From: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com (orb-digest) To: orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: orb-digest V2 #233 Reply-To: orb-digest Sender: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes orb-digest Friday, August 20 1999 Volume 02 : Number 233 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 01:03:58 -0700 (PDT) From: A Johnston Subject: (orb) Non orb jest ATTENTION KAEL DRISCOLL: Your complaints about CDNOW have been duly noted, and a cadre of minions have been dispatched to you residence to force you to CONFORM to CorporateWorld's expectations. In the future, you will enjoy out updates so much that you will request them before the are available. Furthermore, our team of suits (lawyers to you) are busy deciding whether you have damaged CDNOW's pristine reputation enough to warrat legal action... Just kidding, hope nobody's pissed off... Andrew Johnston __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 99 00:34:11 -1000 From: Subject: (orb) Cassini made it thru/ NASA's future plans Hi All, I just wanted to let you know Cassini made it. It is still worth checking out because of the future insane plans. Solar would work and NASA needs to know that. No need for Nukes in space >p.s. 2 hrs 15 min left to the end of the world? >August 18, 1999 - S.A.L.T. comes to mind, but why hasn't anybody posted >it here today? *********************************************************************** Did you know eight more nuclear plutonium missions are planned by NASA? NASA's Cassini probe was a threat August 17. It could have spread 72.3 POUNDS of Plutonium into our air! This one made it, will the next eight? http://www.rain.org/~openmind/cass2.htm - ----** Aloha from Hawaii, Joy **---- Mind expansion, Music and laughter inside. ----** Peace to you **---- # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 05:57:06 -0500 From: Ryan Platte Subject: (orb) turkey well, folks, it's august *19*, 1999, and we're still emailing and all... (whew) but i guess our friends in turkey didn't fare so well...an earthquake caused the "black rainbow" i read some predictions of, as an oil refinery burned out of control. this millennium stuff is racking my nerves. ryan # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 04:27:52 -0700 (PDT) From: steve robles Subject: Re: (orb) turkey - --- Ryan Platte wrote: > this millennium stuff is racking my nerves. in the words of flava flav, 'don't believe tha hype!' besides, the millenium doesn't start until 2001. and the mayan calendar goes until 2012, so we got that goin' for us ... ;) steve0 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 10:47:35 -0700 From: "-> rachel" Subject: (orb) Chem Bros/Fatboy Slim If anyone wants to catch a glimpse of what appeared to be a really kickin show, you can view the cybercast at: http://www.astralwerks.com/highfidelity/redrocks.html =) rachel # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 14:41:34 EDT From: mullbug@aol.com Subject: Re: (orb) turkey yeah but nostrildumbass predicts the shits going to go real bad and it will happen above the forty fifth parallel. -t # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 19:44:57 +0000 From: Jeremy Taylor Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini made it thru/ NASA's future plans Hey there, saw this non-orb post and I could not help but think about it. Being an Astrophysics major I find peoples paranoia over nuclear powered devices just a little excessive. I mean thinking about from a physical sense what is the worry, the things gas tank is gonna spring a leak. Nuclear powered craft are hardly anything to waste energy getting excited about. Want to get excited, lets get excited about all the damn nuclear weapons. Nuclear power is relatively safe. These warheads on he other hand are something to get upset about. When was the last time any major accident happened with nuclear power (it's been a while, back in the begining days, and that was to be expected). I tell you, I am much more concerned about our leaders not getting along with other countries leaders and using the damn weapons, than i am about a nuclear powered space probe. Besides thinking about it logically, even if Cassini did spring a leak, what is the worst that happens, assuming any plutonium that falls, does NOT burn up in the atmosphere, we have a few pieces of plutonium sitting around giving off radiation. But of course, plutonium is not usually (unless melted) a liquid, so a leak is physically impossible. People general assume a rather ominous tone when talking "Nuclear" but very few understand the science behind it, and understanding leads to diminish fear. The chances of one of our warheads detonating on its own is probably greater than the odds of cassini messing up and spilling its plutonium. Besides there are bigger and better things for people to spend there time getting upset about than an unclear understanding of nuclear power. What the hell are people gonna do when we switch to antimatter matter reactions (100% energy yield compared to nuclear's 10% at best yield) (and technologically speaking containment will probably be by far more advanced). Hell, no one is bitching about the sun, and that's the biggest damn nuclear engine in our neighborhood (much bigger than cassini) lets do something about that and all the damn radiation it keeps spitting at us (and our horrible care of our atmosphere of course allows even more deadly radiation in) now that's something to get excited about. Also, solar of course is good, but one, as you get farther away the panels receive less photons to displace electrons in the solar panels (thus less power). also solar panels are rather fragile (especially in space with all the damn pieces of space garbage we've thrown out) and if a panel is damaged, we are not getting out there to fix it like a satellite, its just gone, and thus so is a very expensive space probe and the scientific data it would have yielded. In the future, we will no doubt find better means of propulsion, but for now, nuclear is the best and is much safer than the generally uneducated public is aware. Of course I would be happy to be shown an instance of a nuclear powered probe doing what everyone is so scared of it doing (dumping its solid nuclear fuel). Just my thoughts. Knowledge over Ignorance leads to personal and intellectual freedom and diminished fear of the unknown. Unshackle yourselves, or be a slave to the man and his media for ever. (And if you believe the news, keep in mind that most of these people have no scientific background what so ever, they simply report hat they are told, or what they think.) One more thing, if anyone could please explain exactly how Cassini could go and spread its plutonium all over our atmosphere, I would be most interested in hearing about, considering the odds are greater of us being struck by a massive meteor than cassini messing up in the manner proposed, in which case, cassini will be the least of our concerns. - -Jeremy # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 10:04:20 +0800 From: Kael Driscoll Subject: Re: (orb) Non orb jest PLEASE NOTE: KAEL DRISCOLL IS NO LONGER AT THIS ADDRESS I am Kael's Grandfather, Johnny Driscoll, and Kael sometimes uses this email address to threaten and cajole large Internet compoanies such as CDNOW. Please forgive him, he is a very naughty boy. Just let me say that I have never had any trouble with CDNOW, and if I ever had the chance I would tell everyone in the world that CDNOW are the rulers of the universe. Honest. They kick ass, or "arse" as we say here in Australia. Did you know that CDNOW even sell CD's by the Orb? regards Johnny just in case there are some "suits" out there itching to get busy: this is a joke! # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 19:05:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Gavin Miller Subject: Re: (orb) turkey > besides, the millenium doesn't start until 2001. and > the mayan calendar goes until 2012, so we got that > goin' for us ... ;) Uh, look how well it worked for the Mayans... I guess we should worry more about invasion. Gavin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 23:26:37 -0700 From: "-> rachel" Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini made it thru/ NASA's future plans this is why i LOVE the orb list - people ecstatic about the orb with random knowledge to boot!!!! love you all! =) rachel # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 14:28:52 +0800 From: Kael Driscoll Subject: (orb) love youse all I agree with Rachel......we have a special balance here keep it coming people! luv KL >this is why i LOVE the orb list - people ecstatic about the orb with random >knowledge to boot!!!! > >love you all! > >=) >rachel p.s.: for some freaked out views on Cydonia, for those who are keen on a long read: http://cybooks.com/ahill3/contents.htm see why the Orb are keen on Cydonia.... its a crazy place! # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 14:33:23 +0800 From: Kael Driscoll Subject: (orb) sorry for the bandwidth I think I should point out that I don't actaully AGREE with theat crazy Cydonia book I sent to you all, but it was interesting! orb orb orb # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 09:16:15 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) From: Ed Blackshaw Subject: (orb) All this Nostradamus shite... # # yeah but nostrildumbass predicts the shits going to go real bad and it will # happen above the forty fifth parallel. # -t Sorry people, but Nostradamus wrote cryptic poetry in old French when completely off his face on various herbs and grated nutmeg. He never claimed to be a prophet and people have only ever claimed that what he wrote was prophecy after the event. You might as well try to claim that Shakespeare was a prophet. I mean, if you take a random passage from the works of Shakespeare, I'm sure if you fiddle about with it and mistranslate it enough times, you can make it mean anything. To quote, "I haven't got TIME for this Mickey Mouse bullshit!" - - Rant over, flame suit on... -~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~- | Ed Blackshaw, School of Chemistry | ( Organic Section ) ) University of Bristol ( ( Tel. (internal) ext. 4252 ) ) Ed.Blackshaw@bristol.ac.uk ( ( ) ) "We're not dropping out here, we're infiltrating ( ( and taking over." ) ) ( | http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/~cheab | -~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~- # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 09:22:32 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) From: Ed Blackshaw Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini made it thru/ NASA's future plans I'd just like to say, WELL SAID my friend. Perhaps we could explain to people how genetically modified food isn't going to kill them? The only thing I have against it is the fact that Monsanto is trying to control the global crop seed market... Interesting fact for those who campaign against GM food, who also happen to be veggies: Vegetarian cheese is made from vegetarian rennet. Rennet is an enzyme normally found in calf stomachs. How do they get vegetarian rennet? the genetically modify bacteria to produce the enzyme by inserting the relevant gene sequence into the bacteral genome. Most cheese these days is vegetarian because this is a cheaper way of producing rennet. Do you see people walking around with extra heads? No. GM food is safe. Period. -~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~- | Ed Blackshaw, School of Chemistry | ( Organic Section ) ) University of Bristol ( ( Tel. (internal) ext. 4252 ) ) Ed.Blackshaw@bristol.ac.uk ( ( ) ) "We're not dropping out here, we're infiltrating ( ( and taking over." ) ) ( | http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/~cheab | -~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~- # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 16:21:08 +0800 From: Kael Driscoll Subject: Re: (orb) All this Nostradamus shite... > >To quote, "I haven't got TIME for this Mickey Mouse bullshit!" Nostradamus never said that did he????? ha ha its been a long boring friday............... # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 11:24:25 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) From: Ed Blackshaw Subject: Re: (orb) All this Nostradamus shite... # >To quote, "I haven't got TIME for this Mickey Mouse bullshit!" # # Nostradamus never said that did he????? Well, if you take random letters from all his quatrains, rearrange them to form the above sentence then discard all the letters you have left over... -~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~- | Ed Blackshaw, School of Chemistry | ( Organic Section ) ) University of Bristol ( ( Tel. (internal) ext. 4252 ) ) Ed.Blackshaw@bristol.ac.uk ( ( ) ) "We're not dropping out here, we're infiltrating ( ( and taking over." ) ) ( | http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/~cheab | -~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~'`'~,.,~- # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 99 01:13:01 -1000 From: Subject: (orb) Cassini debate/love to Rachel and all orbies Hi Rachel and All, I love you too! Sorry about the bad news and all, but better to be informed I think. Aloha! I wrote Russell Hoffman who has been working for years on stopping the Cassini. I quoted Jeremy the "astrophysics major." This is his answer. Sorry about the bandwidth, Jeremy wrote a lot so Russell did too. :-) Thanks for showing me this, but this person is either confused or lying. He states: >Besides thinking >about it logically, even if Cassini did spring a leak, what is the worst >that happens, assuming any plutonium that falls, does NOT burn up in the >atmosphere, we have a few pieces of plutonium sitting around giving off >radiation. But of course, plutonium is not usually (unless melted) a >liquid, so a leak is physically impossible Clearly, he thinks plutonium "burns up in the atmosphere." It does nothing of the kind. It vaporizes into smaller particles but IT'S THE EXACT SAME THING. Just spread more finely around. So what? Well, it turns out that the ideal size for lodging in one's lung is about a 10 micron particle --- the same size that would have been created in an incineration of Cassini in our atmosphere. There is no known minimum dose of plutonium, and even a particle of Pu 238 a tenth of a millionth of a gram is sufficient to cause lung cancer, normally, in humans. A 10 micron-sized particle is far smaller but proportionately just as capable of killing people. That word "proportionately" is beyond this guy's comprehension, I think, but the statistical math (explained to me by Dr. John W. Gofman, but mistakes are my own of course) goes approximately as follows: If you take a single lethal dose of plutonium -- that is, the minimum amount which will normally kill a person -- and divide it among two people instead, then on average, one of them will die. If you divide that same original amount among 10 people instead, on average, one of them will die. If you divide it out among a thousand people, still, on average in this diabolical experiment, one of them will die. Try proving that to people who want you to believe that a millionth of a lethal dose is harmless, even if you are giving that dose to some 6 billion people! Of course, no one gets an "average" dose. Some people get more and some get less. The sun, for this guy's information, is a comfortable 93 million miles away (or thereabouts) where nuclear reactions belong. Cassini could have used that big nuclear reactor instead of that manmade crap plutonium, by the way. It's called solar power. Technology would already permit a slightly smaller mission to have been solar, and even the bloated Cassini could have been solar too, probably, despite NASA's BS to the contrary. As to this guy complaining that lack of knowledge is the problem among those opposed to Cassini and its ilk, ask him to take the Cassini quiz to prove his own knowledge on the subject, shown below. The "space garbage we threw out" is mainly Earth orbiting debris, and would have nothing to do with Cassini (except during that awful flyby! The panels would not even have had to been retracted. If this guy is so concerned about the environment as to worry about the space debris, why doesn't he think about the risk of the plutonium-laden rocket hitting the same debris -- sure, it's less likely than a solar panel hitting it, but it's vastly more devastating. Oh yeah and -- someone should tell him the RTGs are not for "propulsion" at all! (That's what the several tons of propellant are for.) The RTGs produce heat, same as a parabolic reflector, which is converted into electricity very inefficiently. An instance of a nuke probe dumping fuel? Offhand, SNAP-9A, Apollo 13 (who knows what it did with its cargo), Mars '96 (Russian) and I suspect countless other military failures. Those are just the plutonium failures. There have also been actual nuclear reactors launched into space which have failed too! Some are in orbit and need to be safely retrieved. Thanks, but that's all I have time for. He's rude, name-calling, condescending, and incredibly sure of himself even when he's completely wrong. Ask him to read the web site and stand corrected. I would be happy to debate him any time he can put together a worthy audience, but he's a complete waste of both our times if it's just him we are trying to convince. He wouldn't know when he looks like an idiot anyway. Yours, Russell Hoffman Founder and Editor STOP CASSINI newsletter FORTY-FOUR CASSINI QUESTIONS: (1) How many RTGs (Radioisotope Thermoelectric Generators) are there on Cassini? (2) How many GPHSs (General Purpose Heat Sources) are there in each RTG? (3) How many GISs (Graphite Impact Shells) are there in each GPHS? (4) How much plutonium is there in each one? (5) How many LWRHUs (Light Weight Radioactive Heater Units, also known simply as RHUs) are there on board Cassini (roughly, since I'm not sure NASA ever gave a final exact figure)? (6) How much plutonium is there in each one? (7) What is the likelihood, according to NASA, that the LWRHUs will incinerate in a reentry accident? (8) What is the maximum percentage of plutonium which is EXPECTED to be vaporized in a reentry accident, according to page 4-51 of the June 1995 Environmental Impact Statement for the Cassini mission? (9) What's the minimum EXPECTED to be vaporized, according to that page? (10) What particle size range and mean can be expected from a vaporization, if it is approximately the same as for the reentry that occurred in April 1964 that provided actual data regarding the vaporization characteristics of plutonium? (11) What particle size is ideal for lodging permanently in a person's lung if it is inhaled? (12) How much radiation does the cells around a particle of plutonium receive, according to the late Dr. Karl Z. Morgan and related to me in a conversation in 1997, which I described in a statement published in a NASA Cassini document? (13) How many Curies of plutonium did SNAP-9A carry? (14) What chance of reentry did NASA give for SNAP-9A? (15) Did the SNAP-9A reenter Earth's atmosphere? (16) How many Curies are there in 2.1 lbs plutonium, assuming the mix is the same as for NASA's radioactive thermoelectric generators? (17) How much plutonium was on board Russia's Mars '96? (18) Where is it now? (19) How much plutonium was on board Apollo 13? (20) Where is it now? (21) Can you prove it's there? Have you seen it? Has anyone seen it? (22) What were NASA's official odds against a Space Shuttle failure prior to the Challenger accident? (23) What were NASA's official odds on the same thing shortly after the Challenger accident? (24) What is the half-life of Pu 236? (25) What is the half-life of Pu 238? (26) What is the half-life of Pu 239? (27) What is the half-life of Pu 240? (28) What is the half-life of Pu 241? (29) What is the half-life of Pu 242? (30) For the next seven questions, the launch weight percentage may be given: (31) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 236? (32) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 238? (33) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 239? (34) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 240? (35) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 241? (36) What percentage of Cassini's plutonium is Pu 242? (37) What percentage of the RTG fuel is oxygen? (38) What kind of radiation does plutonium 238 give off? (39) What is an alpha particle? (40) If inhaled or ingested, is an alpha-emitter dangerous? (41) If so, why? (42) What health effects do plutonium cause? (43) How much plutonium 239 is considered by most people in medical science to be a fatal dose, because it will almost surely cause lung cancer if lodged permanently in a lung? (44) How much Pu 238 would it take to have the same radiological effect? - ------ End of quiz ----- You can subscribe to the stop Cassini newsletter via this email rhoffman@animatedsoftware.com *********************************************************************** Did you know eight more nuclear plutonium missions are planned by NASA? NASA's Cassini probe was a threat August 17. It could have spread 72.3 POUNDS of Plutonium into our air! This one made it, will the next eight? http://www.rain.org/~openmind/cass2.htm - ----** Aloha from Hawaii, Joy **---- Mind expansion, Music and laughter inside. ----** Peace to you **---- # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 07:58:40 EDT From: Phpadvice@aol.com Subject: Re: (orb) Mission 92 contents what does this compilation consist of im curious mission 92 "i dont know if i was high or just......" love for all my people php # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 13:23:22 EDT From: mullbug@aol.com Subject: Re: (orb) All this Nostradamus shite... I am merely a prophet of things to come. -t # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 13:24:54 EDT From: mullbug@aol.com Subject: (orb) opinions ? Good day everyone. Would anyone care to comment on either of these two records or perhaps give an opinion as to which one they like better and why. 12 IS 652 DJ Kris Needs Up For A Fortnight Mix Way Out West Begbie mix 12ISX 652DJ Toxic Genes Orb Dub Fila Brazilia mix thanks, t # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 19:37:57 +0000 From: Jeremy Taylor Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini debate/love to Rachel and all orbies Sorry again for non-orb content, this is my final response on this (as I don't want to be the cause of any negative e-vibes). Well, i must say that is some very impressive information there (someone did there homework one the effects of plutonium). I would be quite convinced by all this info being thrown this way, except despite the fact that much of this is correct, there is nothing said about the incredible unlikely possibility of Cassini having a failure and re-entering the atmosphere. I do not debate any of the info presented cause (from my scanning over it) it would appear to be correct and in order. So that is what would happen IF cassini messes up. But one, as i said, it is unlikely, and two, its even more unlikely that it would screw up while in a position to cause re-entry here on earth. Being a scientist (or on my way) of course it is my duty to defend science from paranoia (think of where we would be without science, i would not be sending any email nor would anyone else, we would be sending messages via horse or carrier pigeon). My intent is not to flame anyone's opinions on this matter, merely to try and inform people that although there is some worry, it is being exaggerated slightly (like the whole Y2K thing, so much more hype than fact). Hell, anyone out there who smokes cigarettes, you are inhaling radioactive particles every time you light up (if your that worried about it) and the decay and half lives of the various radioactive particles in cigarette smoke (even if you quite at like age 25 and live to 85) you will still die with radioactive particles in your lungs (they will never all decay to stable isotopes as long as you live). But I do not deny the risk involved, I just say its less likely than Mr. Hoffman would have you believe, but I do understand and empathize with the concern. But perhaps Mr. Hoffman would be interested in working with a few people to develop a means of energy production that would be safer and equally as efficient as nuclear. I am sure his input could be more useful put to a productive goal, than inspiring fear. I am not a big fan of nuclear power generation, but its the most efficient we have right now (imagine how much fossil fuels would be used if there were no nuclear power plants). I would imagine most of you online right now are getting part of the power going to your computer from nuclear power plants. One more thing (last one I promise). "He's rude, name-calling, condescending, and incredibly sure of himself even when he's completely wrong. He wouldn't know when he looks like an idiot anyway." Rude and name-calling, perhaps a closer inspection of my original post is in order. Name-calling? What name did I call anyone? These kind of childish comment don't give me a very high opinion of Mr. Hoffman. I am 22, I would imagine this guy is probably older, and he finds it necessary to resort to third grade style flaming. I must say his argument would probably be taken a little more seriously if he chosen to omit that last paragraph. That sort of stuff does not fly well in any debate. However, yes I am rather sure of my self. If I came off as rude that was not my intention. But name calling, let's keep it real. My apologizes if anyone though I was being rude though (not my intention). Again sorry for non-orb content. This is my last comments on this issue (heating up the list just a little too much, gonna need some AC around here) - -Later Jeremy > > > Thanks, but that's all I have time for. He's rude, name-calling, > condescending, and incredibly sure of himself even when he's completely > wrong. Ask him to read the web site and stand corrected. I would be > happy > to debate him any time he can put together a worthy audience, but he's a > complete waste of both our times if it's just him we are trying to > convince. He wouldn't know when he looks like an idiot anyway. > > Yours, > Russell Hoffman > Founder and Editor > STOP CASSINI newsletter > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 19:35:23 +0000 From: Jeremy Taylor Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini debate/love to Rachel and all orbies Sorry again for non-orb content, this is my final response on this (as I don't want to be the cause of any negative e-vibes). Well, i must say that is some very impressive information there (someone did there homework one the effects of plutonium). I would be quite convinced by all this info being thrown this way, except despite the fact that much of this is correct, there is nothing said about the incredible unlikely possibility of Cassini having a failure and re-entering the atmosphere. I do not debate any of the info presented cause (from my scanning over it) it would appear to be correct and in order. So that is what would happen IF cassini messes up. But one, as i said, it is unlikely, and two, its even more unlikely that it would screw up while in a position to cause re-entry here on earth. Being a scientist (or on my way) of course it is my duty to defend science from paranoia (think of where we would be without science, i would not be sending any email nor would anyone else, we would be sending messages via horse or carrier pigeon). My intent is not to flame anyone's opinions on this matter, merely to try and inform people that although there is some worry, it is being exaggerated slightly (like the whole Y2K thing, so much more hype than fact). Hell, anyone out there who smokes cigarettes, you are inhaling radioactive particles every time you light up (if your that worried about it) and the decay and half lives of the various radioactive particles in cigarette smoke (even if you quite at like age 25 and live to 85) you will still die with radioactive particles in your lungs (they will never all decay to stable isotopes as long as you live). But I do not deny the risk involved, I just say its less likely than Mr. Hoffman would have you believe, but I do understand and empathize with the concern. But perhaps Mr. Hoffman would be interested in working with a few people to develop a means of energy production that would be safer and equally as efficient as nuclear. I am sure his input could be more useful put to a productive goal, than inspiring fear. I am not a big fan of nuclear power generation, but its the most efficient we have right now (imagine how much fossil fuels would be used if there were no nuclear power plants). I would imagine most of you online right now are getting part of the power going to your computer from nuclear power plants. One more thing (last one I promise). "He's rude, name-calling, condescending, and incredibly sure of himself even when he's completely wrong. He wouldn't know when he looks like an idiot anyway." Rude and name-calling, perhaps a closer inspection of my original post is in order. Name-calling? What name did I call anyone? These kind of childish comment don't give me a very high opinion of Mr. Hoffman. I am 22, I would imagine this guy is probably older, and he finds it necessary to resort to third grade style flaming. I must say his argument would probably be taken a little more seriously if he chosen to omit that last paragraph. That sort of stuff does not fly well in any debate. However, yes I am rather sure of my self. If I came off as rude that was not my intention. But name calling, let's keep it real. My apologizes if anyone though I was being rude though (not my intention). Again sorry for non-orb content. This is my last comments on this issue (heating up the list just a little too much, gonna need some AC around here) - -Later Jeremy > > > Thanks, but that's all I have time for. He's rude, name-calling, > condescending, and incredibly sure of himself even when he's completely > wrong. Ask him to read the web site and stand corrected. I would be > happy > to debate him any time he can put together a worthy audience, but he's a > complete waste of both our times if it's just him we are trying to > convince. He wouldn't know when he looks like an idiot anyway. > > Yours, > Russell Hoffman > Founder and Editor > STOP CASSINI newsletter > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 19:47:05 +0000 From: Jeremy Taylor Subject: Re: (orb) Cassini debate/love to Rachel and all orbies Very sorry about the double post there (sendmail daemon has been acting up lately). - -Jeremy # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:55:00 EDT From: "Peter Henry" Subject: (orb) Speaking of... Speaking of plutonium, the milennium, and prophets, I was listening to the Orb with my girlfriend (she hates the Orb as much as I hate her show tunes) when the CD went "the youth of America on LSD." She told me that it is taken from the show "Hair." I thought that some of you might be interested. - -Pete _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 15:55:06 EDT From: "Peter Henry" Subject: (orb) Speaking of... Speaking of plutonium, the milennium, and prophets, I was listening to the Orb with my girlfriend (she hates the Orb as much as I hate her show tunes) when the CD went "the youth of America on LSD." She told me that it is taken from the show "Hair." I thought that some of you might be interested. - -Pete _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 18:57:33 +0100 From: "Peter Evans" Subject: (orb) FS: 2 x LFC 12" Hi all... Anybody interested in purchasing: Cat.No.12 ISD 729/572 503-1 Little Fluffy Clouds 2 x 12" Tracks included are: A - Little Fluffy Clouds (Danny Tenaglia's Downtempo Groove) B - Little Fluffy Clouds (Danny Tenaglia's Detour Mix) C - Little Fluffy Clouds (Adam Freeland Tsunami One Remix) D - Little Fluffy Clouds (Cumulo Nimbus Mix) Little Fluffy Clouds (One True Parker Mix) regards'n'little fluffy clouds Peter # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ End of orb-digest V2 #233 *************************