: Who=92=C4=F4s out there. >(Ron Morgan, > >ET CETERA: > > >>Dreaming in Public >Have a few writers & artists talk about putting together a hypothetical >heavily illustrated story book. > >>The Better Books. Some authors are known for their =92=C4=F2blockbuster= =92=C4=F4 or >=92=C4=F2classic=92=C4=F4 books. But sometimes those aren=92=C4=F4t their= =92=C4=F2best=92=C4=F4 books. >Alduous Huxley wrote the famous "Brave New World" and his last and best and >little known book, "Island" and what other authors and books have suffered = a >similar fate? >**>>Teaching Science Fiction in the classroom >(Laura Swift, David-Glenn Anderson, > >Media: > >>LOTR/Star Wars/Harry Potter: =92=C4=FAgive in to the dark side...=92=C4= =F9 The use of >light and dark in LOTR , Star Wars and Harry Potter. (May be a Media panel= ) >(Heather Monson, Barbara Hume, Krys Morgan, ) > > >PRESENTATIONS: >@Paul N. Hyde "The Foundations of Middle Earth: The Linguistic Aesthetic o= f >J.R.R. Tolkien." >@Terry O=92=C4=F4Brien =92=C4=FAFair Gods and Feathered Serpents=92=C4=F9 >@Michael R. Collings =92=C4=FABookbinding: do-it-yourself bookmaking=92=C4= =F9 >@Judi Collings =92=C4=FAJewelry making: With emphasis on period designs in = beadwork >or wire-wrap:=92=C4=F9 >@Pat Castelli =92=C4=FABest recent YA and Children=92=C4=F4s literature=92= =C4=F9 >@Shayne Bell? > > > >> panel/presentation titles >** panels most likely to make it >@ presentations > >Workshops: >Poetry (Michael R. Collings) >To: ltue@yahoogroups.com >From: "esmertal" >Mailing-List: list ltue@yahoogroups.com; contact ltue-owner@yahoogroups.com >Delivered-To: mailing list ltue@yahoogroups.com >List-Unsubscribe: >Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 18:04:56 -0000 >Subject: [ltue] Call for Panelists -- Create Your Own World >Reply-To: ltue@yahoogroups.com > >This year, CYOW will be holding panels on the following topics. If >you have interest in any of the following fields and would like to >participate in a panel, please contact me. For a list of the panels >that will be presented, please visit the website: >http://humanities.byu.edu/ltue/events.html > >Anthropology >Botany >Cartography >Comparative Religion >Ecology >Evolution >Genealogy and Lineage >Geology >Geography >Linguistics >Metaphysics >Meteorology >Mythology >Physics >Political Science >Propaganda >Psychology >Sociology >Storytelling >Superstition >Technology >Warfare >Weapons and Armor >Zoology - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 15:35:05 -0700 From: "Clark Goble" Subject: [AML] RE: SAMUELSEN, _Peculiarities_ (Review) ___ Mary Jane ___ | And as I recall, there was some stink a couple years ago about | some students that had started up a "nickmo" web site, where | people could go to find willing partners. BYU and Provo City | tried to get that shut down pretty quickly. ___ As I recall that was because it was being used for muggings and the like. (As if anyone stupid enough to take such a site seriously had any common sense) There are lots of so-called "nickmos" at BYU. It seems like a rite of passage for freshmen and sophomores. At realistically a lot of people who do a lot of nicmos tend to end up doing more than a simple make out. (Although typically shy of what would get them in trouble) So it isn't a good thing. I personally know of people who've made out with hundreds of people at BYU. I don't think that is a good thing either. I personally think it is about the same thing as those people who go home with different partners at dance clubs all the time. Perhaps they aren't typically having sex at BYU like at other places. But I tend to think the root underlying effects on ones view of relationships is the same. Further, as I mentioned, I believe it is far easier to screw up in such circumstances. But this is getting away from literature. . . Unless someone wants to do a book about it I suppose. [Clark Goble] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 17:44:24 -0500 From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: RE: [AML] Book of Mormon Movie Casting Call This Book of Mormon movie thing is very amusing, so far. Here's what we know: - - They want to cast only attractive people. We've been making fun of this, but really, isn't it what all movies do? What's funny, I suppose, is that they actually saw a need to SAY that in the press release, like somehow that will stop ugly people from auditioning. The fact is, as you know if you watched "American Idol," being untalented or unattractive doesn't stop people from THINKING they're talented and attractive. No matter what the press release said, bad actors who are also ugly and short will show up to audition, I guarantee it. - - They want to cast non-professionals, but non-professionals who are gorgeous and super-talented. Seems like most people fitting that description would have already gone pro by now, but maybe not. And again, see the last item about people thinking they're talented when they're not. - - Their intention, according to the press release I saw, is to have the film in theaters in spring 2003. But they HAVEN'T EVEN CAST IT YET! A low-budget, no-location film like "Singles Ward" MAYBE could be thrown together that fast. But a big epic adventure with location shooting? My goodness, no. This alone makes me wonder if the people involved have ever been involved with making a movie before. - - Surely the film will be terrible. I hope it's good, and I'm eager for it to be good, but the signs sure don't point that direction right now. And when it's bad, and critics say so, people will accuse them of watching it with the wrong spirit, or being anti-Mormon, or whatever, the way they did when "Handcart" sucked and some of us said so. (And by "some of us," maybe I just mean me. We got a phone call the day my review ran from the father of one of the cast members, and he was demanding we run a retraction -- like somehow I had gotten my opinion wrong and needed to correct it.) Anytime secular things like movies are mixed with spiritual things like the Book of Mormon, there's going to be trouble. I can't wait. Eric D. Snider - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 16:20:06 -0700 From: "Clark Goble" Subject: RE: [AML] Laurel Thatcher Ulrich and BELLESILES, _Arming America_ ___ Eric ___ | Bellesiles' response to the Emory report quite correctly points | out that the Emory committee found fault with only the tiniest | corner of his research. ___ Not having read him nor the full report, is that because they examined all his facts and arguments or is it that this is just the things they looked at? I ask because it sounds like he has lied about numerous other things to the point of accusing other scholars of forging emails and claiming what was on his web site was put there by hackers. Further reviews I've read have taken him to task on many things other than the forged probate records. i.e. his reading of anti-federalists and so forth. The bigger problem is that Bellesiles' thesis is about the ownership of guns. He claims, based on the fictitious probate records, that it was around 15% and that most of those guns were old. Yet others who did surveys of records have claimed that in the late 18th century the figure was 55% and that there was no evidence they were old or broken. Thus it seems like the problem is more than a few paragraphs. I don't know what the answer is. To be honest it isn't a topic that interests me too much. However the wide range of views here and Bellesiles' dishonesty makes me think that perhaps assuming someone will replicate Bellesiles' work is a tad questionable. [Clark Goble] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 16:23:24 -0700 From: "Mary Jane Jones" Subject: Re: [AML] Artists and Unions Peter Chamberlain wrote: > I would be interested in artists experiences with >unions and being able to maintain artistic control, if there have been = any situations. Most orchestral musicians belong to AFM, the American Federation of = Musicians. While in some ways the union really helped to improve the = working conditions and the rights of orchestra musicians, they also tied = the hands of the music director and the administration in all kinds of = complicated ways, and I have even seen times where union rules have hurt = the overall artistic integrity of the orchestra. =20 For example, the union rules specifically state that, rehearsals are = exactly 2 and a half hours long, and not a minute longer (unless you pay = overtime). The musicians will pick up and walk out (and many have been = known to do so). In the past, some conductors would hold excruciatingly = long rehearsals - that no longer can happen. But if a conductor needs = just 15 more minutes to finish a rehearsal, he is out of luck. My husband = was doing a joint concert with the ballet a few years ago, and they ran = out of orchestra rehearsal time before they could finish a final run-throug= h of the world premiere ballet they were performing. The ballet director = had a screaming fit, because the dancers didn't have a union, and she = couldn't understand why the musicians couldn't just stay another 10 = minutes to finish the piece. Also, it is very, very difficult to dismiss a musician who has been given = tenure, even if there seems to be good reason for the dismissal (lack of = musicianship, etc.) Here in Charleston, there has been at least one time = where the music director tried to fire a particular musician because the = musician's playing was just not up to standard. The union called in = several "New York" lawyers (which is a big deal in Charleston). The = orchestra administration and the music director basically had to back down = because they lacked the resources to fight the union. That musicians = still plays, and the playing is, sadly, still not up to standard... Mary Jane Ungrangsee - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 17:06:50 -0700 From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: RE: [AML] Voice from the Dust: Book of Mormon Movie > >The primary crew members involved, according to the website, are: > >Producer/Writer/Director=20 >Peter Johnson > >Producer >Steven DeVore > >Producer >Craig Peterson=20 > >Producer=F1Production Manager >Scott Swofford=20 > >Writer=20 >Neil Newell=20 > >Director of Photography >Reed Smoot=20 I don't feel so bad about the film now, knowing the Neil is writing it and that Reed Smoot is filming it. Reed has always been my first choice were I ever to do a film. Neil is a good writer (though, it goes without saying, his version of the BofM screenplay will never be as good as mine! ). Thom Duncan - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 17:53:27 -0700 From: "Kathy Fowkes" Subject: Re: [AML] Single Bishops D. Michael Martindale: > On the other hand, those poor naive bishops would never have had that > shocking experience in the first place if we'd just talk about these > things, or write about them in stories. Perhaps that murky slime beneath > the surface wouldn't even exist if we opened up about it so we could do > something about it. > > But I guess that's out of the question. You see, it's not "uplifting." > Better to let the lives of many people fester under the surface, so > those who think inspiration is a feel-good story that evokes a tear > aren't bothered with the sordid details of reality. > > Sorry, feeling a bit cynical tonight. Sordid details of reality. This post kind of stayed with me until I saw this scene in my mind that I would like *very much* to see in an LDS novel. A Stake President offers a man to be sustained as the new bishop of a ward. Hands go up in agreement. "Any opposed?" And first one, then a second hand goes up, slowly, then more determinedly in the first rows of the middle section. The hands belong to the new 'bishop''s teenage daughters. Except for the usual sounds of small children, the congregation is dead silent. The Stake President looks the daughters in the eyes. One stares back defiantly. The other is in tears. They carefully avoid the shocked face of their mother sitting beside them, ignoring her whispered,"what are you doing?!", as well as the wrath in the eyes of their father on the stand. The Stake President, under the influence of the Holy Ghost, asks if there are any others who are opposed, that now was the time to speak up. After seconds that feel like millenia, other hands, just a smattering, also go up. Girls who have been previous friends of the daughters, who used to be visitors to their house. One or two are known to be the sluts of the ward. A couple of others have had more serious troubles with drugs and alcohol, and rebellion of other kinds. Two or three are the 'perfect' girls in the ward who appear to do everything right, get all A's, not popular at school, but not ostracized either. Just good kids. There are about 9 or 10 hands that eventually remain after about 30 seconds have gone by. The Stake President indicates that his stake business will be concluded at a later date, thanks everyone, then steps away from the podium and walks out of the congregation. The girls who raised their hands all follow him. The man who was to be sustained as bishop is as white-faced as it is possible to be, and looks like he would like the floor to open up and swallow him, but he doesn't know how to leave. Once he does leave, the police are waiting for him with handcuffs out in the foyer. Just once I would like to see this happen. And just once maybe, if this were in a novel, girls who are sitting in a congregation (girls I know personally, now women) while their father or molestor -- often a friend's father -- was being sustained as bishop, will have the courage to raise their hands to oppose that sustaining, and end the lies, end the cycle, and begin the healing. Kathy Fowkes - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #882 ******************************