From: owner-utah-firearms-digest@lists.xmission.com (utah-firearms-digest) To: utah-firearms-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: utah-firearms-digest V2 #197 Reply-To: utah-firearms-digest Sender: owner-utah-firearms-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-utah-firearms-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk utah-firearms-digest Monday, October 23 2000 Volume 02 : Number 197 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:50:27 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: FW: New Anti-Gun Strategy Doomed to Fail Subject: New Anti-Gun Strategy Doomed to Fail Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:45:37 -0400 From: hunter@mva.net To: "Multiple recipients of LRT Discussions Mailing list" Here's an article well worth reading that gives some important advice for RKBA activists. In an interesting twist, Dr. Brown thinks that the very demonization heaped upon gunnies for many years makes us uniquely qualified to counter-demonstrate and pretty much ruin any chances the victim disarmament crowd has of building true grass-roots organizations. Its a good point, and makes it especially important that local groups of concerned citizens show up to confront any public events staged by groups like the Million Moronic Moms. http://www.keepandbeararms.com/newsarchives/XcNewsPlus.asp?cmd=view&articleid=691 - --- Hunter's Hundred Sixty-Second Rule: Reality doesn't care what you want, it just happens. Ceterum censeo fiscum delendum esse - --- >= LIBERTY ROUND TABLE DISCUSSIONS LIST (http://www.vader.com/lrtdiscuss) >= >= TO POST TO THE LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss@vader.com >= TO SUBSCRIBE TO LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-request@vader.com >= TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-drop@vader.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:51:56 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: FW: Beavis and Butthead on Guns and Gun Control Somehow the ^F search function doesn't seem to work at this URL. - ----- Subject: Beavis and Butthead on Guns and Gun Control Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 02:23:56 -0400 From: "Gary M. Shoemaker" To: "Multiple recipients of LRT Discussions Mailing list" "Well, it starts with enforcing law. We need to say loud and clear to somebody, "If you're going to carry a gun illegally, we're going to arrest you. If you're going to sell a gun illegally, you're going to be arrested. And if you commit a crime with a gun," there needs to be absolute certainty in the law." - --George W. Bush, 2nd Debate Bush says "everyone believes that" all schools should be gun-free. (self-defense free zones, now there is a concept any potential violent aggressor can love. Everyone believes this?) Let me get this right. Bush will support making anyone under the age of 21 caught carrying a handgun anywhere or anyone carrying any gun in a school zone a criminal. (What happened to H.S. rifle clubs anyway?) What if Gun Control Inc. manages to make gun ownership a capital offense? Oh, ok, I get it, Bush is the "law and order" candidate, he will enforce the law. (See Bush's Texas record on capital punishment.) Bush thinks 18 year olds should wait until they are 21 to self-defend in this country. Maybe we should wait until our soldiers are 21 before we ask them to pack for "our" defense. (It might make it harder for the Bush dynasty to protect its oil interests or "project American commercial influence" abroad, but I still think people who are not old enough to make contract, drink or shoot should not be expected to defend those who are.) Bush is opposed to photo-licensing of gun owners. hmmm, anyone see a loophole in this one? :) Gary Here is the debate transcript on guns and gun control. Read it and weep. http://www.keepandbeararms.com/newsarchives/XcNewsPlus.asp?cmd=view&articleid=698 Ceterum censeo fiscum delendum esse - --- >= LIBERTY ROUND TABLE DISCUSSIONS LIST (http://www.vader.com/lrtdiscuss) >= >= TO POST TO THE LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss@vader.com >= TO SUBSCRIBE TO LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-request@vader.com >= TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-drop@vader.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 12:03:37 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: 7 Varieties Of Gun Control Advocates Which are you? http://www.jpfo.org/jp_seven.htm 7 Varieties of Gun Control Advocates by Gus Cotey, Jr. The right of decent private citizens to personally possess, transport, and responsibly use arms without government interference is the ultimate freedom and the main pillar supporting all other liberties. Few cultures have allowed their general population access to weapons, the tools of power, to the same degree as the United States. Instead, most societies have restricted the keeping and bearing of arms to a select few power brokers and their agents, often resulting in oppression on a grand scale. Despite a massive amount of historical evidence to the contrary, there is a substantial body of Americans, many occupying positions of influence, who contend that the abrogation of the Second Amendment is the quickest path to domestic tranquility. Since this is as absurd as advocating blood-letting as a cure for anemia, it would seem advisable to question the motives and mentalities of the gun control advocates themselves. In my observation, weapon prohibitionists can be broken down into seven major categories. Even though their motives may vary they all pose a mortal threat to liberty. Elitists Many of those in favor of oppressive firearms legislation are best classed as elitists. Elitists frequently identify with a peer group based on wealth, power, rank, social status, occupation, education, ethnic group, etc. and perceive themselves and their peers as inherently superior to and more responsible than the "common people", thus more deserving of certain rights. Since elitists practically consider those outside their class or caste as members of another species, that most anti-elitist list of laws, the Bill of Rights is viewed by them as anathema. Naturally, the Second Amendment is their first target as it serves as the supporting structure for the other nine [now 10 since one of the original Bill or Rights was ratified as the 27th amendment - Scott] amendments. Authoritarians Another type of individual who favors the restriction of private gun ownership is the authoritarian. Authoritarian personalities are characterized by their belief in unquestioning obedience to an authority figure or group and a disdain for individual freedom of action, expression, and judgement. Those with authoritarian personalities function well in symbiosis with elitists occupying positions of power. Because authoritarians repress their desires for autonomy, they harbor a deep resentment toward free and independent thinkers. Of course authoritarians do not want firearms in the hands of the general population as this constitutes a major obstacle to fulfilling their pathological and obsessive desire to control people. Criminals It goes without saying that career criminals would like to see the public disarmed for obvious reasons. A well-armed population makes crimes such as assault, robbery, and burglary hazardous for the perpetrator and this is bad for "business." Also, it would seem that even non-violent "white collar" criminals live in constant fear of retribution from the public that they financially bleed and would therefore prefer that the public be disarmed. Evidence supporting this hypothesis can be gathered by studying the Second Amendment voting records of those legislators who have been convicted of willful misconduct. The Fearful Cowards by definition are easily or excessively frightened by things and situations that are recognized as dangerous, difficult, or painful. It therefore stands to reason that the mere thought of guns and the circumstances in which they are employed causes them abnormal amounts of stress. Rather than admit their weakness to themselves or others, some fearful types jump on the anti-gun bandwagon and purport moral superiority to those "barbaric" enough to employ lethal force against armed assailants by claiming various humanitarian and pragmatic motives for allowing evil to remain unchecked. In reality, many of these individuals harbor an envy induced resentment toward anyone with the means, skill, and will to successfully stand up to criminal aggression. The desire to assert oneself exists in nearly everyone, wimps included, so cowards seek out tame enemies against whom they can ply their pitiful brand of machismo. Instead of the sociopaths who commit acts of wanton aggression with guns, guns themselves and responsible gun owners are the main targets of their attacks. After all, real criminals are dangerous, so cowards prefer doing battle with inanimate objects that do not have a will of their own and with decent law-abiding people whose high level of integrity and self discipline prevent them from physically lashing out against mere verbal assailants, however obnoxious they may be. Ideological Chameleons Ideological chameleons follow the simple social strategy of avoiding controversy and confrontation by espousing the beliefs of the people in their immediate vicinity or advocating the philosophy of those who scream the loudest in a debate. Quite a few supposedly pro Second Amendment public officials have shown themselves to be ideological chameleons when they supported restrictions on the private possession of military style semiautomatic rifles following recent atrocities in which such firearms were employed. Like their reptilian namesake, people who merely blend in with the ambient philosophical foliage seem to have little insight into the moral and social ramifications of their actions. Political and/or economic gain along with avoidance of confrontation are their only goals. Security Monopolists Security monopolists are those members and representatives of public and private security providing concerns who want the means of self protection out of private hands so that they can command high fees for protecting the citizenry against the rising tide of crime. These profiteers stand to lose a great deal of capital if citizens can efficiently defend themselves. To the security monopolist, each criminal who enters and exits the revolving door of justice is a renewable source of revenue providing jobs for police, social workers, victim counsellors, judges, prison employees, security guards, burglar alarm installers, locksmiths, and others employed by the security monopolies or their satellite organizations. No wonder it is so common for an honest citizen to be more ruthlessly hounded by the authorities when he shoots a criminal in self defense than is a criminal who shoots honest citizens. The Dysfunctional Unworldly Just as a limb will weaken and atrophy if not used, so will aspects of the mind fail to develop if nothing in one's environment exists to challenge them. People who have led excessively sheltered lives tend to have a difficult time understanding certain cause and effect relationships and an even harder time appreciating just how cruel the world can be. These dysfunctionally unworldly types are truly perplexed at the very notion of firearms ownership with regard to defense. To them, tyranny and crime are things that happen in other places far removed from their "civilized" universe. Also, they do not understand the value of private property and why some people would fight for theirs since they never had to work hard to acquire what they possess. While those suffering from dysfunctional unworldliness are most often people who have been born into considerable wealth, this condition is also common in members of the clergy, academicians, practioners of the arts, and others who have spent much of their lives cloistered in a safe and pampering environment. While many of these people may be quite talented and intelligent in some ways, their extreme naivety makes them easy prey for the tyrants who use them for the financial support and favorable advertisement of their regimes. Needless to say, the anti-gun movement is well represented and financed by the dysfunctionally unworldly. The price of liberty is eternal vigilance, and it behooves all vigilant lovers of liberty to know and be able to recognize the various types of arms prohibitionists and understand their differing but equally dangerous motives. Acquiring knowledge of one's foes is the first step toward defeating them. We must never forget that a threat to private firearms ownership is a threat to all freedoms. Jews for the Presevation of Firearms Ownership - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 11:17:45 -0700 From: Joe Waldron Subject: [Fwd: (ai) Israelis use specialized sniper rifles] Coming soon to a SWAT team near you... (This message is being forwarded not as a commentary on right or wrong in the middle east, but rather to inform list members of a new riot-control tactic adopted by an organization with vast experience in the riot control arena. While one would think our Bill of Rights would prevent such targeted bloodshed, one never knows...) Joe W >=20 > The Times >=20 > TUESDAY OCTOBER 17 2000 > No bangs, no smoking guns: > victims just fell and bled > SAM KILEY IN RAMALLAH > ISRAELI snipers using specialised rifles fitted > with silencers yesterday picked off high-profile > Palestinian rioters in Ramallah in an apparent bid > to "take out" ringleaders of the 19-day uprising. > Stone-throwing youths watched, stunned, as men > and boys at the barricades collapsed with small > bullet holes in their chests, testicles, arms and > hips. Those wounded included the nephew of > Marwan Barghouti, the leader of the West Bank > intifada who has been using the uprising to > position himself as a potential successor to Yassir > Arafat. >=20 > Coming soon after an Israeli armoured vehicle > charge at rioters, no one knew quite what to do > about the new approach to riot control. The > Israelis hurled stun grenades, and fired the > occasional rubber bullet. The Palestinians were > used to that, ducking and diving and chucking > stones back. But the use of rounds which > apparently came from nowhere terrified the > crowds. There were no bangs, no smoking guns. > The victims just flopped down and bled, > sometimes unnoticed. >=20 > Tahir Afaneh, 18, was unmoved by the sight of > two men who fell close to him and were whisked > away by ambulance. He already had an arm and a > knee bandaged from rubber bullet wounds > sustained earlier in the "al-Aqsa intifada". >=20 > Easily visible in a white T-shirt, Mr Afaneh > stepped from behind a car to whirr his slingshot > and take aim at Israeli soldiers 100 yards away. > There was no sound of a shot, but he spun around, > falling on his back. "I didn't hear a thing. I didn't > feel much, I just fell over," he said in Ramallah's > central hospital where he was treated for a wound > to his pelvis, where the bullet lodged. >=20 > Hosni Atari, the doctor who treated him, said he > had never seen the results of the new Israeli > weapon before. Hollow-nosed bullets opened like > an umbrella on impact, spun about, chewing up > internal organs, and seldom left an exit wound. >=20 > The long-barrel 22mm rifle was deadly even at > long range =AF and had the advantage of never > revealing the sniper's nest. "These are intended to > cause the maximum amount of damage to a > person," Dr Atari said. He treated seven such > patients yesterday. >=20 > As the Israeli and Palestinian leadership talked > peace in Sharm el-Sheik, another patient was > rushed in. This time, it was Tamir Barghouti, > whose uncle had declared at the funeral of a > Palestinian gunman yesterday: "Our intifada is > greater than Sharm el Sheik". >=20 > Tamir Barghouti, 23, had been shot through the > abdomen and the bullet lodged in his hip. "He > might make it," Dr Atari told Marwan Barghouti, > who took the opportunity to announce to > journalists outside the operating theatre: "The > talks in Egypt will fail. We support Mr Arafat, but > we wish he had not bothered to go. There is only > one solution, and that is to put an end to the Israel= i > occupation of Palestine." >=20 > By sunset, the toll across the West Bank was two > dead =AF a boy of 13 and a policeman =AF a 14-year > old boy described as clinically dead, and 69 > wounded. >=20 > * > * NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 Section 107, this material > * is distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed = a > * prior interest in receiving this information for non-profit research = and > * educational purposes only. Provided by G2-Forward. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 13:43:10 -0600 From: charles hardy Subject: Re: [Fwd: (ai) Israelis use specialized sniper rifles] I have two thoughts on this. 1--I'm should think that snipers using accurate rifles from protected and concealed locations could do a lot better job of hitting their targets than to just wound them--if they really wanted to. 2--I believe the Israeli response is probably the appropriate one given violent rioters who refuse lawful orders to disperse. Should our own government ever reach the stage where revolution is an appropriate response--and I hope and pray it never does--then the proper response is armed revolution where both sides expect to get shot at, not throwing rocks at tanks. I wish our paid peace keepers had been able and willing to employ some of these tactics during the LA Riots before so many millions of dollars of property damage had been done and so many innocent lives lost or damaged forever. ================================================================== Charles C. Hardy Utah Email Coordinator--Women Against Gun Control On Tue, 17 Oct 2000 11:17:45 -0700 Joe Waldron writes: > Coming soon to a SWAT team near you... (This message is being > forwarded not as a commentary on right or wrong in the middle > east, but rather to inform list members of a new riot-control > tactic adopted by an organization with vast experience in the > riot control arena. While one would think our Bill of Rights > would prevent such targeted bloodshed, one never knows...) > > Joe W > > > > > > > > The Times > > > > TUESDAY OCTOBER 17 2000 > > No bangs, no smoking guns: > > victims just fell and bled > > SAM KILEY IN RAMALLAH > > ISRAELI snipers using specialised rifles fitted > > with silencers yesterday picked off high-profile > > Palestinian rioters in Ramallah in an apparent > bid > > to "take out" ringleaders of the 19-day > uprising. > > Stone-throwing youths watched, stunned, as men > > and boys at the barricades collapsed with small > > bullet holes in their chests, testicles, arms > and > > hips. Those wounded included the nephew of > > Marwan Barghouti, the leader of the West Bank > > intifada who has been using the uprising to > > position himself as a potential successor to > Yassir > > Arafat. > > > > Coming soon after an Israeli armoured vehicle > > charge at rioters, no one knew quite what to do > > about the new approach to riot control. The > > Israelis hurled stun grenades, and fired the > > occasional rubber bullet. The Palestinians were > > used to that, ducking and diving and chucking > > stones back. But the use of rounds which > > apparently came from nowhere terrified the > > crowds. There were no bangs, no smoking guns. > > The victims just flopped down and bled, > > sometimes unnoticed. > > > > Tahir Afaneh, 18, was unmoved by the sight of > > two men who fell close to him and were whisked > > away by ambulance. He already had an arm and a > > knee bandaged from rubber bullet wounds > > sustained earlier in the "al-Aqsa intifada". > > > > Easily visible in a white T-shirt, Mr Afaneh > > stepped from behind a car to whirr his slingshot > > and take aim at Israeli soldiers 100 yards away. > > There was no sound of a shot, but he spun > around, > > falling on his back. "I didn't hear a thing. I > didn't > > feel much, I just fell over," he said in > Ramallah's > > central hospital where he was treated for a > wound > > to his pelvis, where the bullet lodged. > > > > Hosni Atari, the doctor who treated him, said he > > had never seen the results of the new Israeli > > weapon before. Hollow-nosed bullets opened like > > an umbrella on impact, spun about, chewing up > > internal organs, and seldom left an exit wound. > > > > The long-barrel 22mm rifle was deadly even at > > long range ¯ and had the advantage of never > > revealing the sniper's nest. "These are intended > to > > cause the maximum amount of damage to a > > person," Dr Atari said. He treated seven such > > patients yesterday. > > > > As the Israeli and Palestinian leadership talked > > peace in Sharm el-Sheik, another patient was > > rushed in. This time, it was Tamir Barghouti, > > whose uncle had declared at the funeral of a > > Palestinian gunman yesterday: "Our intifada is > > greater than Sharm el Sheik". > > > > Tamir Barghouti, 23, had been shot through the > > abdomen and the bullet lodged in his hip. "He > > might make it," Dr Atari told Marwan Barghouti, > > who took the opportunity to announce to > > journalists outside the operating theatre: "The > > talks in Egypt will fail. We support Mr Arafat, > but > > we wish he had not bothered to go. There is only > > one solution, and that is to put an end to the > Israeli > > occupation of Palestine." > > > > By sunset, the toll across the West Bank was two > > dead ¯ a boy of 13 and a policeman ¯ a 14-year > > old boy described as clinically dead, and 69 > > wounded. > > > > * > > * NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 Section 107, this > material > > * is distributed without profit or payment to those who have > expressed a > > * prior interest in receiving this information for non-profit > research and > > * educational purposes only. Provided by G2-Forward. > > - > ================================================================== Charles C. Hardy Utah Email Coordinator--Women Against Gun Control ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 14:52:06 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: Very nice article Forward - ----- Subject: Very nice article Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 14:23:30 -0400 From: hunter@mva.net To: "LRT Discussions Mailing list" A very interesting article that gives an awful lot of detail and background information to present its case that the American political and social systems have some serious problems. Well worth a read. http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles/silveira66.html - --- Hunter's Eleventy-Third Rule: Respect often follows quoting Ben Franklin, which I suspect would amuse the old coot. Ceterum censeo fiscum delendum esse - --- >= LIBERTY ROUND TABLE DISCUSSIONS LIST (http://www.vader.com/lrtdiscuss) >= >= TO POST TO THE LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss@vader.com >= TO SUBSCRIBE TO LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-request@vader.com >= TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM LIST: send mail to lrt-discuss-drop@vader.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:27:30 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: FW: LP RELEASE: More Guns, Less Crime Shocking study: 25 million more guns helped produce a 40% drop in crime WASHINGTON, DC -- Gun-related crime has plunged 40% in recent years while the number of guns in circulation has reached an all-time high, according to a new study by the U.S. Department of Justice -- and that's terrible news for supporters of gun control, Libertarians say. "The message is clear: More guns equal less crime," said Harry Browne, the Libertarian Party's presidential candidate. "The biggest threat to your safety isn't guns; it's politicians who want to restrict gun ownership. "That's why we need to do everything we can to keep dangerous gun laws out of the hands of politicians like Al Gore and George W. Bush." Data released last week by the FBI shows that gunshot wounds inflicted during crimes dropped to 39,400 from 64,100 nationwide between 1992 and 1997 -- a decrease of 40%. But during the same five years, the number of guns in America surged to 230 million from 205 million, according to the National Association of Federally Licensed Firearms Dealers. "Even street thugs understand what gun-banning politicians don't: Guns deter crime," Browne said. "Americans went on a gun-buying binge from 1992 to 1997, purchasing 11 million new handguns and 14 million new rifles and shotguns -- and crime continued to decline. "Imagine how much further crime would fall if politicians made it easier for more law-abiding citizens to buy guns by repealing many of the 20,000 gun laws currently on the books." One immediate target for repeal: State laws preventing Americans from carrying concealed weapons. "The three most violent cities in America -- New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles -- all have something in common: Gun control," Browne said. "According to the FBI figures, these three cities led the nation in murder, armed robbery, and assault. And no wonder. In those cities, it's illegal to carry a concealed weapon. Democrats and Republicans who refuse to repeal these laws are painting a target on the backs of innocent Americans." Browne conceded that other factors -- such as demographic changes, longer prison terms, and an improved economy -- may have played a role in the drop in crime rates. "But a dramatic increase in the number of guns didn't cause an increase in crime -- which is what politicians routinely claim when they spout off about the so-called need to reduce easy access to guns," he said. "In fact, giving ordinary Americans easy access to guns is apparently what criminals fear most." Another shocking truth about gun control laws, Browne said, is that even politicians don't favor them -- for themselves. "Visit the Capitol building in Washington, DC, and notice how many guards are carrying guns," he said. "Politicians say you have to be disarmed to make America safer, but they don't disarm government employees. Senators and Congressmen may have a compelling need to defend themselves, but is it really more compelling than your need to defend your home and your family against criminals? "Of course not. That's why if I'm elected president I will immediately sign an executive order disarming every single guard on Capitol Hill -- until Congress fully restores your right to carry a gun." During the presidential debates, both Bush and Gore emphasized their support for background checks, taxpayer-financed trigger locks, and enforcing current gun laws, noted Browne. "Gore and Bush are both promoting the dangerous utopian idea that criminals will suddenly decide to follow whatever laws they manage to pass," he said. "But more laws are not the answer. The best solution is to repeal every existing gun control law on the books. The number of guns in the hands of criminals will not change, but more Americans would recover the right to defend themselves -- which will probably inspire many more criminals to seek a safer line of work." # # # - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:47:54 -0600 From: charles hardy Subject: FW: LP RELEASE: More Guns, Less Crime Nothing surprising to us here, but nice to see a few press releases that give credit where credit is due. ================================================================== Charles C. Hardy Utah Email Coordinator--Women Against Gun Control - --------- Forwarded message ---------- Shocking study: 25 million more guns helped produce a 40% drop in crime WASHINGTON, DC -- Gun-related crime has plunged 40% in recent years while the number of guns in circulation has reached an all-time high, according to a new study by the U.S. Department of Justice -- and that's terrible news for supporters of gun control, Libertarians say. "The message is clear: More guns equal less crime," said Harry Browne, the Libertarian Party's presidential candidate. "The biggest threat to your safety isn't guns; it's politicians who want to restrict gun ownership. "That's why we need to do everything we can to keep dangerous gun laws out of the hands of politicians like Al Gore and George W. Bush." Data released last week by the FBI shows that gunshot wounds inflicted during crimes dropped to 39,400 from 64,100 nationwide between 1992 and 1997 - -- a decrease of 40%. But during the same five years, the number of guns in America surged to 230 million from 205 million, according to the National Association of Federally Licensed Firearms Dealers. "Even street thugs understand what gun-banning politicians don't: Guns deter crime," Browne said. "Americans went on a gun-buying binge from 1992 to 1997, purchasing 11 million new handguns and 14 million new rifles and shotguns -- and crime continued to decline. "Imagine how much further crime would fall if politicians made it easier for more law-abiding citizens to buy guns by repealing many of the 20,000 gun laws currently on the books." One immediate target for repeal: State laws preventing Americans from carrying concealed weapons. "The three most violent cities in America -- New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles -- all have something in common: Gun control," Browne said. "According to the FBI figures, these three cities led the nation in murder, armed robbery, and assault. And no wonder. In those cities, it's illegal to carry a concealed weapon. Democrats and Republicans who refuse to repeal these laws are painting a target on the backs of innocent Americans." Browne conceded that other factors -- such as demographic changes, longer prison terms, and an improved economy -- may have played a role in the drop in crime rates. "But a dramatic increase in the number of guns didn't cause an increase in crime -- which is what politicians routinely claim when they spout off about the so-called need to reduce easy access to guns," he said. "In fact, giving ordinary Americans easy access to guns is apparently what criminals fear most." Another shocking truth about gun control laws, Browne said, is that even politicians don't favor them -- for themselves. "Visit the Capitol building in Washington, DC, and notice how many guards are carrying guns," he said. "Politicians say you have to be disarmed to make America safer, but they don't disarm government employees. Senators and Congressmen may have a compelling need to defend themselves, but is it really more compelling than your need to defend your home and your family against criminals? "Of course not. That's why if I'm elected president I will immediately sign an executive order disarming every single guard on Capitol Hill -- until Congress fully restores your right to carry a gun." During the presidential debates, both Bush and Gore emphasized their support for background checks, taxpayer-financed trigger locks, and enforcing current gun laws, noted Browne. "Gore and Bush are both promoting the dangerous utopian idea that criminals will suddenly decide to follow whatever laws they manage to pass," he said. "But more laws are not the answer. The best solution is to repeal every existing gun control law on the books. The number of guns in the hands of criminals will not change, but more Americans would recover the right to defend themselves -- which will probably inspire many more criminals to seek a safer line of work." # # # ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 16:52:21 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: Not-so safe-storage laws Not-so safe-storage laws - ---------- by Dave Kopel, Dr. Paul Gallant & Dr. Joanne Eisen "Rather than saving lives, could it be that trigger-lock laws are intended to condition Americans into believing that firearms aren't acceptable for self-defense, or worth the bother?" (10/19/00) http://www.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel101800.shtml To subscribe or unsubscribe to this and other lists, click to: http://free-market.net/features/lists/ or http://free-market.net/cgi/listMgr.cgi (for members) - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2000 18:26:04 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: FW: Doctor Emerson acquitted! Unconfirmed Doctor Emerson acquitted! (by Eugene Volokh) According to the San Angelo Standard Times, Oct. 19, http://www.texaswest.com, Dr. Emerson (of U.S. v. Emerson fame) has been acquitted of threatening his ex-wife with a gun. Recall that the feds went after him as a result of that alleged threat (since otherwise they probably wouldn't even have known that he still had his guns). Emerson's story was that the ex-wife "barged into his office and would not leave when he asked. He then pulled a Beretta pistol out of a desk drawer and laid it on the desk. According to Emerson, McSpadden insisted on going down the hallway to retrieve the daughter's shoes and socks. According to an affidavit, Emerson said he again warned McSpadden about trespassing and held the gun in the air, cocked it, then lowered it to his side." Prosecutors, on the other hand, "argued that the case was one of domestic violence and that Emerson put McSpadden and his daughter in danger of their lives when he drew the weapon." The jury seems to have bought Emerson's claim; Texas law apparently allows people to threaten deadly force to eject trespassers, so Emerson was apparently acting within his rights under state law. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2000 19:32:06 EDT From: JHVG@aol.com Subject: Re: FW: Doctor Emerson acquitted! The Federal government's appeal of Dr. Emerson's acquital on federal charges is still pending in the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals. A decision is expected before the end of the year. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2000 20:42:29 -0600 From: Scott Bergeson Subject: Emerson Aquitted! Longer version http://www.sierratimes.com/artx102100.htm A SierraTimes Editorial - © 2000 SierraTimes.com Emerson Aquitted! San Angelo Standard-Times - - Posted:10.21.00 Doctor not guilty of felony charges West Texas man involved in federal case with gun rights implications; state prosecutors appeal By BEN MONTGOMERY Staff Writer A West Texas doctor who made national headlines because of a federal case with gun rights implications was cleared of state charges on Wednesday. Dr. Tim Emerson was found not guilty of endangerment of a child and aggravated assault in State District Court by a Tom Green County jury made up of nine women and two men. The two state felony charges were in addition to federal charges of possessing a firearm while under a restraining order in 1998. The federal charges were thrown out by a trial judge, who cited in part that Emerson' Second Amendment rights were violated. It was federal court action that received attention from the National Rifle Association, law-enforcement officers, media and lawyer organizations. Some legal scholars and historians even predicted the losing side would push Emerson's case all the way to the Supreme Court. Following the case's dismissal, prosecutors appealed the case to the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals in New Orleans. Both the state and federal charges resulted from a conflict between Emerson and his ex-wife Sacha McSpadden. In 1998, McSpadden filed for divorce. She alleged that Emerson had threatened her boyfriend and State District Judge John Sutton granted a temporary restraining order. The judge had failed to warn Emerson, however, of a 1994 federal law that made gun possession illegal under a restraining order. Emerson had represented himself in the case, so no lawyer made him aware of the law that is intended to protect spouses during pending divorces. According to Standard-Times reports, in November 1998, McSpadden showed up at the doctor's medical office at 14 South Jefferson Street with the couple's 4-year-old daughter. Emerson said McSpadden barged into his office and would not leave when he asked. He then pulled a Beretta pistol out of a desk drawer and laid it on the desk. According to Emerson, McSpadden insisted on going down the hallway to retrieve the daughter's shoes and socks. According to an affidavit, Emerson said he again warned McSpadden about trespassing and held the gun in the air, cocked it, then lowered it to his side. Emerson said he brought the weapon to work because of threats from a patient he suspected of abusing pain medication. During the trial, McSpadden, who has since remarried and lives in Sterling City, claimed Emerson aimed the gun at her and her daughter, hence the charges of aggravated assault and endangering a child. Prosecutors argued that the case was one of domestic violence and that Emerson put McSpadden and his daughter in danger of their lives when he drew the weapon. "It is time to send a message that there is no excuse for this kind of domestic violence," District Attorney Steve Lupton told jurors in closing arguments. Defense attorneys said McSpadden and an accomplice planned to ruin the doctor's medical practice. They added that it is the law in the state of Texas that a person can defend his property. The jury deliberated for just more than an hour before acquitting Emerson of both charges. Contact Ben Montgomery at bmontgomery@texaswest.com or 659-8263. - - ------------------------------ End of utah-firearms-digest V2 #197 ***********************************