From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V2 #125 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Tuesday, August 19 2003 Volume 02 : Number 125 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 19:08:05 -0600 From: "David and Dianna Graham" Subject: [AML] Being a Mormon Actor [MOD: Wow, Dianna! Thanks for writing the kind of insightful, sharing post that really gives substance to a discussion like this one.] Eric Dixon asked: >And this could be an interesting question to discuss: What is it about success in Hollywood that drives actors to distance >themselves from the church? It doesn't always happen, but we have ready examples in Ryan Gosling, Paul Walker, Eliza Dushku, >Matthew Modine, Aaron Eckhart (?), Jewel Kilcher, etc. Is there a level of secular artistic success that makes church >membership particularly perilous? Did the entertainment industry even have anything to do with their departure from >activity, or would it likely have happened in another profession as well? Of course, the best people to ask are the successful actors themselves. But here's a little tidbit from a house-wife, would-be actress (hope to be one again someday). I've done a bit of work with some really successful theatre actors, and it is, of course, a slightly different animal from film, but here it is. (Note: Everything I'm about to say is from an actor stand point). Being an active Mormon in a group of non-LDS entertainers can be really lonely at times. While there are some wonderful, balanced people in the business who see acting as a job or a great creative opportunity, not a life-style, they are few and far between. In one of the productions I was in up in SLC, the guest director was from New York and usually directed soaps. He was a doll (called me "Sweetie" and "Honey" all the time, not a big deal), and I'd work with him again any day, but he loved to say f*** while giving directions at least a few times a day. One of the dancers in the show regularly slapped me on the bum every time I passed him until I finally got up the nerve to gently ask him to stop (and it took a lot courage and then he seemed to feel so bad). One of the musical numbers in the show had a very sensual tango in it where at one point, we, the dancers, had to reach over to our partner and grab one of their bum cheeks. (Those were some fun discussions with my husband. I was able to grab my dance partner's hip and make it look like the other, and I felt fine with that). One afternoon, while the ensemble was waiting for their next rehearsal time, two of our cast members (males, by the way) first mooned us all through one of the rehearsal room windows, and then proceeded to french kiss with their mouths still open, hoping to make us all laugh. (And most folks did). I think the woman in the cast who made the most dirty jokes and used the most profanity was the only other Mormon woman in the cast. I mean, I loved doing the show, and I thought everyone was fun, don't get me wrong. But to be completely honest, it was hard to not follow suit with the others, because even though about 1/5 of the cast was LDS, most behaved the same way. These creative opportunities are relationships where goodbyes often include kisses on the lips, even from the dancer who you thought absolutely hated you for not being as good a dancer as him. In some ways, I really think the intimacy performers celebrate is fabricated, but it's still a level of intimacy. Oh, another tidbit from that show, our wig and make-up guy was a gay ex-Mormon. He was one of my favorite co-workers, the sweetest guy I ever met, and we had a really nice friendship. But this was a man in the ladies' dressing-room when a few of us were taking showers before or after the show. I had a man (gay men are men, period) who was not my husband less than five feet away when I was going from a towel to a corset bra. Our lesbian sound lady, another fantastically sweet woman, would sometimes make interesting, forward comments to me. (Like when I asked her once if my fake eyelashes were on right, and she said, "You look great! I could kiss you if you like!" I guess I had that coming.) Anyway, if the film world is anything like the theatre world, it's got to be a little lonely if you don't want to compromise at all and if you want to connect with those around you. At that job, in particular, I really felt like a freshman in high school really wanting to fit in. It's especially challenging if you have to travel for a job, which so many performers do. You're far away from your family and friends who are, for the most part, a little more likely to live the way you do, and all of a sudden, you're alone. There are some really healthy actors who are so self-assured they can ignore the behavior completely or ask others to be more sensitive to them, etc., but I've not met many. (And it really doesn't help if most of the other Mormons' behavior is the same if not more extreme). Then there's that whole debate you hear in your head (the "committee" speaking), "Strong language does not a bad Mormon make." "He doesn't mean anything bad when he touches you that way, so you shouldn't be offended..." (Another tidbit: I was once the only woman in a group of men for a few hours of blocking. The scene was the morning after my character's wedding night, and the men started making remarks about how my character should hardly be able to walk the next day. I spoke up that I didn't like what they were saying, and my director later said it's better to "just ignore it." Words of wisdom? Sort of. But, that doesn't really do anything to help the next women in that situation, does it? Nor does it make me feel safe...) Like I said, high school. You want to fit in, you want to build bridges, and you want to be a part of that...love, I guess it is, that seems to be circulating through the air. The kisses and the jokes and fun and laughter. You don't enjoy having someone condescend to you that you must be a hypocrite to be a Mormon and yet befriend a gay man, because "how can you reconcile those together?" You know how you can, but the dressing room 30 minutes before a show doesn't seem like the place to discuss it. Do you know what I mean? The entertainment business is so much more than a business, as it should be. We are artists. If we do not connect with each other, with audiences, we are wasting our time our work is masturbatory at best. But, the entertainment world is so mixed up, never finding resolution on what makes a professional environment. Language and behavior that would be completely unacceptable in an office is typical everyday behavior on a set or in a rehearsal room. (And that's between AND during performances, right?) It is a place where you should be open to confrontation and you should refrain from judgement, but where you should be prepared to be judged. It is a scary place to be. So, how do we respond to such an environment? Some of us choose to step away from it and try to grow up a bit more before we go back to give it another shot. Maybe we pursue some other dreams, like a family or writing, or both, etc. Maybe we're the weaklings of the bunch, or just extremely wise, I know not. Others tough it out, holding their own, and improving their social skills, strengthening their backbone, finding humor in situations, or creating opportunities for themselves and creating a world in which they can make up the rules. These ones, I believe are the heros. Finally, there is the artist who wants to join in, wants to stop having to fight against temptation. Maybe he no longer remembers what the fight was once about, because, hey, these other people are really wonderful people too. Or maybe he or she decides or realizes that the fight was never real to them anyway. Perhap a mormon artist can redefine their faith to themselves and make that other world fit in, and somehow embracing that world makes them more Christlike. There may be a hint of truth to that theory. But these folks are the majority. I bet there are a lot more Ryan Goslings and Eliza Dushkus out there than we know. Dianna Graham - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 19:17:31 -0600 From: "David and Dianna Graham" Subject: [AML] "Mormon" Actors Thomas Baggley quoted: >Films have NOT been listed on this page >based on any determination of church activity, Thom Duncan responded: >Nor should they ever be, imo. If a person self-identifies as Mormon, that should be enough for the rest of us. Dianna responds: It is likewise if someone identifies themselves to no longer be a Mormon. It's a little strange to read articles that highlight successful Mormon artists when those individuals don't consider themselves to be LDS anymore. It's not an issue of activity either. It may not be an accurate view, but I don't really consider ex-Mormons whose names simply haven't been removed from church records as Mormons, active or less active. Here are two examples to illustrate my point. First, I did a show with a woman a few years back who completely identifies herself as a Mormon, even though she doesn't really get involved in the church at all. She may or may not drink, and I'm not sure what her view on the law of chastity is. She doesn't attend church regularly, though, and she doesn't see the point to tithing. But she only likes to date LDS men because she is a Mormon. So, she's definitely a Mormon, and should she achieve notable success in the entertainment industry, I'd love to see her name on the "Mormon Artist" lists. The other example, however, is about a former BYU student who is a wonderful TV actor. Years ago, when he was the star of a pilot sitcom, he was featured in a Deseret News article where the interviewer was so excited about featuring a "Mormon actor who's really making it." The article basically said that while it's cool that any young man can do so well as a professional actor, it's even cooler that this one was an RM. It was such a funny article, though, because you could even tell from the writer's quotes that the actor was trying to politely, subtly say that his religion was a part of his upbringing and his past, but not really a part of his life anymore. They kept saying, though, "Hey, look, a successful Mormon actor!!" Anyway, though I might be wrong, I really don't think this individual would call himself a Mormon artist. I'd be really interested in seeing how many of "our own" really consider themselves one of "our own." I'm not trying to be mean or exclusive, but when I see articles or Box Office lists of successful Mormon artists, I'd rather know that they all basically consider themselves a Mormon. When I first saw those lists back in the "even-more-naive-than-I-am-now" days, I got really excited to see that so many Mormons could make it in the real entertainment world. It was reassuring and energizing. But since I've come to realize that a large number of them kind of had to cast aside the old religion thing in the process of achieving commercial success as an artist, it's really just become kind of annoying. Dianna Graham - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 13:14:55 -0600 From: "Kim Madsen" Subject: RE: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith Thom Duncan writes "So far I haven't anyone suggesting an actor to play Joseph who more approximated his physical type: 6 feet, 200 pounds, (considered porty by some accounts) with a slightly receeding chin. My suggestion would be John Lovitz." Based on that criteria, I'd rather see Oliver Platt than John Lovitz. Even better, Laim Neesan...but aren't they all too old? So at 5'11 and 45, I'd still vote for Viggo. I'm doubting THE PROPHET will have any butt shots in it. Kim Madsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 17:41:27 -0700 From: Harlow S Clark Subject: Re: [AML] Changing the Words On Thu, 14 Aug 2003 15:57:49 -0600 "Nan P. McCulloch" writes: > To add to my post regarding permission to change dialogue in a play. > Don't hesitate to ask, but ask early on before you pay the big bucks. > The Pleasant Grove people waited until a week before they were set > to open. > > Nan McCulloch The story I saw on TV said they didn't ask, that somehow Neil Simon's lawyer got wind of what they were doing and sent them a letter saying that would be a violation of their contract and they had to do it as written or not at all. The reporter said the theatre owners told her they knew cutting the swear words was a violation of their contract but they didn't think it would matter. Can they get a refund after having paid the royalties? Harlow Clark ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 11:38:16 -0400 From: Tony Markham Subject: Re: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith My first choice would have to be Val Kilmer. His choice of roles through the years has spoken of a kind of integrity that I like. And he was as aghast as I was at the ruin Joel Shoemacher (sp?) wreaked on the Batman series. He has an honest kind of spirituality that comes through. Jackman and Mortensen are too much hunk-o-the-week. Why not just cast Matthew McConnaghey (sp?), shoot me, and get it over with? Or get Aaron Eckhardt for the role, a little reactivation action... Tony Markham - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 09:49:04 -0600 From: Tammy Daybell Subject: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks >From the transcript of the 60 minutes interview with President Hinckley: Mike Wallace: No alcohol, no tobacco, no coffee, no tea, not even caffeinated soft drinks... Gordon B Hinckley: Right. Tammy Daybell - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V2 #125 ******************************