From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V2 #128 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Thursday, August 21 2003 Volume 02 : Number 128 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 11:41:33 -0700 (PDT) From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Dale W. NELSON, _A Latter-day Saint Perspective on the Lost Tribes_ (Review) The following information comes courtesy of Fred Pinegar: "The book is carried by Deseret Book, and most of the independent stores know about it. However, people looking for it may have to ask for it. Otherwise, it can be ordered directly through me, at 801-225-5401." He also adds, clarifying a portion of my review [admittedly a joke, but still -- for the record]: "[The book] is a work in progress which I produce in small batches. Before each new printing we go over it to insert new material and to address problems we or others have found. Hugh Nibley described the book as 'notes,' because when he saw the manuscript it was in a very preliminary stage." ~~William Morris __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 18:46:07 GMT From: Larry Jackson Subject: [AML] Re: Caffeinated Drinks Terry Jeffress: Just to set the record straight . . . To reach a physical dependence (occurring at 350mg caffeine per day), you would have to consume 58.3oz (3.6lb) of Hershey's chocolate each day . . . _______________ Well, then, I should just stomp right down to the bishop's office and let that counselor have it for giving my son a 5 lb (yes, pound) Hershey's chocolate bar for excellent attendance in deacon's quorum last year. Or, maybe I should be a responsible parent and just make sure he takes at least two days to eat it? Nah. That wouldn't be any fun, would it? [grin] Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2003 14:40:20 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks Tammy Daybell wrote: > > >From the transcript of the 60 minutes interview with President Hinckley: > > Mike Wallace: No alcohol, no tobacco, no coffee, no tea, not even > caffeinated soft drinks... > > Gordon B Hinckley: Right. I have a friend whose bishop heard this and immediately concluded it was now official doctrine. Since then he includes avoiding caffeinated drinks as part of the requirements for getting a temple recommend. Another example of doctrine made up as we go along that plagues our church, along the lines of "The prophet said not to see R-rated movies." - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:54:52 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith Thom Duncan wrote: > > Why couldn't an unknown have been cast? It worked > well for "Ghandi" and "Superman" making stars out of > both men. Because Zion Films is not a big budget movie studio with lots of money to gamble. Dutcher has to do everything he can to assure a profitable return on his investors' money. Everyone knows a bankable star is an important ingredient to that. Heck, it's an important ingredient to raising the money in the first place. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:02:57 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks John Dewey Remy wrote: > > During my short stint at the COB, it was common to see Church employees with > well-worn, large, refillable cups crossing the street to the the ZCMI food > court or to the little corner convenience store in the Gateway Apartment > building (where Pres. Hinckley, Pres. Faust and Jana's great-aunt Madge > live). While I begrudge no man or woman their daily morming stimulants, I > think it ironic that those huge mugs, if filled with Pepsi or Coke, could > hold the same amount of caffeine as two medium-sized cups of coffee (perhaps > one shot of espresso?). The potential sugar content is pretty scary, too. As a recently diagnosed diabetic who has become enlightened in the ways of sugar, I'd recommend everyone be orders of magnitude more concerned about consuming all that sugar than any accompanying caffeine. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 14:22:09 -0500 From: Ronn! Blankenship Subject: RE: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith At 02:41 PM 8/19/03 -0600, Margaret Young wrote: >Well, if we're casting Joseph Smith based on how many women will swoon >at the first screening, my vote definitely goes with Denzel Washington. >Casting him might be expensive, but it would add some really interesting >plot devices to the script and probably increase marketability. But would it play in Provo? - -- Ronald W. ("Ronn!") Blankenship mailto: ronn.blankenship@att.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:33:34 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders [MOD: I really, really don't want to get into a discussion of whether the specific items Michael lists later in his post are or aren't official policy, how justified they are, etc. In fact, it's off-topic for AML-List to go there. But I think there are some potentially interesting questions about how you depict issues like this in Mormon literature, particularly with the variety of attitudes we encounter about them in the Church. So while the issues themselves aren't on-topic for AML-List, attitudes about them--as I see it--are. If we can go that direction in this discussion, I'll let it continue. If not, I'll have to regretfully close it down.] Margaret Young wrote: > > Since I've spent the past five years studying the race issue and its > history in the Church, I have become intimately acquainted with terrible > statements spoken over the pulpit and elsewhere from the time of Brigham > Young onward, statements which are STILL WITH US in the form of > folklore. I have wondered about the assurance which I hear quoted all > the time: "The Lord will never allow his prophet to lead the Church > astray. The prophet would be removed before God would let that happen." > I don't have the wording exactly right, but that's the gist, spoken by > Wilford Woodruff. I simply don't believe it. That statement, and a more recent paraphrasing of it by, I think, Elder Nelson, is deeply imbedded in the Mormon psyche as an excuse for blindly obeying church leaders (in spite of our protests that we don't blindly obey them) and in continually preaching that obedience is a primary virtue (obedience to God, sure--but to other human beings?) What I don't understand is, how do we know for sure that Woodruff and Nelson and whoever else aren't making a mistake in the very act of preaching that peculiar Mormon brand of infallibility? > I keep hearing > that obedience is the first law of Heaven, but the scriptures show the > Savior obeying his own conscience rather than the earthly, phariseical > laws time and time again. He follows the law of compassion consistently > (even when compassion comes in the form of a lash.) His example > suggests to me that I should not be too hasty in accepting something > which feels wrong to my heart. Christ saved his most flaming condemnations for the lawyer and Pharisee "hypocrites." We tend to think of the Pharisees as "them" while Christ and his followers are "us." What we seem to overlook is, the Pharisees and other Jewish leaders of the time _were_ the true church back then. They had the authentic priesthood of God, officiated in the temple ordinances which Christ respected and partook in, and were all the church there was. We're so used to the "Great Apostacy" where the church and the priesthood entirely left the world, that we forget that apostacies previous to that were not absolute. The church can and has gone astray many times without actually disappearing. We read cycles of that over and over again in the Book of Mormon. So what's to say the modern church can't go astray now and then over one thing or another? The answer--nothing guarantees us it can't! And how did Christ handle the elements of doctrine that had gone astray in the "true church" of his time? He utterly ignored them and obeyed only the pure teachings of the law of Moses. Should we not be more like Jesus in this aspect too? When Jesus condemns the Pharisees, I think he's speaking as much to us in modern times as he was to his contemporaries. Are we piling on our own set of ad hoc rules that we demand each other live, because we somehow don't think the principles of the gospel are good enough to teach us to govern ourselves? Caffeinated drinks. R-rated movies. Ear piercings and tattoos. Modesty in clothing defined to the inch. Bellybuttons defined as immodest. Girls shamed and thrown out of church dances--even nonmembers who didn't know any better--because they didn't follow the above two rules to the letter. Facial hair considered suspect. Defining "appropriate" art--not just privately for ourselves, but for everyone else too. Declarations of when and how sex should be depicted in literature, or spoken about at all--again for everyone else. Intricate and intrusive liquor laws in Utah. Laws defining all manner of nudity--even the most innocent kind--as lewdness or child abuse in Utah. Demands that public--emphasis on public--resources like swimming pools and such be closed on Sunday and Monday evening in communities of Utah. Declaring a harmless school mascot as evil, just because it's a cartoon devil, as recently happened in a Utah community. Are we sure we're not the Pharisees too? - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:32:10 -0700 From: Jeffrey Needle Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders My take on this -- context is everything. The famous Woodruff statement was made within the context of the decision to end the practice of PM. It is not apparent that he intended it to extend over any other subject. Part of the folklore is that this statement applies to *every* decision made by a GA. On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 09:17:20 -0600, Margaret Young wrote: > Since I've spent the past five years studying the race issue and its > history in the Church, I have become intimately acquainted with terrible > statements spoken over the pulpit and elsewhere from the time of Brigham > Young onward, statements which are STILL WITH US in the form of > folklore. I have wondered about the assurance which I hear quoted all > the time: "The Lord will never allow his prophet to lead the Church > astray. The prophet would be removed before God would let that happen." > I don't have the wording exactly right, but that's the gist, spoken by > Wilford Woodruff. I simply don't believe it. - -- - ------------------ Jeffrey Needle jeff.needle@general.com or jeffneedle@tns.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:33:29 -0700 From: Jeffrey Needle Subject: Re: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith Because then a whole lot of LDS would have to deny him the priesthood, and that might make for a very interesting plotline... On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 10:42:32 -0500, Thom Duncan wrote: > Why not Denzel? I just heard they're making a movie of The Honeymooners > with Cedric the Entertainer in the Jackie Gleason role. - ------------------ Jeffrey Needle jeff.needle@general.com or jeffneedle@tns.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:39:16 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders Bill Willson wrote: > So it isn't necessarily the errors of the GA's we need to be worrying about, > it's the misinterpretations and errors of the rank and file that get us into > trouble. But since one nearly always results in the other, we do need to worry. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 14:43:02 -0500 From: Ronn! Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders At 10:59 AM 8/20/03 -0500, Thom Duncan wrote: >Tying this back into a literary context. Scott >Bronson and Ronn! will remember a problem we once had >while writing training scripts for the MTC. The >middle manager between us and Elder Packard was >setting up walls for something we wanted to do. Our >producer was a degreed Instructional Designer so kinda >knew the ropes. Our producer managed to get an >interview with Elder Packard who, once apprised of our >game plan, gave it the green light. His words: "You >guys are the professionals. I trust you to make the >right decision." OTOH, when I suggested that we make the investigator in one of our videos=20 black, that suggestion got bounced upstairs from person to person (though I= =20 don't know precisely who got involved) before the word came back down, "No,= =20 you can't do that, because the Church isn't baptizing many blacks.=B9 You= =20 can make him Hispanic, though." So he got a stereotype Hispanic name like= =20 Hernandez or Melendez or something like that in the script. Of course,=20 when it came time to shoot the finished product, the actor they got to play= =20 the part was drawn from the available pool of talent: typical Happy Valley= =20 white bread. ______ =B9Which was sorta my point in wanting to make him black: if those who saw= =20 the video saw a black investigator, maybe it would inspire them to share=20 the Gospel with more black people . . . (FWIW, this was in IIRC 1986 or= 1987.) - -- Ronald W. ("Ronn!") Blankenship mailto: ronn.blankenship@att.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:41:05 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Reference in SWAT Bill Willson wrote: > > From: "Cathy Wilson" > > > Very cute. > __________________________________ > > I agree that dialogue is funny, but it can be damaging too. > This is a good example of the rank and file's misinterpretation of the > guidance from our GA's in favor of safe choices, and spreading of false > doctrine based on correct principles taught by our leaders. (see earlier > post on ...errors among leaders). I'm sure the writer was trying to either > spread some doctrine, or else deliberately vilify the intolerance of church > doctrine, either way, it is incorrect and damaging to the church's public > image. Or maybe the writer was just trying to provide a cute moment in the movie. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:49:43 -0600 From: "Nan P. McCulloch" Subject: Re: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks You can't wear a beard and officiate in the Jordan River Temple. Nan McCulloch - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 15:01:30 -0500 From: Ronn! Blankenship Subject: Re: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks At 11:25 AM 8/20/03 -0600, jeffress@xmission.com wrote: >[MOD: Thanks to Terry for adding some information and facts to the >discussion of this point.] > >Quoting "Eric D. Dixon" : > > [BYU] sell[s] plenty of varieties of chocolate, including > > in the form of a hot drink -- all of which are certainly caffeinated. > >Just to set the record straight . . . > >Undisputedly, coffee contains caffeine (C8 H10 N4 O2 or 3,7-Dihydro-1,3,7- >trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione). > >Chocolate contains theobromine (C7 H8 N4 O2 or 3,7-Dimethyl-Zanthine,2,6- >Dihydroxy-3,7-Dimethyl-Purine), which although structurally similar to >caffine produces 1/10th the stimulating effect in the human metabolism= [11]. Just to nit-pick=97and aren't all writers nit-pickers?=97there are a couple= of=20 small errors in the above. It's spelled "xanthine." (I know: my=20 spell-checker doesn't recognize it, either.) Caffeine is indeed=20 1,3,7-trimethylxanthine, theobromine is 3,7-dimethylxanthine. A third=20 member of the family is theophylline, or 1,3-dimethylxanthine, which is=20 more common in tea than in coffee or chocolate, and is used in the=20 treatment of asthma (prescription brand name "Theo-dur", etc.). And just=20 to be complete, there is a fourth compound called paraxanthine, which is=20 1,7-dimethylxanthine, but I'm not aware of any common use for it. Also, an important note: while as Terry reports above theobromine has only= =20 a fraction of the stimulating effect of a similar amount of caffeine on the= =20 human metabolism, dogs especially are quite sensitive to the effects of=20 theobromine, and the theobromine in only a small amount of chocolate will=20 kill a dog, so be sure to keep your chocolate out of the reach of your=20 pets. Besides, you want it all for yourself, don't you? We now dismiss chemistry class and return you to your regularly scheduled=20 discussion of Mormon literature . . . - -- Ronald W. ("Ronn!") Blankenship mailto: ronn.blankenship@att.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 14:05:43 -0600 From: "Paul VanDenBerghe" Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders Thom wrote: That indeed is THE problem. I can't remember the=20 exact quote but Elder Holland made a talk in which he=20 said that young men shouldn't be required to wear=20 white shirts while passing the Sacrament. The=20 =66ollowing week, our local leaders were preaching that=20 the young men should all start wearing white shirts. =20 It was amazing how this leap from moderate to mandate=20 took only a week. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The great "White Shirt" controversy will be a longstanding debate for years= = to come. Just to clarify Elder Holland's stance, here are his actual words: "May I suggest that wherever possible a white shirt be worn by the deacons,= = teachers, and priests who handle the sacrament. For sacred ordinances in th= e= Church we often use ceremonial clothing, and a white shirt could be seen a= s= a gentle reminder of the white clothing you wore in the baptismal font and= = an anticipation of the white shirt you will soon wear into the temple and = onto your missions. "That simple suggestion is not intended to be pharisaic or formalistic. We = do not want deacons or priests in uniforms or unduly concerned about = anything but the purity of their lives. But how our young people dress can = teach a holy principle to us all, and it certainly can convey sanctity. As = President David O. McKay taught, a white shirt contributes to the sacrednes= s= of the holy sacrament (see Conference Report, Oct. 1956, p. 89). - --Jeffrey R. Holland, "This Do in Remembrance of Me," Ensign, Nov. 1995, 68 I wish what we remembered and talked about from this conference talk is the= = part about not wanting our deacons or priests to be "unduly concerned about= = anything but the purity of their lives." Not the part about they should all= = wear a white shirt. A humorous little anecdote happened to my wife and I while driving with her= = older brother who had become a new bishop in Alaska. We were discussing the= = sometimes seemingly pharisaic pronouncements from individual bishops in = various wards throughout the church. My wife's brother, who tends to = gravitate to a more conservative opinion that does she, expressed that he = wanted all the deacons, teachers, and priests to wear white shirts for the = sacrament. My wife was making the point that we should be teaching them mor= e= along the lines of "purity of their lives," or the importance of their = personal worthiness, not their personal wardrobe. It's fine to teach about = a= white shirt symbolizing purity, but let's make sure people understand = that's what it is, a symbol. "That way we won't have all the youth of the = Church growing up believing that a white shirt is a requirement to pass the= = sacrament." Her brother replied, "Oh, nobody believes that wearing a white shirt is a = requirement." =46rom the back seat came the quick, surprised, and earnest response from = his teenage daughter, "It's not a rule?" I can imagine this scene fleshed out a bit in a story, novel, or play. It = would effectively make the point that we should be trying to move beyond = appearances; move beyond the letter of the law to the spirit of the law. Paul VanDenBerghe - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= - --- This message may contain confidential information, and is intended only for= = the use of the individual(s) to whom it is addressed. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:31:38 -0700 From: "Susan Malmrose" Subject: Re: [AML] Being a Mormon Actor > So, how do we respond to such an environment? Some of us choose to step > away from it and try to grow up a bit more before we go back to give it > another shot. Maybe we pursue some other dreams, like a family or writing, > or both, etc. Maybe we're the weaklings of the bunch, or just extremely > wise, I know not. Others tough it out, holding their own, and improving > their social skills, strengthening their backbone, finding humor in > situations, or creating opportunities for themselves and creating a world in > which they can make up the rules. These ones, I believe are the heros. > Finally, there is the artist who wants to join in, wants to stop having to > fight against temptation. Maybe he no longer remembers what the fight was > once about, because, hey, these other people are really wonderful people > too. Or maybe he or she decides or realizes that the fight was never real > to them anyway. Perhap a mormon artist can redefine their faith to > themselves and make that other world fit in, and somehow embracing that > world makes them more Christlike. There may be a hint of truth to that > theory. But these folks are the majority. I bet there are a lot more Ryan > Goslings and Eliza Dushkus out there than we know. I want to thank Diana for this post. I've always kind of assumed it would be like she describes in the acting/theater world, but I didn't really know. It all comes down to living in the world without being a part of it. It can be a very tricky balance at times. I know someone who was studying to be an opera singer, but he ended up dropping out of the program. I've never talked to him about it personally, but I'd heard that he did so partially because of the cultural environment. He wasn't comfortable with it. This is an issue I think about a lot, because I love to go see underground bands play at little bars. The drinking/smoking doesn't bother me and I'm never tempted to try it. (Well the smoke is an irritant, but that's about it.) I was invited to see a local band play at a private party recently, and I figured there'd be drugs there. I was just hoping there wouldn't be anything hardcore like heroin or cocaine. If there was I didn't see any sign of it. Lots of pot, though. (Just like high school!) Susan M - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:48:30 -0700 From: "Kathy Tyner" Subject: [AML] Abuse in the Church (was: Dutcher on Krakauer) I asked Thom what source he based his statement about the high incidence of spousal abuse in the Church on. He replied: > I'm basing my assumption that the percentage is high > enough to have interested the Brethren to the extent > that not a General Priesthood meeting goes by but that > they don't mention it as a serious problem. > > Thom Duncan I don't recall that the Brethren have said there is a high incidence of spousal or child abuse in the Church, per se, but I'm guessing any amount of abuse, in any form, is considered an unacceptable and egregious breach of covenants and of the individual dignity as a Child of God each person deserves. In other words, any abuse is too much, and warrants a serious rebuke from the Brethren. Does anyone know where there might be reliable stats about this issue? Kathy Tyner Orange County, CA - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 14:56:06 -0600 From: "Jongiorgi's e-mail" Subject: Re: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith Thanks to everyone for their casting responses (both the funny and the serious). I said I would take responses seriously (except the obviously joking), but in one case I respectfully have to disagree: Hayden Christensen can't act. Go watch SWII again and notice how the kid telegraphs and indicates every single "emotional" reaction in the movie. He's hideously awful the more you watch him. Just my opinion, of course! Jongiorgi Enos - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 15:17:49 -0600 From: "Roy Schmidt" Subject: RE: [AML] Caffeinated Drinks Not quite right. Temple workers, including veil workers, are clean shaven as of two years ago. An exception MAY be granted if a beard is required for medical reasons. Roy Schmidt - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:19:22 -0600 From: Fred C Pinnegar Subject: Re: [AML] Dale W. NELSON, _A Latter-day Saint Perspective on the Lost The retail price for Nelson's book on the Lost Tribes is around $20, and it is available through Deseret Book, but they may have to order it in or look for it on the bottom shelf. Most independent LDS bookstores are aware of it because I bother them about it all the time, but you can order it directly through me if you want to. I will give AML members a price break. Call me at 801-225-5401. In addition, I recently reprinted Paris Anderson's stunning little book, Tough-Luck, Sitting Bull's Horse. Regards, Fred Pinnegar, Owner FCP Publishing - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 01:38:13 GMT From: Darvell Hunt Subject: [AML] Re: ROWLING, J.K., _Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix_ (Review) Maybe there's hope for me as a writer after all. Veering a little bit from the original post on Harry Potter, I'd like to comment on my reading of _Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets_ by J.K. Rowling that has lifted a bit of the doubt from my own mind of whether or not my writing has any hope of being published. Near the end of the book, I read a sentence that referred to Lord Voldemort as "the last remaining ancestor of Salazar Slytherin." I've read the last few chapters about three times because I like the ending and I'm trying to figure out what makes Rowling's stories so interesting to millions of readers. When suddenly I realized that Lord Voldemort could not be an ancestor of Salazar Slytherin, but rather a descendant. I smiled big. If Rowling can make a word-use blunder like that, maybe there's hope for me. I've discovered that some (maybe later?) editions have this word-use error corrected. And who knows, maybe a copy editor got it wrong instead and actually changed the correct word into an error. I know my editor for a local newspaper has done that to my writing before, much to my chagrin--because readers probably think it was me who made the error. But who cares if it was her or not! I know I'm not perfect and if I can see that somebody who is as sucessful (and now rich!) as J. K. Rowling and can still make mistakes like this, then maybe I should pick up my pen again (okay, keyboard) and start a new project. I think I will. Thanks J.K.! ;) Darvell Hunt P.S. Please don't point out errors in this post. As much fun as it was to see J.K. Rowling falter, I don't need anybody to notice when I do! Not until you can pick up my book in the local bookstore, anyway! ;) ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 21:38:48 -0500 From: "Lisa Tait" Subject: Re: [AML] Val Kilmer and Joseph Smith - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thom Duncan" > Why not Denzel? I just heard they're making a movie > of The Honeymooners with Cedric the Entertainer in the > Jackie Gleason role. > > Thom In this light, maybe Denzel would work better for the REMAKE of the Joseph Smith movie. Lisa Tait - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 19:51:17 -0600 From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Religious Fundamentalists as Murderers I'm a few days behind on posts, so if this has already been covered, I apologize. Dianna Graham mentioned wanting a book about how murderers decide to become murderers, that it is a choice. There are actually a couple out there that I have found fascinating and very helpful in writing characters. John Douglas, formerly of the FBI and the foremost developer of profiling, has written several books about this very thing, and although he can describe certain characteristics that a killer will likely have, he is emphatic about the point that murderers' actions are choices and not inevitable because of the way they were raised. *The Anatomy of Motive* was great, as was the one (title escapes me) where he profiles the major murder cases in history from Jack the Ripper to Jon Benet. I think his first one was called *Journey into Darkness.* They are anything but dull downers. I heard he used to work in Provo law enforcement and was LDS--but I'm not positive on that. Annette Lyon - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 21:47:11 -0500 From: "Lisa Tait" Subject: Re: [AML] Perceptions of Error among Leaders - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Willson" > So it isn't necessarily the errors of the GA's we need to be worrying about, > it's the misinterpretations and errors of the rank and file that get us into > trouble. > And a big reason for misinterpretation by the rank and file is the widespread desire to have church leaders prescribe all kinds of behavior and rules that ought to be left to personal consideration and inspiration. Part of the reason we even have discussions like these is that there are a lot of church members who want to be told what to do in every aspect of their lives. Lisa Tait - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 17:01:56 -0600 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Irreantum Proofers Needed The AML invites volunteer proofers to review the summer 2003 issue of Irreantum for typos and errors before it goes to press. This issue is largely devoted to LDS romance. A PDF of the issue is expected to go out on Tuesday, Sept. 2, and all corrections would be due back by Tuesday, Sept. 9. (If the PDF is ready sooner or later, those dates would be adjusted to allow a full week for proofing.) Not only do you help Irreantum be much more professional, but your volunteer work can be claimed as resume skill or experience. The AML will give references for competent volunteers. If you can help, drop me a line, and we'll send you the PDF as soon as it's ready. Thanks, Chris Bigelow chris.bigelow@unicitynetwork.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 23:45:24 -0600 From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Being a Mormon Actor On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 19:08:05 -0600 "David and Dianna Graham" writes: > here's a little tidbit from a house-wife, would-be actress A very nice tidbit it was. Now here's a tidbit from me; a different perspective. Having standards is not necassarily prohibitive to having an acting career. Having said that, I DO believe having standards will effect how long it might take for that career to mature. The more stringent your standards, the longer it will take simply because you limit the number of projects for which you are available. Each actor will have to decide for her/himself what those standards will be. EVERY actor will have their own line in the sand. Even Mormon actors. So, it is possible, I believe, to be a Mormon AND have a successful acting career. Now, having said that, I must also say that in order to be an ACTOR at the level we're talking about here, I believe it would be nearly impossible (though not completely impossible) to become that actor and remain a fully committed Mormon. Becoming a star requires a singleness of purpose. Achieving a goal like that forces one to give up a lot of things. EVERYTHING COSTS SOMETHING. You have to choose your master, because every master demands absolute devotion. There are quite a few really fine actors among us who are also Mormons, but have chosen to be mothers and fathers, husbands and wives before they raise the flag of "Great Actor." Notice how Dianna referred to herself as a house-wife first. She is one of those very fine actors I just mentioned. Add to that list people like Shelly Graham, Kim Abunuwara, Chris Clark, Elwon Bakly, Ivan Crosland, Jeremy Selim, Susan Milne. So much talent. That you've never heard of. There are some who would say that the talents of these fine folk are being wasted on domesticity. I can say with authority, I believe, that it's a whole lot harder to be a GOOD dad and husband than it is to be a GREAT actor. I would rate myself a FAIR dad and husband and a PRETTY DARN GOOD actor. And let me tell you this, I could give up acting and writing and never be as good at fathering as I could be great at acting and writing if I gave up fathering. You want a really famous really talented really mormon Mormon actor? That's gonna be tough. Really tough. J. Scott Bronson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 08:51:42 -0600 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] FW: Eric D. Snider update: All Fired Up Eric Snider said to forward this to any interested parties, so here it is. Frankly, I can't quite grasp why he was fired. - -----Original Message----- From: Eric D. Snider [mailto:eric@ericdsnider.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 9:21 PM To: Christopher Bigelow Subject: Important Eric D. Snider update: All Fired Up To whom it may concern -- The short version of this story is, as the result of being fired, I no longer work at The Daily Herald. The long version follows. I wrote a news story on Aug. 8 about the Grove Theatre in Pleasant Grove, Utah, being forced to shut down its production of Neil Simon's "Rumors" because Samuel French, Inc., which handles the copyright, learned the theater was altering some of the dialogue. This is against copyright laws, and faced with either doing it chock-full of profanity or not doing it at all, the theater chose to not do it at all. Before the theater made its decision, I spoke with Samuel French about possible copyright violations. The Samuel French people led me to understand they didn't act on anonymous information (which is what I was providing), and that they had already heard about this anyway. When the word came down from them officially, they said they were acting on info from Simon's lawyer, not from an anonymous tipster. All of this led me to believe that though I had spoken with them, it was not my conversation that had led to the play closing. Here's where I made my mistake, which cost me my job: I ought to have told my editors at the Herald that I had been involved, even though I believed my involvement to be ultimately irrelevant. At the very least, I should have disclosed that and asked that another reporter cover the story. It might have been appropriate to disclose my involvement in the story itself, too. But I didn't tell my editors, and when they subsequently learned of it, they fired me for an ethics violation. I made an error in judgment; I freely admit that. I ought to have spoken up at the time. I'm sending this e-mail to everyone so that there is no mystery or gossip about why I left the Herald. I want to be up front about it, and to admit my mistake. Feel free to send the relevant details of this e-mail to anyone you think may be curious about it. Let me also caution budding would-be journalists: Don't work for The Daily Herald! Make one mistake, and they fire your sorry behind! But I jest. While I think the firing was an over-reaction, and one that newspapers are keen to make nowadays in order to prove to the public how noble and honest they are, I also think the editor who made the decision honestly believes he was doing what he had to do. You can't fault a guy for that. By the same token, I hope I have not lessened my esteem in your eyes (if indeed there was esteem to begin with). I made a mistake, an error in judgment. I misjudged the facts and misjudged how everything would look. If you are a colleague of mine, or a business associate, I hope you will forgive any damage I have done to the credibility of professional journalists. Please note that this e-mail address, eric@ericdsnider.com, is how you can contact me from now on, and I hope you will. To my friends and family, I hope you will look upon me as the same sort of fellow you've always known, and whom you probably already knew was not perfect. To my readers, I apologize for what will be a sudden dearth of "Snide Remarks" columns (they are too hard to write to do them for free) and only as many movie reviews as money for admission tickets will allow. (Free time will not be a problem.) I hope that you, too, will forgive my mistakes. Best wishes, Eric D. Snider P.S. In the "silver lining" department, this frees me up to return to my first love: pizza delivery. Does anyone know of any openings? P.P.S. That P.S. aside, I actually DO need a job. Also, now would be a GREAT time to buy those "Snide Remarks" books you've been putting off purchasing. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V2 #128 ******************************